How can Priests/Pastors forgive sins?

[Albion]

You cited entire chapters that cover a large context, not merely a couple of verses. Cite the specific verses you are referring to.

I guess I counted on you to read larger passages in order that there not be a risk of anything being taken out of context.

 

[Albion]

It's not as simple as you make it out to be. The teaching is that one can be saved if they were ignorant of Christ during their life, so long as they followed the Law that is written on our hearts to the best of their ability and sought out God with a sincere heart.

?? That is just about the same as how I explained it.

 

[JIMINZ]

Technically, that wouldn't be correct to say now that the Catholic Church has begun insisting that even a person who has never heard of Jesus or the Bible can be saved so long as he is true to whatever non-Christian religion he belongs to.

.
Are you saying.

A Buddhist, Hindu, Muslim, etc, if they remain true to their respective False Religions, Can, Do and Will receive the same Salvation as the Born Again Believer in Christ?.....Can I say here, "What a Crock"!

Does the Catholic Church supply any Scripture which they use as the Criteria for such a statement?

 

[JIMINZ]

It's not as simple as you make it out to be. The teaching is that one can be saved if they were ignorant of Christ during their life, so long as they followed the Law that is written on our hearts to the best of their ability and sought out God with a sincere heart.

.
Rom 3:9-12
9) What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin;
10) As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:
11) There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.
12) They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one.

What Law is it that has been Written on (Whose) heart, and who wrote it there when?

Where does it say "With a Sincere Heart"?

 

[Albion]

.
Are you saying.

A Buddhist, Hindu, Muslim, etc, if they remain true to their respective False Religions, Can, Do and Will receive the same Salvation as the Born Again Believer in Christ?...!

That is about it. Of course, it presumes that those people had no knowledge of Christ, the Bible, etc. or else they would not be blameless. But yes, two of the three most recent Popes voiced that opinion and most Catholic laypeople (in the USA, at least) now agree with it.

Does the Catholic Church supply any Scripture which they use as the Criteria for such a statement?

I do not know the answer to that question. However, Universalists have long pointed to half a dozen or so verses that they think support the idea of universal salvation which, presumably, might cover the same ground.

 

[Albion]

duplicate

 

[thecolorsblend]

A Buddhist, Hindu, Muslim, etc, if they remain true to their respective False Religions, Can, Do and Will receive the same Salvation as the Born Again Believer in Christ?.....

The Church teaches that it's possible that some non-Christians may go to Heaven. If such a thing is possible, certain conditions would apply. But the Church teaches that it might be possible.

The Church also teaches that best practice is to be a Catholic in a state of grace.

Can I say here, "What a Crock"!

Yes.

Does the Catholic Church supply any Scripture which they use as the Criteria for such a statement?

I am not sure that you understand that the Church isn't making a guarantee on this. She's simply suggesting what might be possible. And if a non-Christian goes to Heaven, it won't their non-Christian beliefs which get them there. It would still be Our Lord's sacrifice that saves them.

 

[TuxAme]

.
Rom 3:9-12
9) What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin;
10) As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:
11) There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.
12) They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one.

What Law is it that has been Written on (Whose) heart, and who wrote it there when?

Where does it say "With a Sincere Heart"?

I don't hold to Sola Scriptura, nor did I claim that this particular passage promoted the idea, so I fail to see your point.

 

[TuxAme]

?? That is just about the same as how I explained it.

Not quite. You said:

Technically, that wouldn't be correct to say now that the Catholic Church has begun insisting that even a person who has never heard of Jesus or the Bible can be saved so long as he is true to whatever non-Christian religion he belongs to.

This isn't the language that we use. "Being true" to one's non-Christian religion isn't a basis that we use for making this claim.

 

[Albion]

Not quite. You said:
This isn't the language that we use.

Yours wasn't the language we use, either. The message was the same, though.

"Being true" to one's non-Christian religion isn't a basis that we use for making this claim.

Really, it is.

It is casual speech, to be sure; but I feel that when posting on a discussion board where there are people of all sorts of backgrounds, to use everyday language is helpful.

 

[Alithis]

Exodus 19:5-6 reads, Now therefore, if you will obey my voice and keep my covenant, you shall be my own possession among all peoples; for all the earth is mine, and you shall be to me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation. These are the words which you shall speak to the children of Israel.”

Would you dare to call the Levitical priests "usurpers"? Because while God in the Old Covenant (like Peter and John in the New) referred to all under the Covenant as a Kingdom of Priests, that didn't subtract from the fact that He established a ministerial priesthood through Aaron and his sons to offer sacrifice to Him.

The jewish priesthood being decendants of arron .ordained by God not man.
Now defunct as their task has ended with the new covenant.
The rcc priesthood is made up by men
Not ordained by God but in opposition to God.
Its own supercult.
Yeah yeah go cry on the report button
.the rcc has murdered untold thousands for stating the truth and the moment the religious political climate allows they will do so again .

 

[Not David]

The jewish priesthood being decendants of arron .ordained by God not man.
Now defunct as their task has ended with the new covenant.
The rcc priesthood is made up by men
Not ordained by God but in opposition to God.
Its own supercult.
Yeah yeah go cry on the report button
.the rcc has murdered untold thousands for stating the truth and the moment the religious political climate allows they will do so again .

I wouldn't be so critical of Catholics when Protestants have done terrible things too.

 

[JIMINZ]

The Church teaches that it's possible that some non-Christians may go to Heaven. If such a thing is possible, certain conditions would apply. But the Church teaches that it might be possible.

The Church also teaches that best practice is to be a Catholic in a state of grace.

Yes.

I am not sure that you understand that the Church isn't making a guarantee on this. She's simply suggesting what might be possible. And if a non-Christian goes to Heaven, it won't their non-Christian beliefs which get them there. It would still be Our Lord's sacrifice that saves them.

.
No it would not.

There isn't Salvation for the Non Believer unless, they acknowledge that Sacrifice.

 

[thecolorsblend]

.
No it would not.

There isn't Salvation for the Non Believer unless, they acknowledge that Sacrifice.

Ah. No need for God to judge anybody, eh? JIMINZ has this thing under control.

 

[JIMINZ]

Ah. No need for God to judge anybody, eh? JIMINZ has this thing under control.

.
Sure God can and I'm sure He has forgiven those who are Non Believers, but that is not the Norm, what is being put forward by the Catholic Church casts a very broad net that isn't really possible for the greater majority of Non Believers, they are a very select few.

Remember, there were two criminals alongside Jesus one was forgiven the other wasn't, why do you suppose that was? Hummmm?

And you know full well what I meant.

 

[thecolorsblend]

Sure God can and I'm sure He has forgiven those who are Non Believers,

So we agree.

but that is not the Norm,

We agree again.

what is being put forward by the Catholic Church casts a very broad net that isn't really possible for the greater majority of Non Believers, they are a very select few.

This isn't doctrine. It's a conjecture. It's possible. The Church makes no guarantees about it. She simply theorizes on the circumstances whereby it might be possible.

Again, she teaches that best practice is to be Catholic.

Remember, there were two criminals alongside Jesus one was forgiven the other wasn't, why do you suppose that was? Hummmm?

One came to faith and the other did not.

 

[Loren T.]

It's a little confusing to me to understand the process. Can someone explain this?

They can't. Next question?

 

[FutureAndAHope]

You interpret it to suit your own belief system.

It's amazing where some people like solar scripturists will take some things literally from the Bible when it suits and at other times dismiss it!

We never saw the apostles setting up booths, to let their flock know if their sins were forgiven or not. From reading their letters it is clear any sin is forgiven that a man confesses and forsakes. God does not need mans approval to forgive sins.

 

[JIMINZ]

One came to faith and the other did not.

WOW, one came to Faith, isn't that exactly what I said to start with, the Non Believer MUST acknowledge the Sacrifice?

So then, what the Church is putting out is ,an unsubstantiated Dogma.

A belief without proof, just an assumption based upon our best guess.

 

[thecolorsblend]

WOW, one came to Faith, isn't that exactly what I said to start with, the Non Believer MUST acknowledge the Sacrifice?

So then, what the Church is putting out is ,an unsubstantiated Dogma.

A belief without proof, just an assumption based upon our best guess.

Wow, you really didn't read a single word of the catechism that TuxAme posted for you, did you?