How did God cause the distribution of nations from the Tower of Babel?

[tonychanyt]

Ge 10 gave an overview of the distribution of nations:

1 These are the generations of the sons of Noah, Shem, Ham, and Japheth. Sons were born to them after the flood. 2 The sons of Japheth: Gomer, Magog, … . 5 From these the coastland peoples spread in their lands, each with his own language, by their clans, in their nations.

15 Canaan fathered Sidon his firstborn and Heth. … 20 These are the sons of Ham, by their clans, their languages, their lands, and their nations.

21 To Shem also, the father of all the children of Eber. … 30 The territory in which they lived extended from Mesha in the direction of Sephar to the hill country of the east. 31 These are the sons of Shem, by their clans, their languages, their lands, and their nations.

People of the same clan spoke the same language in the same land area.

Ge 11 described the initial cause of the distribution:

1 Now the whole earth had one language and the same words.

Started with Noah's family.

2 And as people migrated from the east, they found a plain in the land of Shinar and settled there. 3 And they said to one another, “Come, let us make bricks, and burn them thoroughly.” And they had brick for stone, and bitumen for mortar. 4 Then they said, “Come, let us build ourselves a city and a tower with its top in the heavens, and let us make a name for ourselves, lest we be dispersed over the face of the whole earth.”

God didn't like what the people were doing.

5 And the Lord came down to see the city and the tower, which the children of man had built. 6 And the Lord said, “Behold, they are one people, and they have all one language, and this is only the beginning of what they will do. And nothing that they propose to do will now be impossible for them. 7 Come, let us go down and there confuse their language, so that they may not understand one another’s speech.” 8 So the Lord dispersed them from there over the face of all the earth, and they left off building the city. 9 Therefore its name was called Babel, because there the Lord confused the language of all the earth. And from there the Lord dispersed them over the face of all the earth.

If God randomly confused the languages then how did everyone end up being grouped within their common lineages and tongues?

God did not randomly confuse the languages. The scattering was organized by family groups, with each group/clan receiving its own language. People with the same new language formed new communities in different parts of the world.

 

[Diamond72]

Ge 10 gave an overview of the distribution of nations:




People of the same clan spoke the same language in the same land area.

Ge 11 described the initial cause of the distribution:


Started with Noah's family.


God didn't like what the people were doing.


If God randomly confused the languages then how did everyone end up being grouped within their common lineages and tongues?

God did not randomly confuse the languages. The scattering was organized by family groups, with each group/clan receiving its own language. People with the same new language formed new communities in different parts of the world.

How did God confuse the language in China where every city speaks a different language?

In the case of China, the languages spoken there today, like Mandarin, Cantonese, and other Chinese languages, are part of the Sino-Tibetan language family. These languages developed over thousands of years as people in that region were separated and isolated, influenced by geography, culture, and local traditions. While the Bible doesn't directly address the evolution of specific languages like Mandarin, the principle from the Tower of Babel story—a sudden disruption leading to diversity—can be seen as a theological explanation for the eventual development of all human languages, including Chinese.

 

[KevinT]

God did not randomly confuse the languages. The scattering was organized by family groups, with each group/clan receiving its own language. People with the same new language formed new communities in different parts of the world.

I notice that often language today is tool of "clan-ism". A group will form, and only they know the "cool" way to describe things in a certain way. It is a way to distinguish between "us" and "them". In the US we call the part that connects the engine of a car to the back differential the "driveshaft." In the UK, they call this the "prop shaft." Not a huge difference, but why aren't they the same word? Why don't we all sit down in some meeting and come up with one unified meaning? Well, because we all love our local "flavors" of words.

My point in all this is that the language issue at Babel could also be explained if instead of God handing out different languages to different groups, it was instead a sudden uptick in clan-ism (perhaps also instigated by God), and everyone rejecting commonality in favor of their own group's special lingo.

All pure conjecture, but fun to think about.

Best wishes,
KT

 

[Mark Quayle]

How did God confuse the language in China where every city speaks a different language?

In the case of China, the languages spoken there today, like Mandarin, Cantonese, and other Chinese languages, are part of the Sino-Tibetan language family. These languages developed over thousands of years as people in that region were separated and isolated, influenced by geography, culture, and local traditions. While the Bible doesn't directly address the evolution of specific languages like Mandarin, the principle from the Tower of Babel story—a sudden disruption leading to diversity—can be seen as a theological explanation for the eventual development of all human languages, including Chinese.

Maybe off-topic, but I don't think so: Why/how is Basque, not considered of any outside language family, so isolated?

 

[OldAbramBrown]

The chaos-producing policies of the king (who may have been Nimrod, a mighty brigand against the Lord - indeed all religions) coincided with mass immigrations (perhaps partly under duress) and emigration and natural disasters concurrently.

 

[Diamond72]

Why/how is Basque, not considered of any outside language family, so isolated?

Some early scholars and theologians speculated that Basque might be a remnant of the original language spoken before the dispersion of languages at the Tower of Babel. However, this theory lacks solid evidence and is more rooted in myth and speculation than in linguistic or historical research.

Monogenesis Theory:​

• Premise: This theory suggests that all languages originate from a single, common ancestral language, often referred to as the "proto-language."
• Key Ideas: According to this theory, as human populations spread and settled in different parts of the world, the proto-language diversified into the various languages we see today.
• Evidence: Proponents of this theory often point to commonalities in grammar, vocabulary, and phonetics across different languages as evidence of a shared origin.

 

[Mark Quayle]

• Evidence: Proponents of this theory often point to commonalities in grammar, vocabulary, and phonetics across different languages as evidence of a shared origin.

That works for a lot of languages, but not for all. Particularly where stark differences in mindset and sentence formation are found. Some languages are almost entirely spoken as propositional or subjunctive, others are without particularly relevant tenses and are almost entirely contextual, others are noises and even concepts that translators find almost impossible to notate. My brother was (now retired) a linguist with Wycliffe Bible Translators, and says the variety of mindsets that accompany language expressions is amazing.

Myself, I find it confounding that some people actually think that a language can be translated literally without losing meaning.

 

[Diamond72]

Some languages are almost entirely spoken as propositional or subjunctive

Then they are called dialects. In the Philippines, they have many different dialects but only one written language Tagallo. Although they use English also. The Tagallo is more Spanish when the conquistadors ruled the country.

You make an interesting contribution to the discussion.

• The Philippines was under Spanish rule for more than 300 years, from 1565 to 1898. This long period of colonization had a profound effect on various aspects of Filipino culture, including the language.
• Loanwords: Many Spanish words were integrated into Tagalog, resulting in a considerable number of Spanish loanwords. These are often used in everyday speech and cover a range of topics from religion to government, food, and clothing.
• Writing System: The Spanish introduced the Latin alphabet, which replaced the traditional Baybayin script used by Tagalog speakers.

 

[Diamond72]

Myself, I find it confounding that some people actually think that a language can be translated literally without losing meaning.

I was raised to believe that proper people speak proper English. But ghetto or hood people seem to want to have their own language.

It is amazing how AI can copy an individuals language. I have used it to write songs for people.

 

[JosephZ]

In the Philippines, they have many different dialects but only one written language Tagallo. Although they use English also. The Tagallo is more Spanish when the conquistadors ruled the country.

There are many people groups found in the Philippines: Tagalogs, Visayans, Ilocano, Maranao, Sama, etc., and each has its own distinct language. There are actually well over 100 written languages in the Philippines, with many of those having many indigenous or regional dialects.

One of the reasons the language of the Tagalog was chosen as the national language of the Philippine is because it's the native language of the indigenous Tagalog people, the largest ethnic group in the Philippines. The Tagalog are mostly found in Luzon, especially in and around the national capital region.

A Filipino from Manila that speaks Tagalog won’t be able to carry on a conversation with a Filipino in Mindanao who speaks Central Sinama, one of the nine languages of the Sama Bajau people.

I will give an example below of how the two languages are written and it will be easy to see that they are different languages and are not mutually intelligible.

Do you know how to speak Filipino?

Marunong po kayong magsalita ng Pilipino? (Tagalog)

Ata'u ka magbissala Pilipino? (Central Sinama)

I understand a little, but I don't know how to speak it.

Nauunawaan ko po nang kaunti, ngunit hindi ako makapagsalita. (Tagalog)

Makahati isab aku diki' diki' saguwa' mbal sadja makabissala. (Central Sinama)


Within both the Tagalog and Central Sinama languages, there are several regional dialects. For example, within Central Sinama, some of the dialects would include Sama Siasi, Sama Sibaud, Sama Manubal, Sama Kaulungan, and Sama Tabawan. These dialects are named after the islands that the Sama Bajau are found. While each island is populated by members of the same people group, they have noticeable differences in how they speak their native language. Even so, Sama Bajau who live on one island can visit Sama Bajau living on another and can understand each other for the most part, despite having noticeable differences in their grammar and how they pronounce certain words, because they share the same language, Central Sama. The same would be true of the Tagalog in Luzon who speak different dialects of their language.

 

[Diamond72]

There are many people groups found in the Philippines:

What is interesting though is the biodiversity.

The biodiversity of the Pacific Islands has been shaped by climatic changes over millions of years, including the ice ages. Here's a brief overview:

Ice Age Impact:​

• Glacial Periods: During the ice ages, lower sea levels exposed land bridges between islands and mainland areas, allowing species to migrate and colonize new areas.
• Isolation: As the ice age ended and sea levels rose, many islands became isolated, leading to the evolution of unique species adapted to their specific environments.

Post-Ice Age Biodiversity:​

• Endemism: The isolation of islands has resulted in high levels of endemism, where species are found nowhere else in the world.
• Adaptation: Species have adapted to the diverse microclimates and ecological niches available on the islands, leading to a rich variety of flora and fauna.