How long do I stand?

[ido]

I think you misunderstood what I said, I did not say to live in gang land to get out of paying 25%, I said the father could live in gang land so that he CAN pay the 25%. I never said student loans were her problem but that does not mean the father should default on them they still have to be paid and can be substantial in some cases so adjustments would need to be made so he could still pay 1K in CS and pay his loans which means living in a rough area, that way he could still have 1-2K in disposable income in case he wanted to buy a snowmachine or an air plane.

When I say student loans im not talking about going to school im talking about debt that is owed from going to school long ago in which you already have a degree for it which is how you are making 4K a month net.

I think the point BarelyBreathing is trying to make is that it is possible to live comfortably in a nice neighborhood, including all utilities on around $3K/month. I live in a middle class neighborhood and drive a moderate car and my "must pay" expenses each month come to just under $3K. No, I don't have student loans - so I can't speak to what it would be like if I did have those bills. It probably would have meant buying in a different neighborhood that was equivalent to the one I am in now, but with older homes than my home.

 

[pepper1]

I think the point BarelyBreathing is trying to make is that it is possible to live comfortably in a nice neighborhood, including all utilities on around $3K/month. I live in a middle class neighborhood and drive a moderate car and my "must pay" expenses each month come to just under $3K. No, I don't have student loans - so I can't speak to what it would be like if I did have those bills. It probably would have meant buying in a different neighborhood that was equivalent to the one I am in now, but with older homes than my home.

You could live for 3K a month even with student loans the problem is you would be living from pay check to pay check and would NEVER have money for anything extra until the kid was 18, the student loans would push you right to the edge of 3K a month and potentially push you over. When my ex left me it cost me about 3200 a month to maintain what I had and I did not have a car payment so had I had a car payment I would have been at close to 4K, fortunatly there were no kids. This does not include having to replace an oven that is leaking gas or a broken washer and dryer or a 1500$ mechanic visit when the check engine light came on, and thats only because I know a good mechanic, had I gone to a garage off the street it would have cost me twice that for what I needed to get done, I was lucky I had that 800$ a month extra considering my credit was shot after the divorce. Had things been different I would have had to sell the condo and move to a rough area so I could pay all my bills and have enough extra to save for emergencys like a check engine light, you can usually rent a room out of a 4 plex or something for 400$ month which is way cheaper than my 1800$ condo and dues but thats because its in a decent area, to get 300-400$ a month you have to live in a fairly rough area.

 

[ido]

You could live for 3K a month even with student loans the problem is you would be living from pay check to pay check and would NEVER have money for anything extra until the kid was 18, the student loans would push you right to the edge of 3K a month and potentially push you over. When my ex left me it cost me about 3200 a month to maintain what I had and I did not have a car payment so had I had a car payment I would have been at close to 4K, fortunatly there were no kids. This does not include having to replace an oven that is leaking gas or a broken washer and dryer or a 1500$ mechanic visit when the check engine light came on, and thats only because I know a good mechanic, had I gone to a garage off the street it would have cost me twice that for what I needed to get done, I was lucky I had that 800$ a month extra considering my credit was shot after the divorce. Had things been different I would have had to sell the condo and move to a rough area so I could pay all my bills and have enough extra to save for emergencys like a check engine light, you can usually rent a room out of a 4 plex or something for 400$ month which is way cheaper than my 1800$ condo and dues but thats because its in a decent area, to get 300-400$ a month you have to live in a fairly rough area.

Trust me, I know all about living paycheck to paycheck. My car payment is modest - $250/month. I can't imagine owning a car that would cost me $800/month, although I know people who do it. lol

Unfortunately, saving for extras and emergencies becomes a luxury in a divorce. It's a luxury for a lot of families that are not divorced, truthfully.

I could have put myself in a better position if I would have demanded half of my ex-husbands 401K and Roth IRA, but I wasn't looking to stick it to him. I wanted what was fair for the kids and that's it. It's all I've ever wanted.

Cost of living for an area obviously plays into how far a dollar goes. I own a 3 bedroom home and don't pay near what you pay for my mortgage. We even have a lake in the back, so it's worth more for being considered waterfront property. Had I tried to buy this home in my hometown that I moved from after my divorce, I never would have been able to afford it b/c of the cost of living. It was one of the choices/sacrifices I made through the divorce. I left the place I had called home for 30+ years so that I could afford to keep my children in the lifestyle they were accustomed to.

 

[pepper1]

Trust me, I know all about living paycheck to paycheck. My car payment is modest - $250/month. I can't imagine owning a car that would cost me $800/month, although I know people who do it. lol

Unfortunately, saving for extras and emergencies becomes a luxury in a divorce. It's a luxury for a lot of families that are not divorced, truthfully.

I could have put myself in a better position if I would have demanded half of my ex-husbands 401K and Roth IRA, but I wasn't looking to stick it to him. I wanted what was fair for the kids and that's it. It's all I've ever wanted.

Cost of living for an area obviously plays into how far a dollar goes. I own a 3 bedroom home and don't pay near what you pay for my mortgage. We even have a lake in the back, so it's worth more for being considered waterfront property. Had I tried to buy this home in my hometown that I moved from after my divorce, I never would have been able to afford it b/c of the cost of living. It was one of the choices/sacrifices I made through the divorce. I left the place I had called home for 30+ years so that I could afford to keep my children in the lifestyle they were accustomed to.

Its debatable if saving for car repairs is a luxury or not or a gas leak in your home (I am finally to a point where I can make a balloon payment on my student loans and pay 1/3 of them off with one check, but thats after having been divorced for quite a while). My city has a high cost of living unfortunatly what I do requires me to live in specific areas I cant just live anywhere for my occupation (I could also move to libia or azubijan and work and bank but its tough to find a GF in thoes places), of course if my world fell apart thoes are sort of my last ditch places to just go and stay and make a really good living. I would love a place with a lake and a jet ski or float plane but I will probably stay in my condo until I die because its exponentially more expensive to upgrade from where I am now. It was fortunate that you had a job that allowed you to move around.

I guess it just depends on everyones situation, but all I was saying is that if the CS is causing the father to move into a rough area where he will be spending visitation with his kid where gang members have gun battles every now and then the court should be taking things like that into consideration and his occupation may not allow him to move to another city with a lower cost of living, unfortunatly they dont and I have a friend where that exact scenario played out and he worked construction and made good money when he had work but was always on and off jobs because thats how constuction goes but the court did not take into account that his work is sporatic so he was always in and out of arrears and living off his GF and stayed with me for the summer, there are some serious issues with the family law courts when stuff like that is happening.

 

[BarelyBreathing]

I think you misunderstood what I said, I did not say to live in gang land to get out of paying 25%, I said the father could live in gang land so that he CAN pay the 25%.

I understood that perfectly. Apparently you misunderstood me. I asked if you think his wife and child(ren) should then be forced to live in gangland because he refuses to pay child support , which leaves her living off her minimum wage while ha makes his 80K a year.

I never said student loans were her problem but that does not mean the father should default on them they still have to be paid and can be substantial in some cases so adjustments would need to be made so he could still pay 1K in CS and pay his loans which means living in a rough area, that way he could still have 1-2K in disposable income in case he wanted to buy a snowmachine or an air plane.

I agree that loans should not be defaulted on. Must be nice to have that type of disposable income. I'd never be able to afford a snow machine or airplane-- not that I ever feel a need for either of those luxury items. I am all for simplicity and being self-sufficient.

When I say student loans im not talking about going to school im talking about debt that is owed from going to school long ago in which you already have a degree for it which is how you are making 4K a month net.

I know what student loans are. I am well aware of what you just stated. Apparently you misunderstood me again. The fact that he has a degree is partly why he is making more money-- has a higher paying job. His student loans should have no bearing on how much CS he pays out. If they reduce a man's CS so that he can pay his student loans, then they should increase it accordingly so that his ex-wife can go to school and also get a higher paying job. My point is that neither should pay for the others education, and student loans have should have absolutely no bearing on how much CS he pays.

I have a friend where that exact scenario played out and he worked construction and made good money when he had work but was always on and off jobs because thats how constuction goes but the court did not take into account that his work is sporatic so he was always in and out of arrears and living off his GF and stayed with me for the summer, there are some serious issues with the family law courts when stuff like that is happening.

He sounds familiar...... And I will refrain from commenting further.

 

[pepper1]

I understood that perfectly. Apparently you misunderstood me. I asked if you think his wife and child(ren) should then be forced to live in gangland because he refuses to pay child support , which leaves her living off her minimum wage while ha makes his 80K a year.

I may regretfully have to put you on ignore, because you saying you understood me completely and then making statments that are contrary to what I just said is pointless. I said HE would live in gang land not her or her child except when the child has visitation with dad and that way HE CAN pay his 25%. This is your last chance.

I agree that loans should not be defaulted on. Must be nice to have that type of disposable income. I'd never be able to afford a snow machine or airplane-- not that I ever feel a need for either of those luxury items. I am all for simplicity and being self-sufficient.

It is nice to go through 5 years of engineering eductaion and be strung out on debt for it to actually pay off. The whole point of investments is for it to pay out, you dont invest money to loose it.

I know what student loans are. I am well aware of what you just stated. Apparently you misunderstood me again. The fact that he has a degree is partly why he is making more money-- has a higher paying job. His student loans should have no bearing on how much CS he pays out. If they reduce a man's CS so that he can pay his student loans, then they should increase it accordingly so that his ex-wife can go to school and also get a higher paying job. My point is that neither should pay for the others education, and student loans have should have absolutely no bearing on how much CS he pays.

This is the last time I will state this I agree HIS student loans are not HER fault and his CS should not be reduced due to them, I am saying the court should look at the fact that he may have to go into forclosure due to CS amounts and if not everyone better be ok with child visitation in gang land. Again this is the last time.

He sounds familiar...... And I will refrain from commenting further.

He got a raw deal and if you want to make snide remarks towards someone that was almost put out on the streets because of family law court you can go on my ignore list.

 

[eatenbylocusts]

I make "almost" 6 figures (a little over 80K) and I can barely pay my student loans after uncle sam gets his fingers in my cookie jar and health insurance and 3% towards my 401K. Also why dont you get your mom or a friend to watch the kid part of the time to take some of the slack off his dad and yourself.
also if the kid is in school the day care should be nominal if anything, keep in mind depending on the situation it will cost you in the next life if you are not doing all you can to aliviate some pressure on him.

I get 0 child support for my two kids. I live with my mom and have to hear about how I'm just using her as a baby sitter, etc. She only takes them to school about twice and week and usually only needs to pick up the smallest. Most people have to work, so there aren't a whole lot of friends to use for baby sitting. And without my mom, I'd have to pay for child care because my dd can't go to school at the time I go to work and I get off about 2 hours after she gets out. It ain't that easy.

 

[BarelyBreathing]

I may regretfully have to put you on ignore, because you saying you understood me completely and then making statments that are contrary to what I just said is pointless. I said HE would live in gang land not her or her child except when the child has visitation with dad and that way HE CAN pay his 25%. This is your last chance.

He got a raw deal and if you want to make snide remarks towards someone that was almost put out on the streets because of family law court you can go on my ignore list.

Pepper, if you want to put me on ignore then do it. I'm sure that you don't need anyone's permission to do so. I understood perfectly what you said and my comments were not contrary. It is not my fault if you are unable to understand what I wrote.

Want me to try and make it simpler?

You said, and I will repeat it so that you know I got it, that he will have ot live in gangland so he can pay his 25%...... and I said, would you rather he didn't pay it and she and her child live in gangland. There is a flip side. If you are unable to see the consequence to the action, then I can't help you there. From what you said, he pays = he lives in gangland (because the money goes to her and he is unable to afford any better). So, the flip side would be that he doesn't pay = she and the child are forced to live in gangland (because she is now having to live off of minimum wage and support at least 2, while he keps all his 80K and supports one).


I never made snide remarks about your friend. I said I would refrain from commenting. Would you like me to comment?

 

[ido]

Its debatable if saving for car repairs is a luxury or not or a gas leak in your home (I am finally to a point where I can make a balloon payment on my student loans and pay 1/3 of them off with one check, but thats after having been divorced for quite a while). My city has a high cost of living unfortunatly what I do requires me to live in specific areas I cant just live anywhere for my occupation (I could also move to libia or azubijan and work and bank but its tough to find a GF in thoes places), of course if my world fell apart thoes are sort of my last ditch places to just go and stay and make a really good living. I would love a place with a lake and a jet ski or float plane but I will probably stay in my condo until I die because its exponentially more expensive to upgrade from where I am now. It was fortunate that you had a job that allowed you to move around.

I didn't have a job that allowed me to move. I was basically unemployed and had to find a FT job. Not easy when you're a newly single mom with two children under the age of 5. Not many people want to hire you.

I'm a little confused. You have the married icon, but you just mentioned living somewhere that you could find a GF. Are you married or not?

I guess it just depends on everyones situation, but all I was saying is that if the CS is causing the father to move into a rough area where he will be spending visitation with his kid where gang members have gun battles every now and then the court should be taking things like that into consideration and his occupation may not allow him to move to another city with a lower cost of living, unfortunatly they dont and I have a friend where that exact scenario played out and he worked construction and made good money when he had work but was always on and off jobs because thats how constuction goes but the court did not take into account that his work is sporatic so he was always in and out of arrears and living off his GF and stayed with me for the summer, there are some serious issues with the family law courts when stuff like that is happening.

My ex-husband used to work a seasonal job - meaning he made more money in the winter months and less money in the summer months. His salary during the summer months was lower than his monthy support amount, so the courts allowed him to pay less to me during the summer months and make up the difference during the winter months.

What happened to your friend is unfortunate, but is not always the case. Family courts do try to work with both parents, in my experience.

 

[pepper1]

I didn't have a job that allowed me to move. I was basically unemployed and had to find a FT job. Not easy when you're a newly single mom with two children under the age of 5. Not many people want to hire you.

I'm a little confused. You have the married icon, but you just mentioned living somewhere that you could find a GF. Are you married or not?



My ex-husband used to work a seasonal job - meaning he made more money in the winter months and less money in the summer months. His salary during the summer months was lower than his monthy support amount, so the courts allowed him to pay less to me during the summer months and make up the difference during the winter months.

What happened to your friend is unfortunate, but is not always the case. Family courts do try to work with both parents, in my experience.

My statement about moving to libia was a worse case scenario if my currant wife were to divorce me or some other such thing, at least I have an ejection seat because of the nature of my work I can go over seas. The USA is allowing its infrastructure to crumble so if you are allowing your nation to fall apart litterally you dont have much need for engineers.....at least until buildings start falling down, bridges are already falling down like in minnasota of course the longer you wait the more expensive it gets and if there are not enough projects to keep engineers busy they are going to go do other things or go over seas and its going to cost you and arm and a leg to get them back. I know alot of engineers that are getting tired of being treated like general laborers when we should be treated like doctors anyways I digress.

I dont know what FT is?

 

[pepper1]

Pepper, if you want to put me on ignore then do it. I'm sure that you don't need anyone's permission to do so. I understood perfectly what you said and my comments were not contrary. It is not my fault if you are unable to understand what I wrote.

Want me to try and make it simpler?

You said, and I will repeat it so that you know I got it, that he will have ot live in gangland so he can pay his 25%...... and I said, would you rather he didn't pay it and she and her child live in gangland. There is a flip side. If you are unable to see the consequence to the action, then I can't help you there. From what you said, he pays = he lives in gangland (because the money goes to her and he is unable to afford any better). So, the flip side would be that he doesn't pay = she and the child are forced to live in gangland (because she is now having to live off of minimum wage and support at least 2, while he keps all his 80K and supports one).


I never made snide remarks about your friend. I said I would refrain from commenting. Would you like me to comment?

Depends on whos fault the divorce is, thats one bad thing about no fault divorces, if there was no fault there would not be a divorce. Was he a smuck and went off and cheated for no reason or did she sexually neglect him and force him out the door? I would have no problem forcing a woman to live in gang land and giving custody of the kid to the father if she caused the divorce. Unfortunatly thats not how family law works, and because of that fact I usually give the man the benifit of the doubt, until I know exactly what went down.