How do you get saved?

[Blood Bought 1953]

Either Paul preached the wrong gospel and peter who was given the keys from JEsus himself...and walked with JEsus himself...had the right one (acts 2:38) or you're taking one passage out of context.... based off the wording alone....and the fact this chapter is part of the apostles doctrine (written to churches to teach them how to sanctify themselves and continue to walk in salvation) I would say you're taking this way out of context.


1. That's not an introductory salvation text...you're using it as such for some reason. These people are already saved.... that's why the bible verses say this. (and again...this was written to a church....just like any other epistle.....)


1 Corinthians 15:1-4 King James Version (KJV)
15 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;

2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.



Comment: That's why they can simply continue to believe in the Gospel to and they are good...becuase they are already living it. In fact receive here means to receive with the mind...it means to have in them... but also Paul says they stand in this gospel!. They have already repented, been baptized, and have the holy ghost.... Besides if Paul was saying hey....this is salvation!! he would contradict what Peter said in acts 2....but also contradict his own teachings...take a look.


Romans 6 as a whole is a good example....


But ima focus on these here.... in 2 cori. 7:10 "Godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation. 1 peter 3:21...."baptism doth now save us." titus 3:5 that we are saved by the "washing of regeneration and renewing of the HOly Ghost.



Paul didn't go against Peter....the bible even says he had an ecnourtor with Jesus in the desert...

No contradictions.......Paul wrote to gentiles.....Peter was writing to his fellow Jews....Peter confessed that Paul’s message was “ hard to understand”, but acknowledged it was valid Scripture.....If they were preaching identical doctrine, Peter’s explanation would not have been necessary.....All the Bible is Truth......Paul’s message was true for the gentiles, Peter’s message was true for his Jewish listeners

 

[mukk_in]

My take on it is that salvation is God's idea and the grace to repent and be saved also comes from the Lord (John 16:8-10, 2 Timothy 2:25). Theologians here can probably explain it better. Peace in Christ.

 

[Loren T.]

"if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved."

Yep, it's that simple.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Also simple: (and too late to repent to be saved) >>>

Matthew 7:23 Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you; depart ...
biblehub.com/matthew/7-23.htm
And then will I declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from me, you ...

 

[ladodgers6]

Some people say it is all God's work and YOU don't do a thing. Some say you have to believe and repent and God will save you. Some say that you have to work out your own salvation. A few say everybody is saved. So how do you get saved and is it all God's work, some your own work, or something else?

Excellent question, I am glad to see people asking the right questions. And these are the questions we should be asking and searching the answer too.

Do you know why you even need Christ, a Savior, a Redeemer in the first place? Because if you do not know the answer to this question. The others do not matter! You will be chasing a allusion.

Now, like in your comments above, those points are because of the view of Sin, the Fall of the human race. Some say, that people are good and can choose God, apart from the Holy Spirit and God's Grace. That people are good enough to enter heaven with good works. Some say you have to get saved by your works. Other say you must believe & repent to get saved. Or people say that God will save everyone.

I can go through these one by one, but it will take some time, and a very long post. So I challenge you to search the Scripture about sin, and the fall of the human race. What happened to us after the fall? Who saves who whom in Salvation? Does God save sinners? Or do sinners save themselves? What does the Law commands of us? Can sinners obey the Law? Does the Law of God demands perfect obedience? Will God lower His standard of Holiness (which is perfection) to let us in?

Why did Christ come to fulfill the Law, not abolish it? Why was Christ born in the flesh, and born under the Law?

If we can do something to get saved. Then why do we need Christ? If God saves everyone, then why is there is Hell?

To help you out, these are the two major competing topics:

Monergism vs Synergism​

In theology, synergism is the position of those who hold that salvation involves some form of cooperation between divine grace and human freedom. This premise that there are two efficient agents in regeneration, namely the human will and the divine Spirit, which, in the strict sense of the term, cooperate. This theory accordingly holds that the soul has not lost in the fall all inclination toward holiness, nor all power to seek for it under the influence of ordinary motives...To put it simply, synergism is the belief that faith is produced by our unregenerated human nature...

Monergism is the position in Christian theology that God, through the Holy Spirit, works to bring about the salvation of an individual through spiritual regeneration, irrespective of the individual's cooperation.

So the question becomes who saves whom?

Thanks for this excellent thread.

God bless!

 

[Blood Bought 1953]

Also simple: (and too late to repent to be saved) >>>

Matthew 7:23 Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you; depart ...
biblehub.com/matthew/7-23.htm
And then will I declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from me, you ...

Paul said if you add to his Gospel of Grace with works , you are accursed—— those are the ones He never knew......commonly referred to as “ legalists” or “ Judaizers” if you prefer....It is pride ( see what “ I” did) as opposed to thankfulness for what “ HE “ did.

 

[Danthemailman]

Acts 16:30 - And he brought them out and said, “Sirs, what must I do to be saved?” 31 So they said, “Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved, you and your household.”

Those who believe on the Lord Jesus Christ have already repented in the process of changing their mind and choosing to believe on the Lord Jesus Christ (Acts 11:17,18).

Although it is our responsibility to choose to believe and we will be held accountable for unbelief (John 3:18), saving belief in Christ is never exclusively a matter of human decision. Unless the Father draws us in and enables us (John 6:44,65), we would NEVER come to believe all by ourselves. The approach of the soul to Christ is initiated by the Father, but He doesn't force us to choose Christ, we must choose Him. The impulse to faith in Christ comes from God.

 

[Athanasius377]

So you meant to say "spiritually dead"? What exactly has that to do with "saving themselves"?

Some say that one cooperates in their salvation. My point is that Paul says that's impossible because dead people can't cooperate.

 

[GingerBeer]

Excellent question, I am glad to see people asking the right questions. And these are the questions we should be asking and searching the answer too.

Do you know why you even need Christ, a Savior, a Redeemer in the first place? Because if you do not know the answer to this question. The others do not matter! You will be chasing a allusion.

Now, like in your comments above, those points are because of the view of Sin, the Fall of the human race. Some say, that people are good and can choose God, apart from the Holy Spirit and God's Grace. That people are good enough to enter heaven with good works. Some say you have to get saved by your works. Other say you must believe & repent to get saved. Or people say that God will save everyone.

I can go through these one by one, but it will take some time, and a very long post. So I challenge you to search the Scripture about sin, and the fall of the human race. What happened to us after the fall? Who saves who whom in Salvation? Does God save sinners? Or do sinners save themselves? What does the Law commands of us? Can sinners obey the Law? Does the Law of God demands perfect obedience? Will God lower His standard of Holiness (which is perfection) to let us in?

Why did Christ come to fulfill the Law, not abolish it? Why was Christ born in the flesh, and born under the Law?

If we can do something to get saved. Then why do we need Christ? If God saves everyone, then why is there is Hell?

To help you out, these are the two major competing topics:

Monergism vs Synergism​

In theology, synergism is the position of those who hold that salvation involves some form of cooperation between divine grace and human freedom. This premise that there are two efficient agents in regeneration, namely the human will and the divine Spirit, which, in the strict sense of the term, cooperate. This theory accordingly holds that the soul has not lost in the fall all inclination toward holiness, nor all power to seek for it under the influence of ordinary motives...To put it simply, synergism is the belief that faith is produced by our unregenerated human nature...

Monergism is the position in Christian theology that God, through the Holy Spirit, works to bring about the salvation of an individual through spiritual regeneration, irrespective of the individual's cooperation.

So the question becomes who saves whom?

Thanks for this excellent thread.

God bless!

So, I am thinking that you'd be in the "it is all God's work and YOU don't do a thing" camp, is that right?

 

[GingerBeer]

Some say that one cooperates in their salvation. My point is that Paul says that's impossible because dead people can't cooperate.

Where does Paul say that? To be specific where does Paul write in any of his letter that cooperation in one's salvation is "impossible because dead people can't cooperate"?

 

[ladodgers6]

So, I am thinking that you'd be in the "it is all God's work and YOU don't do a thing" camp, is that right?

Yes, I believe that Redeeming sinners is Monergistic. I'm thinking you are from the Synergistic camp?

 

[GingerBeer]

Yes, I believe that Redeeming sinners is Monergistic. I'm thinking you are from the Synergistic camp?

I am outside the camps.

 

[ladodgers6]

Where does Paul say that? To be specific where does Paul write in any of his letter that cooperation in one's salvation is "impossible because dead people can't cooperate"?

Thank you GingerBeer, excellent questions, I am impressed. And please do not take this the wrong way. I am not patronizing you. Exactly I am commending you on these questions.

Now, I can overwhelm you with passages, but I will not, only if you want all of the passages, then I will. But I will start with these:

​

No One Is Righteous​

​

Romans 3: 9What then? Are we Jews any better off? No, not at all. For we have already charged that all, both Jews and Greeks, are under sin, 10as it is written:

“None is righteous, no, not one;
11no one understands;
no one seeks for God.

1 Cor. 2: 14 The natural man does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God. For they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned.

Further Conflict Over Jesus’ Claims​

22Then came the Festival of Dedication at Jerusalem. It was winter, 23and Jesus was in the temple courts walking in Solomon’s Colonnade. 24The Jews who were there gathered around him, saying, “How long will you keep us in suspense? If you are the Messiah, tell us plainly.”

25Jesus answered, “I did tell you, but you do not believe. The works I do in my Father’s name testify about me, 26but you do not believe because you are not my sheep. 27My sheep listen to my voice; I know them, and they follow me. 28I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand. 29My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all ; no one can snatch them out of my Father’s hand. 30I and the Father are one.”

I will end with these.

Hope this helps???

God Bless!

 

[ladodgers6]

I am outside the camps.

Can you share what you believe in?

 

[GingerBeer]

Thank you GingerBeer, excellent questions, I am impressed. And please do not take this the wrong way. I am not patronizing you. Exactly I am commending you on these questions.

Now, I can overwhelm you with passages, but I will not, only if you want all of the passages, then I will. But I will start with these:

...

No One Is Righteous

​

I want to isolate the title that you chose. "No One Is Righteous" because I am wondering was Enoch righteous? And I am sure that Jesus is righteous. How does that fit in with the proposition that the title presents?

Romans 3: 9What then? Are we Jews any better off? No, not at all. For we have already charged that all, both Jews and Greeks, are under sin, 10as it is written:

“None is righteous, no, not one;
11no one understands;
no one seeks for God.

1 Cor. 2: 14 The natural man does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God. For they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned.

Further Conflict Over Jesus’ Claims​

22Then came the Festival of Dedication at Jerusalem. It was winter, 23and Jesus was in the temple courts walking in Solomon’s Colonnade. 24The Jews who were there gathered around him, saying, “How long will you keep us in suspense? If you are the Messiah, tell us plainly.”

25Jesus answered, “I did tell you, but you do not believe. The works I do in my Father’s name testify about me, 26but you do not believe because you are not my sheep. 27My sheep listen to my voice; I know them, and they follow me. 28I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand. 29My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all ; no one can snatch them out of my Father’s hand. 30I and the Father are one.”

I will end with these.

Hope this helps???

God Bless!

 

[GingerBeer]

Can you share what you believe in?

Sure.
A) God knows everything that can be known so God knows what will happen from the beginning. In truth God knew what would happen before time was created. That being the case it follows that God is not in the dark about who will believe and who will not and he is capable (because he is almighty) of ensuring that some will believe or even (if he wanted it) that everyone will believe and be saved.
B) People do not know everything from the beginning. For people the future is a mystery and the past is a memory which no human being can change. That being the case it follows that from a human perspective the future is unknown, the past is remembered only partially, and the present is knowable only within the limits of what can be observed by each person.
C) Maybe God chose to let human beings decide to believe or decide not to believe. I do not know everything so I cannot say that God definitely made the choice to let people choose for themselves. It is also possible that God chose to control human beings so that their decisions are wholly under his control. In which case human decisions only appear to be their own while in reality they are God's planned out course of events.
Given (A) and (B) the choices in (C) are either known by human beings or they are not known by human beings and the only way to find out is to (1) check what happens in observable reality, (2) check what is written in scripture and see if scripture unequivocally teaches one of the two choices mentioned in (C), (3) be very careful to interpret scripture correctly which means avoiding pushing some philosophy or theology into the passages in the scripture while at the same time not missing what is said in the scriptures given their context and whatever other factors affect the meaning of what is written.

I think that maybe (C) is still up in the air which means that maybe God decides everything or maybe human beings decide for themselves. Hence I am outside the camps because I am not convinced that human decisions are free and I am not convinced that human decisions are all part of a plan formed by God before creation.

 

[ladodgers6]

Sure.
A) God knows everything that can be known so God knows what will happen from the beginning. In truth God knew what would happen before time was created. That being the case it follows that God is not in the dark about who will believe and who will not and he is capable (because he is almighty) of ensuring that some will believe or even (if he wanted it) that everyone will believe and be saved.
B) People do not know everything from the beginning. For people the future is a mystery and the past is a memory which no human being can change. That being the case it follows that from a human perspective the future is unknown, the past is remembered only partially, and the present is knowable only within the limits of what can be observed by each person.
C) Maybe God chose to let human beings decide to believe or decide not to believe. I do not know everything so I cannot say that God definitely made the choice to let people choose for themselves. It is also possible that God chose to control human beings so that their decisions are wholly under his control. In which case human decisions only appear to be their own while in reality they are God's planned out course of events.
Given (A) and (B) the choices in (C) are either known by human beings or they are not known by human beings and the only way to find out is to (1) check what happens in observable reality, (2) check what is written in scripture and see if scripture unequivocally teaches one of the two choices mentioned in (C), (3) be very careful to interpret scripture correctly which means avoiding pushing some philosophy or theology into the passages in the scripture while at the same time not missing what is said in the scriptures given their context and whatever other factors affect the meaning of what is written.

I think that maybe (C) is still up in the air which means that maybe God decides everything or maybe human beings decide for themselves. Hence I am outside the camps because I am not convinced that human decisions are free and I am not convinced that human decisions are all part of a plan formed by God before creation.

Thanks for your honesty. It seems to me that your on the fence? And I admire your thoughts here. Before I reply, which will be probably later in the evening. I have some questions for you to think about, before you respond.

In Reformed Theology we believe and teach that people do have a choice and that it is self-determined. Nobody forces people to sin. Here is a excerpt from John Calvin on 'Free-Will'.

"...we allow that man has choice and that it is self-determined, so that if he does anything evil, it should be imputed to him and to his own voluntary choosing. We do away with coercion and force, because this contradicts the nature of the will and cannot coexist with it. We deny that choice is free, because through man's innate wickedness it is of necessity driven to what is evil and cannot seek anything but evil. And from this it is possible to deduce what a great difference there is between necessity and coercion. For we do not say that man is dragged unwillingly into sinning, but that because his will is corrupt he is held captive under the yoke of sin and therefore of necessity will in an evil way. For where there is bondage, there is necessity. But it makes a great difference whether the bondage is voluntary or coerced. We locate the necessity to sin precisely in corruption of the will, from which follows that it is self-determined.
- John Calvin from Bondage and Liberation of the Will, pg. 69-70

Give me your thoughts on this, and I will respond later in the evening.

Hope this helps???

God Bless!

 

[ladodgers6]

...
​

I want to isolate the title that you chose. "No One Is Righteous" because I am wondering was Enoch righteous? And I am sure that Jesus is righteous. How does that fit in with the proposition that the title presents?

I do not have a lot of time right now, so I will leave you with this. And I will address Enoch later this evening, you forgot to name Moses, Noah, Abraham, and Cornelius. But I will later.

Not so fast that isolated title is quoted from Scripture in Romans 3:10As it is written:

“There is no one righteous, not even one;

11there is no one who understands;

there is no one who seeks God.

 

[Athanasius377]

Where does Paul say that? To be specific where does Paul write in any of his letter that cooperation in one's salvation is "impossible because dead people can't cooperate"?

I gave you two examples. Dead means dead. You're not sort of dead, have a nasty case of death or just slightly dead and then get better .
Can you describe a time when a dead person cooperated with you?

 

[Phil 1:21]

How do you get saved?

"For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— not by works, so that no one can boast." Ephesians 2:8-9