How large would a bird need to be to carry us aloft?

[Radrook]

There is no evidence whatsoever of a giant race of human beings. We also now have a very good idea of how both Stonehenge and the pyramids were constructed. They did not have metal tools or machine power but the ancient engineers were very clever.

So when the Bible mentions giants you consider that to be myth.

 

[Radrook]

Ya thats why there would have to be a high level of gene editing and/or splicing to get one to be big enough to ride.

What is why?

 

[JackRT]

So when the Bible mentions giants you consider that to be myth.

Myth possibly but it could be metaphorical as well:

"If I have seen further than others, it is by standing upon the shoulders of giants." ~~~ Isaac Newton

 

[Blackmarch]

What is why?

Because the only bird that is remotely large enough, the ostrich, to carry a person is not built for flying, so once gene editing gets good enough we could say either hybradize it with something else or directly change it so that its wings could be larger and functional... Or using genes from it to bulk up another species... Or do a completely artificial edit and coming up with a virtually new species.

 

[Radrook]

Because the only bird that is remotely large enough, the ostrich, to carry a person is not built for flying, so once gene editing gets good enough we could say either hybradize it with something else or directly change it so that its wings could be larger and functional... Or using genes from it to bulk up another species... Or do a completely artificial edit and coming up with a virtually new species.

Has this actually been considered?

 

[Blackmarch]

Has this actually been considered?

I'd be very surprised if no one who sees the potential of gene manipulation hasnt made an effort to try to see how far it could go. Dont know if anyone has considered this idea that we have here specifically.
I actually got the idea from some old sci fi story where they modified a horse to have wings that were usable in a very low gravity environment entertainment park.. So people could have their own pegasi for a day.

 

[Radrook]

I'd be very surprised if no one who sees the potential of gene manipulation hasnt made an effort to try to see how far it could go. Dont know if anyone has considered this idea that we have here specifically.
I actually got the idea from some old sci fi story where they modified a horse to have wings that were usable in a very low gravity environment entertainment park.. So people could have their own pegasi for a day.

Maybe it is easier to get a Pegasus like equine to fly than a ostrich. Those birds just don't look too aerodynamically stable. In fact, even on the ground they always seem to be somewhat off center.

 

[essentialsaltes]

 

[dad]

So when the Bible mentions giants you consider that to be myth.

Could it refer to dinos? I would have no problem with giants having lived such as Goliath. But when we see a book like the so called book of Enoch talking about sky high people...that is very hard to believe, in fact seems ridiculous.

 

[Blackmarch]

Could it refer to dinos? I would have no problem with giants having lived such as Goliath. But when we see a book like the so called book of Enoch talking about sky high people...that is very hard to believe, in fact seems ridiculous.

closer to how goliath was. Males are in the upper 7s low 8s on average and the females were generally around 6 ft.

 

[dad]

closer to how goliath was. Males are in the upper 7s low 8s on average and the females were generally around 6 ft.

Goliath was something like 10 feet tall if I recall.

 

[Blackmarch]

Goliath was something like 10 feet tall if I recall.

yeah, i recall 9 feet.. Cant remember if it was a low nine or high one tho.

 

[dad]

yeah, i recall 9 feet.. Cant remember if it was a low nine or high one tho.

Your point is what...that you doubt?

 

[Blackmarch]

Just meandering there sorry. The point was that the giants are closer to goliath in size, with goliath being at the upper end of the spectrum.

 

[Radrook]

yeah, i recall 9 feet.. Cant remember if it was a low nine or high one tho.

These are some pretty tall people as well:

Hows about having a wife this size?
Anna Haining Bates - Wikipedia


Genesis 6 GIANTS: A Pic is Worth Ten Thousand Words. . .

 

[Blackmarch]

These are some pretty tall people as well:

Hows about having a wife this size?
Anna Haining Bates - Wikipedia


Genesis 6 GIANTS: A Pic is Worth Ten Thousand Words. . .

Interesting. Most accounts ive seen were north eastern US, I was unaware of the utah accounts. (for deceased finds)

 

[Radrook]

Absolutely ... mythological. Humans much taller than 9 feet can barely move, their weight (cube function) overpowering thier strength (square function), also they break bones on almost any fall and live shortened lives.

As far as "Goliath" is concerned: his height, as described in various ancient manuscript, varies: the oldest manuscripts — the Dead Sea Scrolls text of Samuel, the 1st century historian Josephus, and the 4th century Septuagint manuscripts — all give his height as "four cubits and a span" (6 feet 9 inches) whereas the Masoretic Text gives this as an unlikely "six cubits and a span" (9 feet 9 inches).

Please note that I don't consider Goliath and any other of the people mentioned in the Post Floodworld as Nephilim. So my preference for the Masoretic text isn't based on that belief.

 

[Radrook]

That's fine I don't believe any of it, I'm just supplying evidence that that indicates how unlikely it all is.

What's so fetched about it? The Watusi reach 7 plus feet and there are documented cases of people exceeding that height by a foot or more..

List of tallest people - Wikipedia

D. Kellermann suggests that Goliath’s symptoms in 1 Samuel 17 match those of pathological gigantism (a pituitary condition known as acromegaly), including a tunnel-vision type of visual defect, which David presumably took advantage of in defeating him. If so, then the MT reading need not be considered an exaggeration.’, Li, ‘Goliath’, in Arnold & Williamson (eds.), ‘Dictionary of the Old Testament: Historical books’, p. 356 (2005).

4. ‘The biblical giant Goliath may have been afflicted with acromegaly.’, Ember & Ember, ‘Encyclopedia of Medical Anthropology’, p. 392 (2004)

 

[Radrook]

"Four cubits and a span" is reasonable, "six cubits and a span" is highly unlikely.

Unlikely doesn't equate with impossible.

BTW
Unlikelihood is brushed aside as insignificant when applied to abiogenesis despite the fact that compared with Goliath's height abiogenesis is infinitely far more unlikely.

 

[Radrook]

r

Abiogenesis has nothing to do with the alleged height of the alleged Goliath.

Along with a penchant for logical fallacy you seem to be having trouble with statistics and basic physics. Have you never wondered why there are no giant ants like in the movies? Here's a hint, the same reason there are no humans "six cubits and a span."

I provided a link with documented cases of humans reaching the height of 8'8" due to acromegaly. Your claim that Goliath could not have been stricken with the condition as well and reached the stated height smacks of bias which makes any claim to being scientific sound hollow.

Also strongly indicative of cogent reasoning ignorance would be the insinuation that one needs to be a scientist in order to detect fallacious reasoning on the part of a scientist. It's tantamount to saying that we must be dentists to detect dental malpractice. Especially since physicians are regularly sued by their patients for malpractice.

Also, an appeal to science fiction is ridiculous since no one is suggesting that ants or any other insect can reach such enormous sizes. All that is being said is that Goliath could have been suffering from an unusually severe case of acromegaly.

The only logical reason for anyone finding such a possibility unacceptable is that it goes against an anti biblical agenda which includes striving to prove that
Bible writers were dishonest.

BTW
Here is an article on the Goliath acromegaly issue
Slaying a biblically bad idea