How are people actually saved?

[Julie]

Do you have any Scripture to back up your view?








In Matthew 25:41, Jesus Himself said that there is coming a day when He will say to the wicked, "....Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels." Revelation 20:15 says, "And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire." Then John 3:36 says that the "wrath of God" abides on everyone who does not have Jesus Christ as their Savior.

Have you believed on the Lord Jesus Christ? Have you RECEIVED Him as your personal Savior?

Do you realize that you are a sinner, and that only Jesus Christ can save you? Do you realize that you must trust HIM ALONE to save you? If so, then why not repent of your sins and call upon the Lord to save you RIGHT NOW. The Bible says, "For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved" (Rom. 10:13). Romans 10:9 says, "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved."

 

[Bruno]

Reformationist,

If you believe that you are either saved, or not saved practically as soon as you are born and don't have free choices, why are you here arguing what other people believe. How can you possibly benefit any of us. If you are saved no matter what, you can basically do whatever you want and get away with it, right? Sounds like a very convenient belief. Sounds rather dangerous.

 

[vegan]

Originally posted by Julie
So Vegan, a Catholic receives Jesus Christ through a cookie and fermented wine? And not by faith?

  Okay.  i got your point, thank you.  

Julie - I am not a Catholic. I left the Catholic church. I am simply stating what Catholics believe. Lets not turn this into a debate over who holds the key to salvation here.  As far as I know, it is through faith in Jesus Christ.  THat means a Catholic, a Jew, or a Muslim who puts their faith in Christ can be saved.  I dont agree with everything the Church does; nor do I believe in some of Catholic dogma.  I will not, however, deny they can not be saved or receive the Holy Spirit.

Catholics are saved by faith, regardless of the fact that they believe in the sacraments.  If a Catholic has faith and receives the sacraments, they are saved.  If a Catholic doesnt have faith and receives the sacraments, they are not saved.

 

[Reformationist]

Originally posted by vegan
  Easy! I am not sure, but I sense you are being combative.  You yourself admit you have a minority viewpoint in this forum. You are entitled to your POV. I understand salvation as most people on this board do: through faith in Jesus Christ.  Being saved in a Baptist church, I said the traditional salvation prayer.  My question was regarding salvation through faith but NOT saying the prayer.  I was very clear in my original post.  But, again, thank you for your reply.  

I'm not trying to be combative.  I was just under the impression, obviously wrongly, that you were asking "how are people actually saved."  I didn't realize that you were just saying that you already had an opinion on whether the prayer was the vehicle for the grace of God.

As for my view, salvation is by faith.  It's just that that faith is a gift of God's grace.  Saving faith is what is given to those whom Jesus died for.  Jesus death was efficacious to bring about exactly what He intended.

Regardless of the popularity of the reformed view on this MB it's certainly a view I encourage you to investigate.  Having or not having this view isn't the difference in whether someone is saved.  It's just immensely helpful in glorifying God.

God bless

 

[Reformationist]

Originally posted by Julie
No Reformationist it shows you have a strange view of Salvation.

LOL!!  LOL!! Ha Ha!!  ROTFLOL!!!  Wow!  Thanks Julie.  I needed a good laugh.

For one who is regularly told her views are strange it seems strange that you would make this type of statement.

/me has thoughts of a proverbial pot calling the kettle black image...

God bless

 

[vegan]

Originally posted by Bruno
Please don't. Read the title of the thread again.

Why? Is devoted a Catholic?  I dont know why she posted what she did, but dont be too quick to judge her.  WHen I was younger, I was very involved in Christian things outside the Catholic Church.  My parents best friends were Baptists.  We would go to Sunday night services at their church.  QUite a few times my folks met hostility toward their Catholic beliefs (usually by ex-catholics).  I was also involved with something called "Boys Brigade," a Christian boy scout-type organization.  ONce, at talent show for the parents, one of the parents in attendance verbally assaulted myself (I was probably 12 or 13 at the time) and my father for being Catholic.  Non-Catholics would also leave anti-Catholic CHick tracks at our Church during mass.

So, maybe Devoted misunderstood my intentions, but maybe she has had some of the past experiences I have had as a Catholic.

 

[Julie]

God sent His only begotten Son to be the sacrifice for our sins. Jesus paid our sin debt for us. For us, He won the victory over SIN, DEATH, and HELL, and we can CLAIM that victory by RECEIVING Him as our Savior (John 1:12). God has no other Salvation plan. Jesus Christ is the ONLY way to Heaven; so God COMMANDS us to repent of our sins and receive Christ as Savior. In II Corinthians 6:2, the Bible says that, "....now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation."

 

 

 

Have you believed on the Lord Jesus Christ? Have you RECEIVED Him as your personal Savior?

 

[Reformationist]

Originally posted by Bruno
Reformationist,

If you believe that you are either saved, or not saved practically as soon as you are born and don't have free choices, why are you here arguing what other people believe. How can you possibly benefit any of us. If you are saved no matter what, you can basically do whatever you want and get away with it, right? Sounds like a very convenient belief. Sounds rather dangerous.

Bruno, if you don't know what I believe how about you don't make assumptions.  I never said we are regenerate from birth.  I never said we could do what we want and get away with it.  I don't believe what I believe for convenience sake.

As to whether I can be of any benefit all I can say is that is a pretty harsh question.  The athiests on this MB are a benefit to us.  Their unbelief causes us to dig deeper and learn more about God.  They give us the opportunity to practice loving others who are difficult to love.  The fact that you don't see my input as a benefit, regardless of whether you agree with it, is truly offensive.

Tell you what, you start a MB and I promise not to post on it.  Okay?

God bless

 

[kern]

[edited -- I didn't notice this was in the nd/r/p discussions part]

 

[Blindfaith]

Back to the OP

 

[Reformationist]

Originally posted by Julie
For us, He won the victory over SIN, DEATH, and HELL, and we can CLAIM that victory by RECEIVING Him as our Savior

So did He win it for you or do you have to do something to get it?  Sounds like you think Christ won you the opportunity, not the gift.

God bless

 

[Julie]

"Saving faith is what is given to those whom Jesus died for.
Having or not having this view isn't the difference in whether someone is saved."

I was going to say I hope you are right about that but...........

 

 

Romans 4:5 says, "But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness."

 

[Bruno]

Originally posted by Reformationist
As for my view, salvation is by faith.  It's just that that faith is a gift of God's grace.  Saving faith is what is given to those whom Jesus died for.  Jesus death was efficacious to bring about exactly what He intended. 

Yes, faith is a gift, but just like with ANY gift, one has a choice to keep it, or reject it.

Jesus died for ALL humans, not just for a chosen few. Your belief makes me think of Hitler who selected his chosen few to be the "elite" of human race. Look where it got him.

 

[Blackhawk]

Mod hat on***

I have read the posts since my last one and I think everyone needs to cool it. Both sides of this argument are being combative and argumenative. Both sides are not showing patience or kindness or gentleness to the other side. We can debate but let's debate as Christians.

Mod hat off***

 

[Bruno]

Originally posted by vegan
Why? Is devoted a Catholic?  I dont know why she posted what she did, but dont be too quick to judge her. 

Yes, devoted is a full blown Catholic. We have been getting to know each other rather well in the past few days.

And yes, judging is not up to me, but God.

 

[Athlon4all]

Praise the LORD Vegan. Ephesians 2:8-9 says that for by grace are you saved through faith. The inital Salvation and indwelling of the Holy Spirit is by faith alone. But, if u are truly saved, you will have works also. See James 2 for that. You must accept Jesus as your LORD, and it is that acceptance that saves you.

 

[Blackhawk]

Now reformanist I think that we definitely have to believe and confess like Romans states in order to be saved. That we are only saved until we do that. I believe the Bible is clear on this. However I also believe that how we get to this point is different. Yes we do have to have faith to be saved but we get the oppurtnity for that faith from God. Now you know we debate over how God gives us that faith and if we can reject God etc. But when I answered the question I was thinking of what I said first and not how you answered the question. now possibly we can debate more about how we get that faith which is what I see you doing with others although I would rather call our discussions not debates but truth finding missions because we are both seeking truth.

 

[vegan]

I have to agree with Blackhawlk - Lets remember that Christ came for every last one of us. If someone is "wrong" by your standards, why not try to win them with kindness.

I was listing to a DC Talk song today. The intro said the number one cause of atheism in the world is Christians - Christians who "amen, amen" the preacher at church, but fail to show christian love on the street. I have been just as guilty...... including with some of my posts in this forum. I am seriously trying to be more Christ-like in my words so that no non-Christian will ever look at me and say, "See, that is why I reject their savior."

FOr all our differences, most of us here believe Jesus Christ is the Son Of God who has taken up our sins on the cross so that we may get to heaven.

Lets be a light unto his name instead of petty in-fighting.

PS - Starscream, if you are reading this, I am sorry for my arrogance in previous posts.

 

[Bruno]

Originally posted by Reformationist
The fact that you don't see my input as a benefit, regardless of whether you agree with it, is truly offensive.

This is NOT a fact. My intention was not to apply your view is not beneficial. (I appologize if it appears like that.)

What I am trying to understand is, if you believe that someone is not going to get saved no matter what you tell them, why bother?

 

[geocajun]

I am Catholic, but I wanted to share a non-denominationaly oriented comment here if you dont mind =o)

When I hear the question "what must a person do to be saved"
I believe it stems from a theological mindset which says
"whats the least I can do, and still go to heaven"
Jesus came and showed us that God loves us, and His love for us is perfect, holding nothing back, so when we take this minimalist approach of seeking salvation with the least amount of effort on our part, it can be seen as "How much can I hold back?" or "So Jesus is a get out of hell free card? a 'Tool' ?"

I think the best answer is, Love God with your whole heart, mind, and body, and your salvation will never be a question.

Peace be with you all.