Homosexuality

[Bro.T]

tanzel,
if you faith and no works you have nothing... I do not believe at this point that you believe that salvation is by works.... what you speak of is faith and not salvation...

It is like me saying I have faith in this parachute... that if I put it on it will surely save my life... then someone comes up to me and says come on lets go up to 20,000 feet and jump out of a plane... I look at them and say you are nuts!!!... what, dont you believe that the parachute will save you? yeah!... well come one.. NO!....
you do not have faith that it will do what it is designed to do.... now my faith will not me save the parachute saves me but by my actions I show my faith... that I believe God is who he says he is and he will do what he says he will do... putting feet to your faith is beyond important...
There is a saying or analogy in facing the giants:
there was a serious drought, and 2 farmers were in desperate need of Rain or else they would loose their crops. So the 2 men prayed to God, that he would bring rain and save the crops. One of the men went out right after the prayer and prepaired his fields for the rain the other did not, who do you think got rain?

Why are you telling me this, do I not have a thread on this subject,
did I not post today, faith without works is dead, now I ask you, what
are your works, can your works be measure even close to the people
in the Bible, but remember, you have to keep the law (Ten Commandment)
Can't tell me you gave somebody a few dollars and thats your works, now,
don't get me wrong (cause I no many people love to) its good to do that
and it helps a lot, but, the lord is expecting us to keep the law, now, while
you keeping the law, go helps somebody out, now in (Hebrews 12:5-11) the lord give us an example of how he deal with us....

And ye have forgotten the exhortation which speaketh unto you as unto children, My son, despise not thou the chastening of the Lord, nor faint when thou art rebuked of him:
12:6 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.
12:7 If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?
12:8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.
12:9 Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?
12:10 For they verily for a few days chastened us after their own pleasure; but he for our profit, that we might be partakers of his holiness. 12:11 Now no chastening for the present seemeth to be joyous, but grievous: nevertheless afterward it yieldeth the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto them which are exercised thereby.

See now, you working and have to keep the faith, cause that chastisement, sometimes don't put a smile on your face, plus
you keeping the law, people noah, job, moses, abraham, etc...
And this is when the fruit of the spirit come in brother and sisters
cause these people went threw some serious stuff, so I know faith
and works and keeping the law, brother and sister, all this stuff is written
for our consumption, now, lets look at some law...

If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well:
2:9 But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.
2:10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
2:11 For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law. (James 2:8-11)

Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law. (1John 3:4)

So brother and sisters this no cake walk, this is serious business

Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.(Heb.13:8)
Don't think jesus started with mary, brothers and sisters

peace in jesus name

 

[hiumble1]

ok... easy Tanzel... it is nice to bring up point like in a sermon... but you do not know me... before you attempt to bring my works out to show my faith what are yours?....
Assuming you have repented and placed your faith and trust in Christ what are your works to show your faith....
A mirror is best when the owner looks into it before showing others their fault....
you who strain out a gnat while swallowing a camel... you strive to add to the burden while Christs yoke is easy his burden is light...
you busy yourself with the meal and do not notice the guest... you spend your time on keeping the commandments, do you not know there are over 600 commandments? Focus on God and Christ Jesus than that which offends fleas... and your heart will be that of flesh...

 

[zerosaiyaman]

Criminy, Tanzel! How many times do I have to post the same verses that prove you, unequivocally, wrong?! Even logically you are utterly wrong. I mean come on! Noah, Job, Abraham, were all /BEFORE THE LAW!/ They trusted in God to save them, and that trust ALONE was enough. To trust in God for salvation /is to be found righteous before Him/, never by what you do since your best acts are nothing but filthy rags - though greater is the reward of any who seeks to do what is right. You can give /nothing/ to God who is all powerful! Just as Christ himself says again and again, "..whoever BELIEVES in [me] will have eternal life."

Jeepers, you are blind. Can you not read what is clearly printed in the bible? What I clearly post on your screne? Are you so PRIDEFUL to think that you can save yourself? God have mercy on you for your astounding arrogance!

I give you a mountain of verses, I show how it all makes sense with the scant few verses you use since none actually support you, I show how it harmonizes, yet you give nothing meaningful. You ignore all the verses I've shown, not even tried to answer them when they clearly prove you wrong, you break the very bible, you deny Christ and the reason He came. You call God a liar, flat out. May the Lord have mercy on you for trampling under foot the Son of God!

The law was the reason Christ came, to save us from it, because we cannot keep it! Unless you believe yourself as perfect as Christ Himself, you've already broken the Law and doomed yourself, as have we all. That's why we need Christ! Because breaking one letter of it breaks all the law, we need Christ! And once you have Christ, you've passed from death to life, the law is nullified and void, "Christ is the end of the law"!

You heed not the Word of God. Therefore, since you ignore scripture and flagrantly flaunt your prideful arrogance before God and cast down the Son, I have nothing further to say to you. For dozens and dozens of verses I've given you. Whole chapters of the bible pronounce you dead wrong (Galatians 3)! You make stuff up that is not in scripture in any way, shape, or form. So I am done. God forgive you for your arrogance, and for leading others astray. Don't you realize the first sin ever, the sin that cast Satan from heaven, was the sin of pride?! You've been warned!

 

[Bro.T]

ok... easy Tanzel... it is nice to bring up point like in a sermon... but you do not know me... before you attempt to bring my works out to show my faith what are yours?....
Assuming you have repented and placed your faith and trust in Christ what are your works to show your faith....
A mirror is best when the owner looks into it before showing others their fault....
you who strain out a gnat while swallowing a camel... you strive to add to the burden while Christs yoke is easy his burden is light...
you busy yourself with the meal and do not notice the guest... you spend your time on keeping the commandments, do you not know there are over 600 commandments? Focus on God and Christ Jesus than that which offends fleas... and your heart will be that of flesh...

Didn't mean no harm, just trying to make a point.

peace in jesus name

 

[Bro.T]

(Gal. 3:11) But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, THE JUST SHALL LIVE BY FAITH. [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]This didn’t start in the New Testament, Paul was only quoting scripture, and the just has always lived by their faith. [/FONT][/FONT](Hab. 2:4) Behold, his soul which is lifted up is not upright in him: but the just shall live by his faith. [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]The just shall live by his belief (faith), and how do you show the Lord that you believe in him? By your obedience to his word. [/FONT][/FONT](1Tim. 6:17-19) (v.17) Charge them that are rich in this world, that they be not high-minded, nor trust in uncertain riches, but in the living God, who giveth us richly all things to enjoy; (v.18) That they do good, that they be rich in good works, ready to distribute, willing to communicate; (v.19) Laying up in store for themselves a good foundation against the time to come, that they may lay hold on eternal life.

[FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]Riches and gains that is the doctrine of today, they are preaching the gospel of prosperity and not the gospel of the coming of the kingdom of God. But the Lord said to charge them that are rich in this world that they be not high-minded, but that they should be rich in good works that they may lay hold on eternal life. [/FONT][/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]([/FONT][/FONT]James 2:14-18, 20-26) (v.14) What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? Can faith save him? (v.15) If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of a daily food, (v.16) And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?

[FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]If someone came to you hungry and needed clothes and all you told them was peace be unto you, and God bless you, be ye warmed and filled. All you did was give lip service, no works, you didn’t help the problem. [/FONT][/FONT]

(v.17) Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]The bible has been telling you all alone that you must have fruits to prove your faith. [/FONT][/FONT](v.18) Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works. [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]True faith goes hand in hand with good works. [/FONT][/FONT](v.20) But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

[FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]Did you know that? Has anybody ever read this verse to you? How can you, after reading this verse ever say again that we need not work? You can have all the faith you want, but if you have no works to go along with that faith, that faith is in vain, that faith is dead. [/FONT][/FONT]

(v.21) Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar? [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]We read where Abraham, the father of the faithful showed the Lord his faith by his works. [/FONT][/FONT]

(v.22) Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect? (v.23) And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, ABRAHAM BELIEVED GOD AND IT WAS IMPUTED UNTO HIM FOR RIGHTEOUSNESS: and he was called the friend of God. (v.24) Ye see then how that by works a man is Justified, and not by faith only.

[FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]Do you see that also? Do you understand that you need works to go along with that faith; if you love and fear God then you should have no problem obeying his commandments. [/FONT][/FONT]

(v.25) Likewise also was not Ra’-hab the harlot justified by works, when she received the messengers, and had sent them out another way? [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]Ra’-hab showed her faith in God and her fear of God by doing good works. [/FONT][/FONT](v.26) For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

[FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]Take it or leave it, but this is the true uncut word of God. Just as the body is dead when you take away the spirit (breath) so faith is dead if you have no works.[/FONT][/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]peace in jesus name
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[kellyc]

Well that sounds sad, cause I've been going it for very long time now,
and I know that I am not special, you have to be taught, like everything
else, just like that high paying job, you'll work for, but you given up before
you try.

so you've earned your salvation? that's amazing, because you will be the only one in heaven who did. everyone else had to rely on Jesus.

 

[Bro.T]

so you've earned your salvation? that's amazing, because you will be the only one in heaven who did. everyone else had to rely on Jesus.

But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved (Matthew 24:13)

Psalms 1:1 Blessed is the man that walketh not in the counsel of the ungodly, nor standeth in the way of sinners, nor sitteth in the seat of the scornful.
2 But his delight is in the law of the LORD; and in his law doth he meditate day and night.
3 And he shall be like a tree planted by the rivers of water, that bringeth forth his fruit in his season; his leaf also shall not wither; and whatsoever he doeth shall prosper.
4 The ungodly are not so: but are like the chaff which the wind driveth away.
5 Therefore the ungodly shall not stand in the judgment, nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous.
6 For the LORD knoweth the way of the righteous: but the way of the ungodly shall perish. ​

Look at verse 5, the ungodly shall not stand in the judgment, nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous. The ungodly will not stand in the congregation of the righteous. What does this mean? ​

Revelation 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years. 5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. ​

Why doesn't the righteous stand in the congregation of the ungodly? Look at verse 4 again. Judgment was given unto them, that is why they don't stand in the congregation of sinners.

These people were also in the first resurrection.

Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.(Revelation 22:14)

Thanks for you opinion, I think you misunderstood me

peace in jesus name

 

[kellyc]

i hope i misunderstood you, but re-reading what you said i think most everyone did get what you are saying.

 

[Bro.T]

Matthew 10:37 [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me. [/FONT][/FONT]38 [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me. [/FONT][/FONT]39 He that findeth his life shall lose it: and he that loseth his life for my sake shall find it.

Will you deny the LORD for your mother or your father or any other family member? Will you turn away from His law for someone in your family? Look and see who the LORD considers family members.

Matthew 12:46 While he yet talked to the people, behold, his mother and his brethren stood without, desiring to speak with him. 47 Then one said unto him, Behold, thy mother and thy brethren stand without, desiring to speak with thee. 48 But he answered and said unto him that told him, Who is my mother? and who are my brethren? 49 And he stretched forth his hand toward his disciples, and said, Behold my mother and my brethren! 50 For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother. So I see, if you do the will of the Father in heaven you are a family member.

Proverbs 24:10 [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]If thou faint in the day of adversity, thy strength is small. [/FONT]11 [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]If thou forbear to deliver them that are drawn unto death, and those that are ready to be slain; [/FONT][/FONT]12 [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]If thou sayest, Behold, we knew it not; doth not he that pondereth the heart consider it? and he that keepeth thy soul, doth not he know it? and shall not he render to every man according to his works?

Look at verse 10, If thou faint in the day of adversity, thy strength is small. So when hard times come for the Word's sake, you brake, and don't lean on GOD you're weak. Look at 11, thou forbear to deliver them that are drawn unto death, and those that are ready to be slain; 12 If thou sayest, Behold, we knew it not; doth not he that pondereth the heart consider it? and he that keepeth thy soul, doth not he know it? and shall not he render to every man according to his works? Remember the LORD knows what's on your mind you can't hide anything from Him. He will give you exactly what you have coming.

Ezekiel 24:15 [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]Also the word of the LORD came unto me, saying, [/FONT][/FONT]16 [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]Son of man, behold, [/FONT][/FONT]I take away from thee the desire of thine eyes with a stroke: yet neither shalt thou mourn nor weep, neither shall thy tears run down. 17 Forbear to cry, make no mourning for the dead, bind the tire of thine head upon thee, and put on thy shoes upon thy feet, and cover not thy lips, and eat not the bread of men. 18 [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]So I spake unto the people in the morning: and at [/FONT][/FONT]even my wife died; and I did in the morning as I was commanded. 19 [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]And the people said unto me, Wilt thou not tell us what these things are to us, that thou doest so? [/FONT][/FONT]20 [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]Then I answered them, The word of the LORD came unto me, saying, [/FONT][/FONT]21 [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]Speak unto the house of Israel, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will profane my sanctuary, the excellency of your strength, the desire of your eyes, and that which your soul pitieth; and your sons and your daughters whom ye have left shall fall by the sword.

You see how Ezekiel even after his wife died he continued to preach the Gospel. The people were confused, they knew his wife had died and he did not mourn for her. They wanted to know why? Look at verses 20and 21, 20 Then I answered them, The word of the LORD came unto me, saying, [/FONT][/FONT]21 [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]Speak unto the house of Israel, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will profane my sanctuary, the excellency of your strength, the desire of your eyes, and that which your soul pitieth; and your sons and your daughters whom ye have left shall fall by the sword. He told them what will befall them. No matter what happens in your life and you are a true servant of the true and living GOD you must continue. Remember what the LORD said in Matthew. [/FONT][/FONT]
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[FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]Matthew 10:37 He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me. [/FONT][/FONT]38 [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me.[/FONT][/FONT]

Look what Abraham did here. Who does he love more Isaac or the LORD.
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Genesis 22:1 [/FONT][/FONT]And it came to pass after these things, that God did tempt Abraham, and said unto him, Abraham: and he said, Behold, here I am. [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]2 [/FONT][/FONT]And he said, [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]Take now thy son, thine only son Isaac, whom thou lovest, and get thee into the land of Moriah; and offer him there for a burnt offering upon one of the mountains which I will tell thee of. 3 [/FONT][/FONT]And Abraham rose up early in the morning, and saddled his ass, and took two of his young men with him, and Isaac his son, and clave the wood for the burnt offering, and rose up, and went unto the place of which God had told him. [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]9 [/FONT][/FONT]And they came to the place which God had told him of; and Abraham built an altar there, and laid the wood in order, and bound Isaac his son, and laid him on the altar upon the wood. [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]10 And Abraham stretched forth his hand, and took the knife to slay his son. 11 [/FONT][/FONT]And the angel of the LORD called unto him out of heaven, and said, Abraham, Abraham: and he said, Here am I. [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]12 [/FONT][/FONT]And he said, [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]Lay not thine hand upon the lad, neither do thou any thing unto him: for now I know that thou fearest God, seeing thou hast not withheld thy son, thine only son from me.
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Abraham had faith in GOD. Why? He did exactly what the LORD told him to do. The LORD told Abraham earlier that Isaac would carry his seed. Abraham new the LORD would not lie, he knew the LORD could raise his son from the dead if he had sacrificed him.

This act got Abraham into the kingdom. How do I know that, read the next set of verses in Hebrews and you will see. A few other brothers also in Hebrews 11 are waiting on the promise.
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Hebrews 11:1 [/FONT][/FONT]Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]2 [/FONT][/FONT]For by it the elders obtained a good report. [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]3 [/FONT][/FONT]Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.
4 [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh. [/FONT][/FONT]5 [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][/FONT][/FONT]
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[FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God. [/FONT][/FONT]23 [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]By faith Moses, when he was born, was hid three months of his parents, because they saw he was a proper child; and they were not afraid of the king's commandment. [/FONT][/FONT]24 [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]By faith Moses, when he was come to years, refused to be called the son of Pharaoh's daughter; [/FONT][/FONT]25 Choosing rather to suffer affliction with the people of God, than to enjoy the pleasures of sin for a season;

Just a little example of people having faith working to obtaining salvation, I haven't earn salvation, I'm still working

peace in jesus name
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[Cassidy]

Well good luck with your work...I hope it works out for you. At least I can be assured in Christ's work and know that I've actually succeeded through Christ. You're still 'working' to get there. I feel sorry for you oh foolish Galatian!

Obviously Christ coming and dying on the Cross and fullfilling the law wasn't good enough for you! Wonder why Christ bothered then he could have saved himself a trip with people like you still trying to save yourself! You lack faith in the one who has fullfilled the law...and without faith it is impossible to please Him.

Good luck, you're going to need it.

 

[Bro.T]

Well good luck with your work...I hope it works out for you. At least I can be assured in Christ's work and know that I've actually succeeded through Christ. You're still 'working' to get there. I feel sorry for you oh foolish Galatian!

Obviously Christ coming and dying on the Cross and fullfilling the law wasn't good enough for you! Wonder why Christ bothered then he could have saved himself a trip with people like you still trying to save yourself! You lack faith in the one who has fullfilled the law...and without faith it is impossible to please Him.

Good luck, you're going to need it.

Brother and sisters are we to believe that God’s holy commandments are no longer to be kept in this world of modern Christianity? One of the most often quoted verses to try and do away with God’s Royal law comes from the writing of the Apostle Paul; (Rom. 6:14) For sin shall not have dominion over you: for you are not under the law, but under grace. Now people will take this one verse and run with it, ignoring the writings of the others apostles and the prophets and the statements of even Jesus himself. Grace is nothing more than a free gift. And that free gift is our access back to the tree of life (Jesus) which Adam caused us to lose by disobeying God.

But to maintain your grace you must keep the law. (1John 3:4) Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law. Now we have just read the biblical definition of sin, the transgression (breaking) of the law (commandments.) It doesn’t matter what you or I think sin is, it’s what God says sin is that counts. Sisters and brothers when you read about the law having a shadow of good things to come, and the law that was our school master to bring us unto Christ, it was not referring to God’s holy commandments but the animal sacrifice law.

Daniel the prophet foretold the doing away of this law. (Dan 9:26-27) And after threescore and two weeks shall Mes-si’-ah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined. Now we know that Jesus is the Mes-si’-ah, and cut off means to be killed, and Jesus didn’t die for himself, but for the sins of the people. (v.27) “And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease.” When Jesus died on the cross he caused the sacrifice and oblation to cease. This signified the end of the law of animal sacrifice, not Gods Royal law.

Paul explained this in; (Heb.10:1, 9-10,18,26-27) (v.1) For the law (what law, the law of animal sacrifice?) having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect. (v.9) Then said he, (Jesus) Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away the first that he may establish the second. (v.10) By which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. When Jesus died on the cross that was the end of the first covenant, which consisted of the blood
of animals and the keeping of God’s commandments. And his death also brought in the second covenant, which consist of the blood of Jesus and the keeping of God’s commandments. (v.18) Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin. In other words, no more animals are going to die for your sins. (v.26) For if we sin willfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins.

Now do we understand what’s being said here? If you sin willfully after you have knowledge of what the truth is, no more animals are going to die for you. (v.27) But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries. Now if you are being deceived into believing that once you are under God’s grace you no longer have to keep his commandments, all you have to look forward to is the day of judgement and the lake of fire (fiery indignation).

peace in jesus name

 

[Cassidy]

But the commandments are kept! By Christ! Where's the problem? Isn't Christ good enough to fullfill the law??

And we all sin...brother...does that mean we are all doomed?

 

[kellyc]

i don't know of anyone here who said that we aren't supposed to keep the commandments. what everyone has been trying to tell you is that you CAN'T keep them, that is why Christ died in payment for your sins.

 

[brinny]

Greetings once again to the word of God. How many of you readers think that God will accept homosexuals in the kingdom of God? Once you read through this article, you will surely pick a side to be on. Wither it be God's side or man's side, nothing will change the judgment the Lord have against sodomites, lesbians, bisexual's ( down-low brothers or sisters), or homosexuals.

The Lord wanted to see for himself this great sin the city of Sodom committed. Abraham was with the Lord and Abraham ask the Lord, will you destroy the righteous with the wicked. In Genesis 18:26 the Lord told him, if I find 50 righteous I will spare the place for their sakes. The Lord did not find 50, 45, 40, 30, neither did the Lord find 10 righteous people. Therefore, the Lord sent two angel's to destroy Sodom. Genesis 19:5 And they called unto Lot, and said unto him, Where are the men which came in to thee this night? bring them out unto us, that we may know them. 19:6 And Lot went out at the door unto them, and shut the door after him, 19:7 And said, I pray you, brethren, do not so wickedly

Genesis 19:6-9 inform us that Lot tried to plead with them concerning the law, and that this was wicked. The men of Sodom confronted Lot to tell him, who are you, a judge. They were going to deal with Lot worse than with the men in the house, The angels of the Lord pulled Lot into the house and blinded the men of Sodom at the door. In Genesis 19:12-13, the angel told Lot to get his family together and leave this place because “the LORD hath sent us to destroy it.”
In 1 Kings 14:21-22 Rehoboam allowed Judah to do the things evil in the eyes of God; and there were sodomites in the land. A few years after Rehoboam another king rose up named Asa. 1 Kings 15:11 says Asa did that which was right in the eyes of the Lord. Asa took away the sodomites out the land and so did his son Jehoshaphat, who reign in his fathers stead. Generations passed and the people had strayed away from God. The book of the law was lost and the people continues to sin. In 2 Kings chapter 22, a king came up named Josiah who reigned 31 years in Jerusalem. During this time of Josiah's rule, carpenter, builders and mason workers was repairing the house of the Lord. Hilkiah the priest was with the workers and he found the book of the Law. Hilkiah gave the book to Shapan the scribe to read it to the king.

After reading the book of the law Josiah gathered together elders, priest, prophets, and all the people small and great to read the book of the law to them. In 2 kings 23:3 Josiah made a covenant before the Lord and a agreement with the people to perform the words of this covenant in the book, and the people kept the covenant. During this time of obedience, Josiah killed the idolatrous priest and torn down their high places, stopped the children of Hinnom from sacrificing their kids to false gods,

and broke down the houses of the sodomites. Josiah did these things because in the book he read Leviticus 18: 22 and Leviticus 20:13, as well as Deuteronomy 22:5; 23: 17.

The world say Jesus done a new things and that we are under grace and not the law! But look at what the bible say...Romans 6:1 “What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God forbid.” Romans 7:7 “What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid.” Read the WHOLE chapter one of Romans and see this NEW THING concerning homosexuals and bisexual's, and tell me is this something new.Romans ch7:10 And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death. 7:12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good. You know what else is good the judgment that is set forth for those you take pleasure in the vile acts of ungodliness. In 1 Corinthians 6: 9 effeminate correlates in the dictionary as being a man who is feminine; and will not inherit the kingdom of God.

In Judges chapter 19, a Levite, his concubine and his servant traveled and lodged in the land of Benjamin. An old man took them into his home to cater to them that day. It is writing that Sodomites surrounded the house to get to know this man; the same as they desired in the city of Sodom. The old man told them “not to do this folly.” I'll bring my daughter and the Levite concubine out ...but to this man do not so a vile thing. As you read the rest of Judges chapter 19, 20, 21 you see that thousand's and thousand's of Benjamites were killed because they condoned homosexuality.James 4:4 Ye adulterers and adulteresses, know ye not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoever therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God. Matter of fact the bible says, do good to all men. Our point is, don't give in to any manner of ungodliness, thinking it is okay.

Do you remember on the news this year of 2008 when the supreme court rule 4 to 3 in favor of same sex marriage in California? What did the homosexually say that was on the news...he said “today California tomorrow America.” We know that homosexuality is all across America, but look at the example the God is showing us with California. Those examples are earthquakes and huge wild fires which was stated on the news, to be uncontained and burning for weeks at a time. We read in 2 Peter 2:6 that the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha is an example to those that should live ungodly. Look what the bible says about preserving yourself blameless until he comes (1 Thess. 5:23). Are we blameless? Do we sin inadvertently or do we sin willfully. Which one will get you punished by God (2 Peter 2:9).

Let us continue to remember the consequences of sin. But for this case and point we leave you with a very important message from the prophet Jude.

Jude 1:5 “I will therefore put you in remembrance, though ye once knew this, how that the Lord, having saved the people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed them that believed not...7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire. Smoke in the city.
Peace in jesus name

Hi tanzel. Mind if i ask you a question? It's in reference to Sodom and Gomorrah. It was a sermon I heard on why Sodom and Gomorrah was destroyed and deserving of God's wrath. It was something God abhored and speaks of frequently in the Bible. It was not homosexuality. What do you think the sermon was referring to?

 

[Bro.T]

Hi tanzel. Mind if i ask you a question? It's in reference to Sodom and Gomorrah. It was a sermon I heard on why Sodom and Gomorrah was destroyed and deserving of God's wrath. It was something God abhored and speaks of frequently in the Bible. It was not homosexuality. What do you think the sermon was referring to?

Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man: 1:14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed. 1:15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death. (James 1:13-15)

Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law. (1John 3:4)

20:3 Thou shalt have no other gods before me. 20:4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth: 20:5 Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; (Exodus 20:3-5)

If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them. (Leviticus 20:13)

The thing that hath been, it is that which shall be; and that which is done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun. (Ecclesiastes 1:9)

Samethings going on then, is the samethings going on now.
The Lord destroy then and the Lord is going to destroy again and
its all about the samething, not keeping the Law, sinning.

Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever. (Hebrews 8:13)

peace in jesus name

 

[Floatingaxe]

Well good luck with your work...I hope it works out for you. At least I can be assured in Christ's work and know that I've actually succeeded through Christ. You're still 'working' to get there. I feel sorry for you oh foolish Galatian!

Obviously Christ coming and dying on the Cross and fullfilling the law wasn't good enough for you! Wonder why Christ bothered then he could have saved himself a trip with people like you still trying to save yourself! You lack faith in the one who has fullfilled the law...and without faith it is impossible to please Him.

Good luck, you're going to need it.

Hear, hear!

 

[Floatingaxe]

i don't know of anyone here who said that we aren't supposed to keep the commandments. what everyone has been trying to tell you is that you CAN'T keep them, that is why Christ died in payment for your sins.

Amen!

James 2:10
For the person who keeps all of the laws except one is as guilty as a person who has broken all of God’s laws.


Faith in Jesus Christ declares us free from the curse!


Galatians 3:13
But Christ has rescued us from the curse pronounced by the law. When he was hung on the cross, he took upon himself the curse for our wrongdoing. For it is written in the Scriptures, “Cursed is everyone who is hung on a tree.

 

[LovebirdsFlying]

I haven't posted in ND for ages. Nor have I read all the previous pages of this thread, so I apologize for any duplication.

The way I understand it, the temptation itself is not the sin. Giving in is the sin, whether in the form of committing the act, or in keeping it in your mind and heart, allowing the fantasies and wishes to play out. This becomes akin to the "adultery in the heart" that Jesus spoke of.

Therefore, I don't think anyone is going to be denied heaven just because he/she has homosexual tendencies. That's the temptation, and we are all subject to some temptation or other. A tendency toward homosexuality is not my particular weakness, but I have others that I fight, therefore I don't feel qualified to point a finger at homosexuals. Someone who is oriented gay (has the temptation) but relies on the Spirit of God to keep him/her from sin, would be no more condemned than the rest of us. And are the rest of us? Of course, without the blood of Christ.

Now, I don't understand using Old Testament passages to condemn homosexuality, then going home and eating a pork chop. The same book (Leviticus) that condemns lying with mankind as with womankind, also forbids eating pork. It takes a lot of education to be able to separate moral law from ceremonial law. Anyone unsaved or new in the faith is going to see this as a glaring hypocrisy. I would suggest sticking to the New Testament when teaching about homosexuality.

 

[Cassidy]

We all keep the commandments...and the whole law as matter of fact...perfectly and fully!!!!!

But through Christ! It is impossible to do it any other way, that's why we needed a saviour!

 

[Floatingaxe]

While temptation is not a sin, we have the burden as Children of the Light to cast out sinful thoughts. When our minds are overrun with besetting thoughts like sexual perversion, that is something quite different than the run-of-the-mill temptations we face.

Sexual temptations like homosexual perversion tend to stick around and become a problem, not fleeing when resisted, and continually returning when suppressed and denied. Why? Because it they are demonic strongholds. It is an area of Satanic domination over one area of one's soul.

Deliverance is required--even at the stage where one is not acting on it, but even with the temptation.

Being beset with this kind of temptation and not taking control over it interferes with one's effective ministry. It is a barrier to freedom in Christ! He died for us to have the victory. We don't have to put up with that junk!