How can I find spiritual awareness?

[drich0150]

If it is there, I cannot see it in the way that you suggest.

This is a start:

I have stepped out in faith more than once,

and landed flat on my nose. Doing that again is clearly not the way for me, though I do not know why.

Scripture asks of you to step out in your faith as far as to merely humble yourself before the Lord, and allow for Him to lift you up, and yet this is not acceptable to you.. For me this is readily identifiable as pride, what do you call it? (A relationship with God, not on His terms but your own.)

By you trying to justify your experience with terms and time limits, it only furthers my point. What Truly Humble man gets impatient?

What you suggest is effectively what I did for almost two years. Yet during that time there was never the slightest sign of a tug, a pull, or of God lifting me up in any way.

Not all will receive the same gifts or talents. Perhaps you are the servant entrusted with only the one talent, and like him rather than use what your Master has given you bury it in the sand.. Yes I did note that you did in fact use it for 2 years, but the story tells us we are to use the Masters talent until He returns.

Matt 25:
The Parable of the Talents

14"Again, it will be like a man going on a journey, who called his servants and entrusted his property to them. 15To one he gave five talents[a] of money, to another two talents, and to another one talent, each according to his ability. Then he went on his journey. 16The man who had received the five talents went at once and put his money to work and gained five more. 17So also, the one with the two talents gained two more. 18But the man who had received the one talent went off, dug a hole in the ground and hid his master's money.

19"After a long time the master of those servants returned and settled accounts with them. 20The man who had received the five talents brought the other five. 'Master,' he said, 'you entrusted me with five talents. See, I have gained five more.'
21"His master replied, 'Well done, good and faithful servant! You have been faithful with a few things; I will put you in charge of many things. Come and share your master's happiness!'
22"The man with the two talents also came. 'Master,' he said, 'you entrusted me with two talents; see, I have gained two more.'
23"His master replied, 'Well done, good and faithful servant! You have been faithful with a few things; I will put you in charge of many things. Come and share your master's happiness!'
24"Then the man who had received the one talent came. 'Master,' he said, 'I knew that you are a hard man, harvesting where you have not sown and gathering where you have not scattered seed. 25So I was afraid and went out and hid your talent in the ground. See, here is what belongs to you.'
26"His master replied, 'You wicked, lazy servant! So you knew that I harvest where I have not sown and gather where I have not scattered seed? 27Well then, you should have put my money on deposit with the bankers, so that when I returned I would have received it back with interest. 28" 'Take the talent from him and give it to the one who has the ten talents. 29For everyone who has will be given more, and he will have an abundance. Whoever does not have, even what he has will be taken from him. 30And throw that worthless servant outside, into the darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.'

Equality with God? Sorry, I have no idea why you suggested that idea.

Because it is becoming more and more apparent that you do not want to approach the Lord on His terms you want to dictate them. Servants/slaves do not dictate to their Masters, only an equal or someone greater can.

Your responses are listed with reasons that you will not go before God on his terms, but you do find it agreeable to "have a relationship" with God if He first grant you the spiritual Gift you seek..

What you are suggesting in your final paragraph sounds to me like a gospel of works. Serve God and all will be well. That is not my understanding of the gospel.

14What good is it, my brothers, if a man claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save him? 15Suppose a brother or sister is without clothes and daily food. 16If one of you says to him, "Go, I wish you well; keep warm and well fed," but does nothing about his physical needs, what good is it? 17In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead.

18But someone will say, "You have faith; I have deeds."
Show me your faith without deeds, and I will show you my faith by what I do.
19You believe that there is one God. Good! Even the demons believe that—and shudder.
20You foolish man, do you want evidence that faith without deeds is useless? 21Was not our ancestor Abraham considered righteous for what he did when he offered his son Isaac on the altar? 22You see that his faith and his actions were working together, and his faith was made complete by what he did. 23And the scripture was fulfilled that says, "Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness," and he was called God's friend. 24You see that a person is justified by what he does and not by faith alone. 25In the same way, was not even Rahab the prostitute considered righteous for what she did when she gave lodging to the spies and sent them off in a different direction? 26As the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without deeds is dead.

Remember, before you realized that you could work without the relationship you require, all you wanted, even more than Heaven was to simply serve the Lord.. Or so you said..

I am not expecting a relationship with God to come first; I know that it comes after being saved.

Perhaps this is the crux of your issue. A relationship with God is not guaranteed after you are saved, it is merely possible for a relationship to happen.
Like in any relationship though, if you don't work on it, what you do have will fail.

 

[aiki]

How do you manage to get the multi quotes in your reply to work? I assume that you press the “multi quote” button. When I press that button, nothing happens.

That is why I have to respond in this way, first preparing it on the word processor and then putting in the italics etc when I have copied it into the little box and the box has got rid of all my italics, different fonts and so on.

If the quotation button in the tool bar at the top of the "Reply" window won't work for you, try simply putting the word "quote" in all caps and in square brackets at the beginning and end of what it is you want to render as a quotation. The word "quote" at the end of the quotation must also be preceded by a backslash, which is within the square brackets, too (only put a backslash in the last set of brackets, not the first, and don't leave any space between the word "quote" and the backslash). Hope this helps.

I am interested in the spiritual dimension to life because I am aware that I am missing out on something important. I do not feel any spiritual “pull” from God; I wish I did feel such a pull.

There's that word "feel" again. You seem to understand to some degree that a Christian "walks by faith, not by sight," but you also appear to think that what God says is so must be validated by something you feel. When a Christian walks "not by sight" this means he/she does not have, necessarily, experiential proof of what God has said. Hebrews 11 talks all about people who walked this way. They believed what God said simply because it was God who said it.

How can you be so certain that the interest you feel about the spiritual life is not God's pull?

I did not have any specific expectations. But I was expecting something to happen. However, nothing happened.

"Nothing" is something, though, isn't it?

I think its kinda' odd that you would have no "specific expectations." The Bible tells us that when one is saved one can expect several things to be true of them for the first time. Were you not made aware of these things? It is only by believing these things to be true that one begins to act in conformity to them and change occurs. Maybe there will be some feeling that accompanies what God does in the new believer, maybe not. The reality of what God has done, however, is never certified by what one feels, but by what God has said.

Because I trusted God and the promises of the Bible.

I was holding onto the promises of God.

Okay, I'm confused here. How can you have had "no specific expectations" and yet "hold onto the promises of God"? Why would you hold onto those promises when you had no specific expectation that they would accomplish anything in your life?

I think you must have misunderstood my. My poor wording again, perhaps. I repeat, I was not doing those things in order to find God. I was doing those things because they are the things that Christians do.

Ugh. "The things that Christians do" is a phrase I strongly dislike. I grew up in a community of believers who would say the same thing. It was never, "I go to church, pray, and read my Bible because I love God"; it was only "This is what Christians do." There was a certain mechanical quality, a ritualistic character to their faith that deeply disturbed me. I'm sure many of them loved God, but the connection between the choices they made as Christians and the love for God they held wasn't as direct as it ought to have been. Anyway, I digress...

How do you know God will say this to you? Where do you get this "depart from me" stuff?

Matthew 25

Yes, actually, I know this quite well. I was being a little facetious. You had written:

Please do not ask me to have faith in a book before I have faith in God. Because unless I know God, my trust in the Bible will be worth nothing. God will still say to me,” depart from me because I do not know you."

I just thought it was ironic that in the same breath, so to speak, that you were saying you could not have faith in the Word of God, you were using it to justify doing so.

I agree with you completely, and that is the way it was for me. Except that I was never aware of receiving the grace that you write of.

Sure you were. You knew what the Bible said about God's grace enabling the believer. You may not have felt its presence as some sort of warm, inner glow, but if you knew and believed what was written in Scripture about God's grace, you were aware that He gives it to all who exert faith in Christ as Saviour and Lord.

Are you aware that 1 + 1 = 2? Is this just a feeling you have? Or do you comprehend this mathematical fact with your intellect? If you did not have any particular feeling that this equation was true, would it then be false? Obviously not. Whether or not you have any special feeling about this equation or, as you would put it, "awareness" of it, the truth is that 1 + 1 does equal 2. Would you be able to trust this truth and count on it when you do your banking, or buy something at the store, or bake a cake if you had no particular feeling about it? Of course. Why, then, can you not do the same with the facts, the truths, of God's Word?

I also respect the knowledge and wisdom contained in the Bible. However, I do not go so far as to call it the word of God. God may have been the inspiration for the writers of the Bible, but it was written by human beings – and human beings get it wrong sometimes.

How do you know that the writers of the Bible didn't get it all wrong? On what basis can you trust any of the Scriptures?

I never said that I could not have faith in God as revealed in the Bible. I said that I could not have faith in a book, and the reason is that it was written by fallible human beings.

Now you sound like you're contradicting yourself. The book you say you cannot have faith in is the same book you imply you do have faith in as a revelation of God. How does this work, exactly?

I asked as sincerely as I was able to ask, given that I did not have any particular awareness of sin or the need of a saviour for my sins to be forgiven. And I believed sincerely that I was saved.

Again, this doesn't make any sense to me. If you did not have any particular "awareness" of sin or need of a Saviour, why would you ask to be saved from sin by the Saviour? How could you believe sincerely that you were saved from something you were "unaware" of?

Who said that I doubted what the Bible said about my need to be forgiven from my sin?

Well, if you did not doubt it, then what difference does it make that you had no "awareness" of your need of forgiveness?

What I said was that I had no particular awareness of sin or the need of a saviour for my sins to be forgiven. The Bible tells us that such an awareness of sin arises when the Holy Spirit convicts a person of sin. Unfortunately I have no spiritual awareness, and so am not aware of any action of the Holy Spirit.

But you were so convicted. You implied above that you had no doubt about your need to be forgiven of your sin. As you said, such certainty can only come from the Holy Spirit.

Peace.

 

[losthope]

To drich0150:

Scripture asks of you to step out in your faith as far as to merely humble yourself before the Lord, and allow for Him to lift you up, and yet this is not acceptable to you.. For me this is readily identifiable as pride, what do you call it? (A relationship with God, not on His terms but your own.)

You seem to be very keen to make assumptions about me and about my motives. Looking at it from your point of view, only God can know what is in a man’s heart.
Let me say it again, I cannot understand why you want to bring pride into it. What I said was that I stepped out in faith – although in fact I did it in humility on my knees - but had no awareness of the Lord lifting me up. Why do you say that this is not acceptable to me? I just cannot understand where you are finding these assumptions about me.

By you trying to justify your experience with terms and time limits, it only furthers my point. What Truly Humble man gets impatient?
Not all will receive the same gifts or talents. Perhaps you are the servant entrusted with only the one talent, and like him rather than use what your Master has given you bury it in the sand.. Yes I did note that you did in fact use it for 2 years, but the story tells us we are to use the Masters talent until He returns.

I continued to think of myself as a Christian for two years. Then I recognised that something was seriously wrong, and I recognised that what was needed was to find out what was wrong, put it right, and start again with God. I am still doing that now, more than thirty years later. I am still trying to get myself ready for when the master returns, as you put it

Equality with God? Sorry, I have no idea why you suggested that idea.
Because it is becoming more and more apparent that you do not want to approach the Lord on His terms you want to dictate them. Servants/slaves do not dictate to their Masters, only an equal or someone greater can.

Sorry, but once again I cannot understand your reasoning. Let me make it quite clear. I am not trying to dictate terms to God. That would be ridiculous. I am trying to find the way to God that is possible for me.

Your responses are listed with reasons that you will not go before God on his terms, but you do find it agreeable to "have a relationship" with God if He first grant you the spiritual Gift you seek..

My responses are listed with accounts of previous attempts to do what you and other Christians have suggested, and which have ended in failure. It is my continuing failure to find God that is leading me to ask how to find God. What am I doing wrong? Or is there something in me that makes it impossible for me to find God? Am I one of the people whose name is not written in the Book of Life?

I have not asked or said anything about spiritual gifts. You have introduced that idea. I have asked about spiritual awareness, something that vast numbers of human beings will acknowledge but which I have never experienced.

Remember, before you realized that you could work without the relationship you require, all you wanted, even more than Heaven was to simply serve the Lord.. Or so you said.

“Ouch”. I wanted, and still want, to serve the Lord. In order to do that, I believe that I need some kind of guidance from God. Maybe that implies a relationship to you, maybe it doesn’t. We all use ideas in different ways. As for heaven, I have no interest in heaven at all.

Perhaps this is the crux of your issue. A relationship with God is not guaranteed after you are saved, it is merely possible for a relationship to happen.
Like in any relationship though, if you don't work on it, what you do have will fail.

I will finish with a quote from the “Be a Christian” section of this web site. If you disagree with what is said below, and you say that a relationship with God is only a possibility, perhaps you should ask yourself why you frequent this web site. As for me, I will go on assuming that being a Christian implies having a personal relationship with God. And that if I lack such a personal relationship then I am not saved.

Jesus Christ wants to have a personal relationship with you. Picture, if you will, Jesus Christ standing at the door of your heart (the door of your emotions, intellect and will). Invite Him in; He is waiting for you to receive Him into your heart and life.

You Must Receive Him

"Yet to all who received him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God." --John 1:12 (NIV)

When you receive Christ into your heart you become a child of God, and have the privilege of talking to Him in prayer at any time about anything. The Christian life is a personal relationship to God through Jesus Christ. And best of all, it is a relationship that will last for all eternity.

 

[losthope]

To aiki:

What you wrote about getting multiquotes sounds even more complicated than what I am doing using the word processor and then making modifications after it has transferred to the CF page.

There's that word "feel" again. You seem to understand to some degree that a Christian "walks by faith, not by sight," but you also appear to think that what God says is so must be validated by something you feel. When a Christian walks "not by sight" this means he/she does not have, necessarily, experiential proof of what God has said. Hebrews 11 talks all about people who walked this way. They believed what God said simply because it was God who said it.

I think that what God says must be seen to be true. To do otherwise would be to call God a liar. If God says that something should happen under certain conditions, and that something does not happen, then maybe the conditions were not what I thought they were. Or maybe I am unable to perceive it. Or maybe I just have to wait a little longer.

How can you be so certain that the interest you feel about the spiritual life is not God's pull?

I cannot be certain about it. But for information, I have also spoken to people whose spiritual awareness is very different, in that they develop spiritual awareness through meditation, or from the wonders of nature, and do not bring God into it at all. I am just as unable to experience the type of spirituality that they describe to me. Is that God’s pull as well? I think you would probably say not.

"Nothing" is something, though, isn't it?

Not in my understanding, no. Nothing is nothing.

I think its kinda' odd that you would have no "specific expectations." The Bible tells us that when one is saved one can expect several things to be true of them for the first time. Were you not made aware of these things? It is only by believing these things to be true that one begins to act in conformity to them and change occurs. Maybe there will be some feeling that accompanies what God does in the new believer, maybe not. The reality of what God has done, however, is never certified by what one feels, but by what God has said.
Okay, I'm confused here. How can you have had "no specific expectations" and yet "hold onto the promises of God"? Why would you hold onto those promises when you had no specific expectation that they would accomplish anything in your life?

I was aware of the kind of things that happen for new Christians. I am also aware that the experience is different for everyone. That is what I meant when I said that I had no specific expectations, meaning that there was no set list of things that I was expecting to happen to me. But I did trust God, and so I was expecting that something would happen. Some change, somewhere. Not necessarily immediately, but eventually.

I just thought it was ironic that in the same breath, so to speak, that you were saying you could not have faith in the Word of God, you were using it to justify doing so.

Sometimes I have to use Christian ideas, and to use the Bible, in order to try to explain things to Christians.

Sure you were. You knew what the Bible said about God's grace enabling the believer. You may not have felt its presence as some sort of warm, inner glow, but if you knew and believed what was written in Scripture about God's grace, you were aware that He gives it to all who exert faith in Christ as Saviour and Lord.
Are you aware that 1 + 1 = 2? Is this just a feeling you have? Or do you comprehend this mathematical fact with your intellect? If you did not have any particular feeling that this equation was true, would it then be false? Obviously not. Whether or not you have any special feeling about this equation or, as you would put it, "awareness" of it, the truth is that 1 + 1 does equal 2. Would you be able to trust this truth and count on it when you do your banking, or buy something at the store, or bake a cake if you had no particular feeling about it? Of course. Why, then, can you not do the same with the facts, the truths, of God's Word?

There is, to me as a non-Christian, a very big difference between a mathematical truth and a statement found in the Bible. I do not regard the Bible in the same way that you do. Maybe one day if I become a Christian and know God in a real way, then I may start to think differently about the Bible. But until then, no.
I would never consider equating objective facts with subjective belief. But I am aware that many Christians, as well as people of other faiths, do this.
To me the things in the Bible are not facts and truths. I repeat, I want to put my trust in God. I am not willing to put my trust in a book. Especially when there are several possible books to choose from – and I am sorry if you find that blasphemous. I happen to have been born in a nominally Christian country, and that is why I happen to be on a Christian website writing about the Bible instead of writing about a different holy book on an equivalent website of another religion. But now I am the one who is digressing.

How do you know that the writers of the Bible didn't get it all wrong? On what basis can you trust any of the Scriptures?

You are the one who trusts the scriptures, not me.

Now you sound like you're contradicting yourself. The book you say you cannot have faith in is the same book you imply you do have faith in as a revelation of God. How does this work, exactly?

The best answer I can give to this is that you are thinking of faith in two different ways here. Sorry if that does not explain very well.

Again, this doesn't make any sense to me. If you did not have any particular "awareness" of sin or need of a Saviour, why would you ask to be saved from sin by the Saviour? How could you believe sincerely that you were saved from something you were "unaware" of?

Because Christians and the Bible told me that asking for forgiveness is the way to become a Christian. Unless you know of any other way?

Well, if you did not doubt it, then what difference does it make that you had no "awareness" of your need of forgiveness?

It is possible that it made an enormous difference, if it prevented me in some way from being saved. However, that is only speculation on my part.

But you were so convicted. You implied above that you had no doubt about your need to be forgiven of your sin. As you said, such certainty can only come from the Holy Spirit.

You seem to be reading more certainty into my words than I had when I wrote them.

Anyway, now that I have answered your questions, are you, or anyone else, going to answer my question and tell me if there is anyone who can help me to find spiritual awareness? Or who can help me to find God. Or help me to get into a position where God can find me.

 

[drich0150]

When you receive Christ into your heart you become a child of God, and have the privilege of talking to Him in prayer at any time about anything. The Christian life is a personal relationship to God through Jesus Christ. And best of all, it is a relationship that will last for all eternity.

But isn't this the core of your issue??? You have no emotion so you can not experience him through your "Heart?" If you have indeed gone through these steps then what is it your looking for?

Spiritual awareness?

Which i have deemed a "Spiritual Gift" Because it is evident that desire alone can not summon spiritual awareness, So awareness of God has to be a Gift. A Gift Given by the Holy Spirit.. A Gift that you feel you Need or demand in order to full fill all you really want, and still want..

But, instead of heeding scripture and the direction it gives us to find and fill needs in the name of the Lord, and to be faithful to what you have been given. you require more. You see what others have and want it for yourself, you have stopped worship and service because you feel you are owed what others have..

Granted You have spun the telling of these facts differently, but at the core you feel you are lacking what you perceive to be a spiritual gift. You want what you perceive others have. You have stopped any Church, and any service to the Lord you were apart of, because you do not want to worship in that way. You claim you want to serve, but will not do so till you get what you want...

Is any of this wrong? If this is correct then how do you not see this as Pride? If not, then to you, what is it? For me I see what you have described as someone holding their faith Hostage till God capitulates to their demands... To me This is to be considered pride, because who are we to demand anything from God? Especially when we are told to humble ourselves to God and be faithful to what you already have..

We have collectively gone down a list of spiritual awarenesses or requirements, for the relationship you seek. the only one you have admitted to is having the ability to see needs in others.. Whether you want this to be an answer to your prayer or not, it is. Because this is an answer to your prayer, it will be one you will be held accountable to. The signal talent that you have buried is all you need to start a relationship with God. You don't Need anything else from Him. If you are faithful to what you have more will be given. If you bury what you have, what you have will be taken from you, and you name will not be found in the Lamb's book.

 

[drich0150]

we are told in 1Co. 12 That we are not all to have the same spiritual gifts..

1 Corinthians 12

Spiritual Gifts

1Now about spiritual gifts, brothers, I do not want you to be ignorant. 2You know that when you were pagans, somehow or other you were influenced and led astray to mute idols. 3Therefore I tell you that no one who is speaking by the Spirit of God says, "Jesus be cursed," and no one can say, "Jesus is Lord," except by the Holy Spirit.

4There are different kinds of gifts, but the same Spirit. 5There are different kinds of service, but the same Lord. 6There are different kinds of working, but the same God works all of them in all men.
7Now to each one the manifestation of the Spirit is given for the common good. 8To one there is given through the Spirit the message of wisdom, to another the message of knowledge by means of the same Spirit, 9to another faith by the same Spirit, to another gifts of healing by that one Spirit, 10to another miraculous powers, to another prophecy, to another distinguishing between spirits, to another speaking in different kinds of tongues,[a] and to still another the interpretation of tongues.[b] 11All these are the work of one and the same Spirit, and he gives them to each one, just as he determines.
12The body is a unit, though it is made up of many parts; and though all its parts are many, they form one body. So it is with Christ. 13For we were all baptized by[c] one Spirit into one body—whether Jews or Greeks, slave or free—and we were all given the one Spirit to drink.
14Now the body is not made up of one part but of many. 15If the foot should say, "Because I am not a hand, I do not belong to the body," it would not for that reason cease to be part of the body. 16And if the ear should say, "Because I am not an eye, I do not belong to the body," it would not for that reason cease to be part of the body. 17If the whole body were an eye, where would the sense of hearing be? If the whole body were an ear, where would the sense of smell be? 18But in fact God has arranged the parts in the body, every one of them, just as he wanted them to be. 19If they were all one part, where would the body be? 20As it is, there are many parts, but one body.
21The eye cannot say to the hand, "I don't need you!" And the head cannot say to the feet, "I don't need you!" 22On the contrary, those parts of the body that seem to be weaker are indispensable, 23and the parts that we think are less honorable we treat with special honor. And the parts that are unpresentable are treated with special modesty, 24while our presentable parts need no special treatment. But God has combined the members of the body and has given greater honor to the parts that lacked it, 25so that there should be no division in the body, but that its parts should have equal concern for each other. 26If one part suffers, every part suffers with it; if one part is honored, every part rejoices with it. 27Now you are the body of Christ, and each one of you is a part of it. 28And in the church God has appointed first of all apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then workers of miracles, also those having gifts of healing, those able to help others, those with gifts of administration, and those speaking in different kinds of tongues. 29Are all apostles? Are all prophets? Are all teachers? Do all work miracles? 30Do all have gifts of healing? Do all speak in tongues[d]? Do all interpret? 31But eagerly desire[e] the greater gifts.
And now I will show you the most excellent way.

For you to ignore what you have been given, in favor of a larger portion is that sin that is keeping you from growing Spiritually.

 

[aiki]

Anyway, now that I have answered your questions, are you, or anyone else, going to answer my question and tell me if there is anyone who can help me to find spiritual awareness? Or who can help me to find God. Or help me to get into a position where God can find me.

All those who have answered your OP are trying to help you find God.

If you will seek God with all your heart, the Bible says, you will find Him. (Jer. 29:13) "Draw near to me," God says in His word, "and I will draw near to you." (Jas. 4:8) Seems pretty simple to me...You have, I think, unnecessarily complicated things with your "I have no spiritual awareness" stuff and your determination to see something more of God than He has already given before you trust Him. In any case, when you really do want Him, He will reach out to you and meet you.

I have heard many incredible stories of, and been a witness to, the measures God has taken to be "found" by those who were truly searching for Him. In light of these stories and my own experience, I am very tempted to doubt that your claim to want to know God is as sincere as you say. Certainly, if you have been looking for Him with all your heart as long you assert, you should have been "found" by Him by now. Whatever the real problem is, it isn't on God's end, friend. He's on your doorstep even now. But with a convoluted and confused line of thinking you justify your refusal to open the door and let Him in. No one can make you open the door; you must open it yourself.

Revelation 3:20
20 Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and dine with him, and he with Me.

Be warned: God sees your heart and knows precisely what is keeping you from Him. He is not deflected by semantics, or tangled reasoning, or a claim to have no "spiritual awareness." Don't think your success in stymieing those who would help you here as an indicator of the validity of your "problem" before God. God's sight pierces through the lies we tell ourselves and the weak justifications we convince ourselves to see as profound. He is not deceived as we often are.

Deuteronomy 30:15-20 )
15 "See, I have set before you today life and good, death and evil,
16 in that I command you today to love the Lord your God, to walk in His ways, and to keep His commandments, His statutes, and His judgments, that you may live and multiply; and the Lord your God will bless you in the land which you go to possess.
17 But if your heart turns away so that you do not hear, and are drawn away, and worship other gods and serve them,
18 I announce to you today that you shall surely perish....
19 I call heaven and earth as witnesses today against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing; therefore choose life, that both you and your descendants may live;
20 that you may love the Lord your God, that you may obey His voice, and that you may cling to Him, for He is your life and the length of your days...

Peace.

 

[losthope]

we are told in 1Co. 12 That we are not all to have the same spiritual gifts..

For you to ignore what you have been given, in favor of a larger portion is that sin that is keeping you from growing Spiritually.

Yes, people do have different gifts. In principle I could agree completely that I have a unique set of gifts (spiritual and otherwise) that I could use for God. My "talent" if you prefer to call it that. But I have to repeat, how does God want me to use my talent?

I could simply make a unilateral decision to serve God, and act on it in various ways. But that would not mean that I was any closer to God. The Pharisees made a decision to serve God, and they acted on that decision very thoroughly – but did that make them valued servants of God?

Over the years Christians have accused me of many things. Including suggesting that I am asking for the impossible. But as far as I can remember you are the first to describe it as pride, or as a desire to be equal with God.

 

[losthope]

All those who have answered your OP are trying to help you find God.

If you will seek God with all your heart, the Bible says, you will find Him. (Jer. 29:13) "Draw near to me," God says in His word, "and I will draw near to you." (Jas. 4:8) Seems pretty simple to me...You have, I think, unnecessarily complicated things with your "I have no spiritual awareness" stuff and your determination to see something more of God than He has already given before you trust Him. In any case, when you really do want Him, He will reach out to you and meet you.

I have heard many incredible stories of, and been a witness to, the measures God has taken to be "found" by those who were truly searching for Him. In light of these stories and my own experience, I am very tempted to doubt that your claim to want to know God is as sincere as you say. Certainly, if you have been looking for Him with all your heart as long you assert, you should have been "found" by Him by now. Whatever the real problem is, it isn't on God's end, friend. He's on your doorstep even now. But with a convoluted and confused line of thinking you justify your refusal to open the door and let Him in. No one can make you open the door; you must open it yourself.

Revelation 3:20
20 Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and dine with him, and he with Me.

Be warned: God sees your heart and knows precisely what is keeping you from Him. He is not deflected by semantics, or tangled reasoning, or a claim to have no "spiritual awareness." Don't think your success in stymieing those who would help you here as an indicator of the validity of your "problem" before God. God's sight pierces through the lies we tell ourselves and the weak justifications we convince ourselves to see as profound. He is not deceived as we often are.

Yes, I am aware that all who have contributed to this thread are all trying, each in their own way, to help me to find God.

The Bible says that if we seek God and reach out for God, if we open the door, then God will respond. Many Christians have reminded me of those verses. You wrote that when I really do want God, then God will reach out to me and meet me.

I find it difficult to imagine that I could ever want God any more than I did in my time of real need in late 1975 and early 1976. It was a time when I was praying a lot, and many others were also praying for me. However, I can assure you that whatever those Bible verses may say, God did not reach out to me, meet me or open the door. The effect on me, when I eventually accepted that I was not going to have any awareness of a response from God, was huge. I was plunged into serious depression (although at the time I did not realise that it was depression), my marriage almost failed, my health deteriorated, and for six months I was in a sense just a shadow of myself. All of this at a time when I had lost my social support (the fellowship) and had nobody to turn to. I survived it, but there were times when I wondered if I would survive it.

You say that you have heard incredible stories of how God has been found by those who truly sought God. Well, please add to those stories my story, of how I truly sought God but did not find God.

You say that you doubt my claim that I really did want to find God. And that if I really have been truly searching for such a long time, I should have been “found” by now. I can understand why you say this; I was not expecting to have to search for so many years and still not have found God. I had thought that maybe it would be a few months, at the most. But it is now more than 35 years since I first thought that I had become a Christian. If you are tempted to doubt me, there are plenty of Christians who saw me at the time, and who were very much aware of my struggles in the 1970s. As well as the Christians who have seen my struggles more recently, including those who two years ago witnessed the time when I was once again able to trust God, and then almost in disbelief watched my faith wither away for lack of living water to sustain it.

It is because it is taking such a long time, that I asked for help in my original posting. I have waited 35 years already. I may not have another 35 years of life to wait.

I am aware that God would be able to know my motives as well as my actions, and to know what is the barrier between God and me. The trouble is, I do not know, and there is no point in me trying to “second guess” God. I cannot put things right until I find out what is wrong. Many Christians have made suggestions – probably twenty or more quite different suggestions – as well as the things I have thought up myself. I cannot act on all of them, if only because they are not compatible with one another.

 

[drich0150]

But I have to repeat, how does God want me to use my talent?

If all you possess is the ability to see one need, then you are to spend the time you have remaining in service to the Lord to do your best to fill that need in His name. Pray about it ask Him to give you the tools and direction you will need to do you Job, and simply go from there. Make sure you pray and let God know of your intentions, and ask for guidance, even in the way of opening and closing circumstances if you still have absolutely no spiritual awareness at this point.

I could simply make a unilateral decision to serve God, and act on it in various ways. But that would not mean that I was any closer to God. The Pharisees made a decision to serve God, and they acted on that decision very thoroughly – but did that make them valued servants of God?

What separates us or you (hopefully) from the Pharisees will be not what you are doing, but why you are doing it. You are correct "They" did many many things in the name of the Lord. but through the Many rebukes Jesus makes it becomes apparent that what made them hypocrites or blind guides was the fact that they served God through action alone. God isn't concerned with What you do so much as why you are doing it.

If you reluctantly go through the motions of service then in fact you will be better off the way you were. Your service to the Lord should reflect an earnest desire to express love or at least a want to love the Lord. If you can manage this, then we are told we will be blessed. Remember there isn't a timed limit to His offer. You blessing maybe immediate or it may be after this life is over. Remember we do not serve to be paid in blessings. The blessings we receive are gifts that can not be earned.

But as far as I can remember you are the first to describe it as pride, or as a desire to be equal with God.

I say this with all the respect and humility I have. I am truly sorry that it has taken this long for someone representing the Church, to present you with this direction. I didn't intend for my words to be insulting. It is my prayer that you are able to take this new direction, and use it to find what it is your Heart seeks.

 

[aiki]

I find it difficult to imagine that I could ever want God any more than I did in my time of real need in late 1975 and early 1976. It was a time when I was praying a lot, and many others were also praying for me. However, I can assure you that whatever those Bible verses may say, God did not reach out to me, meet me or open the door. The effect on me, when I eventually accepted that I was not going to have any awareness of a response from God, was huge.

I don't doubt that you were convinced that you really wanted God. But what we think this means and what God means are often two very different things. In your case, you were expecting an experience of God that was tangible and emotional. You wanted, at some point, to feel God. The problem with this is that the feeling is often how one comes to believe that what God says is true; the feeling of God becomes God. I have seen this many times with charismatic Christians. Everything they claim to believe must be validated by an extraordinarily emotional experience of God's Spirit. These folk have great difficulty, and some find it impossible, to simply take God at His Word. They come to think that if God cannot be felt, then He cannot be real. They reveal in this sort of thinking that their confidence isn't really in God, but in the feeling of Him. Unfortunately, the nature of feelings is that they wax and wane. And Christians who base their faith ultimately on what they feel find that their relationship with God also follows a similar ebb and flow. Spiritually, such Christians are "unstable in all their ways," like "waves of the sea, driven by the wind and tossed." This is not what God wants for His children. He desires that we understand who He is and, having understood, that we trust Him without reserve.

The rich young ruler who came to Christ and said he wished to follow him was challenged to release the one thing he most valued: His wealth. He could not follow Christ wholeheartedly and at the same time hold onto his riches. I think your desire to feel God, to have a "spiritual awareness" of Him, may be your challenge point with God. To follow Him wholeheartedly, you must give it up. You need Him, not a feeling.

Christ said,

Matthew 10:39
39 He who finds his life will lose it, and he who loses his life for My sake will find it.

It is paradoxical to give up, for the sake of a relationship with God, what one most cherishes or desires in order finally to obtain it, but this how things work with Him. I suspect that when you can walk with God without needing to feel Him, then it is that He will give you those feelings.

I didn't marry until I was forty. I waited (often rather unhappily) upon God for a very long time before He finally brought my wife and I together. This happened, however, only after I had come to the place where I was truly content to live the rest of my life single, with God as my most intimate friend, if that was what He wanted. Sometimes to find what we want, we must cease to want it. God intends that our desire for Him never be confused with, or corrupted by, anything else. Until He knows we cannot be confused or corrupted in our desire for Him by what else we may desire, He will not give it to us.

Peace.

 

[losthope]

I don't doubt that you were convinced that you really wanted God. But what we think this means and what God means are often two very different things. In your case, you were expecting an experience of God that was tangible and emotional. You wanted, at some point, to feel God. The problem with this is that the feeling is often how one comes to believe that what God says is true; the feeling of God becomes God. ... Unfortunately, the nature of feelings is that they wax and wane. And Christians who base their faith ultimately on what they feel find that their relationship with God also follows a similar ebb and flow. Spiritually, such Christians are "unstable in all their ways," like "waves of the sea, driven by the wind and tossed." This is not what God wants for His children. He desires that we understand who He is and, having understood, that we trust Him without reserve.

I think your desire to feel God, to have a "spiritual awareness" of Him, may be your challenge point with God. To follow Him wholeheartedly, you must give it up. You need Him, not a feeling.

It is paradoxical to give up, for the sake of a relationship with God, what one most cherishes or desires in order finally to obtain it, but this how things work with Him. I suspect that when you can walk with God without needing to feel Him, then it is that He will give you those feelings.

Sometimes to find what we want, we must cease to want it. God intends that our desire for Him never be confused with, or corrupted by, anything else. Until He knows we cannot be confused or corrupted in our desire for Him by what else we may desire, He will not give it to us.

You say that I need God. Not a feeling. I agree completely. Despite what you seem to have assumed, I was never in search of what you describe as a feeling of God. What I was searching for was some kind of "feedback" from God. Something to show me that God had heard my prayers and had accepted me. Any kind of feedback would have been adequate.

What kind of feedback? An answered prayer. Spiritual insight when reading the Bible (a verse "jumping off the page", for example). Some kind of divine guidance. Awareness of God's presence. An awareness of the Holy Spirit working in me. Changing inside. Just something. Anything that would let me know that I was saved. These, and other things, were what Christians told me that they had experienced. Yet for me none of these things have happened. As far as I was aware, nothing whatsoever changed when I (thought I) became a Christian. Months went by, and still nothing happened. Do you think that is normal? Or was I right to be concerned about my salvation?

If you wish to describe all of this as searching for a feeling of God, then that of course is your right. I would certainly not describe it as seeking mere feelings.

You also suggest that when I accept the situation and stop searching for "feelings of God" then God will respond. Well, during the years since my failed experience of being a Christian, there have been times, sometimes lasting for several years, when I have been quite content with my lot away from God. Still, nothing has happened. I am as far from God as I ever was.

 

[losthope]

If all you possess is the ability to see one need, then you are to spend the time you have remaining in service to the Lord to do your best to fill that need in His name. Pray about it ask Him to give you the tools and direction you will need to do you Job, and simply go from there. Make sure you pray and let God know of your intentions, and ask for guidance, even in the way of opening and closing circumstances if you still have absolutely no spiritual awareness at this point.

What separates us or you (hopefully) from the Pharisees will be not what you are doing, but why you are doing it. You are correct "They" did many many things in the name of the Lord. but through the Many rebukes Jesus makes it becomes apparent that what made them hypocrites or blind guides was the fact that they served God through action alone. God isn't concerned with What you do so much as why you are doing it.

If you reluctantly go through the motions of service then in fact you will be better off the way you were. Your service to the Lord should reflect an earnest desire to express love or at least a want to love the Lord. If you can manage this, then we are told we will be blessed. Remember there isn't a timed limit to His offer. You blessing maybe immediate or it may be after this life is over. Remember we do not serve to be paid in blessings. The blessings we receive are gifts that can not be earned.

I say this with all the respect and humility I have. I am truly sorry that it has taken this long for someone representing the Church, to present you with this direction. I didn't intend for my words to be insulting. It is my prayer that you are able to take this new direction, and use it to find what it is your Heart seeks.

You suggest that I should pray and ask God to give me the tools and the direction that I need. It sounds right in principle. It might work for you. But I know from long experience that my prayers are never answered. Not even in, as you put it, opening and closing circumstances. Nothing changes in response to my prayers. I have prayed as you suggest, before. I am still without God's guidance.

You also suggest that my problem is pride. When I wrote that nobody else had suggested this, it was in surprise that you suggest it. It just does not make any sense to me. Neither your logic in coming to that conclusion, nor the conclusion itself. I may lack spiritual awareness but I do not lack self-awareness. I can assure you that I would never think of putting myself equal to God.

 

[drich0150]

You suggest that I should pray and ask God to give me the tools and the direction that I need. It sounds right in principle. It might work for you. But I know from long experience that my prayers are never answered. Not even in, as you put it, opening and closing circumstances. Nothing changes in response to my prayers. I have prayed as you suggest, before. I am still without God's guidance.

You also suggest that my problem is pride. When I wrote that nobody else had suggested this, it was in surprise that you suggest it. It just does not make any sense to me. Neither your logic in coming to that conclusion, nor the conclusion itself. I may lack spiritual awareness but I do not lack self-awareness. I can assure you that I would never think of putting myself equal to God.

so now what?

Are we back to demanding "spiritual awareness" in exchange for your faith?

If so, then perhaps you can educate me, please explain how holding your faith for ransom is not a proud man's behavior.. If in fact you are not the proud man I speak of, that also has a great sense of self awareness, then directly addressing my points will be easy for you, rather than making obscure or general references to my "logic."

How is refusing to use what you have been given, (A spiritual awareness to sense needs) ignored for the talent or Gift you do want, (Spiritual awareness on your terms) Not a proud man's behavior?

To me this screams, "God, I don't want this, I want what everyone else has! And what's more, I refuse to do anything else till I get it.."

 

[losthope]

so now what?

Are we back to demanding "spiritual awareness" in exchange for your faith?

If so, then perhaps you can educate me, please explain how holding your faith for ransom is not a proud man's behavior.. If in fact you are not the proud man I speak of, that also has a great sense of self awareness, then directly addressing my points will be easy for you, rather than making obscure or general references to my "logic."

How is refusing to use what you have been given, (A spiritual awareness to sense needs) ignored for the talent or Gift you do want, (Spiritual awareness on your terms) Not a proud man's behavior?

To me this screams, "God, I don't want this, I want what everyone else has! And what's more, I refuse to do anything else till I get it.."

I never was demanding spiritual awareness in exchange for my faith. I asked about finding spiritual awareness because I thought that it was possible that if I had some spiritual awareness, it would make it easier for me to find faith. It was a possible path towards faith. Most definitely not a bargaining tool or anything like that.

I repeat, I am not holding my faith for ransom. It is this false assumption that seems to be leading you to think in terms of pride. Maybe holding your faith for ransom would be an act of pride. But for me it is not relevant, because I am not holding my faith to ransom.

My faith was freely given, when I was able to give it. There was no bargaining, and no ransom or anything like that. It was freely given. If I could find a way to do it again, then I would give my faith freely again. But at the moment I do not see a way to do that. There is no point in me trying to repeat the mistakes of the past, no matter if you tell me to. If I have tried and failed spectacularly, there is no point trying the same wrong approach again.

There was never any refusal to do anything until I received what other people had received. If I gave you that impression, then I apologise. Because it is not like that. I gave my faith first, up front, without receiving anything from God. It was the continued lack of awareness of any kind of response from God, not even after two years, that made me question my faith and try to find God once again.

I appreciate your concern. But it does not help if your suggestions are based on incorrect interpretations of my experience and my situation.

 

[drich0150]

I never was demanding spiritual awareness in exchange for my faith. I asked about finding spiritual awareness because I thought that it was possible that if I had some spiritual awareness, it would make it easier for me to find faith. It was a possible path toward faith. Most definitely not a bargaining tool or anything like that.

I repeat, I am not holding my faith for ransom. It is this false assumption that seems to be leading you to think in terms of pride. Maybe holding your faith for ransom would be an act of pride. But for me it is not relevant, because I am not holding my faith to ransom.

This is not true, In several other post you have expressed "No desire to serve or worship without a sense of spiritual awareness." If you refuse to use what spiritual awareness God has given you,(The ability to see needs) in favor for a larger or different form of Spiritual awareness (God speaking to you) Then Tell me again how that is not holding your faith for ransom..

My faith was freely given, when I was able to give it. There was no bargaining, and no ransom or anything like that. It was freely given. If I could find a way to do it again, then I would give my faith freely again. But at the moment I do not see a way to do that. There is no point in me trying to repeat the mistakes of the past, no matter if you tell me to. If I have tried and failed spectacularly, there is no point trying the same wrong approach again.

Evidently, your faith was not freely Given, It looks as if you merely loaned it to God for a couple of years, and took it back when you were not promptly rewarded for your efforts. So in fact your "faith" was conditional, as it is now.

There was never any refusal to do anything until I received what other people had received. If I gave you that impression, then I apologise. Because it is not like that.

..But there is now a general refusal correct? If not then why are we still talking about this?? The fact that we are, suggests that you are waiting to get your wants filled, before you give of yourself... So again, how is that not holding your faith for ransom, and in turn how does that not reek of pride???

I ask for a point by point dissection of my efforts, and yet all you have been able to provide is a mild attempt to question my understanding of your situation.. Look, you maybe very successful of fooling others and apparently fooling yourself into think that you are in a unique situation when in fact you are not. From all that you have written here it is evident that you have fallen victim to yourself. Which is one of the oldest and most popular sins.. I think what sets you apart is the fact that when you are confronted with your sins, you choose not to acknowledge them.. Either by claiming a emotional disability or a misinterpretation/misunderstanding of the facts that you have surrounded yourself with...

 

[losthope]

This is not true, In several other post you have expressed "No desire to serve or worship without a sense of spiritual awareness." If you refuse to use what spiritual awareness God has given you,(The ability to see needs) in favor for a larger or different form of Spiritual awareness (God speaking to you) Then Tell me again how that is not holding your faith for ransom..

Evidently, your faith was not freely Given, It looks as if you merely loaned it to God for a couple of years, and took it back when you were not promptly rewarded for your efforts. So in fact your "faith" was conditional, as it is now.

..But there is now a general refusal correct? If not then why are we still talking about this?? The fact that we are, suggests that you are waiting to get your wants filled, before you give of yourself... So again, how is that not holding your faith for ransom, and in turn how does that not reek of pride???

I ask for a point by point dissection of my efforts, and yet all you have been able to provide is a mild attempt to question my understanding of your situation.. Look, you maybe very successful of fooling others and apparently fooling yourself into think that you are in a unique situation when in fact you are not. From all that you have written here it is evident that you have fallen victim to yourself. Which is one of the oldest and most popular sins.. I think what sets you apart is the fact that when you are confronted with your sins, you choose not to acknowledge them.. Either by claiming a emotional disability or a misinterpretation/misunderstanding of the facts that you have surrounded yourself with...

If I wrote that I have no desire to serve or worship without a sense of spiritual awareness, I do not remember writing it. Can you tell me whereabouts it was?

I am aware that when a person gives up their faith, there is a theological need for many Christians to say that the person never really believed in the first place, that they did not give their faith to God. If you believe "once saved, always saved" (as many Christians do) then you have to say that the former believer did not really believe. That is not how it was for me. I gave my faith freely and I really did believe, whether you accept this or not. Of course you can say that I was only fooling myself. In such matters, only God knows the truth.

Again, you may not believe me, but I am not asking for spiritual blessings before I am able to trust God again. What I am looking for is some kind of understanding of what went wrong when I trusted God before. The reason why I seek this, is that I do not want to have another failure of my faith, with all of the consequences that accompanied it. So far I have a 100% failure record of trusting God. Something needs to change. That is why I wrote about lack of spiritual awareness, because that is one possible reason - but not the only possible reason - why I was not aware of anything from God.

Now one possible reason for the failure of my faith before, could be pride. However, none of the Christians who knew me at the time ever suggested pride. That tells me that pride was not the problem back then. However, I recognise that you are saying that pride is my problem now, not that pride was my problem back then.

You say that I choose not to acknowledge my sins when I am confronted by them. I acknowledge them in an intellectual way. I acknowledge that I am not perfect in the way that the Bible tells us that we should be. That I am a sinner. I also recognise that, compared with other men, my sinfulness is nothing special. But none of this has any particular effect on me. No overwhelming desire for forgiveness, nor to change my ways.

If you are saying that the reason why I am far from God is that I am an unrepentant sinner, then I agree with you. But is an intellectual acceptance of being a sinner enough when there is no "with all my heart" behind it? My experience tells me that it is not enough. It is all that I have at the moment, but clearly it is not enough.

I wish I could see a way forward, but I cannot.

 

[drich0150]

If I wrote that I have no desire to serve or worship without a sense of spiritual awareness, I do not remember writing it. Can you tell me whereabouts it was?

Page 4 post #39 was where is was taken. this is not the only time your philosophy was mentioned.

I have stepped out in faith more than once, and landed flat on my nose. Doing that again is clearly not the way for me, though I do not know why. I just do not not know how to find God. That is why I asked about spiritual awareness, in case a lack of spiritual awareness was in some way making a barrier between God and me.

It may be possible for you to serve God without having a relationship with God. But I am not interested in doing the same.

That is not how it was for me. I gave my faith freely and I really did believe, whether you accept this or not. Of course you can say that I was only fooling myself. In such matters, only God knows the truth.

If you "Freely Gave" of your faith, then how is it when you didn't get what you wanted (Post #15 page2) you with drew your faith? This isn't about a once saved always save theology. This is about you in a sense, loaning your faith to God, and then when you did not receive the dividends you were expecting, took your faith back after a period of time.

To give is to release your rights of ownership. To take back would imply that you never released rights of ownership in the first place, if you did, you couldn't take back your "faith."

As for the "freely" apart it is evident that your "gift" wasn't free, because again after a period of a couple of year you saw what others had, wanted it for yourself, and then broke off your relationship when you did not get it.

So what I am saying is you may believe with all your heart that you "Freely gave of your faith" but when we compare the actions of what you have posted it is apparent that you neither "freely" or "Gave" of your faith..

God does know the truth of this matter, but one Doesn't have to be God to also share that revelation of truth.

What I am looking for is some kind of understanding of what went wrong when I trusted God before.

What I am suggesting is Nothing went wrong, you are just a different member of the same body. you can not expect to have the same Gifts as everyone else. You have been give a "Talent" and it is your responsibility to invest that talent in the service of the Lord.

1 Corinthians 12

Spiritual Gifts

1Now about spiritual gifts, brothers, I do not want you to be ignorant. 2You know that when you were pagans, somehow or other you were influenced and led astray to mute idols. 3Therefore I tell you that no one who is speaking by the Spirit of God says, "Jesus be cursed," and no one can say, "Jesus is Lord," except by the Holy Spirit.

4There are different kinds of gifts, but the same Spirit. 5There are different kinds of service, but the same Lord. 6There are different kinds of working, but the same God works all of them in all men.
7Now to each one the manifestation of the Spirit is given for the common good. 8To one there is given through the Spirit the message of wisdom, to another the message of knowledge by means of the same Spirit, 9to another faith by the same Spirit, to another gifts of healing by that one Spirit, 10to another miraculous powers, to another prophecy, to another distinguishing between spirits, to another speaking in different kinds of tongues,[a] and to still another the interpretation of tongues.[b] 11All these are the work of one and the same Spirit, and he gives them to each one, just as he determines.
12The body is a unit, though it is made up of many parts; and though all its parts are many, they form one body. So it is with Christ. 13For we were all baptized by[c] one Spirit into one body—whether Jews or Greeks, slave or free—and we were all given the one Spirit to drink.
14Now the body is not made up of one part but of many. 15If the foot should say, "Because I am not a hand, I do not belong to the body," it would not for that reason cease to be part of the body. 16And if the ear should say, "Because I am not an eye, I do not belong to the body," it would not for that reason cease to be part of the body. 17If the whole body were an eye, where would the sense of hearing be? If the whole body were an ear, where would the sense of smell be? 18But in fact God has arranged the parts in the body, every one of them, just as he wanted them to be. 19If they were all one part, where would the body be? 20As it is, there are many parts, but one body.
21The eye cannot say to the hand, "I don't need you!" And the head cannot say to the feet, "I don't need you!" 22On the contrary, those parts of the body that seem to be weaker are indispensable, 23and the parts that we think are less honorable we treat with special honor. And the parts that are unpresentable are treated with special modesty, 24while our presentable parts need no special treatment. But God has combined the members of the body and has given greater honor to the parts that lacked it, 25so that there should be no division in the body, but that its parts should have equal concern for each other. 26If one part suffers, every part suffers with it; if one part is honored, every part rejoices with it. 27Now you are the body of Christ, and each one of you is a part of it. 28And in the church God has appointed first of all apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then workers of miracles, also those having gifts of healing, those able to help others, those with gifts of administration, and those speaking in different kinds of tongues. 29Are all apostles? Are all prophets? Are all teachers? Do all work miracles? 30Do all have gifts of healing? Do all speak in tongues[d]? Do all interpret? 31But eagerly desire[e] the greater gifts.
And now I will show you the most excellent way.

why I was not aware of anything from God.

The Foot doesn't get to see where it takes the body. It is the eye's job to See, and in turn the eye could only see what is in front of it if it were not for the foot taking it to new places.. the reason you were not aware, was at the time it is not been given to you, to be aware. You must first use what you have been given.. The Spiritual awareness you have been given, (Seeing needs in your community and or your church) has been cast aside for the Spiritual awareness or the type of relationship that you want..

God has dictated the terms or nature of the relationship you are to start out with Him. You have decided that these terms are unacceptable, and are holding out for a relationship on your terms..

One more time, how is that not pride? Before you answer with another version of "I have misunderstood your position" Take the time as I have and explain your terminology and meanings include scripture to back your theology, and walk me through your thought process. Show me logically and specifically where I am in error as I have done for you.

If you are saying that the reason why I am far from God is that I am an unrepentant sinner, then I agree with you. But is an intellectual acceptance of being a sinner enough when there is no "with all my heart" behind it? My experience tells me that it is not enough. It is all that I have at the moment, but clearly it is not enough.

I know you have spent some time constructing an argument that precludes you from the culpability of Christianity, because of your "all my Heart" clause. You can see it in how you choose to shoot other well meaning people down.. I say, This has nothing to do with why you are far from God.. You are Far from God because you choose to be..

If you choose to be with God you would use the gift that He has seen fit to give you and Build a relationship from there.. I'm not speaking of going through the motions for a few years and quit when you don't get the attention you want.. We are beyond freely giving if you gift come with conditions.. You must Sell yourself as a slave to His authority, and His mission for your life.. If it is as you say, and you do not want to be an equal to God (dictating term of your involvement and relationship with him and how that all looks) then you should have no trouble humbling yourself before Him.

 

[christandisrael]

Christianity is not about spiritual awareness. However, the Holy Spirit may visit you from time to time to guide you.

 

[Gnostophorrion]

If you cannot help, do you know of someone, anywhere in the world, who could help me? Perhaps someone open to the spiritual gifts of wisdom or a word of knowledge from God. Maybe there is someone who has met my situation before.

My first suggestion is re-examine your understanding of Christianity and make sure all of your facts and historical information is clearly sorted out. That way, you might have a better comprehension of what you believe.

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