I changed my stance on gun control!!!

[Bradskii]

Or on a bork bork nom nom.

I had to Google that. But yeah, my old pooch would go ape when he heard someone at the door. Even friends who knew he was safe wouldn't come in if the screen door was unlocked until I made an appearance.

Unless someone knows that you have something quite valuable at home, most guys who break in do so at random. And do so when they know you're out. And 90% of the time they'll knock to make sure of that. They really don't want the hassle of having someone interrupting them rumaging through your stuff looking for easily carried valuables that can be sold easily. If you have a dog, they'll move on.

 

[Aldebaran]

I had to Google that. But yeah, my old pooch would go ape when he heard someone at the door. Even friends who knew he was safe wouldn't come in if the screen door was unlocked until I made an appearance.

Unless someone knows that you have something quite valuable at home, most guys who break in do so at random. And do so when they know you're out. And 90% of the time they'll knock to make sure of that. They really don't want the hassle of having someone interrupting them rumaging through your stuff looking for easily carried valuables that can be sold easily. If you have a dog, they'll move on.

Prepared burglars bring dog treats. Dogs are easily distracted that way.

 

[Bradskii]

That's my point. You're trying to discuss the energy level of the bullet by only one factor.

You really don't understand the physics, do you...I thought you were just ignoring it. But it seems to not make sense to you. You didn't understand what energy meant and you didn't know how it was calculated. And now you complain that only one factor is being considered. Except it's the factor that is the most important because it is squared to get the energy. Double the mass will give you double the energy. Double the speed and you get quadruple the energy.

 

[Aldebaran]

You really don't understand the physics, do you...I thought you were just ignoring it. But it seems to not make sense to you. You didn't understand what energy meant and you didn't know how it was calculated. And now you complain that only one factor is being considered. Except it's the factor that is the most important because it is squared to get the energy. Double the mass will give you double the energy. Double the speed and you get quadruple the energy.

That still doesn't make it the only factor to focus on. Science takes all factors into consideration. Or at least it used to.

 

[Bradskii]

I originally posted the scenario to someone else when we were talking about which gun would be appropriate in particular settings, and how they could be used safely. If you want to go into other details and derail the topic, please start a new thread.

How to deal with possible intruders by shooting them is off topic in a thread about guns? Whaaat?

I'm not the one who is making up possible scenarios to try to justify keeping a weapon similar to that used by the military in your bedroom, complete with ammo to repel possibly armed intruders who have somehow randomly accessed your house while you are in your bedroom, leaving all other occupants to fend for themselves.

I guess better security and a dog aren't as much fun as owning a weapon that will penetrate steel sheet at 500m.

 

[Subduction Zone]

You really don't understand the physics, do you...I thought you were just ignoring it. But it seems to not make sense to you. You didn't understand what energy meant and you didn't know how it was calculated. And now you complain that only one factor is being considered. Except it's the factor that is the most important because it is squared to get the energy. Double the mass will give you double the energy. Double the speed and you get quadruple the energy.

That wording looks oddly familiar

 

[Bradskii]

Prepared burglars bring dog treats. Dogs are easily distracted that way.

If you have burglars who break into houses that they know have a dog, then either you have the world's dumbest burglars or we're still deep in the land of fantasy. Again, which war zone do you live in?

 

[Bradskii]

That wording looks oddly familiar

I'm responding to each post as I play catch up. I then saw that you had the maths covered quite well. But maybe if we keep repeating it, the fog of confusion will lift from those who seem not to grasp it.

 

[Aldebaran]

If you have burglars who break into houses that they know have a dog, then either you have the world's dumbest burglars or we're still deep in the land of fantasy. Again, which war zone do you live in?

If they target a house, it might be because it's a house with something specific they want. Jewelry, money, your wife, etc.
A dog is hardly the ultimate security measure.

 

[Bradskii]

If they target a house, it might be because it's a house with something specific they want. Jewelry, money, your wife, etc.
A dog is hardly the ultimate security measure.

If you have valuable things to protect then get a security system. Get stronger locks on the front door. Secure all windows. Buy a dog. Your game plan seems to be 'wait until they get in and then hunker down in the bedroom with a gun'. Brilliant...

 

[RDKirk]

You think you need a gun to protect yourself yet you're suggesting someone could make it to your bedroom door before you're aware there's anyone in the house? Save money on guns and spend the money on a security sytem for heaven's sake.

I didn't hear that suggestion in Aldebaran's post.

 

[RDKirk]

Now we have a bunch of people in the house and somehow they've made it to the bedroom door wothout being noticed (zero security I guess) and now you want to spray bullets everywhere (after checking if they're all armed) as you have luckily kept your weapon under the bed and have had time to get it, get to the ammo (surely under lock and key), load it all while they wait patiently outside until you're ready and the kids are ducking for cover, get your wife somewhere out of danger and mentally prepare yourself to shoot an unknown number of assailants. We're truly back in fantasy land.

Where on earth do you live?

That is an inane post. That's where you get to when you run out of intelligent rebuttals.

I do have an alarm system. I do not, have kids, however my and my wife's bedside guns are loaded but kept in biometric safes. All we have to do is lay our fingertips on tops of the safes and the guns pop out.

The alarms alert us to a possible break in. My alarm system also identifies which sensor tripped the alarm, and there are security cameras making recordings in certain areas as well. Someone actually inside the house will actually additional sensors as they move from room to room. I'll be monitoring all that on my phone.

I get my gun and phone, and move to a defensible position in the hallway, my wife takes a defensible position in the bedroom and calls 911. If I did have children, my position would be ahead of the bedrooms, and my wife's job would include making sure the children were in the room with her.

Our alarm system is remotely monitored, so if we don't call them to give an "all clear," they will also dial 911. My wife will stay on the phone and continue reporting until the police arrive, or else call them off if/when I give her an "all clear."

We've had to run through that drill a couple of times.

 

[Bradskii]

I didn't hear that suggestion in Aldebaran's post.

But you might have read it: 'someone would keep a gun in the bedroom to take up a stationary position there and have the gun pointed at the closed door is obviously a case where someone was aware of an intruder in the house'.

An intruder 'in' the house. Because there's no security, no heavy duty locks, no grilles on windows and no dog, some guys (who might be armed) have already entered. Doesn't sound like he's been investigating that noise downstairs already armed. No sirree. Best bet is to hunker down behind tbe bed and shoot anyone who comes in.

I keep asking, but there's been no response...where do you guys actually live? Are you in nightly danger of armed intruders? Why isn't your house like Fort Knox?

 

[RDKirk]

You really don't understand the physics, do you...I thought you were just ignoring it. But it seems to not make sense to you. You didn't understand what energy meant and you didn't know how it was calculated. And now you complain that only one factor is being considered. Except it's the factor that is the most important because it is squared to get the energy. Double the mass will give you double the energy. Double the speed and you get quadruple the energy.

I also understand how they can be applied. Bullet velocities in any given gun can't be doubled willy-nilly. It's not a paper assignment, it's applied physics. Talking about the problem as though it was merely a paper assignment displays both arrogance and ignorance of the actual subject.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I also understand how they can be applied. Bullet velocities in any given gun can't be doubled willy-nilly. It's not a paper assignment, it's applied physics. Talking about the problem as though it was merely a paper assignment displays both arrogance and ignorance of the actual subject.

That sounds like projection on your part. No one was suggesting that.

 

[Bradskii]

That is an inane post. That's where you get to when you run out of intelligent rebuttals.

I do have an alarm system. I do not, have kids, however my and my wife's bedside guns are loaded but kept in biometric safes. All we have to do is lay our fingertips on tops of the safes and the guns pop out.

The alarms alert us to a possible break in. My alarm system also identifies which sensor tripped the alarm, and there are security cameras making recordings in certain areas as well. Someone actually inside the house will actually additional sensors as they move from room to room. I'll be monitoring all that on my phone.

I get my gun and phone, and move to a defensible position in the hallway, my wife takes a defensible position in the bedroom and calls 911. Our alarm system is remotely monitored, so if we don't call them to give an "all clear," they will also dial 911. My wife will stay on the phone and continue reporting until the police arrive, or else call them off if/when I give her an "all clear."

We've had to run through that drill a couple of times.

An alarm system but no means to stop someone getting in? Nobody gets through my front or back door when it's locked from the inside. Well, maybe the fire brigade with the right equipment. And doesn't your alarm system go off? Mine's not connected to the local police but it is seriously painfully loud when it does go off.

At least when someone has suggested that hunkering down in the bedroom sounds like a bad idea then we've moved on to hiding behind something that will stop a bullet in the hallway...

You know what would happen if I suggested to my wife that the area that we we lived required us to run through some drills as to what to do if armed men broke in to the house? She'd move back in with her family until I'd sold the place and bought somewhere where armed resistance wasn't something we'd need to practice.

Yet again, where on earth do you live that requires you to live like this?

 

[rturner76]

I'm a little iffy about buckshot on a bear, I mean I'm pretty sure it'd work, but bears do be "thicc". So I'd like a slug.

The slugs would have the stopping power.

 

[rturner76]

Both buckshot and slugs will go through party walls pretty easily.

Would you go with birdshot?

 

[Bradskii]

I also understand how they can be applied. Bullet velocities in any given gun can't be doubled willy-nilly. It's not a paper assignment, it's applied physics. Talking about the problem as though it was merely a paper assignment displays both arrogance and ignorance of the actual subject.

As sub said, you are projecting to cover your lack of understanding of the basic physics. Nobody has suggested that any given bullet could be made to double its velocity. But if any two bullets have the same weight then the one that travels twice as fast will have 4x the energy of the other. You can do the maths on paper as an assignment or you an apply the physics and you can shoot them and measure the velocity. Either way, the answer's the same.

Which one would you prefer to be shot with? In the bedroom or the hallway.

 

[Robban]

If they target a house, it might be because it's a house with something specific they want. Jewelry, money, your wife, etc.
A dog is hardly the ultimate security measure.

Dunno, read some years back there was a couple who lived in a big house, they had two great Danes.

So the burglar breaks in and they do nothing,
when the burglar had taken what he wanted and was on his way out,

they would not let him out.

They stood on their hind legs and pinned him against the wall until the police arrined.