Homosexuality: Right or Wrong? (read pg1)

[Floatingaxe]

If we were meant to have children for God in heterosexual relationships, then why didn't God create us as heterosexuals?

He did. You reject it.

What the...? So I'm a devilish abomination for not having children, but if I have children, thats not God's will???

Children are only to be produced within wedlock. It isn't the right of unwed people be fornicating and having babies. Illegitimate babies are not conceived within the will of God.

fine, great good... but thats not all there is to a relationship, so why keep banging on about them. Yes, homosexual people won't have children through purely homosexual sex... but what about all the other parts of a relationship?

What about them? Children are the best gift, and homosexuals unnaturally pre-empt that normal function. Why should the relationship be good if it insults the Father?

Homosexuals ARE normal childless couples

That's false in every way. There is nothing normal about it.

I bet there are a lot more "medically sterile" couples that never have children than ones that doi, no matter how much they pray. But thats all so much issue clouding, you are contradicting yourself up in knots... homosexuals are bad because they can't have children, but homosexuals that DO have children are bad too, because they have children outside God's will, and childless heterosexual couples are OK, even though they are childless... Could you please try not to contradict yourself in the same post?

Where's the contradiction? Outside of God's way there is fruitlessness--guaranteed.

Then there is this world we live in which is imperfect and our bodies don't always co-operate with nature, not through any fault of our own apart from being human--not sinning blatantly, but forming loving normally heterosexual homes in marriages....these can be childless, but if they know Jesus Christ, they can be healed of such a dysfunction. Jesus is merciful and kind to His own.

Homosexuals simply ignore God's ways and grasp for themselves that which they have no business to possess.

 

[EnemyPartyII]

He did. You reject it.



Children are only to be produced within wedlock. It isn't the right of unwed people be fornicating and having babies. Illegitimate babies are not conceived within the will of God.

[/B]

What about them? Children are the best gift, and homosexuals unnaturally pre-empt that normal function. Why should the relationship be good if it insults the Father?



That's false in every way. There is nothing normal about it.




Where's the contradiction? Outside of God's way there is fruitlessness--guaranteed.

Then there is this world we live in which is imperfect and our bodies don't always co-operate with nature, not through any fault of our own apart from being human--not sinning blatantly, but forming loving normally heterosexual homes in marriages....these can be childless, but if they know Jesus Christ, they can be healed of such a dysfunction. Jesus is merciful and kind to His own.

Homosexuals simply ignore God's ways and grasp for themselves that which they have no business to possess.

So, I'm really a heterosexual am I?

 

[David Brider]

EnemyPartyII
If we were meant to have children for God in heterosexual relationships, then why didn't God create us as heterosexuals?

He did. You reject it.

So you believe that homosexuals choose to be homosexual?

David.

 

[Miracle Storm]

Ah, so, you're saying that a pleasureable thing that results in harm to oneself is sinful?

Hmmm... guess that rules heterosexual sex out, only us female homosexuals can be righteous in a pleasurable activities. Bummer to all you deviant heterosexuals!

No actually, you question, "If the anus isn't for inserting anything, why's it got all those nerve endings?"

I gave you answers.
Apparently you only see what you want to see though..

 

[EnemyPartyII]

No actually, you question, "If the anus isn't for inserting anything, why's it got all those nerve endings?"

I gave you answers.
Apparently you only see what you want to see though..

You didn't really give answers... you said that just because something is pleasureable, that doesn't make it alright... OK, well, fine... support your point more... is it only stuff thats pleasurable and harmful thats wrong, or what? Or should we just assume ALL pleasure is wrong and avoid it utterly?

So far I'm left with a comparison between nose scratching and sex, and find it a little hard to see them as comparable...

 

[Floatingaxe]

So you believe that homosexuals choose to be homosexual?

David.

In most cases today, yes.

 

[David Brider]

In most cases today, yes.

Do you have any testimony from homosexual people to support that theory? In my experience, most homosexual men and women would emphatically deny your theory. And it doesn't seem to make much sense, either.

David.

 

[Jet_A_Jockey]

i dont think homosexuals consciously choose to be that way. It's like me saying that I choose not to like tomatoes. I don't consciously choose to not like them, because honestly I really get tired of picking them off of my food, but its just something that I don't like. Whether that is a God-given trait is unknown to me, I'm sure there are several factors that make up the equation.

 

[Ohioprof]

In most cases today, yes.

I did not choose to be gay. I am happy being gay, but I did not choose to be gay any more than I chose to be female or chose to be right-handed. It's just a characteristic of me, part of who I am.

If people really chose their sexual orientation, I suspect very few people indeed would choose to be gay and face widespread discrimination, denigration, rejection from families, and lack of social support. That's what gay people face. You don't seem to be aware of this.

 

[Ohioprof]

i dont think homosexuals consciously choose to be that way. It's like me saying that I choose not to like tomatoes. I don't consciously choose to not like them, because honestly I really get tired of picking them off of my food, but its just something that I don't like. Whether that is a God-given trait is unknown to me, I'm sure there are several factors that make up the equation.

Good, thoughtful post.

I am sorry you don't like tomatoes. To many of us they are a delight, but the world is diverse, and some folks just don't like them. I would never urge you to reach out to Jesus in an effort to like tomatoes. If you don't like tomatoes, I accept you the way you are and welcome you as a tomato-disliker!

My daughter just figured out on her own how to spell Sam.

 

[JesusChristLives]

Want my answer? Most, or some of us, grew up AS Christians, I know. We grew into the lifestyle that homosexuality is wrong and that God does not want us to live that lifestyle. Some of you have probably talked to those that are homosexuals. Do you know how it is for them? I know you don't because neither do I, and I have talked to homosexuals before. Everything is based on a point-ofview. We view homosexuality to be wrong, because that is 1: What we were taught to believe 2: That it is simply plain wrong. Now I know most of you might give me a reply saying otherwise. I don't believe in homosexuality, no, but say, for those of us growing up a Christians, what if we weren't? Say that you weren't a Christian now, that you never believed the whole idea of a God. How do you think you would feel about the homosexuals then? Would you pity them? Hate them? Or love them with as much respect as the next guy?

 

[Ohioprof]

Want my answer? Most, or some of us, grew up AS Christians, I know. We grew into the lifestyle that homosexuality is wrong and that God does not want us to live that lifestyle. Some of you have probably talked to those that are homosexuals. Do you know how it is for them? I know you don't because neither do I, and I have talked to homosexuals before. Everything is based on a point-ofview. We view homosexuality to be wrong, because that is 1: What we were taught to believe 2: That it is simply plain wrong. Now I know most of you might give me a reply saying otherwise. I don't believe in homosexuality, no, but say, for those of us growing up a Christians, what if we weren't? Say that you weren't a Christian now, that you never believed the whole idea of a God. How do you think you would feel about the homosexuals then? Would you pity them? Hate them? Or love them with as much respect as the next guy?

Some of us have not only talked to "homosexuals;" we are gay people. You now have additional opportunity to talk with and get to know real gay people.

It's nice to meet you.

 

[lincolngreen50]

First of all, let me explain that I am against homosexuality, the lifestyle, not the person. Even God says that He loves the sinner, but hates the sin.

However, with homosexuality on the rise (even in my small, conservative community) I want to sharpen my sword of truth by seeking scripture.

No doubt, the majority on this site agree with me. So let me be the Devil's advocate arguing for homosexuality. I am not trying to make anyone mad, but just trying to sharpen my own sword. Please join me in this debate, as it has already in our church circles.

So, is homosexuality wrong? Prove it.

Revelation 22:14-15 (New King James Version)

New King James Version (NKJV)

14 Blessed are those who do His commandments,[a] that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city. 15 But[b] outside are dogs and sorcerers and sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and whoever loves and practices a lie.

 

[Phinehas2]

Dear Ohioprof,

Some of us have not only talked to "homosexuals;" we are gay people. You now have additional opportunity to talk with and get to know real gay people.

I know some real homosexuals who are real Christians as well and as such they know same-sex sex is error

It's nice to meet you.

 

[Ohioprof]

Revelation 22:14-15 (New King James Version)

New King James Version (NKJV)

14 Blessed are those who do His commandments,[a] that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city. 15 But[b] outside are dogs and sorcerers and sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and whoever loves and practices a lie.

There is nothing sexually immoral about a committed same-sex marriage.

 

[Ohioprof]

Dear Ohioprof,
I know some real homosexuals who are real Christians as well and as such they know same-sex sex is error

It's nice to meet you.

Why don't you invite them to post here so we can hear them speak for themselves? I am a real Christian, and I am also a real gay person. Same-sex marriages are not "error."We have heard close to a dozen gay and bisexual Christians post in these forums who have said that they disagree with you, and they do not believe that same sex relationships are "error." We have had one or maybe two gay Christians post here who have said they believe that same-sex relationships are wrong. If you want to make your case about what you call "real" gay Christians, I recommend that you invite some of these gay Christians, who believe that our love relationships are "error," to come here and testify for themselves. I would wager that the overwhelming majority of real gay Christians disagree with you and do not regard our marriages as "error."

 

[lincolngreen50]

There is nothing sexually immoral about a committed same-sex marriage.

Can you prove that you are not loving and practising a lie?

 

[Miracle Storm]

You didn't really give answers... you said that just because something is pleasureable, that doesn't make it alright... OK, well, fine... support your point more... is it only stuff thats pleasurable and harmful thats wrong, or what? Or should we just assume ALL pleasure is wrong and avoid it utterly?

So far I'm left with a comparison between nose scratching and sex, and find it a little hard to see them as comparable...

I'm going to make this simple because you have totally missed the points.

1.) Just because something causes the flesh pleasure does not mean that God intended for it to be used that way.

2.) ALL sin is harmful.

 

[Ohioprof]

Can you prove that you are not loving and practising a lie?

I don't understand this question. In what way do you think I am "loving and practicing a lie?" I am simply saying what I believe to be true. Why would I want to lie?

 

[Ohioprof]

I'm going to make this simple because you have totally missed the points.

1.) Just because something causes the flesh pleasure does not mean that God intended for it to be used that way.

2.) ALL sin is harmful.

Being gay is about loving a spouse. Sex is only part of that love, just as it is in opposite-sex marriages.

Being gay is not a sin.