How are we to explain these "miracles?"

[AV1611VET]

People leaving Christianity is happening in virtually every advanced nation AV.

Shallow water is easier to walk out of than deep water.

 

[bhsmte]

SI laid the blame squarely on something that has mass.

Can you do the same?

Like I said, the investigation into the bible pushed me over the edge, but was not the sole reason.

 

[PsychoSarah]

Shallow water is easier to walk out of than deep water.

True, but it is easier to stay where you are than to move.

 

[bhsmte]

Shallow water is easier to walk out of than deep water.

I'm sure that is exactly what they were thinking when they left Christianity AV.

 

[bhsmte]

So, in other words, you are saying you had faith at one time, but not to the point where you defined it as:

"Believing something, even if science says otherwise."

Is that correct?

I have never been prone to refuting obvious realities, no.

 

[AV1611VET]

Like I said, the investigation into the bible pushed me over the edge, but was not the sole reason.

How much mass does "investigation into the Bible" have?

 

[AV1611VET]

I have never been prone to refuting obvious realities, no.

Okay ... I appreciate your honest answers.

 

[quatona]

Shallow water is easier to walk out of than deep water.

Don´t be so harsh on Christianity.

 

[bhsmte]

How much mass does "investigation into the Bible" have?

Mass as in influence?

Quite a bit, when it comes to the credibility of the book.

 

[Kylie]

.

Read post #224.

I did. Just claims with no support.

What gives? Why do you seek remnants in the physical, when it is the product of the Spiritual? What are you seeking, to remain natural, worldly in your methodology and in substance? You are looking back like physical facts could and should have been accumulated and deduced. Do you still seek to be naturalistic in what happened and your approach to find Him?

If God has interacted with our universe, then there will be evidence of it. Your claims here sound like just a way to handwave away the fact there's no actual evidence. And to do it you need to invoke some mysterious spiritual energy that has no supporting evidence whatsoever. In short, when you have to use one unsupported claim to support another claim, neither claim comes of as very convincing.

Show me something I can actually check and measure, and then you'll get my attention. Until then, all you have is a bunch of claims and no way for me to test them for myself. And I don't find your word to be particularly convincing.

.

Vague and notoriously unreliable.

Noted.

But this happened, you believing it or not. You having physical evidence or not. You being skeptical or not.

1. In mothers arms a child with a deformed arm was lengthened and made whole and normal over a few seconds period of time before three peoples eyes, firsthand. A process which the natural cannot account for.

You may believe that. But then again, I've seen people who are absolutely convinced they've seen someone push a lit cigarette through a solid metal coin that had no hole in it.

The fact that you are absolutely convinced of this means very little to me.

 

[Kylie]

We may have to agree to disagree on this, but I do not see you as being logical, reasonable, or truthful in this: Matthew and John were two that personally witnessed Jesus Christ, and what about the stories about Peter and all the apostles being gathered together and spoken of in the book Acts when the Holy spirit came down upon them, these were all "firsthand" witnesses, of both Jesus Christ, and of the power of God/Holy Spirit, in and through the use of Jesus name...

Others were his disciples like Mark and Luke and maybe even Stephen and other disciples some of whom wrote books, the truth is we don't which of these disciples witnessed Jesus first-hand but it is reasonable to assume some did and might have been of the original seventy that Jesus personally sent out...

Others, who you say, were not firsthand witnesses may have had a personal appearance by Jesus after his resurrection, or/and even if they didn't, they are firsthand witnesses of the power of God and of the Holy Spirit, working through Peter, Paul and others, which was sent by out by/through what and because of what Jesus did, and they were performing miracles in Jesus name, through and by the use of Jesus name, and their are many firsthand witnesses to this/these accounts/effect(s)

So, I disagree with you and believe you are only in denial of the truth...

How do you know that the accounts attributed to Matthew and John were actually written by them?

 

[Kylie]

.
I have stated what happened, what I personally and firsthand witnessed.

No evidence in the physical needed. Maybe for you and about 20 to 30 other atheists on this forum. Supplying physical evidence is your problem. You cannot say it is a lie and did not happen in reality. It only shows your ignorance of the reality of Spiritual Realm Dynamics you know not of.

Last night my daughter floated down the hallway instead of walking when I told her to go to bed. Like it or not, believe me or not, but this actually happened. No evidence in the physical needed. Maybe for you and about 20 to 30 other people who don't believe me on this forum. Supplying physical evidence is your problem. You cannot say it is a lie and did not happen in reality. It only shows your ignorance of the reality of Spiritual Realm Dynamics you know not of.

 

[bhsmte]

Last night my daughter floated down the hallway instead of walking when I told her to go to bed. Like it or not, believe me or not, but this actually happened. No evidence in the physical needed. Maybe for you and about 20 to 30 other people who don't believe me on this forum. Supplying physical evidence is your problem. You cannot say it is a lie and did not happen in reality. It only shows your ignorance of the reality of Spiritual Realm Dynamics you know not of.

My daughter did that too, I swear!

 

[Nithavela]

My daughter too, although I don't have any children. Beat that, hu!

 

[Heissonear]

The Bible is precisely what turned many Christians into atheists in the first place. I am one of those myself.

.
Classic Tree of Knowledge sin. What happen, you never heard nor followed the Holy Spirit?

I guess like you are now, ignoring Him.

You never understood nor experienced the basis of the New Covenant.

While I was a lost geologist you were just a church goer ignorant of the New Covenant. And look who found Him!

.

 

[Sayre]

Shallow water is easier to walk out of than deep water.

And yet we leave the deep water as well. Some of us step out of the water all together.

 

[Nithavela]

Exactly, selfinflikted, you were never a real christian, because real christians don't apostate.

 

[madaz]

What makes you state that?

I state that simply because it is a fact, the only accounts we have of Him are from people who never witnessed Him.

Are you also with others, claiming that I lied about the miracles I've witnessed?

I wouldn't explicitly claim that you are lying, but I do dismiss ALL extraordinary claims that lack sufficient evidence.

 

[madaz]

You say that as if you actually believe it.

Belief is not required.

There simply isn't any contempory historical records of Jesus.

 

[madaz]

We may have to agree to disagree on this, but I do not see you as being logical, reasonable, or truthful in this: Matthew and John were two that personally witnessed Jesus Christ, and what about the stories about Peter and all the apostles being gathered together and spoken of in the book Acts when the Holy spirit came down upon them, these were all "firsthand" witnesses, of both Jesus Christ, and of the power of God/Holy Spirit, in and through the use of Jesus name...

Others were his disciples like Mark and Luke and maybe even Stephen and other disciples some of whom wrote books, the truth is we don't which of these disciples witnessed Jesus first-hand but it is reasonable to assume some did and might have been of the original seventy that Jesus personally sent out...

Others, who you say, were not firsthand witnesses may have had a personal appearance by Jesus after his resurrection, or/and even if they didn't, they are firsthand witnesses of the power of God and of the Holy Spirit, working through Peter, Paul and others, which was sent by out by/through what and because of what Jesus did, and they were performing miracles in Jesus name, through and by the use of Jesus name, and their are many firsthand witnesses to this/these accounts/effect(s)

So, I disagree with you and believe you are only in denial of the truth...

All the accounts about Jesus in the bible were written by authors born long after Jesus died.

Do you really believe Matt and John wrote Matt and John?

Really?

If so, then you my friend are in denial of the truth.