How about asking them?

[texastig]

Tell me about it..those types are so frustrating, no?

And definately not all who say "Lord, Lord" will be with God..that gets back to that whole "expell the immoral brother" thing..

Paul said expel the immoral brother. I'd take his word.
Thanks,
TT

 

[texastig]

How do you rationalize the parts of the bible that condemn racial equality?
How do you rationalize the parts of the bible that indicate rape is morally acceptable?
How do you rationalize the parts of the bible that speak to polygamy?
How do you rationalize the parts of the bible that speak of animal and human sacrifice?
How do you rationalize the parts of the bible that condemn prejudice?

Verses please.
Thanks,
TT

 

[texastig]

Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of me. Rejoice and be glad, because great is your reward in heaven, for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you. Matt 5 :11-12

You forgot Matt 5:8
"Blessed [are] the pure in heart: for they shall see God."
and
Matt 5:16
"Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven."

We can't be pure in heart while living in sin.
We can't show good works while living in sin.
Thanks,
TT

 

[OllieFranz]

My friend said it the best:

God speaks of many that will not be in the Kingdom of God. “Homosexuals:” along with any who practice adultery or any type of sexual acts outside of the God ordained marriage of one man and one woman. These are some but not all of those who will not be in the Kingdom of God.


Gen. 19:4 Now before they lay down, the men of the city, the men of Sodom, both old and young, all the people from every quarter, surrounded the house. 5 And they called to Lot and said to him, “Where are the men who came to you tonight? Bring them out to us that we may know them carnally.”
6 So Lot went out to them through the doorway, shut the door behind him, 7 and said, “Please, my brethren, do not do so wickedly! 8 See now, I have two daughters who have not known a man; please, let me bring them out to you, and you may do to them as you wish; only do nothing to these men, since this is the reason they have come under the shadow of my roof.”
9 And they said, “Stand back!” Then they said, “This one came in to stay here, and he keeps acting as a judge; now we will deal worse with you than with them.” So they pressed hard against the man Lot, and came near to break down the door. 10 But the men reached out their hands and pulled Lot into the house with them, and shut the door. 11 And they struck the men who were at the doorway of the house with blindness, both small and great, so that they became weary trying to find the door.

Lev. 18:22 You shall not lie with a male as with a woman. It is an abomination. 23 Nor shall you mate with any animal, to defile yourself with it. Nor shall any woman stand before an animal to mate with it. It is perversion.... 30 ‘Therefore you shall keep My ordinance, so that you do not commit any of these abominable customs which were committed before you, and that you do not defile yourselves by them: I am the LORD your God.’”

Lev. 20:13 If a man lies with a male as he lies with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination. They shall surely be put to death. Their blood shall be upon them.

Deut. 22: 5 “A woman shall not wear anything that pertains to a man, nor shall a man put on a woman’s garment, for all who do so are an abomination to the LORD your God.

Deut. 23:17“ There shall be no ritual harlot of the daughters of Israel, or a perverted[c] one of the sons of Israel.

Isa. 3:9 The look on their countenance witnesses against them, And they declare their sin as Sodom; They do not hide it. Woe to their soul! For they have brought evil upon themselves.

Rom. 1:26 For this reason God gave them up to vile passions. For even their women exchanged the natural use for what is against nature. 27 Likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust for one another, men with men committing what is shameful, and receiving in themselves the penalty of their error which was due

1Cor. 6:9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals,[a] nor sodomites, 10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God

1Tim. 1:9 But we know that the law is good if one uses it lawfully, 9 knowing this: that the law is not made for a righteous person, but for the lawless and insubordinate, for the ungodly and for sinners, for the unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers, 10 for fornicators, for sodomites, for kidnappers, for liars, for perjurers, and if there is any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine

Jude 7 Sodom and Gomorrah, and the cities around them in a similar manner to these, having given themselves over to sexual immorality and gone after strange flesh, are set forth as an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.

Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city. 15 But outside are dogs and sorcerers and sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and whoever loves and practices a lie.

So that means you can't be a Christian and practicing homosexual.
If your struggling with it and seeking help then God can deliver you if you "really" want it.

Thanks,
TT

Ah, it's time to throw "clobber quote" prooftexts at gays again, eh?

Well....

Therefore thou art inexcusable, O man, whosoever thou art that judgest: for wherein thou judgest another, thou condemnest thyself; for thou that judgest doest the same things. 2 But we are sure that the judgment of God is according to truth against them which commit such things. 3 And thinkest thou this, O man, that judgest them which do such things, and doest the same, that thou shalt escape the judgment of God? (Romans 2:1-3)

Judge not, that ye be not judged. 2 For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again. 3 And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye? 4 Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye? 5 Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye. (Matthew 7:1-5)

I don't do the same things. So your verses do not qualify.
Thanks,
TT

But do you keep the niddah laws? And abstain from sex with your spouse for more than two weeks every month because of the wife's period? Anyone who does not keep the niddah laws but condemns gays, especially gays in exclusive committed relationships, who do not perform the single act of "man-lying" forbidden in Leviticus 18:22 is indeed a hypocrite, at least for the purposes of Matthew 7 and Romans 2.

[bible]Leviticus 15:19-24[/bible]

 

[texastig]

But do you keep the niddah laws? And abstain from sex with your spouse for more than two weeks every month because of the wife's period? Anyone who does not keep the niddah laws but condemns gays, especially gays in exclusive committed relationships, who do not perform the single act of "man-lying" forbidden in Leviticus 18:22 is indeed a hypocrite, at least for the purposes of Matthew 7 and Romans 2.

[bible]Leviticus 15:19-24[/bible]

I'm talking about homosexual stuff not a womans period.
Thanks,
TT

 

[Polycarp1]

I'm talking about homosexual stuff not a womans period.
Thanks,
TT

Maybe that's what you're talking about. But what we're talking about is what God has commanded as revealed in the words of Scripture.

Either we are free from the Law to live new lives of grace and love in Christ, or we are not. You may not pick and choose what parts of the Law are binding on Christians. Read Romans -- the whole book, not handy-dandy prooftexts to condemn others.

And if you take it on yourself to adjudge your brother or sister's sin, then by the very words of Christ you have exposed yourself to the same judgment, on exactly the same terms. You, texastig, are an unrepentant sinner -- by your own act of judgment. That's not an accusation or condemnation -- it's a logical conclusion from the teachings of Christ on sin and judgment.

We are called on to "judge righteous judgment" -- and in the context of Christ's teaching, that means to treat one's fellow men and women with compassion and mercy, esteeming them no better nor worse than oneself, truly brothers and sisters in the love of Christ. Read the parable of the sheep and goats, the parable of the Good Samaritan, the parable of the prodigal and his brother (the whole thing; there's a reason Jesus told that particular parable to the Pharisees), the account of the woman taken in adultery, the messages in the Sermon on the Mount.

Either we're all sinners redeemed by God's grace, set free from the Law to live as brother and sisters in Christ, or none of us are. This little game the "conservative evangelical Christians" are playing is nothing more than the same picking and choosing and rationalizing that the Pharisees were doing, and Jesus said how He felt about that.

 

[texastig]

Either we are free from the Law to live new lives of grace and love in Christ, or we are not. You may not pick and choose what parts of the Law are binding on Christians. Read Romans -- the whole book, not handy-dandy prooftexts to condemn others.

Does freedom from the law excuse one from sin?
Nope it doesn't. If that's the case then why did Paul write that people who live in sexual immorality will not inherit the Kingdom of God? God's plan for life is marriage or staying single.

And if you take it on yourself to adjudge your brother or sister's sin, then by the very words of Christ you have exposed yourself to the same judgment, on exactly the same terms.

Your statement is not correct. If I'm not doing homosexual things then I can correct someone in love. If I am doing homosexual things and telling homosexual people they shouldn't be doing things like that then I'm a hypocrite.

You, texastig, are an unrepentant sinner -- by your own act of judgment. That's not an accusation or condemnation -- it's a logical conclusion from the teachings of Christ on sin and judgment.

This is not true either. I have accepted Jesus Christ as my Savior. I have confessed with my mouth that Jesus is Lord and I believe in my hear that God raised from the dead.
We are to judge in righteous judgement.
Jesus and John told people to repent of their sins? Does that make them unrepentant sinners also by your standards? Jesus forgave people of their sin and told them "to sin no more" unless something worse comes upon them.

We are called on to "judge righteous judgment" -- and in the context of Christ's teaching, that means to treat one's fellow men and women with compassion and mercy, esteeming them no better nor worse than oneself, truly brothers and sisters in the love of Christ.

That is correct. It is also love to tell someone that they are going the wrong way to snatch them from the fire.

Read the parable of the sheep and goats, the parable of the Good Samaritan, the parable of the prodigal and his brother (the whole thing; there's a reason Jesus told that particular parable to the Pharisees), the account of the woman taken in adultery, the messages in the Sermon on the Mount.

I have read those.

Either we're all sinners redeemed by God's grace, set free from the Law to live as brother and sisters in Christ, or none of us are.

You are correct. But that doesn't give us a cover up to sin. We are not to live in sin.

This little game the "conservative evangelical Christians" are playing is nothing more than the same picking and choosing and rationalizing that the Pharisees were doing, and Jesus said how He felt about that.

I disagree with that. All throughout history you can see where nations have disobeyed God and those nations have been destroyed. If the homosexual agenda is forced upon America then America is doomed. That's why we conservative Christians are trying to stop it.
I do respect homosexuals as people. I know they have to live, eat, work, etc... What burns me up is when they try to force their ideas/agendas on straight people.
And you can see that straight people don't like it either with all of the states passing marriage amendments across the United States.
Thanks,
TT

 

[tulc]

I do respect homosexuals as people.

Really? Can you name three and why you respect them?
tulc(just a thought)

 

[Phinehas2]

Dear Polycarp1,

Either we are free from the Law to live new lives of grace and love in Christ, or we are not.

as Christians we are.

You may not pick and choose what parts of the Law are binding on Christians.

But you like others have already been shown that Jesus Christ fulfils the law and where and how He does, yet you keep asking this question.

And if you take it on yourself to adjudge your brother or sister's sin, then by the very words of Christ you have exposed yourself to the same judgment, on exactly the same terms.

That makes the assumption the person is a Christian, yet as Christians we know repentance gives us redemption from sin through Jesus Christ. Romans is too believers, anyone disputing the sins in Romans 1 obviously isn’t a believer?

We are called on to "judge righteous judgment" -- and in the context of Christ's teaching, that means to treat one's fellow men and women with compassion and mercy, esteeming them no better nor worse than oneself, truly brothers and sisters in the love of Christ.

No we are called to love all people, we are called on not to associate with those who are promoting sexual sin and we are to restore brothers and sisters from sin.

This little game the "conservative evangelical Christians" are playing is nothing more than the same picking and choosing and rationalizing that the Pharisees were doing, and Jesus said how He felt about that.

Its not a game its deadly serious, and I mean deadly. Secondly it’s the gospel and nothing to do with labelling people ‘conservative evangelical’ . You keep avoiding the issue that texastig keeps pointing out to you, sin. We are saved form sin, if we continue to sin we are not saved from it.

 

[texastig]

Really? Can you name three and why you respect them?
tulc(just a thought)

I don't want to state names without their permission.
But there is a guy here at work. He works very good and hard and he doesn't flaunt or force it on people and he doesn't try to "act" like a woman. That was awesome.

Another guy was in my Army unit who didn't flaunt or force it on people and didn't try to "act" as a woman.
That was awesome.

When my nephew shot himself and died my wifes boss who is homosexual was very respectful of my sister. He didn't flaunt or force anything on anyone but he did "act" like a woman.

Then there are those who do flaunt and force their way onto others which is wrong. I don't excuse their behavior.
Thanks,
TT

 

[texastig]

Dear Polycarp1,
as Christians we are.
But you like others have already been shown that Jesus Christ fulfils the law and where and how He does, yet you keep asking this question.

That makes the assumption the person is a Christian, yet as Christians we know repentance gives us redemption from sin through Jesus Christ. Romans is too believers, anyone disputing the sins in Romans 1 obviously isn’t a believer?

No we are called to love all people, we are called on not to associate with those who are promoting sexual sin and we are to restore brothers and sisters from sin.

Its not a game its deadly serious, and I mean deadly. Secondly it’s the gospel and nothing to do with labelling people ‘conservative evangelical’ . You keep avoiding the issue that texastig keeps pointing out to you, sin. We are saved form sin, if we continue to sin we are not saved from it.

 

[jamielindas]

To the OP, since you claim to be Bilbe believing, how do you rationalize the parts of the Bible that condemn homosexuality?

Probably the same way christians rationalize the parts about animal sacrifice, cloths of two fibers, working on the sabbath, submission of women, murder in the name of god, etc etc

 

[Phinehas2]

Dear jamielindas,

Probably the same way christians rationalize the parts about animal sacrifice, cloths of two fibers, working on the sabbath, submission of women, murder in the name of god, etc etc

They are rather likely to be Jews and not Christians, as Christians dont rationalize the OT law and prophets, they follow Jesus Christ who is the fulfillment of the law and prophets.

 

[OllieFranz]

I'm talking about homosexual stuff not a womans period.
Thanks,
TT

I am talking about God's laws about sexuality, which includes both the niddah laws and the "man-lying" law. Either both are equally binding or both are not.

Dear jamielindas,
They are rather likely to be Jews and not Christians, as Christians dont rationalize the OT law and prophets, they follow Jesus Christ who is the fulfillment of the law and prophets.

But only the fulfillment of the law that you choose not to follow, leaving you "pure" to criticize others whose actions are based on the the fulfillment of the whole law?

Both of you:

What right do you have to tell us that heterosexual couples can ignore the niddah laws, but gay Christians in a loving, committed, sexual relaionship are sinning even if they choose to obey the "man-lying" law and to not engage in a**l s*x?

That is what makes a judgement hypocritical.

 

[texastig]

I am talking about God's laws about sexuality, which includes both the niddah laws and the "man-lying" law. Either both are equally binding or both are not.



But only the fulfillment of the law that you choose not to follow, leaving you "pure" to criticize others whose actions are based on the the fulfillment of the whole law?

Both of you:

What right do you have to tell us that heterosexual couples can ignore the niddah laws, but gay Christians in a loving, committed, sexual relaionship are sinning even if they choose to obey the "man-lying" law and to not engage in a**l s*x?

That is what makes a judgement hypocritical.

Marriage is to be between one man and a woman as Jesus spoke of in Genesis 2:24 and Mark 10:6-9
God's way is marriage between a man and a woman or staying single.
The devil counterfeits the true things of God.
Thanks,
TT

 

[tulc]

I don't want to state names without their permission.
But there is a guy here at work. He works very good and hard and he doesn't flaunt or force it on people and he doesn't try to "act" like a woman. That was awesome.

Another guy was in my Army unit who didn't flaunt or force it on people and didn't try to "act" as a woman.
That was awesome.

When my nephew shot himself and died my wifes boss who is homosexual was very respectful of my sister. He didn't flaunt or force anything on anyone but he did "act" like a woman.

...and do you picture those three people as just biding their time till they have an opportunity to molest/butcher someone because that's how gay people are?
tulc(just curious)

 

[texastig]

...and do you picture those three people as just biding their time till they have an opportunity to molest/butcher someone because that's how gay people are?
tulc(just curious)

I don't know. Only they, God and the devil knows.
Thanks,
TT

 

[OllieFranz]

Marriage is to be between one man and a woman as Jesus spoke of in Genesis 2:24 and Mark 10:6-9
God's way is marriage between a man and a woman or staying single.
The devil counterfeits the true things of God.
Thanks,
TT

That has nothing to do with my question. One more time: If one person is ignoring the niddah laws, and he judges another person to be sinning because he is in a gay relationship, even if the gay person is not violating the "man-lying" law, then how is that not hypocricy?

 

[BigBadWlf]

You forgot Matt 5:8
"Blessed [are] the pure in heart: for they shall see God."
and
Matt 5:16
"Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven."

We can't be pure in heart while living in sin.
We can't show good works while living in sin.
Thanks,
TT

Yes I know you are impure and I know you can’t do good works

 

[BigBadWlf]

I'm talking about homosexual stuff not a womans period.
Thanks,
TT

So you are a hypocrite picking and choosing among the laws of Leviticus based on your personal prejudice and for your personal convenience