Well, I am honored that you have chosen to participate and ask questions not relevant to the thread to support your own understanding.
Hopefully, one day I will learn something from your wisdom.
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Well, I am honored that you have chosen to participate and ask questions not relevant to the thread to support your own understanding.I don't have a lack of biblical understanding, so your point is moot.
Plus, this thread isn't about me.
It is a state of justification through faith, which brings about regeneration/new birth.So one must believe in order to be in a state of salvation. Is that a state of regeneration or justification. If it's the latter, I'd be inclined to agree. If it's the former, then I'd have to disagree.
You didn't answer the last two questions, would you do that please?1. Yes
2. Yes.
3. No
4. No.
It's been awhile since I've explained this, and you're relatively new to this area, so I'll explain my methods to you.Really? I think anyone reading this thread can see that you
1. Rarely answer anything with more than one sentence, much less God's Word
2. You choose to put questions back onto the other person, rather than try to explain the Bible that you do not seem to understand.
So I will let each participant look back on your posts and decide what is truth. Sometimes we convict ourselves with our actions, nothing needed from anyone else.
So then you will be comfortable in asserting that one can please God in an unregenerate state, correct?It is a state of justification through faith, which brings about regeneration/new birth.
They were "if so" questions, so they were not relevant.You didn't answer the last two questions, would you do that please?
I'm not sure why one would feel they need to defend their faith when the other person chooses not to participate in a conversation. Now many times I also answer on my phone, however it is the responsibility of the communicator to express themselves well enough that the one reading their post understands what that person is saying and can adequately answer. Especially when the medium is writing.It's been awhile since I've explained this, and you're relatively new to this area, so I'll explain my methods to you.
One, I don't do long posts for two reasons. First, I do all of my posts from my phone, so it's burdensome to type out long replies. Second, long posts tend to not be taken as a whole. They get deconstructed and by the time the reply is finished, what it said is completely lost. Or, just as bad, only one or two sentences are replied to anyway.
As to the questions, they are cross-examination questions. If you (used generically) make a statement, I would think you would want to defend it, and welcome the chance. People only tend to get upset with the questions when their statements are superficial and cannot stand up to scrutiny.
I hope that helps.
You post in the way you feel is best. I don't criticize it. I just as for the same consideration.I'm not sure why one would feel they need to defend their faith when the other person chooses not to participate in a conversation. Now many times I also answer on my phone, however it is the responsibility of the communicator to express themselves well enough that the one reading their post understands what that person is saying and can adequately answer. Especially when the medium is writing.
Sharing and writing what others cannot understand or that they do not feel to be true and then answering their questions with a question, is hardly effective communication. As a matter of fact, I would say that it is not at all effective and causes less understanding and leads to more questions, that are again answered not in their own right, but with another question. Seems like a cycle to me.
Others on this thread have said the same thing, so I do not feel isolated in my opinion but feel that the same thing has been expressed by others. That is something to think about.You post in the way you feel is best. I don't criticize it. I just as for the same consideration.
I think you need to explain why you have changed the Words of God.
You added 'of the elect'. Are you reading your own opinion into God's perfect Word?
I also noticed Judas BECAME a traitor, which indicates he wasn't one when elected by Jesus.
Well the Bible disagree's with you because it shows that God is looking for faith and it is BY FAITH that we are saved as we accept god's free gift of salvation BY FAITH for the New Covenant and in the Old Covenant, righteousness was imputed to them THROUGH FAITH.
So as you try to prove predestination, you are missing the FAITH that we need to have to accept the free gift.
He didn't add anything. If the verse in question is 2 Pet 3:9, he is simply acknowledging that the pronoun "you" is "the elect", which was already established earlier in the book (2nd Peter), indeed, even in the previous letter (1st Peter)
Follow the pronouns throughout the books/chapter:
The introduction to chapter 3 says "beloved, this is the second letter I have written to you" (2 Peter 3:1)
Who is the "you"? Who is "the beloved"?
If 2nd Peter is the second letter written to this group, that means 1st Peter was the first letter written to them.
The recipients of 1st Peter is "God's elect..exiles scattered abroad" (1 Peter 1:1-2)
So when you get to 2nd Peter Chapter 3 Verse 9, it says:
"The Lord is patient towards YOU..not willing that any should perish"
Who is the "you"?
Is this a pronoun?
Was the antecedent already established for the past several chapters and at least 2 books?
The answer is yes.
No one, at least not me is going to say that faith is not a gift from God. However, God gives ALL a measure of faith, the saved and the unsaved, so the measure of faith that is given by God we know that some come to God and some do not.The Bible teaches that faith is a gift from God.
I believe the Bible.
It's you who denies that faith is a gift, thinking it self-wrought by unregenerate people (who then become regenerate as a result)
This flies in the face of John 3 which teaches we must be born again before we can even see, let alone enter, the Kingdom of God.
Your theology is that a man sees the kingdom and chooses to enter it by faith, then is born again as a result.
The Synod of Dordt already addressed your incorrect theology when they said:
For this (ToBeLoved's soteriology) does away with all effective functioning of God’s grace in our conversion and subjects the activity of Almighty God to human will; it is contrary to the apostles, who teach that “we believe by virtue of the effective working of God’s mighty strength” (Eph. 1:19), and that “God fulfills the undeserved good will of his kindness and the work of faith in us with power” (2 Thess. 1:11), and likewise that “his divine power has given us everything we need for life and godliness” (2 Pet. 1:3).
Not to mention Eph 2:8-9 which says that faith is a gift, and "not of ourselves"
All I have is a cell phone. But thanks anyway.Others on this thread have said the same thing, so I do not feel isolated in my opinion but feel that the same thing has been expressed by others. That is something to think about.
Please note that earlier I said I do understand about replying via cell phone, it is harder and more prone to having to modify your post for spelling errors. I often have to do the same, so I do know it is not easy. Sometimes I will reply to a post that I do not have time to adequately answer the post right now, but that I will come back later in the day or evening when I have more time to give to the answer. I think that is ok and most people are happy with my doing that, or so they say. So there are ways around the technology setbacks, I think.
Well I guess then I do understand you a little better. Do not always agree but I understand more.All I have is a cell phone. But thanks anyway.
And this is why I didn't explain it. Even though Skala adequately explained the reasoning, you didn't engage with what he said. Rather, you dismissed it as if he had said nothing.I still do not think nor trust another if they change God's Word. Now, they can explain or put in parentheses or something the meaning they devise from it, but to change it to me is a big no no. That can get very sloppy, not that that was the intention at all, but I've seen threads where interpretation can get out of control.
All in all, I do not like it. My opinion.
If all have faith from God, then all will saved since we are justified by faith.No one, at least not me is going to say that faith is not a gift from God. However, God gives ALL a measure of faith, the saved and the unsaved, so the measure of faith that is given by God we know that some come to God and some do not.
After a person has been saved, they change masters. One becomes a child of God and God becomes their master. It is then, when we have come to God in faith that the Almighty works through us, after through our free-will we have chosen God through faith.
I think when you read about faith, you are mixing up the measure of faith given to all and the faith that grows inside God's Own through sanctification and the revelation of Truth by the Holy Spirit.
So, you will need to deliniate between the two. If you do that, we can discuss it as you have understood that all have a measure of faith and born again believers grow in faith and the two are not the same.
No one, at least not me is going to say that faith is not a gift from God. However, God gives ALL a measure of faith, the saved and the unsaved, so the measure of faith that is given by God we know that some come to God and some do not.
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