• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

  • CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.

Help with John 10:37-38

A_Thinker

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Apr 23, 2004
11,915
9,069
Midwest
✟979,176.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
So if your believing comes from seeing the signs, will that qualify as faith under the definition given in Hebrews 11:1?

I am fine if you believe it will still qualify, I am just curious what your stand is.
Yes ... generally christians believe in those things which they have not seen.

We have seen signs of the promises, but not the promises themselves ...
 
Upvote 0

Guojing

Well-Known Member
Apr 11, 2019
13,102
1,405
sg
✟275,633.00
Country
Singapore
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Yes ... generally christians believe in those things which they have not seen.

We have seen signs of the promises, but not the promises themselves ...

What do you mean by "signs of the promises"? Can you give some examples?
 
Upvote 0

A_Thinker

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Apr 23, 2004
11,915
9,069
Midwest
✟979,176.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
What do you mean by "signs of the promises"? Can you give some examples?
Certainly, Jesus' works, in His day, ... were "signs" of His larger promises.

Healing the sick, giving sight to the blind, feeding the hungry ... were all "signs" of His promise of reconciliation with ... and adoption ... of those who believe.

Similarly, in our time, giftings of peace, healing, recovery, and spiritual enlightenment ... are signs of His ultimate promises.
 
  • Informative
Reactions: Guojing
Upvote 0

Guojing

Well-Known Member
Apr 11, 2019
13,102
1,405
sg
✟275,633.00
Country
Singapore
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Certainly, Jesus' works, in His day, ... were "signs" of His larger promises.

Healing the sick, giving sight to the blind, feeding the hungry ... were all "signs" of His promise of reconciliation with ... and adoption ... of those who believe.

Similarly, in our time, giftings of peace, healing, recovery, and spiritual enlightenment ... are signs of His ultimate promises.

And you have seen these "signs" in your church too?
 
Upvote 0

Clare73

Blood-bought
Jun 12, 2012
29,605
7,616
North Carolina
✟357,888.00
Country
United States
Gender
Female
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
37 If I do not do the works of My Father, do not believe Me; 38 but if I do them, though you do not believe Me, believe the works, so that you may know and understand that the Father is in Me, and I in the Father.”
Jesus speaking to the Jews.
My take on this is that many Jews had faith in the Father, knew the Scriptures in detail but struggled with Jesus.
Jesus then was saying to them - if you know that only the Father can do what I do, then believe that He is in Me.
Some members seem to believe that Jesus was encouraging the Jews to walk by sight rather than by faith.

I don't believe this to be the case.

Comments welcome.
How about the testimony of two witnesses would establish the truth (John 8:17) .

Jesus presents two witnesses of who he is:
1) testimony of himself--his miracles
2) testimony of his Father (John 5:37) in Matthew 3:17, Matthew 17:5.
 
Upvote 0