Hypothetical: Creationism becomes standard in science classes

[Paul of Eugene OR]

LOL ... wow.

John 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

1 Corinthians 3:16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?

Father, Son, and Holy Ghost.

Science can take a hike.

Disconnected I see. Well, we will still love ya . . .

 

[VirOptimus]

If you could produce logical arguments I might take you seriously, but since you can't and all you can do is make personal attacks I won't waste my time conversing with you any longer.

For the rest of you reading this, it is an unmistakable fact that the laws of thermodynamics disallow any spontaneous auto-creation of anything from nothingness. Quantum theory does not and cannot change this fact because the coupling and uncoupling of subatomic particles too small to be affected by gravitational influences do not, repeat, do not amount to things popping in and out of existence. There are, after all, subatomic particles there in the first place.

However, I'm not the only person to cite natural law as a barrier to the spontaneous auto-creation of the universe. Some people have written books on the matter.

There are only two options for the origin of matter: it is either eternal or it appeared at a finite point in the past. With the elucidation of the First Law of Thermodynamics the implications of this debate, as we will see, have been clearly defined.

Faced with the evidence of a finite, expanding universe, cosmologists began to look for a way to salvage the existence of an eternal universe. In the 1940's Hermann Bondi, Thomas Gold and Fred Hoyle proposed a mechanism that would allow the expanding universe to still be infinitely old. This model for the universe, called the "Steady State Model," asserts that as the universe expands, hydrogen atoms arise spontaneously from nothing in the deep recesses of space. The result is that the universe appears about the same (in a "steady state") in all ages.

In the last forty years this model for the universe has been discredited by a number of scientific discoveries. The first of these has to do with the age of the galaxies. If the universe is infinitely old then we should expect to find galaxies of all ages. However decades of observations reveal that all the visible galaxies in our universe are "middle aged." Secondly, there is no physical (natural) mechanism for the spontaneous origin of hydrogen atoms. In fact, hydrogen atoms have never been observed to appear spontaneously anywhere in the universe.
Thirdly, Isaac Newton's Law of Inertia declares that a body at rest will remain at rest unless acted upon by an outside force. In the Steady State Model there is no mechanism to explain the motion of the galaxies.

The First Law of Thermodynamics is called a "law" because within the bounds of scientific observation it has been proven true beyond all reasonable doubt. In effect, the First Law states that you and I can neither create nor destroy matter. Therefore, it follows that if something which exists (you and I) cannot create matter, then something which doesn't exist cannot create it either!

Matter cannot create itself and, in the real world, cannot arise from nothing. Within the bounds of natural law all effects must have a cause. Because of this fact, the spontaneous appearance of hydrogen atoms out of nothing (ex nihilo creation) is a definite breach of the First Law of Thermodynamics which asserts that matter, under natural circumstances, can neither be created nor destroyed. Therefore, since it is not a natural event, it is by definition a supernatural event-a miracle! This is, we believe, a rather weak starting point for a materialistic scenario to begin.

To avoid this conclusion, a number of physicists have proposed that the laws of physics are different elsewhere in the universe. However, this assertion is not supported by even a shred of scientific evidence. Such appeals reveal the lengths that some will go to avoid a finite beginning for the universe.
source

Perhaps some of our pompous and arrogant devotee's of science should learn some of its laws before pretending to know something others do not.

Tl, dr.

Whenever you invoke magic to explain reality you lose on the spot.

Not knowing is not the same as "therefore god".

 

[VirOptimus]

-snip-

* You are familiar with the Civil War, aren't you? the War Between the States? the North vs the South? Grant vs Lee? freedom vs slavery? the creationists vs the evolutionists?

Creationists vs. evolutionists? In the civil war? Which side was which?

 

[lesliedellow]

Sorry, the ignorance is in the bible and Christianity. Your book and religion are taken from previous religions and repackaged. That applies to dates and traditions as well. Don't worry, Jesus wasn't the first guy to be resurrected, it's an old idea. He also wasn't the first to be born of a virgin. Really, he wasn't the first of anything in religion, just a re-packaging of other gods. I'd be happy to meet your god in person, he's powerless to do anything to me.

Don't tell me. Mithras, Horus, Osiris.....

I wonder which version of that nonsense it is that you have heard?

 

[AV1611VET]

Creationists vs. evolutionists? In the civil war? Which side was which?

By their fruits, ye shall know them.

 

[lesliedellow]

By their fruits, ye shall know them.

Given the way right wing politics seems to accompany fundamentalist religion in America, there can only be one answer to the asked question. The creationists were the confederates.

 

[KWCrazy]

Given the way right wing politics seems to accompany fundamentalist religion in America, there can only be one answer to the asked question.

Now how did I know you were going to be a Hillary supporter?
I guess since you're wrong about everything else, it shows consistency.

 

[lesliedellow]

Now how did I know you were going to be a Hillary supporter?
I guess since you're wrong about everything else, it shows consistency.

For the most part Europeans couldn't care less who Americans elect as their President, but Trump is a running joke over here. No sooner do I think that things seem to have gone quiet on the Trump front, than he plants his foot firmly in his mouth yet again.

That's when he is not firing somebody he hired only a few days previously, that is.

 

[AV1611VET]

For the most part Europeans couldn't care less who Americans elect as their President, but Trump is a running joke over here.

There was a time when Europeans welcomed us over there:

They'll repay the world with:

 

[lesliedellow]

There was a time when Europeans welcomed us over there:

I am not sure what the Second World War has to do with king of the idiots Trump. Apparently you have not heard of the joke, regarding American GIs, which was current in wartime Britain: "Over sexed, over paid and over here."

 

[AV1611VET]

I am not sure what the Second World War has to do with king of the idiots Trump. Apparently you have not heard of the joke, regarding American GIs, which was current in wartime Britain: "Over sexed, over paid and over here."

That's fine.

We have a joke over here too:

Q: Why do boats on Lake Erie have glass bottoms?
A: So they can see the Union Jacks.

 

[lesliedellow]

That's fine.

We have a joke over here too:

Q: Why do boats on Lake Erie have glass bottoms?
A: So they can see the Union Jacks.

It is unlikely to have anybody rolling in the ailes; I had to google it to find out what Lake Erie had to do with anything.

 

[AV1611VET]

It is unlikely to have anybody rolling in the ailes; I had to google it to find out what Lake Erie had to do with anything.

In the War of 1812, England struck from Lake Erie, the Potomac River (in which they burned the White House) ... and the Gulf of Mexico:

 

[Jimmy D]

There was a time when Europeans welcomed us over there:

They'll repay the world with:

"Oooookay.

Not sure what that was all about, but now that it's off your mind, I hope you have a GREAT day!"

Mr Dellow is quite correct though, I'm yet speak to anyone in the UK who doesn't think Trump is a bad joke.

 

[AV1611VET]

Mr Dellow is quite correct though, I'm yet speak to anyone in the UK who doesn't think Trump is a bad joke.

That 'bad joke' just might repeat history.

You do know that England has one of the largest mosques in Europe, do you not?

 

[HitchSlap]

There was a time when Europeans welcomed us over there:

Given what happened in Charlottesville, maybe it's time we welcomed them over here.

 

[HitchSlap]

That 'bad joke' just might repeat history.

You do know that England has one of the largest mosques in Europe, do you not?

The US has 20% higher hate crime than England. So maybe we need a bigger mosque?

 

[lesliedellow]

That 'bad joke' just might repeat history.

You do know that England has one of the largest mosques in Europe, do you not?

So? I suppose Americans still think that the 4.4% of the uk population who are Muslims, are shortly going to have us living under Sharia Law. The other 95.6% might have something to say about that.

 

[Jimmy D]

That 'bad joke' just might repeat history.

You do know that England has one of the largest mosques in Europe, do you not?

Your implied bigotry is noted.

 

[Speedwell]

Now how did I know you were going to be a Hillary supporter?
I guess since you're wrong about everything else, it shows consistency.

How do you know he didn't back Sanders?