Here's the pattern....

[holdon]

Just because something was not written does not mean that it did happen.

Just to complete our series then:

Just because something was not written does not mean that it never happened.

 

[JacktheCatholic]

Hello

I believe that there is already unity in the church.
If Christ is the head, and we have the mind of Christ...

Yes in a mystical way but Jesus prayed for Unity like he and the Father are in unity and that is more then mystical.

What lake did that big fish come out of Jack?

You mean my pic?

That is a dolphin (mahi mahi) from the ocean by St Croix.

And how do you like this nonstop slip sliding?

If you mean constant change from the OP then I think it is par for the course for GT.

 

[ScottBot]

Just to complete our series then:

Just because something was not written does not mean that it never happened.

Isn't that where EC started?

 

[holdon]

Isn't that where EC started?

Eh, you're right: It should have been:

Because it was written does not mean it did never happen.

 

[sunlover1]

Hello
Yes in a mystical way but Jesus prayed for Unity like he and the Father are in unity and that is more then mystical.

Sorry, I dont follow you.

You mean my pic?

That is a dolphin (mahi mahi) from the ocean by St Croix.

LOL, I saw a big fish, and assumed you caught it in one of the great lakes or Canada.

If you mean constant change from the OP then I think it is par for the course for GT.

I meant the slush, then ice, then rain, then snow.
Highways closing down...
But yeah, that too

 

[JacktheCatholic]

LOL, I saw a big fish, and assumed you caught it in one of the great lakes or Canada.

Great Lakes, no. I have fished in smaller lakes in Michigan such as Walnut lake. Mostly perch, blue gil and sunfish.

I meant the slush, then ice, then rain, then snow.
Highways closing down...
But yeah, that too

LOL!

Yeah the roads have been slippery. I drive a 2006 Pontiac GTO and the rear wheel drive plus the horsepower make for a challenging drive on slippery days.

Reminds me of that Simon and Garfunkel song.

Slip sliding away. "Believe we're gliding down the highway, when in fact we're slip sliding away".

 

[sunlover1]

Great Lakes, no. I have fished in smaller lakes in Michigan such as Walnut lake. Mostly perch, blue gil and sunfish.

Woo Hoooo for panfish.
My kids catch gill's and sunfish in the backyard, and perch
now and then.
I know of a great little lake if you ever go north for
vacation.
The fish jump right in the boat!

LOL!

Yeah the roads have been slippery. I drive a 2006 Pontiac GTO and the rear wheel drive plus the horsepower make for a challenging drive on slippery days.

Yes, you gotta get fourwheel drive one day.

Not that it helps on ice though.

Reminds me of that Simon and Garfunkel song.

Slip sliding away. "Believe we're gliding down the highway, when in fact we're slip sliding away".

lol, that's the song that was rolling through my head
when I posted that.

Keep warm !

 

[ScottBot]

I've heard of a place in Florida where sturgeon are jumping into people's boats.

 

[JacktheCatholic]

lol, that's the song that was rolling through my head
when I posted that.

Keep warm !

Great minds think alike.

Stay warm as well.

 

[simonthezealot]

Cyprian of Carthage


"The Lord says to Peter: ‘I say to you,’ he says, ‘that you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build my Church.’ . . . On him [Peter] he builds the Church, and to him he gives the command to feed the sheep [John 21:17], and although he assigns a like power to all the apostles, yet he founded a single chair [cathedra], and he established by his own authority a source and an intrinsic reason for that unity. Indeed, the others were that also which Peter was [i.e., apostles], but a primacy is given to Peter, whereby it is made clear that there is but one Church and one chair. So too, all [the apostles] are shepherds, and the flock is shown to be one, fed by all the apostles in single-minded accord. If someone does not hold fast to this unity of Peter, can he imagine that he still holds the faith? If he [should] desert the chair of Peter upon whom the Church was built, can he still be confident that he is in the Church?" (The Unity of the Catholic Church 4; 1st edition [A.D. 251]).

Jack your source is spurious at best, , here is chapter 4 in its entirety.

http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/anf05.iv.v.i.html?highlight=and%20although%20to%20all%20the%20apostles#highlight

4. If any one consider and examine these things, there is no need for lengthened discussion and arguments. There is easy proof for faith in a short summary of the truth. The Lord speaks to Peter, saying, “I say unto thee, that thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my Church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven; and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound also in heaven, and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven."
And again to the same He says, after His resurrection, “Feed my sheep.” And although to all the apostles, after His resurrection, He gives an equal power, and says, “As the Father hath sent me, even so send I you: Receive ye the Holy Ghost: Whose soever sins ye remit, they shall be remitted unto him; and whose soever sins ye retain, they shall be retained;”. yet, that He might set forth unity, He arranged by His authority the origin of that unity, as beginning from one. Assuredly the rest of the apostles were also the same as was Peter, endowed with a like partnership both of honour and power; but the beginning proceeds from unity. Which one Church, also, the Holy Spirit in the Song of Songs designated in the person of our Lord, and says, “My dove, my spotless one, is but one. She is the only one of her mother, elect of her that bare her.”Does he who does not hold this unity of the Church think that he holds the faith? Does he who strives against and resists the Churchtrust that he is in the Church, when moreover the blessed Apostle Paul teaches the same thing, and sets forth the sacrament of unity, saying, “There is one body and one spirit, one hope of your calling, one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God?”

 

[namericanboy]

Hi , Lover of the Son..Grace and Peace to you..My wife likes her small 4wd pick up. Thing is, when the roads are bad they sorta expect her to be at work..She used 4wd one time and was sold on it..As for the ice, 10 wheel drive won't help..There has been more than one testosterone laced 4WD down an embankment from icy roads..

 

[Catholic Christian]

Any thread started by a Catholic questioning or pointing out errors in Protestantism is derailed and closed. It's quite easy, really. All you have to do is start fights that proceed into flaming, personal attacks, mocking, baiting, way off topic posting, etc.

Consequently, there are now numerous anti-Catholic threads that dominate this fora. And you can't even point that out without the thread getting closed. I must congratulate some of our Protestant brethren for their crafty tactics. We Catholics should take a page out of your playbook! I hope we don't, however.

Now, the big question is, how long will this thread stay open?

You must be a prophet. The Anti-Cartholic YouTube thread has been unlocked, but other Pro-Catholic ones remain locked. In another thread, the first 8 posts are just anti-Catholic videos. They remAin. But my one post questioning the legitimacy of that was removed.

 

[simonthezealot]

Jack, you know that when looking for an understanding of comments or thoughts made by others, a good policy is to always to let the clearest points interpret the others. Cyprian makes some very pointed ones relative to if a singular office such as a Papacy was acknowledged between them.

 

[ScottBot]

You must be a prophet. The Anti-Cartholic YouTube thread has been unlocked, but other Pro-Catholic ones remain locked. In another thread, the first 8 posts are just anti-Catholic videos. They reamin. But my one post questioning the legitimacy of that was removed.

*edit*

 

[JacktheCatholic]

Jack your source is spurious at best, , here is chapter 4 in its entirety.

http://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/anf...ht=and although to all the apostles#highlight

4. If any one consider and examine these things, there is no need for lengthened discussion and arguments. There is easy proof for faith in a short summary of the truth. The Lord speaks to Peter, saying, “I say unto thee, that thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my Church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven; and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound also in heaven, and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven."
And again to the same He says, after His resurrection, “Feed my sheep.” And although to all the apostles, after His resurrection, He gives an equal power, and says, “As the Father hath sent me, even so send I you: Receive ye the Holy Ghost: Whose soever sins ye remit, they shall be remitted unto him; and whose soever sins ye retain, they shall be retained;”. yet, that He might set forth unity, He arranged by His authority the origin of that unity, as beginning from one. Assuredly the rest of the apostles were also the same as was Peter, endowed with a like partnership both of honour and power; but the beginning proceeds from unity. Which one Church, also, the Holy Spirit in the Song of Songs designated in the person of our Lord, and says, “My dove, my spotless one, is but one. She is the only one of her mother, elect of her that bare her.”Does he who does not hold this unity of the Church think that he holds the faith? Does he who strives against and resists the Churchtrust that he is in the Church, when moreover the blessed Apostle Paul teaches the same thing, and sets forth the sacrament of unity, saying, “There is one body and one spirit, one hope of your calling, one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God?”

Spurious???

So you say.

I have been reading about this and it seems that my version has credibility to it and some of that credibility comes from references from other writers.

One of these other writers is Gregory the Great. There are a few others as well.

But it does seem that there are several versions of the Unity of the Church.

Seems to be a can of worms at this point.

Give me a bit to respond and I will have more.

 

[JacktheCatholic]

Jack, you know that when looking for an understanding of comments or thoughts made by others, a good policy is to always to let the clearest points interpret the others. Cyprian makes some very pointed ones relative to if a singular office such as a Papacy was acknowledged between them.

Cyprian says much about the church being unified in this writing and that is how it should be. But he still seems to state that even though the other Apostles received a like power, that Peter was elevated some. Also the word 'like' only means similiar and not the same, I think this should be considered as well.

You know I am trying to be analytical about this even though I wish to show Catholic support.

 

[myfavoritmartin]

You know I am trying to be analytical about this even though I wish to show Catholic support.

It's a tough spot I don't envy you having to be there. I give you credit for kind of holding your ground on sinking sand.

 

[sunlover1]

Hi , Lover of the Son..Grace and Peace to you..My wife likes her small 4wd pick up. Thing is, when the roads are bad they sorta expect her to be at work..She used 4wd one time and was sold on it..As for the ice, 10 wheel drive won't help..There has been more than one testosterone laced 4WD down an embankment from icy roads..

Looks like a cool vehicle.

Yeah, we have those kind of guys around here too lol.
Hopefully my boys are more level headed, seems I
spend an outrageous amount of time praying just for
them lately
Kidding... sorta.

My husband has a fourwheel drive diesel truck,
sharp. I have no vehicle and guess what HE thinks I
should have.

 

[JacktheCatholic]

It's a tough spot I don't envy you having to be there. I give you credit for kind of holding your ground on sinking sand.

Thanks for the compliment.

Lucky for me I do not sense a sinking ground but rather one that is being made level. If you and I can have a civil debate from two opposing fronts then why can't others. Maybe we are helping to level the playing field for all.

Anyhow, that is how I see it in some strange "JacktheCatholic" way.


I should add that I recognize a ever increasing understanding of what Jesus taught to the Apostles and given to the Church so I see no conflicts with teachings that develop over time from the original. I see it as a seed that has been planted with everything need in it and as that seed grows and blossoms we see things more clearly for what they are.

A little example of how I am thinking could be posed as this:

The Apostles were told that Jesus had to die for his mission to be complete. The Aposltes do not understand this and when Jesus is to be taken prisoner the Aposltes think they must fight when they should let him go. It is not until after Jesus is resurrected that the Apostles remember Jesus' words and start to understand what Jesus meant. But even later they start to connect the dots to prophecies and how Jesus fulfilled them. Of course the Paraclete was there to help the Apostles remember.

See how I am stating the teachings from Christ are like that seed that needs time to grow? When Jesus gives it to us and the soil is rich we bury it and it is in the dark until it grows nad takes root in our hearts. After it takes root it reaches for the sun (Son) and then we see light (personal revelation). But it keeps growing and will grow branches and leaves and flowers and then bear fruit. Then we can share this fruit and hope to help others by planting seeds.

Point is that it takes time and the truth is always the same but it has to grow and take root before we see light and then when we see light it takes on an ever growing depth. This is how the Chair of Peter came about and how they grew to understand it. It continued to grow as well. We can see this growth from Ignatius to Cyprian to Origen and so on right up until today. And the Truth is still there as it ever was and the Church has blossomed long ago and it feeding many from it's fruit.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

It's a tough spot I don't envy you having to be there. I give you credit for kind of holding your ground on sinking sand.

Their cathedrals haven't sunk yet, and their numbers are as of the sand of the sea.

Romans 9:27 Isaiah yet cries-out over the Israel 'if-ever may be the number of the sons of Israel as the sand of the sea, the Remnant shall be being saved/swqhsetai <4982> (5701)'. [Daniel 12]