How do I respectfully teach an ex feminist to live more biblically?

[NothingIsImpossible]

(gets out popcorn)
(sees the wife is posting to now)
(gets bigger popcorn bag and soda)

 

[Dave-W]

There appears to be a trend on these boards where Christian men start threads condemning feminists.

Well - feminists are trying to kill off all males. Should that not be condemned? (or should we men all have a death wish?)

The wife of the OP is not a feminist.

 

[Blondepudding]

Well - feminists are trying to kill off all males.

Prove it.

Should that not be condemned? (or should we men all have a death wish?)

Making such a statement without supporting evidence should be condemned.

 

[Blondepudding]

(gets out popcorn)
(sees the wife is posting to now)
(gets bigger popcorn bag and soda)

Sounds like mockery. Is that your point?

 

[Dave-W]

"Well - feminists are trying to kill off all males."
Prove it.

I have posted those quotes and articles (mostly from the 1970s and 80s) numerous times on these forums.

To post them again may be a TOS violation of spamming - posting the same thing over and over.

Go search thru my posts. You are sure to find them.

 

[NothingIsImpossible]

Sounds like mockery. Is that your point?

Maybe, maybe not.

 

[Job8]

It seems that men start screaming about feminism when faced with an intelligent, strong woman.

There are a lot of strong, intelligent women who flatly reject Feminism (along with a lot of strong, intelligent men). In any event, Feminism is not compatible with Christianity, just as rebellion is not compatible with submission.

 

[Dave-W]

Feminism is not compatible with Christianity, just as rebellion is not compatible with submission.

To any man who tries to bring up the whole "wives submit yourselves to your husbands" thing; I bring up another scripture (written primarily to men):

Hebrews 13:17 Obey those who rule over you, and be submissive, for they watch out for your souls, as those who must give account. Let them do so with joy and not with grief, for that would be unprofitable for you.

Men: if you want your wife to submit to you, then submit YOURSELF to your congregational leaders (pastors, elders, deacons) to the same degree you want your wife to submit to you. IOW, lead by example.

 

[ValleyGal]

NM...posted in the new thread "Feminism is not compatible with Christianity

 

[squirrel123]

I have posted those quotes and articles (mostly from the 1970s and 80s) numerous times on these forums.

To post them again may be a TOS violation of spamming - posting the same thing over and over.

Go search thru my posts. You are sure to find them.

Yup. A bunch of quotes from has-been extremists, none of whom represent modern feminism. If modern feminists felt the same, you'd be able to post quotes from the 21st century.

Get over it.

 

[Tiny Bible]

nm

 

[RedPonyDriver]

Well - feminists are trying to kill off all males. Should that not be condemned? (or should we men all have a death wish?)

The wife of the OP is not a feminist.

You're out to lunch...typical of always going to the extreme to show you have no idea of what you're talking about

 

[Dave-W]

Au Contraire. I take those "extremists" that started the modern feminist going to be the "true believers" of the movement. BUt, just like there are thousands of so-called christians in churches that have never truly turned their lives over to God, (and so are not really christians at all) the ranks of feminists have been watered down by the people you describe, morphing into something much less than MS Magazine's founders envisioned from the start.

So in the same way that social club christians are not true Christians; those who do not follow the likes of Stienem, Pitman-Huges, Ireland, et al are not true feminists.

 

[Thursday]

Okay, so here's the problem. My wife was a feminist when we started dating. She was extremely rude to me, derogatory, and I could barely be myself around her let alone say the smallest thing about a woman's place in the home or about almost ANYTHING. She would take offense to the smallest statements.

When we met she claimed to be Christian (Catholic to be more specific) so I had no idea she would turn out to be a feminist when we got closer. And she was barely a Christian at all and she drove me crazy.

Why was she not a Christian? Because she associated with Satan Worshipers, practiced Witch Craft, was heavily into tarot cards, was extremely disrespectful towards men, wrongfully judged a vast majority of society and thought that women were queens among men.

She was only "christian" in the sense that she was raised Catholic (apparently but her family aren't really Christian/Catholic at all either. I can definitely see where she had gotten the ) and that she believed in Jesus and regularly attended Church.

Despite all of this "baggage" I still accepted her. After all, I had my baggage and baggage of sins too. I loved her deeply and we dated for almost 2 happy years and we've been married almost seven months now.

I've just recently gotten my wife to see the some of the light of her evils and I'm slowly guiding her down the right path. She's dropped out of University, she's been trying to be more respectful towards me, She's starting to show people more compassion and love, I haven't seen her pick up a set of tarot cards in almost a year and a half, and we now have a mostly clean house after living together in filth for the last year or so. She also no longer considers herself a feminist and sees just how evil feminists really are.

I'm starting this topic to ask though, how can I instruct her further without making it seem like I'm just controlling her in a bad way? Like, eventually I would like us to live more biblically and have her start treating me with respect. Eventually I would like her to allow me to control the finances, eventually I would like her to start raising our future children, how do I go about prompting her in the right direction while at the same time, treating her with the respect that I want to be given?

Has any women here gone through the same thing when they got married?

I ask her myself and she says that I don't really treat her with respect, and half of the time I seem angry with her when I try to teach her things like how to clean properly.

This book might help. It is written by a former feminist/atheist:

 

[Blondepudding]

I have posted those quotes and articles (mostly from the 1970s and 80s) numerous times on these forums.

To post them again may be a TOS violation of spamming - posting the same thing over and over.

Go search thru my posts. You are sure to find them.

Articles that say feminists are trying to kill males. From the 70's and 80's? Articles from 46 and 36 years ago.

And yet....here you are! We must be very successful after nearly 50 years of trying to kill males off huh? And given women aren't yet capable of parthenogenesis, no one in their right mind would actually think they could sell the lie that women are trying to kill off the sperm source that is part of the human procreative process.

Why is this?The male might ask.
Because without men all the women left in the world, unless they evolved to a state of parthenogenesis, would die off. Therein revoking the possibility of a world populated by women only.

But this thread isn't about hating on feminism is it? Rhetorical question.

This thread is posted by someone who claims all these faults with his woman and yet titles the thread as his concern for her ex-feminist status.

In truth, when they say they're Christian, they should get with their pastor for counseling. Or a married couples counseling group in the church.
The Catholic church has a marriage counseling group. Those stickers are seen affixed to cars quite often around where my family lives.

What isn't going to help is a forum site wherein there are men like you that hate on feminism in a marriage counseling thread that asks how a man can help his ex-feminist wife to live more biblically. Especially when he demonstrates he needs help in learning about Christian doctrine himself.

 

[mkgal1]

There are a lot of strong, intelligent women who flatly reject Feminism (along with a lot of strong, intelligent men). In any event, Feminism is not compatible with Christianity, just as rebellion is not compatible with submission.

Since this is someone's thread about a marital issue, I'm just going to start a new thread using this statement (because I believe it's a worthy and relevant topic):

"Feminism is not compatible with Christianity"

 

[Blondepudding]

Maybe, maybe not.

The popcorn remark makes it a resounding yes.

 

[coloradoguy]

Having read both sides of the story now, I only want to add this:

- I believe you both love each other, and both want this marriage to work. That is an excellent start.
- I think you should put intense effort into learning to communicate better. It sounds like a lot of issues could have been solved much quicker and with less pain, if you were able to communicate better.
- You need to figure out for yourselves what you want your roles to be in your marriage. (As opposed to what a generic man and woman's roles are). Forget society. Forget customs. Take the Bible as your guideline, but make sure you get the full picture (IMO the full picture is actually a lot smaller and less detailed that many people make it out to be!). Then figure it out for yourselves. Every marriage is different, because every couple come with their own sets of strengths and weaknesses, their own hopes and desires.
- You are partners in your marriage - learn to function like a team. When something happens that threaten your relationship (and it will - often!) don't let it divide you! Sit down together, leaving both your egos outside, and figure out a solution together. Accept that you will shape each other, but don't try to change each other. And the key for my husband and me - It's never about WHO is right - it's always about WHAT is right. What is right is rarely exactly what one person thought at the beginning of the "argument" - it's usually somewhere in the middle. (This is why it is absolutely crucial to leave your egos outside when you are trying to figure out a solution!)

Exactly.

How many of you men out there enjoy seeing your wife in a nice pair if jeans or slacks? How many of you have wives with a cute short haircut? How many of you have wives who work outside the home? How many of you have wives who vote and support her right to vote? How many of you have wives who drive their own car? How many of your wives pay the family bills? How many of you enjoy taking your wife to a ball game or some other traditionally "male" activity?

Do you really and honestly want a wife who is dainty, wears a dress, bakes and cooks from scratch, does nothing but cook and clean and raise babies, never participates in your hobbies, can't drive a car or own her own property or have the right to vote or express her opinion? Do you really want a wife who will just always give in to your command at all times?

I don't know of any men like that. Not even one. The men I know like a woman who participates in his life with him, looks good in jeans, can shout "Go, Lions!" at a game just as loud as he does, is intelligent enough to carry on a meaningful conversation about politics and religion, work on the farm just as hard as he does, drive her own car and be independent enough to think for herself. That's feminism.

I could name a few guys that do want very feminine women, but there's a difference between being feminine and being barefoot and in the kitchen at all times.

Au Contraire. I take those "extremists" that started the modern feminist going to be the "true believers" of the movement. BUt, just like there are thousands of so-called christians in churches that have never truly turned their lives over to God, (and so are not really christians at all) the ranks of feminists have been watered down by the people you describe, morphing into something much less than MS Magazine's founders envisioned from the start.

So in the same way that social club christians are not true Christians; those who do not follow the likes of Stienem, Pitman-Huges, Ireland, et al are not true feminists.

So, basically "No-True-Scotsman"?

 

[ValleyGal]

I could name a few guys that do want very feminine women, but there's a difference between being feminine and being barefoot and in the kitchen at all times.

A woman does not have to sacrifice femininity to be feminist. There are a lot of women who wear high heels, jeans with lace details and pearl necklaces - very feminine - but can strip all that off for a sports flag and jersey. There are very professional women in business who present their femininity even while making multi-million dollar deals and driving their own cars and even going to the polls to assert their right to vote - that women forced to wear dresses and rely on men for their "keep" fought so hard for.

 

[Neostarwcc]

Sorry, I was gone yesterday and there are way too many replies to respond to so, I'll just reply to best ones. I have read all of the replies though.

What exactly do you want in an ideal wife?

I missed this, my wife is the perfect ideal wife. It has nothing to do with her becoming ideal for me, she already is. It has to do with us following God's law and for both of us to start respecting each other.

That's where the biggest problem is. You can't change anyone but yourself. And marriage is such a huge step that it should never be done with someone who you want to change or who you think should change. Now that the deed is done, you need to learn to love your wife the way she is without any expectation that she will ever change. She will change - we all do, but you need to love and accept her the way she is, not for what she might become or what you can turn her into.

Yes. Misinformation.

Jesus was the first feminist. There is no command in the Bible for the woman that is different for the man; nor is there any command for the man that is different than for any woman. Every command to men is exactly the same as it is for women.

Cool, only Feminism DOESN'T teach about equality. Feminism doesn't teach about women being submissive to their husbands like it commands in the bible and it doesn't teach men to respect their wives like it commands in the bible. Like many people have told me in this thread and like I admit myself, I don't respect my
wife. And a majority of the reason I treated her the way I did was because of Feminism.

I was AFRAID of her. She even said it herself. And because of Feminism I have been afraid of women for almost my entire life. But, all of a sudden I'm the bad guy for trying to help her get through something evil that only made me afraid of my wife and slowly feel like she was superior to me. It got to the point where we couldn't even have a basic conversation.
Then, it started getting physical from her because she couldn't stand the way I was acting.

Feminism only teaches hate and teaches everything AGAINST the bible. Think about it, ever since Feminism has become popular women divorce at twice the rate as they used to. And they divorce for the stupidest reasons. The number one reason being money and it's all thanks to feminism.

Think of all the laws that got passed over the last 50 years. Think of how legally, men have less legal rights than women. When a woman physically abuses a man the law does next to nothing about it. I know, It's happened to me personally and a police officer
wouldn't even come to my door because it wasn't a crime. But, if I had laid a hand on her 15 cop cars would have shown up and I would have been tazed and immediately gotten 5 years in prison without a trial (slight exaggeration).

There's also child support that sucks away almost every last penny that men have. I'm not saying we shouldn't financially support our kids when our woman divorces us, I'm saying that and there are women
out there who abuse the child support system. I'm also saying that the ammount of money given by child support is massively inflated, it doesn't cost as much money to raise a child as people think.

Many people out there claim that it costs at least $60,000 a year to raise a family of four? My grandparents didn't even make a quarter of that and they raised a family of NINE. Yes, there's been inflation since the 1950's but, it hasn't inflated THAT much. And all of my aunts and unclesf
weren't even born when my grandfather lost his farm. I don't know exactly how much he made but my mother and her brothers and sisters were VERY poor.

So, why take over 90% of a man's paycheck for child support? It isn't fair and a majority of women who get child support don't even spend it on their kids. I know, my sister is one of them.

There's also the issue of rape. It's always man raping man, woman raping woman, or the massively publicized man raping a woman. Never EVER do you see a case of a woman raping a man. But, it happens all the time. More than either you or I will ever want to admit.

Part of it has to do with men being too proud to admit that they were raped by a woman, but even if we opened a rape case almost nothing would be done about it because hey, a woman cannot rape a man right? That is what this country and what our legal system thinks and, again it's all thanks to feminism.

You can disagree with the things that I've said But, I believe it is you that it is Feminsts that are misinformed.

I mean, if feminism was just about giving women the right to vote and giving them the right to own property if they live on their own, or the right to go to university on their own, than I guarantee a majority of us against Feminism wouldn't
be. I wouldn't be. But, that isn't what feminism represents it gives off the aura of teaching equality but, does the exact opposite.
Feminism teaches women that they are SUPERIOR to men. It doesn't just give the idea that women are the superior sex though, it has made it HAPPEN. It teaches women to mistreat men, and it is in every, way, shape, and form against the bible. I'm sorry. To say that God loves Feminism kind of insults me just as much
as I apparently insulted you and all of the other Feminists or women that support Feminism in this thread.

Plus, I don't see how you can say that Jesus was the first Feminist when Feminism didn't start until the 1840's and didn't become super popular until the 1950's.

Anyway, I can debate about this all day But, I didn't open this topic to debate Feminism like people have said, It's been done enough times on these boards.
You have a right to your opinion, and so do I. Oh wait, that's right because of Feminism I DON'T have a right to my opinion, oops I forgot. *eyeroll*

You are on the right track. Your title suggests that you're aware of your own insensitivity to her needs. Recognizing and admitting this is important. A next step is to ask God for wisdom James 1:5. You need this in order to understand her which is crucial to leading her as you ought 1 Peter 3:7. This lack of understanding is a large part of why we, as men, fumble when trying to help our wives. Not knowing why she does this or that, and not knowing how to help her can make us upset and short in our dealings with them Proverbs 14:29. Exercising much sensitivity to her needs will go a long way in helping a right response to your leadership Proverbs 16:21. She doesn't need someone bossing her around. She needs you to be like Christ; compassionate, and gentle; especially when a tense situation needs diffusing Proverbs 25:15.
Read the Bible and pray to God together on a daily basis. This is perhaps the most effective means of leadership you can provide her.

Thank you, that helped a lot. I do have one question though, in Matthew 6:5 & Matthew 6:6 it says that we're supposed to
[/Quote]

Having read both sides of the story now, I only want to add this:

- I believe you both love each other, and both want this marriage to work. That is an excellent start.
- I think you should put intense effort into learning to communicate better. It sounds like a lot of issues could have been solved much quicker and with less pain, if you were able to communicate better.
- You need to figure out for yourselves what you want your roles to be in your marriage. (As opposed to what a generic man and woman's roles are). Forget society. Forget customs. Take the Bible as your guideline, but make sure you get the full picture (IMO the full picture is actually a lot smaller and less detailed that many people make it out to be!). Then figure it out for yourselves. Every marriage is different, because every couple come with their own sets of strengths and weaknesses, their own hopes and desires.
- You are partners in your marriage - learn to function like a team. When something happens that threaten your relationship (and it will - often!) don't let it divide you! Sit down together, leaving both your egos outside, and figure out a solution together. Accept that you will shape each other, but don't try to change each other. And the key for my husband and me - It's never about WHO is right - it's always about WHAT is right. What is right is rarely exactly what one person thought at the beginning of the "argument" - it's usually somewhere in the middle. (This is why it is absolutely crucial to leave your egos outside when you are trying to figure out a solution!)

Will take all this into account, thank you!

I am a feminist. I have multiple degrees. I've owned my own company, been in charge of multi-million dollar projects. I've also been married almost 20 years to a man who adores me. We have an egalitarian relationship. He brought his strengths and weaknesses into our marriage and so did I. The first few years were rough...we were older (mid-30's) and had been on our own for a long time before marrying. He likes doing housework, has an incredible ability to organize anything and everything, when I am faced with a mess (like moving), I want to sit in a corner, suck my thumb and cry. I am better at managing finances, cooking and laundry. I also do all the car repairs because I enjoy it. It works for us and has for a long time.
We couldn't have children so we fostered, got involved in the community, worked as a team.

It seems that men start screaming about feminism when faced with an intelligent, strong woman. I grew up as the only girl, with 4 brothers. I learned to be strong from them. I am not some "she-woman man-hater". 90% of my friends are men....sports, cars, racing...those are MY hobbies. If you have an issue with a strong, independent woman, then go look in the mirror for the root of the problem.

Want a medal for accelerating the rapture? I mean seriously? Just how did you expect me to respond to that? Congratulations on being sinful and completely ignoring God's word? I guess I can respond this way, you're successful congratulations. I will pray for you.

(gets out popcorn)
(sees the wife is posting to now)
(gets bigger popcorn bag and soda)

I laughed so hard, thank you for making my day. Worst part is, I didn't expect it to accellerate this way. I thought these were Christian boards.

Well - feminists are trying to kill off all males. Should that not be condemned? (or should we men all have a death wish?)

The wife of the OP is not a feminist.

She was, she had a lot of pro feminist views until I apparently "wiped her clean of them like a monster and destroyed the evil world that Feminists love accelerating". Which is what a majority of the Feminists replying

Well - feminists are trying to kill off all males.
Prove it.
Should that not be condemned? (or should we men all have a death wish?)
Making such a statement without supporting evidence should be condemned.

I'd be interested in seeing evidence of this too. I've only seen Feminist debates and Feminists get violent. If you said "Feminists are interested in violence" I'd probably agree with you...

Sounds like mockery. Is that your point?

Obviously, and it WAS funny. Because, honestly this thread has just become another debate thread that you apparently hate so much. All I wanted was advice and of course 10,000 Feminists have to attack me because I and other Antifeminists have a different view than them. But, go around preaching equality all day long till your face turns blue maybe one day it'll start happening and you can quit being hypocritical.

There are a lot of strong, intelligent women who flatly reject Feminism (along with a lot of strong, intelligent men). In any event, Feminism is not compatible with Christianity, just as rebellion is not compatible with submission.

Amen brother.

To any man who tries to bring up the whole "wives submit yourselves to your husbands" thing; I bring up another scripture (written primarily to men):

Hebrews 13:17 Obey those who rule over you, and be submissive, for they watch out for your souls, as those who must give account. Let them do so with joy and not with grief, for that would be unprofitable for you.

Men: if you want your wife to submit to you, then submit YOURSELF to your congregational leaders (pastors, elders, deacons) to the same degree you want your wife to submit to you. IOW, lead by example.

Very good point that should be quoted. I completely agree with you and I do respect and submit to Authority.

Yup. A bunch of quotes from has-been extremists, none of whom represent modern feminism. If modern feminists felt the same, you'd be able to post quotes from the 21st century.

Get over it.

So, you're saying there isn't any extremism going on today? Interesting. I could do a quick 5 second google search to prove you wrong but, I have 30+ replies to respond to.

You're out to lunch...typical of always going to the extreme to show you have no idea of what you're talking about

Now that I've read more of this thread, I think he knows a lot of what he's talking about.

Au Contraire. I take those "extremists" that started the modern feminist going to be the "true believers" of the movement. BUt, just like there are thousands of so-called christians in churches that have never truly turned their lives over to God, (and so are not really christians at all) the ranks of feminists have been watered down by the people you describe, morphing into something much less than MS Magazine's founders envisioned from the start.

So in the same way that social club christians are not true Christians; those who do not follow the likes of Stienem, Pitman-Huges, Ireland, et al are not true feminists.

Agreed.

This book might help. It is written by a former feminist/atheist:

I will save up money and check that book out, thank you!

Articles that say feminists are trying to kill males. From the 70's and 80's? Articles from 46 and 36 years ago.

And yet....here you are! We must be very successful after nearly 50 years of trying to kill males off huh? And given women aren't yet capable of parthenogenesis, no one in their right mind would actually think they could sell the lie that women are trying to kill off the sperm source that is part of the human procreative process.

Why is this?The male might ask.
Because without men all the women left in the world, unless they evolved to a state of parthenogenesis, would die off. Therein revoking the possibility of a world populated by women only.

But this thread isn't about hating on feminism is it? Rhetorical question.

This thread is posted by someone who claims all these faults with his woman and yet titles the thread as his concern for her ex-feminist status.

In truth, when they say they're Christian, they should get with their pastor for counseling. Or a married couples counseling group in the church.
The Catholic church has a marriage counseling group. Those stickers are seen affixed to cars quite often around where my family lives.

What isn't going to help is a forum site wherein there are men like you that hate on feminism in a marriage counseling thread that asks how a man can help his ex-feminist wife to live more biblically. Especially when he demonstrates he needs help in learning about Christian doctrine himself.

Here's a tip, how about if you don't like what a thread has become you don't reply to it and continue to fuel the ongoing fire? I mean, I don't seem to recall holding you at gun point and forcing your eyelids open to read and reply to this thread.

And, like I stated I haven't found the right church so why am I at fault for opening this thread? I didn't START it as a Feminist debate thread. It became a Feminist debate thread because other people (including you) turned it into one.

Also, I joined these boards under the impression that I was allowed to ask other Christians for advice. Which I've gotten, after having to sift through the replies of dozens and dozens of angry Feminists. True, I'm igniting the fire too. So, guess I have no place in saying anything. But, I feel like I'm being attacked
why wouldn't I defend myself?

Since this is someone's thread about a marital issue, I'm just going to start a new thread using this statement (because I believe it's a worthy and relevant topic):

"Feminism is not compatible with Christianity"

Thank you! That should at least keep the flamers out of this thread and get some actual on topic replies. I won't debate Feminism in here anymore and will instead post my thoughts and opinions in that thread.

I could name a few guys that do want very feminine women, but there's a difference between being feminine and being barefoot and in the kitchen at all times.

And it's not like I said "My wife should be in the kitchen at all times" either. Nor does really any other man. We do realize that women go into other places of the home.