How to prove that GOD exists from a scientific point of view?

[Lost Witness]

I don't have the same position as you, so you conclude that I must be lying when I said I have read the Bible.

There's that arrogance again. The idea that anyone who reads the Bible MUST reach the same conclusion as you.

I have to agree that you both wouldn't have the same conclusion to the LORDS scripture as it's the Holy Spirit that Grants Genuine Discernment of GODs Word.

 

[Kylie]

I have to agree that you both wouldn't have the same conclusion to the LORDS scripture as it's the Holy Spirit that Grants Genuine Discernment of GODs Word.

How can something that exists in reality that is genuine be different for two different people?

 

[AV1611VET]

How can something that exists in reality that is genuine be different for two different people?

I'll bet you dollars to doughnuts that my birth certificate and driver's license are both different than yours.

 

[Lost Witness]

How can something that exists in reality that is genuine be different for two different people?

Because the LORDS word is alive,
each verse has several meanings.
Which is why true Discernment comes from the LORDS Holy Spirit,
It's through his Holy Spirit that scriptures meaning is revealed.

 

[Kylie]

Because the LORDS word is alive,
each verse has several meanings.
Which is why true Discernment comes from the LORDS Holy Spirit,
It's through his Holy Spirit that scriptures meaning is revealed.

Yeah, things that are actually real don't do that.

You don't get different people measuring the height of the Eiffel Tower to be different values. Different measurements don't show different values for the speed of light. If it's not the same for everyone, it's not objectively true, and you're not going to convince me that it's anything more than your beliefs.

 

[Kylie]

I'll bet you dollars to doughnuts that my birth certificate and driver's license are both different than yours.

Yeah, but that's measuring two different people. You are not the same person as me, are you, AV?

Do you not understand the concept I am trying to explain here?

 

[Lost Witness]

Yeah, things that are actually real don't do that.

You don't get different people measuring the height of the Eiffel Tower to be different values. Different measurements don't show different values for the speed of light. If it's not the same for everyone, it's not objectively true, and you're not going to convince me that it's anything more than your beliefs.

The Holy Spirit gives discernment of the Word of GOD,
It's not a belief, it's Truth.

 

[Kylie]

The Holy Spirit gives discernment of the Word of GOD,
It's not a belief, it's Truth.

You believe it is the truth.

It's still a belief.

 

[timothyu]

If who a person actually is was somehow separate from their physical body, why would changes to that body result in changes to the personality?

If your car is acting up mechanically, does it not affect your driving?

 

[Lost Witness]

You believe it is the truth.

It's still a belief.

No, I Absolutely Know it's True.
What I do believe is i'm talking to someone named "kylie"

 

[Kylie]

No, I Absolutely Know it's True.
What I do believe is i'm talking to someone named "kylie"

Beliefs do not become truths no matter how strongly you believe them to be truths.

 

[Lost Witness]

Beliefs do not become truths no matter how strongly you believe them to be truths.

I Believe i'm talking to someone named Kylie?

 

[YahuahSaves]

The only hurt has been arrogant Christians

...

And belief in Jesus being God is RELIGION.

Religion is man-made.

I don't have the same position as you, so you conclude that I must be lying when I said I have read the Bible.

I didn't say you lied, I wasn't sure if I remembered you saying you read the bible or it was other posters here, but just incase you had read it, then you mustn't have interpreted it properly, otherwise you would have understood my reference to living stones.

There's that arrogance again. The idea that anyone who reads the Bible MUST reach the same conclusion as you.

How is it arrogant? Refer to previous post. Just because someone tells you that you are misunderstanding something they say doesn't make that arrogance. You've corrected me quite a bit in your posts as well when it comes to my "misunderstanding".

I said a change to a person's body can result in changes to their personality. People have received brain injuries and they have become completely different people.

What about changes to the brain?
Hey there's a scientific study for you!
See if there's any difference to the connections made in the brain between believers and non-believers? I know they tried to do the same study with psychopaths in the general population. But humans don't know enough about the brain as yet, and I highly doubt they will.

Now tell me, do you think that a person finding religion changes the physical structure of their brains?

Not physical. But again, you're limiting everything to the purely physical realm.

Belief in Jesus is a religious belief.

OK seeing as you're not getting my point, let's say Jesus is not a belief, but an understanding of who he is. Religion is not an understanding, it's a bunch of rules and rituals, which often leads to a works-based salvation ideology.

Irrelevant. Just because the Bible makes a claim it does not mean that claim is true.

You could say the same about scientific theory.

Yes you are doing it, the moment you say only a "true" Christian can do it.

Trying to cherry-pick what I said again

I'd be happy to, once I am shown evidence that he exists.

That's not humility. God doesn't have to give you any evidence of his existence at all.

I pointed out that I have indeed done X and I did NOT get result Y.

You said you tried praying to make your husband happy because you love him. You then didn't even mention you had any desire to know God in that moment, but did you? In your heart?

That's not twisting what you said.

You said I accused you of not listening but I actually said your heart posture needs to be right and make sure to listen. It's not the same thing, you did twist my words.

you all but accused me of lying when I said I had asked God to reveal himself to me.

Were you thinking of your husbands response or Gods in that the moment? Intention really matters. I'm not accusing you of lying. I'm going by the things you yourself wrote. "I did it for my husband because I love him" was the gist of it.

You are also showing your arrogance again by assuming that I must hold the position I do because a Christian must have hurt me.

Refer to your own post at the top of mine.

This conversation is circular. I was hoping to get you to think more deeply about these things, but it's obviously making you upset.

 

[AV1611VET]

Religion is man-made.

Indeed.

Christianity is not a religion, per se.

It is a spousal relationship with Jesus Christ.

2 Corinthians 11:2 For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ.

 

[Lost Witness]

Were you thinking of your husbands response or Gods in that the moment? Intention really matters. I'm not accusing you of lying. I'm going by the things you yourself wrote. "I did it for my husband because I love him" was the gist of it.

^^^
this is true,
I myself, Prayed because I didn't want to leave my son without a Dad.
The LORD answered.

 

[Kylie]

Religion is man-made.

Agreed.

I didn't say you lied, I wasn't sure if I remembered you saying you read the bible or it was other posters here, but just incase you had read it, then you mustn't have interpreted it properly, otherwise you would have understood my reference to living stones.

Yes you did.

Pipp@: If you practice the example given the results will speak for themselves.
Kylie: Already have done, as I've told you.
Pipp@: Doubt it.

You said you doubted I had done as you asked, despite the fact that I outright told you that I had done so.

How is it arrogant? Refer to previous post. Just because someone tells you that you are misunderstanding something they say doesn't make that arrogance. You've corrected me quite a bit in your posts as well when it comes to my "misunderstanding".

It is arrogant because you assume that I misunderstand solely because I don't agree with you. You just can't conceive that maybe you are wrong, not me.

What about changes to the brain?
Hey there's a scientific study for you!
See if there's any difference to the connections made in the brain between believers and non-believers? I know they tried to do the same study with psychopaths in the general population. But humans don't know enough about the brain as yet, and I highly doubt they will.

We aren't talking about the differences between the brains of believers compared to non-believers.

We are talking about whether there is some spirit that exists independently of our bodies.

There is a literal ton of evidence that shows that people's personality can change if their brain structures are changed.

Not physical. But again, you're limiting everything to the purely physical realm.

You've done nothing to show that the existence of the spiritual is true.

OK seeing as you're not getting my point, let's say Jesus is not a belief, but an understanding of who he is. Religion is not an understanding, it's a bunch of rules and rituals, which often leads to a works-based salvation ideology.

You aren't getting my point.

Believing that Jesus is real and the son of God and all that, THAT is a religion.

You could say the same about scientific theory.

No you can't. Science has testable claims that have been tested and shown to be accurate. Religion does not.

You don't understand science at all, do you?

Trying to cherry-pick what I said again

I'm literally quoting your words, and you've said the same thing several times now.

That's not humility. God doesn't have to give you any evidence of his existence at all.

Then he shouldn't expect me to believe in him, should he?

You said you tried praying to make your husband happy because you love him. You then didn't even mention you had any desire to know God in that moment, but did you? In your heart?

Then, as now, I want the truth.

I am not going to assume what the truth is and then decide I want that.

You said I accused you of not listening but I actually said your heart posture needs to be right and make sure to listen. It's not the same thing, you did twist my words.

And, of course, the correct heart posture is whatever is required to reach the same conclusion as you, isn't it?

Were you thinking of your husbands response or Gods in that the moment? Intention really matters. I'm not accusing you of lying. I'm going by the things you yourself wrote. "I did it for my husband because I love him" was the gist of it.

As I've said, I'm not going to assume God exists. I want the truth. If that's God then so be it.

This conversation is circular. I was hoping to get you to think more deeply about these things, but it's obviously making you upset.

What's upsetting is that you think you can tell me why I hold the position I do when you don't know me at all.

 

[Kylie]

I Believe i'm talking to someone named Kylie?

And you have evidence for that. That evidence being posts written by this "Kylie" that are on the net for all to see.

So when you have testable evidence that can be independently checked by everyone, that's just a "belief."

When there is no independent evidence and no one else can check it, all of a sudden, that's absolute 100% accurate knowledge that can't be disputed.

Right...

 

[YahuahSaves]

^^^
this is true,
I myself, Prayed because I didn't want to leave my son without a Dad.
The LORD answered.

That's different J, you asked for his HELP.
You didn't ask him to prove himself to you.

 

[Lost Witness]

And you have evidence for that. That evidence being posts written by this "Kylie" that are on the net for all to see.

So when you have testable evidence that can be independently checked by everyone, that's just a "belief."

When there is no independent evidence and no one else can check it, all of a sudden, that's absolute 100% accurate knowledge that can't be disputed.

Right..

I can't Personally prove what you've said,
I choose to believe I'm talking to a kylie.

 

[Lost Witness]

That's different J, you asked for his HELP.
You didn't ask him to prove himself to you.

I did ask for his help,
But it's still the intention that matters.
now for instance,
Say i was Married for sake of the argument and my wife was Christian,
wanted me to become Christian,
I would.
I'd think about all the time I spent with her, how i grew to love and trust her
I'd use that to build my own trust that my wife wouldn't be lying to me or trying to deceive me
I'd simply Pray and tell the LORD that i want to share everything with her from the bottom of my heart.