How many agree with this

[LittleLambofJesus]

I could not disagree more.
Of course, I won't speak for Catholics

In some ways so do I. But now instead of just 1 billion RCs to contend with, we will have 2 billion if you include the Muslims

 

[Rdr Iakovos]

God can be discovered through natural means, as St. Paul testifies. He also testifies that the pagans with the altar to the unknown God were worshipping the true God without knowing it.

Muslims don't worship contingent beings as idolators do (including polytheists). Rather, like Jews and other non-Christian monotheists they acknowledge the one transcendant God, Creator of all that can be known by natural means. Just because they believe something to be His revelation that isn't, doesn't mean it's the not the same God.

A good read on this is the chapter on Islam in Hillaire Belloc's book, "The Great Heresies."

St. Gregory VII, a crusader, affirmed the same thing as did St. John Damascene who described Islam as a heresy.

And I shall create a God, call Him Jack, and attribute to Him interactions with Moses, and voila! same God as y'all, sans the higher revelation of the Christian Church. I shall then pursue converts among your people, and subdue your lands- and ye shall call me brother.

what utter tripe.
Baal worship, the worship of my brother.
Lord have mercy.

 

[sunlover1]

Sunlover, you're right that there is no salvation in Islam, and that it is only by Christ that we are saved... and indeed there are many lies in their religion...
but that does not mean that there isn't ANY truth there too, after all they also believe that there is one God who is the Creator. So they got that part right so do you see, they don't really know God the way He wants to be known, but that little part of truth they have could not have come from the devil. So it's not really that they believe in a God of their own making, but rather they have a corrupted, incomplete understanding of the real God. (and of course this is not enough for salvation, since we can only be saved by Christ..and God wants to bring them to the light).

This is a very controversy issue and even more so because of
the fact that the pope says what he says.
But if you read the Koran (sp) and compare it to the God of
Scripture, how can we say it's the same God that they 'worship'?
How bout the hindu gods, or the Sikh God? Sikhs say God is
one, etc.
But like I said, it's a very controversial topic, and either way,
I'd never tell them they're cool with their beliefs. Instead
they deserve to be told the truth.
And in fact, they know about Jesus Christ, and deny Him,
so where does that leave them then?

What makes your religion/belief correct and not others?

Jesus.

 

[ScottBot]

[/FONT]

Is the god of Islam and Roman Catholicism one and the same god?

The God of the Jews, Muslims, and Christians is the same God.

Of course, the Jews and the Muslims erroneously reject the divinity of Christ, but we all share a common belief in God the Father.

 

[MoNiCa4316]

Basically all that JPII was trying to say there is that we all believe that there is a God. This belief can not be from the devil, because the fact that there is a God is the truth, not a lie. In every way that Islam differs from Christianity, it is wrong. (and no one is saying it can lead to salvation)

Hope that makes sense!

Peace

monica

 

[nitecrawlur]

This is a very controversy issue and even more so because of
the fact that the pope says what he says.
But if you read the Koran (sp) and compare it to the God of
Scripture, how can we say it's the same God that they 'worship'?
How bout the hindu gods, or the Sikh God? Sikhs say God is
one, etc.
But like I said, it's a very controversial topic, and either way,
I'd never tell them they're cool with their beliefs. Instead
they deserve to be told the truth.
And in fact, they know about Jesus Christ, and deny Him,
so where does that leave them then?

Jesus.

And how does Jesus make your belief correct and not others. What I am getting at is why is your belief more real than an opposing one?

Saying "Jesus" is the reason why yours is correct is like me saying my car is the best car because it has my name on the license plate.

 

[MoNiCa4316]

And how does Jesus make your belief correct and not others. What I am getting at is why is your belief more real than an opposing one?

Saying "Jesus" is the reason why yours is correct is like me saying my car is the best car because it has my name on the license plate.

because no person in the history of the world could defeat death, except Jesus...and He proved it by the Resurrection, which was witnessed by more than 500

 

[nitecrawlur]

because no person in the history of the world could defeat death, except Jesus...and He proved it by the Resurrection, which was witnessed by more than 500

what physical evidence supports the ressurrection of Jesus?

People die and get revived all the time by the way. There is medical record of it. It's not all that uncommon. They get revived because of technology which makes it possible. Unlike 2000 years ago when that technology did not exist. Which would make it near impossible.

 

[MoNiCa4316]

what physical evidence supports the ressurrection of Jesus?

People die and get revived all the time by the way. There is medical record of it. It's not all that uncommon. They get revived because of technology which makes it possible. Unlike 2000 years ago when that technology did not exist. Which would make it near impossible.

but eventually they still die (again)

Jesus defeated death, He is alive forever...and because He is God and reconciled humanity to the Father by the Incarnation, in Him, we also defeat death and have eternal life

what type of evidence are you looking for?

Peace

monica

 

[nitecrawlur]

Ahh, the predictable appeal to relativism.

The question posed should be "is there objective truth?"
That is to say, is there such a thing as truth?

In science, there is no relativism- yet we should believe somehow that in philosophy or theology (a subset of the former).
pffft.

The logical outcome of relativism is that there is also no right and no wrong, beyond function.

Here it is as though you are implying that there is no truth.

So you are saying "it is true that there is no truth" which is a contradiction within itself. if it were true that there is no truth, then that statement could not be true.

There is relativism in science. They are called theories. The relativism disappears when theories become proof.

 

[nitecrawlur]

but eventually they still die (again)

Jesus defeated death, He is alive forever...and because He is God and reconciled humanity to the Father by the Incarnation, in Him, we also defeat death and have eternal life

what type of evidence are you looking for?

Peace

monica

physical, something that I could see for myself how Jesus (assuming he did exist) resurected and ascended into heaven as God.

The Bible is not evidence since it was written by humanity. Your word and preaching is worthless as it is mearly an opinion.

So I ask again, what evidence can be given to support the theory that Jesus/God is the one true God assuming that a supernatural-mega daddy does exist.

 

[MoNiCa4316]

physical, something that I could see for myself how Jesus (assuming he did exist) resurected and ascended into heaven as God.

do you mean a videotape? how can you 'see for yourself' if it happened 2000 years ago?

The Bible is not evidence since it was written by humanity. Your word and preaching is worthless as it is mearly an opinion.

have you read the book 'case for Christ' by Lee Strobel? it presents a pretty good case for the witnesses of the Resurrection not lying and not being crazy...and the earliest manuscripts are from 50-70 AD!

So I ask again, what evidence can be given to support the theory that Jesus/God is the one true God assuming that a supernatural-mega daddy does exist.

well apart from what I wrote before,

"Faith is to believe what we do not see, and the reward of this faith is to see and enjoy what we believe." St. Augustine"

simply put, you can know that He is real by experiencing a relationship with Him here on earth

 

[sunlover1]

And how does Jesus make your belief correct and not others. What I am getting at is why is your belief more real than an opposing one?

Saying "Jesus" is the reason why yours is correct is like me saying my car is the best car because it has my name on the license plate.

But I believe Scripture.
So it wouldnt be the same.
Why does Jesus make me believe
that my fiath is correct? Because
He came for us. All other religions
are man reaching for, searching
for God; searching for nirvana,
enlightenment... Christianity
is God seeking us. He came to us,
in the form of a servant, gave His
all for us. He wanted a son, wanted
a son to have a kingdom, Adam blew it,
Jesus was the way. So our God,
actually came down to us, in the flesh,
in the form of Jesus Christ, the perfect
theology.

But I"m guessing you're looking for a more
logical and tangible reason.

God revealed Himself to me at a young age,
and He's never ever let me down. He answers
specific prayers, He's healed before my eyes,
saved my life on more than one occasion.
and always in the name of Jesus Christ.

In the kingdom of Heaven, if you want to live,
you must die, if you have lack, you give,
if you desire greatness, you serve...
But most people arent excited about that
type of life, sacrificing now for the glory
later. To me it's a double blessing. I cant
imagine living any other way. High on
God is a gzillion times better than any
high drugs or hang over in the morning
alcohol can offer.
My fingers are tired, feel free to ask me
anything.

Maybe that helps?
sunlover

 

[ScottBot]

what physical evidence supports the ressurrection of Jesus?

People die and get revived all the time by the way. There is medical record of it. It's not all that uncommon. They get revived because of technology which makes it possible. Unlike 2000 years ago when that technology did not exist. Which would make it near impossible.

Blessed are those who believe but have not seen.


This is the mystery of Christ.


Its is called faith.

 

[MoNiCa4316]

But I believe Scripture.
So it wouldnt be the same.
Why does Jesus make me believe
that my fiath is correct? Because
He came for us. All other religions
are man reaching for, searching
for God; searching for nirvana,
enlightenment... Christianity
is God seeking us. He came to us,
in the form of a servant, gave His
all for us. He wanted a son, wanted
a son to have a kingdom, Adam blew it,
Jesus was the way. So our God,
actually came down to us, in the flesh,
in the form of Jesus Christ, the perfect
theology.

But I"m guessing you're looking for a more
logical and tangible reason.

God revealed Himself to me at a young age,
and He's never ever let me down. He answers
specific prayers, He's healed before my eyes,
saved my life on more than one occasion.
and always in the name of Jesus Christ.

In the kingdom of Heaven, if you want to live,
you must die, if you have lack, you give,
if you desire greatness, you serve...
But most people arent excited about that
type of life, sacrificing now for the glory
later. To me it's a double blessing. I cant
imagine living any other way. High on
God is a gzillion times better than any
high drugs or hang over in the morning
alcohol can offer.
My fingers are tired, feel free to ask me
anything.

Maybe that helps?
sunlover

amen sister hehe..

God bless

monica

 

[nitecrawlur]

do you mean a videotape? how can you 'see for yourself' if it happened 2000 years ago?



have you read the book 'case for Christ' by Lee Strobel? it presents a pretty good case for the witnesses of the Resurrection not lying and not being crazy...and the earliest manuscripts are from 50-70 AD!



well apart from what I wrote before,

"Faith is to believe what we do not see, and the reward of this faith is to see and enjoy what we believe." St. Augustine"

simply put, you can know that He is real by experiencing a relationship with Him here on earth

Why do you believe what you can't see? If you were brought as a muslim would you still believe in the same things as you do now? Probably not. So the only reason you believe what you do is because it is what you were taught.

When you say "He is real by experiencing a relationship with Him" do you mean like a child has a relationship with his/her imaginary friend?

 

[MoNiCa4316]

God is love...He came to us and gave His all to save us, even His life..as Sunlover said.. and if we respond to His love, and believe in Him and love Him back, then we can experience knowing Him in a beautiful way... it is only through love that we can know God, through putting our trust in Him and following Him and showing His love to others.. we can pray to Him, or worship, and feel His presence, not as a mere emotion but it goes deeper than that... and I know He is real because for a long time I tried to change, but nothing worked except when I asked Him to change me..I look at my Christian brothers and sisters and see God working in their lives too

 

[MoNiCa4316]

Why do you believe what you can't see? If you were brought as a muslim would you still believe in the same things as you do now? Probably not. So the only reason you believe what you do is because it is what you were taught.

I was actually brought up as an agnostic, and wasn't taught anything I even made fun of Christians at one point of my life

When you say "He is real by experiencing a relationship with Him" do you mean like a child has a relationship with his/her imaginary friend?

No, cause the child does not actually hear from their imaginary friend, but we can hear from God, and not only that but get prayers answered in concrete ways... and when children grow up they usually see that the 'friend' was imaginary, but in the Christian's life, you just see God more and more with time and He becomes more real to you... it's not something you grow 'out of', unless you decide to reject Him

it's hard to describe...to put into words...knowing Jesus is not quite like anything else that we experience

 

[nitecrawlur]

But I believe Scripture.
So it wouldnt be the same.
Why does Jesus make me believe
that my fiath is correct? Because
He came for us. All other religions
are man reaching for, searching
for God; searching for nirvana,
enlightenment... Christianity
is God seeking us. He came to us,
in the form of a servant, gave His
all for us. He wanted a son, wanted
a son to have a kingdom, Adam blew it,
Jesus was the way. So our God,
actually came down to us, in the flesh,
in the form of Jesus Christ, the perfect
theology.

But I"m guessing you're looking for a more
logical and tangible reason.

God revealed Himself to me at a young age,
and He's never ever let me down. He answers
specific prayers, He's healed before my eyes,
saved my life on more than one occasion.
and always in the name of Jesus Christ.

In the kingdom of Heaven, if you want to live,
you must die, if you have lack, you give,
if you desire greatness, you serve...
But most people arent excited about that
type of life, sacrificing now for the glory
later. To me it's a double blessing. I cant
imagine living any other way. High on
God is a gzillion times better than any
high drugs or hang over in the morning
alcohol can offer.
My fingers are tired, feel free to ask me
anything.

Maybe that helps?
sunlover

I understand what you are saying...kind of. But again there is no evidence. You SAY these things, but they are only words. Not physical evidence. For example we know dinosaurs lived because we have physical evidence of them. As for Jesus or God there is nothing of that type to support it.

When you say he answers specific prayers: you can make anything out of anything when your mind looks for it. It's a natural occurance and is scientifically proven.

When you say he has healed before your eyes, I'm willing to bet that there was no medical follow up to assess possible theories what what really happened.

And if you mean literally that he saved your life, I'm sure that it was mearly coincidence on whatever the scenerio was. I could be more specific if you provide more detail.

As far as the "high" you get: I was raised Christian and I remember the feeling when everyone gets excited in church and so on. That is a mental emotion that is triggered by stimulating certain parts of the brain. Basically what I'm saying is you are capable of creating any feeling you want whether it be concious or not. I get a high when I watched this years superbowl on tv in the fourth quarter.

To add, I hope you're not implying that I abuse controled substances. Or for that matter I hope you aren't trying to bribe me into your belief under the assumption that I do by saying "your high" is better than mine.

 

[MoNiCa4316]

Blessed are those who believe but have not seen.


This is the mystery of Christ.


Its is called faith.

yes, it all happens by faith we do not see God yet...well most of us, lol...but someday we will...