Here’s the No. 1 fallacy on eternal security

[Clare73]

So I'll ask again. Did God want His people to be freed?

That's another dodge. . . in relation to Pharaoh, who was commanded by God to do what God did not want him to do.

If He wanted His people to be freed while not wanting His people to be freed then we'd have a problem, and duplicitousness, not to mention irrationality.

Non-responsive to God's "duplicitousness" with Pharaoh, in commanding Pharoah to do what God did not want Pharoah to do.

 

[fhansen]

That's another dodge. . . in relation to Pharaoh, who was commanded by God to do what God did not want him to do.

That's another error. God wanted Pharaoh to free His people. In fact, if His people were not freed then we'd have no faith to be discussing right now.

 

[Clare73]

That's another error. God wanted Pharaoh to free His people. In fact, if His people were not freed then we'd have no faith to be discussing right now.

"But I will harden his heart so that he will not let the people go." (Ex 4:21)

"Duplicitous" with Pharaoh?

Moral: Don't measure/describe God by man's standards; e.g., whether or not God is "duplicitous."

 

[fhansen]

"But I will harden his heart so that he will not let the people go." (Ex 4:21)

"Duplicitous" with Pharaoh?

Moral: Don't measure God by man's standards, such as duplicitousness.

Did Pharaoh let the people go? Did God get what He wanted, iOW? Do you think that God did not want the Jews to be set free?

Moral: Consider the whole story not just bits of it.

 

[Clare73]

Did Pharaoh let the people go? Did God get what He wanted, iOW?
Moral: Consider the whole story not just bits of it.

The subject and point was God's "duplicitousness" with Pharaoh, not God's plan for Israel.
Moral:
1) Consider the subject and point in view (duplicitousness), not the unrelated whole story as a distraction from it.
2) Don't measure God by man's standards, such as duplicitousness.

 

[fhansen]

The subject and point was God's duplicitousness with Pharaoh, not God's plan for Israel.
Moral: Consider the subject and point in view, not the unrelated whole story as a distraction from them.

But you're avoiding all of it.
1) Through Moses, did God tell Pharaoh that He wanted the people to be set free?
2) Did God want the people to be set free?
3) If not, then He was being duplicitous, by lying to Pharaoh.

Likewise with Adam. If God commanded Adam to obey while not wanting him to obey that would be lying to Adam, and therefore duplicitous.

 

[Clare73]

The subject and point was God's "duplicitousness" with Pharaoh, not God's plan for Israel.
Moral:
1) Consider the subject and point in view (duplicitousness), not the unrelated whole story as a distraction from it.
2) Don't measure God by man's standards, such as duplicitousness.

But you're avoiding all of it.
1) Through Moses, did God tell Pharaoh that He wanted the people to be set free?
2) Did God want the people to be set free?
3) If not, then He was being duplicitous, by lying to Pharaoh.

Does not address God's "duplicitousness" with Pharaoh in commanding Pharaoh to do a thing which God hardened his heart against so that he could not do it (Ex 4:21).

 

[fhansen]

Lying is duplicitousness.

As I said. So the question for you today remains the same. Did God want his people to remain in captivity or did he want his people to be set free as he told Pharaoh?

That's the only relevant question here. Did God lie to Pharaoh when He told him that He wanted His people to be free

 

[Clare73]

As I said. So the question for you today remains the same. Did God want his people to remain in captivity or did he want his people to be set free as he told Pharaoh?

Does not address God's "duplicitousness" with Pharaoh in commanding Pharaoh to do a thing which God hardened his heart against doing "so that" he could not do it (Ex 4:21).

 

[fhansen]

Does not address God's "duplicitousness" with Pharaoh in commanding Pharaoh to do a thing which God hardened his heart against doing "so that" he could not do it (Ex 4:21).

You might call that duplicitous if you like. But it's not lying because God's desire didn't change. If He had told Pharaoh that He would never harden his heart and then He hardened his heart that would be lying.