I changed my stance on gun control!!!

[dogs4thewin]

Pretty much yeah. We need guns in the hands of the right people. School shooters etc get their guns illegally. More laws won't stop that. It will only stop legitimate buyers.

Guns make murder easier but guns themselves don't cause people to murder.

yup if someone wants another dead badly enough they eill find a way. There are ways to do it and make t harder for the DA to prove than a gun too.

 

[Tiberius Lee]

Pretty much yeah. We need guns in the hands of the right people. School shooters etc get their guns illegally. More laws won't stop that. It will only stop legitimate buyers.

Guns make murder easier but guns themselves don't cause people to murder.

Or may be USA can enter 21st century like rest of the western countries and take away guns like they did in other democracy like Australia and make it safer.


Gun Deaths by Country 2021 (worldpopulationreview.com)

 

[durangodawood]

Which should tell you it is not a gun problem it is a heart problem and fallen world problem.

If the fallen world is a given, then we have to adapt to that.

One adaptation is to decide which objects are just too dangerous to have in general circulation.... which we already do, of course.

 

[dogs4thewin]

Or may be USA can enter 21st century like rest of the western countries and take away guns like they did in other democracy like Australia and make it safer.


Gun Deaths by Country 2021 (worldpopulationreview.com)

Again gun deaths and gun violence are different things. Moreover when you have as many guns as we do good luck trying to round them all up. There is a little thing called the black market.

 

[Subduction Zone]

So you have valuables. How is a gun different?

I have no use for a gun since I no longer hunt. I do not own a chainsaw either.

 

[Tiberius Lee]

Again gun deaths and gun violence are different things. Moreover when you have as many guns as we do good luck trying to round them all up. There is a little thing called the black market.

Yea – black market, if we take a way guns from law-abiding citizen, only criminal will have guns and they will be anarchist and law-abiding citizen live in a fearful life. These are all hypothetical situation.

The reality from rest of the “industrial civilization” is that gun control eliminate murder, mass shooting crime significantly. US had more mass shooting in 2021 then entire western civilization combined.

 

[dogs4thewin]

I have no use for a gun since I no longer hunt. I do not own a chainsaw either.

and I am pretty sure no one in this thread is proposing a law that would mandate everyone to own a gun.

 

[Subduction Zone]

and I am pretty sure no one in this thread is proposing a law that would mandate everyone to own a gun.

And I am not proposing a ban on all guns.

 

[dogs4thewin]

Yea – black market, if we take a way guns from law-abiding citizen, only criminal will have guns and they will be anarchist and law-abiding citizen live in a fearful life. These are all hypothetical situation.

The reality from rest of the “industrial civilization” is that gun control eliminate murder, mass shooting crime significantly. US had more mass shooting in 2021 then entire western civilization combined.

You do not eliminate murder and in fact there is at least one type of murder that would be much harder for the DA to prove than guns now it would not "work with everyone. Again also there are very few truly random mass shootings.

 

[dogs4thewin]

And I am not proposing a ban on all guns.

The way you said that you saw no need to have a gun made it seem as though you were trying to say that people were claiming that guns should be mandatory.

 

[Subduction Zone]

The way you said that you saw no need to have a gun made it seem as though you were trying to say that people were claiming that guns should be mandatory.

No, someone asked me personally if I owned a gun. There was no such implication.

I do know that both sides tend to distort the facts for themselves. For example the anti-gun people pretend that one has to fire a gun to use it. You probably know that is not the case. A homeowner that shows up at the door with a gun when threatened almost never needs to fire it. But I do not see that happening to me.

 

[Aldebaran]

Actually about 40%, And I never would advertise that I was a gun owner if I owned one.

Then why be concerned about being targeted for it?

That is pure paranoia.

I'm not the one who doesn't want a firearm for fear of being targeted for theft.

More paranoia. That happens very rarely.

It only takes once.

A good stout door is probably better protection than a firearm.

Then don't forget to replace all your windows with "good stout doors" as well.

 

[renniks]

I have no use for a gun since I no longer hunt. I do not own a chainsaw either.

Every man should have a gun and a chainsaw.
Just in case.

 

[RDKirk]

To ask OB's question in another way, why is it only in the US that people feel the need to protect themselves in that way? Where on earth do you live? Is it that dangerous? If it is, then you have some real problems that you need to solve. Your home must be like some kind of fortress.

Americans are violent and indifferent to human life across the board. It's not just guns, Americans are among the top nations in homicide by all methods. We like killing each other by any means available. The US does have a homicide problem for sure, but the availability of guns is not the source of it.

So for many Americans, being armed with a gun is a last option against the meaner, tougher, larger people armed with knives, clubs, greater numbers, more fighting experience that really are out there.

 

[Aldebaran]

Americans are violent and indifferent to human life across the board. It's not just guns, Americans are among the top nations in homicide by all methods. We like killing each other by any means available.

Please just speak for yourself and not the rest of us, ok?

 

[RDKirk]

Thinking that the greatest military power in history can be overthrown by untrained first world civilians with small ams is delusional.

No, not delusional. It means is that Private Pyle will have to face the possibility of shooting Sherrif Andy, Deputy Fife and even Aunt Bea. From the point of view of a soldier, that's a daunting possibility.

Even the Soviet Red Army refused to fire on Soviet citizens during the last days of the Soviet Union. American soldiers are not more likely to do so, unless there is a very bright indication that it's definitely a matter of protecting Sherrif Andy, Deputy Fife and even Aunt Bea.

What I saw the military do in the last days of Watergate, and what I heard from them during the last days of the Trump presidency, is that they're going to be watching all three branches very, very carefully and reading the Constitution very strictly. If the Executive doesn't get at least one other branch on its side in this kind of matter, they will fold their hands.

 

[RDKirk]

Please just speak for yourself and not the rest of us, ok?

All you have to do is look at the homicide statistics. Don't forget to look at abortion and capital punishment rates, as well. Americans have a homicide problem.

 

[Astrid]

Americans are violent and indifferent to human life across the board. It's not just guns, Americans are among the top nations in homicide by all methods. We like killing each other by any means available. The US does have a homicide problem for sure, but the availability of guns is not the source of it.

So for many Americans, being armed with a gun is a last option against the meaner, tougher, larger people armed with knives, clubs, greater numbers, more fighting experience that really are out there.

And if you were 90 some lbs, under five ft tall and one of
those so- violent Americans you described decided to defile
you, what would you propose to do?

I tried being seriously injured. Whats your preference?

 

[Tiberius Lee]

You do not eliminate murder and in fact there is at least one type of murder that would be much harder for the DA to prove than guns now it would not "work with everyone. Again also there are very few truly random mass shootings.

“Eliminate murder” is a poor choice of word. But rest of the world statistics prove that stronger gun control , and removing guns from citizen will reduce gun valiance and also murder rate in US homicide rate is 4.96 , where in Canada it is 1.76, in Europe it is less then 2, in AU less then one. And gun related homicide US – 12.21/ 100K , Canada 2.05/100k, EU less then 3/100k . it’s statistically proven a stronger gun control reduce violence. But American conservatives don’t care!

 

[Aldebaran]

And if you were 90 some lbs, under five ft tall and one of
those so- violent Americans you described decided to defile
you, what would you propose to do?

I tried being seriously injured. Whats your preference?

It would seem that the preference of many is to wait until it happens to them, THEN do something. Meanwhile, they assume "It can't happen here. It can't happen to me."