How do non-Catholics explain Eucharistic miracles, such as bleeding, and Marian...

[MoreCoffee]

Why do folk from Protestantism's minor denominations dislike the perpetual virginity of the Blessed Virgin Mary so much?

Since Jesus had brothers it is not possible that Mary was a perpetual virgin unless of course His brothers were all born from immaculate conceptions.

So you say, but the first post apostolic christians did not share your opinion, except for perhaps a few.

 

[seeingeyes]

Why do folk from Protestantism's minor denominations dislike the perpetual virginity of the Blessed Virgin Mary so much?

Because it dogmatizes something that the authors of scripture didn't deem important enough to mention.

...and some people just hate Catholics.

 

[Rev Randy]

Those who defend the visions as true and good theology seem to have disappeared.

It's been shown that the children's visions are bad theology, deceptive, and point away from Christ to an entity called immaculate heart. That "heart" is their salvation based on what they said.

Let's hope they come to Christ before it's too late.

The Op was not directed to those who defend the visions as true. It was directed to non-Catholics.

 

[Rev Randy]

Because it dogmatizes something that the authors of scripture didn't deem important enough to mention.

...and some people just hate Catholics.

The former is a good point but it seems to forget that her life wasn't yet over on earth when much was penned. It also never speaks of Peter dying or Paul for that matter. Paul speaks on his own death to come but no one penned about his death in the canon of Scripture. We know how both died from Oral tradition and later non-canonical writings and more concerning Mary in the same fashion.
The latter is simply true. Some just hate Catholics so much that they throw out the baby with the bathwater.

 

[Root of Jesse]

Because it dogmatizes something that the authors of scripture didn't deem important enough to mention.

...and some people just hate Catholics.

Sounds very...Christian...

 

[psalms 91]

There are vision of God and those that are from the other side, not all visions are true or good. There are many reasons I dont believe in the Catholic church but some things they do have right.

 

[seeingeyes]

Sounds very...Christian...

Well, the former is a solid point, the latter is an unfortunate (and unchristian) truth.

 

[Root of Jesse]

The former is a good point but it seems to forget that her life wasn't yet over on earth when much was penned. It also never speaks of Peter dying or Paul for that matter. Paul speaks on his own death to come but no one penned about his death in the canon of Scripture. We know how both died from Oral tradition and later non-canonical writings and more concerning Mary in the same fashion.
The latter is simply true. Some just hate Catholics so much that they throw out the baby with the bathwater.

Matter of fact, she was taken away after Pentecost to Ephesus.

Here was the convincing point for me in my conversion...we know where many of the apostles are buried. We know where Peter, Paul, James, Mary Magdalene, are for certain. There is no place that claims, even hints, at having the tomb of Mary. We do have the Church of the Dormition. No tomb. Why not?

 

[seeingeyes]

The former is a good point but it seems to forget that her life wasn't yet over on earth when much was penned. It also never speaks of Peter dying or Paul for that matter. Paul speaks on his own death to come but no one penned about his death in the canon of Scripture. We know how both died from Oral tradition and later non-canonical writings and more concerning Mary in the same fashion.

That's true, but then I would argue that if an ever-virgin Mary is a necessary belief for the faith, it would have come up at some point during Jesus' ministry. Like, maybe when his mother showed up while he was preaching. Or maybe when that woman in the crowd cried out, "blessed are the breasts that nursed you". But in both situations, Jesus turned everyone's attention not to himself, not to Mary, but to his Father.

If someone's attention is already on the Father, there doesn't seem to be any need to point to Mary, and Jesus never did so. So whether Mary is ever-virgin or not is an interesting discussion, but hardly need be dogmatized.

 

[Root of Jesse]

That's true, but then I would argue that if an ever-virgin Mary is a necessary belief for the faith, it would have come up at some point during Jesus' ministry. Like, maybe when his mother showed up while he was preaching. Or maybe when that woman in the crowd cried out, "blessed are the breasts that nursed you". But in both situations, Jesus turned everyone's attention not to himself, not to Mary, but to his Father.

If someone's attention is already on the Father, there doesn't seem to be any need to point to Mary, and Jesus never did so. So whether Mary is ever-virgin or not is an interesting discussion, but hardly need be dogmatized.

If Mary had other children, why did Jesus give her to John to take care of? Why not her next-oldest child?

 

[prodromos]

What reason should anyone think it wasn't?

I know there are some parents out there who like to think their children are god , but seriously, how 'normal' could a marriage be when you have given birth to God?

How many people in the bible, when touched by the divine, continued to live a 'normal' life afterwards?

 

[Root of Jesse]

I know there are some parents out there who like to think their children are god , but seriously, how 'normal' could a marriage be when you have given birth to God?

How many people in the bible, when touched by the divine, continued to live a 'normal' life afterwards?

Answer, none. Their lives were changed forever.

 

[MoreCoffee]

Because it dogmatizes something that the authors of scripture didn't deem important enough to mention.

...and some people just hate Catholics.

I reckon it's mainly that part after the ellipsis points that drives the matter.

 

[seeingeyes]

I reckon it's mainly that part after the ellipsis points that drives the matter.

Agreed.

 

[sunlover1]

If Mary had other children, why did Jesus give her to John to take care of? Why not her next-oldest child?

I'd never give my mom to my siblings.

No seriously though. Scripture makes it so clear that Jesus came to
turn parents against children etc.
IOW, it's SPIRITUAL family that counts.
I would NEVER leave my mom in the hands of folks unless
i knew they were going to be praying over her and loving
her with a godly love.
Just "anybody" wont do.

(But i don't really know the answer, that's my thoughts,
using my own experiences going by what I'd do)

I know there are some parents out there who like to think their children are god , but seriously, how 'normal' could a marriage be when you have given birth to God?

How many people in the bible, when touched by the divine, continued to live a 'normal' life afterwards?

I'm not in the Bible but I carry God in my body.
And life has never been the same since.

 

[MoreCoffee]

One ought to note that Mary is only ever called "the Mother of Jesus" and never called "the mother of <insert name here>" - check your bible and see.

 

[Rick Otto]

Originally Posted by MoreCoffee

I reckon it's mainly that part after the ellipsis points that drives the matter
​

Romancing a bunker mentality.
​

 

[Rev Randy]

I know there are some parents out there who like to think their children are god , but seriously, how 'normal' could a marriage be when you have given birth to God?

How many people in the bible, when touched by the divine, continued to live a 'normal' life afterwards?

Now that is a good point. Scripture seems to suggest St. Joseph was not forbidden but I'm not of the mind to think he would. Given the duty of raising and protecting the God child should put the mind elsewhere.

 

[Rev Randy]

I'd never give my mom to my siblings.

No seriously though. Scripture makes it so clear that Jesus came to
turn parents against children etc.
IOW, it's SPIRITUAL family that counts.
I would NEVER leave my mom in the hands of folks unless
i knew they were going to be praying over her and loving
her with a godly love.
Just "anybody" wont do.

(But i don't really know the answer, that's my thoughts,
using my own experiences going by what I'd do)

I'm not in the Bible but I carry God in my body.
And life has never been the same since.

That is not the point. It was custom and the way of the Hebrew people. It would be a right not just the custom for the second born son to support his widowed mother.

 

[Standing Up]

If Mary had other children, why did Jesus give her to John to take care of? Why not her next-oldest child?

Sunlover1 answered accurately. Would you trust your parents to just anyone?

Prior to the cross, the brothers of Jesus (same mother, different father) didn't believe in Christ (John 7:5). John did. The honor fell to him.

PS. John as cousin also had the right to care for Mary.