Help with debate!

[Modus]

shh! pretend I didn't post here!

1. "Thirty Six Nanoseconds Faster Than Light"
   Electronics and Wireless World 1988 pp 1162-1165
2. "Faster Than Light?" Radio-Electronics pp 55-58.
   Also - "New Scientist" April 1, 1995; pp 26-29 "Faster Than What" Newsweek June 19, 1995 p 67-69

"The speed of light was ten billion times faster at time zero!"
Dr. V.S. Troitskii, Cosmologist at the Radio-physical Research Institute in Gorky. "Physical Constants and the Evolution of the Universe" Astrophysics and Space Science , Vol. 139, No. 2, December 1987 pp 389-411. "A shocking possibility is that the speed of light might change in time during the life of the universe."
Dr. Joao Magueijo of Imperial College London Sunday-times.co.uk 12-24-2000

 

[bmount1217]

hmmm....The man got a degree from a homeschool program sop taht make shim wrong....interesting.. I wonder how many Evolutionists, or Physists got a degree from the University of Phoenix or such..

 

[Pete Harcoff]

Forerunner...I got a better idea....God the creator Expanded the dense matter? Possible? The quantum fluctation had to start from something...Ive never seen a car start itself

The idea of causality as we know it may not have applied at that point. Difficult to grasp, I admit, but the reality is that not all physical laws apply in all situations.

 

[TruthTraveler]

gotta go.

ILL BE BACK.

 

[Meatros]

hmmm....The man got a degree from a homeschool program sop taht make shim wrong....interesting.. I wonder how many Evolutionists, or Physists got a degree from the University of Phoenix or such..

No Bmount1217, Patriot University isn't accredited. It's a diploma mill. His degree, BTW, is in Theology (IIRC) and has nothing to do with evolution.

University of Phoenix, IIRC is accredited and is recognized as a legitimate University. BTW-I don't think you actually *can* get a degree from UoP in biology or Physics, they offer only business type degrees.

 

[ForeRunner]

hmmm....The man got a degree from a homeschool program sop taht make shim wrong....interesting.. I wonder how many Evolutionists, or Physists got a degree from the University of Phoenix or such..

None with jobs I'd be willing to bet.

 

[Pete Harcoff]

hmmm....The man got a degree from a homeschool program sop taht make shim wrong....interesting..

No, but Hovind tries to use his degree (and also his teaching "expertise") to prop up what he tells people. By telling people he has a PhD, they might more easily accept what he tells them with respect to science.

But even if his PhD was legit, it still has nothing to do with any of the science he argues against (in fact, it is in "Christian education"). So either way, that Hovind has a PhD lends absolutely nothing to his arguments, other than to more easily sway his audiences (which is all Hovind cares about it, since his arguments are largely rubbish to begin with).

 

[Physics_guy]

"Thirty Six Nanoseconds Faster Than Light"
Electronics and Wireless World 1988 pp 1162-1165
"Faster Than Light?" Radio-Electronics pp 55-58.
Also - "New Scientist" April 1, 1995; pp 26-29 "Faster Than What" Newsweek June 19, 1995 p 67-69

Umm, I pretty sure this has to do with exactly the work I helped Dr. Chiao with - quantum tunneling. It is a rather strange quantum mechanical effect that allows particles (not necessarily the same particles) to travel through a barrier at what appears to be faster than c speeds. I think you should do some more reading (actually reading, not quoting from other people's sights) about this topic before you engage anyone who knows something about the subject matter.

"The speed of light was ten billion times faster at time zero!"
Dr. V.S. Troitskii, Cosmologist at the Radio-physical Research Institute in Gorky. "Physical Constants and the Evolution of the Universe" Astrophysics and Space Science , Vol. 139, No. 2, December 1987 pp 389-411. "A shocking possibility is that the speed of light might change in time during the life of the universe."
Dr. Joao Magueijo of Imperial College London Sunday-times.co.uk 12-24-2000

Have you read these articles? I have read much of the source material that they are based on and I think you will find that they do not support your point of view very well.

Yes there has been some observations that the fine structure constant may have been different in the distant past, which in turn leads to some possibility that the speed of light may have been different as well. Unfortunately for your position, the changes are no where near recent enough. We observe none of the tell-tale signs of change in the physical constants with the possible exception of the first moments after the big bang (about 13 billion years ago). So how could we see light from SN1987 which went supernova approximately 187,000 years ago?

 

[Modus]

Since I have some people here, Im going to share the gospell with you guys (one more time wont hurt, you must have heard it all before i know)

First of all, most of you might think you are a good person. Well, I have a simple test to see if that is true. Here it goes:

Answer each of the following with guilty or inocent.

1. "You shall have no other gods before Me."
Have you always put God first in your life? Jesus said to love God with all your heart, mind, soul, and strength-- so much, that your love for your parents, brothers and sisters, friends, and even your own life is like hatred compared to your love and devotion for God. Have you ever failed to put Him first in your life? (if you don't believe that God exists the answer is automaticaly no)

2. "You shall not make for yourself any idol."

Who is God to you? Is he only a god of love and mercy who would never judge anyone and never cast anyone into Hell? If that's your god, then you're right. Your god couldn't cast anyone into Hell because he doesn't exist. He's a figment of your imagination. You've created a god in your own mind that you're more comfortable with. You may call it your "personal belief," but God calls it idolatry. It's the oldest sin in the Book, and the Bible warns that idolaters will not inherit the kingdom of heaven.

3. "You shall not take the name of God in vain."

Have you ever used God's name as a curse word? If you have, you've taken the holy name of God-- who gave you your life, your family, and everything precious to you-- and used it as a filthy, four-letter word. Hitler's name wasn't even despised enough to be used as a curse word! If you have used God's holy name in that manner, you are a blasphemer and the Bible says "God will not hold him guiltless who takes the name of the Lord in vain."

4. "Remember the Sabbath Day, to keep it holy."

God commands that we set aside one day in seven. Have you ever been guilty of breaking this Commandment?

5. "Honor your father and your mother."

Have you always honored your parents in a way that's pleasing in the sight of God? Ask Him to remind you of the sins of your youth. You may have forgotten them, but God hasn't.

6. "You shall not murder."

Jesus warned "Whoever is angry with his brother without cause, is in danger of judgment," (Matthew 5:22) and the Bible says, "He who hates his brother is a murderer," (1 John 3:15). God sees hatred in the heart to be as wicked as murder. We can violate His Law by attitude and intent.

7. "You shall not commit adultery."

Jesus warned," You have heard...'You shall not commit adultery.' But I say to you that whoever looks at a woman to lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart. Have you ever looked at another person with lust? The Bible says that adulterers and fornicators (those who have had sex before marriage) will not enter the kingdom of heaven.

8. "You shall not steal."

Have you ever stolen anything (even if it was something small)? The value of the thing stolen doesn't matter; petty theft is still theft. Have you ever taken anything that belonged to someone else (from the office, school, parents, etc.)? If you have, that makes you a thief.

9. "You shall not lie."

Have you ever told a lie? Then you are a liar. How many murders do you have to commit to be a murderer? Just one. If you have told even one lie, that makes you a liar. The Bible warns that all liars will have their part in the Lake of Fire (Revelation 21:8). You may not think deceitfulness is a serious sin, but God does.

10. "You shall not covet."

This means we should never desire anything that belongs to another person. Not their house, nor their car, nor their money, nor their wife, nor their lifestyle, nor anything that belongs to our neighbor.

If you have said guilty to anyone of these, then you are guilty of breaking God's law.


If you have not repented (decided to hate sin and turn from it) and put your trust in Jesus Christ then when you die you will be judged by this standard, and if you said guilty to any one of those you will recieve the consequences, eternity in hell. If you want to escape the consequences to your sin, then you must turn from your sins, ask for forgiveness, and follow Jesus.

If you do this, God will make you righteous and on the day of judgment, your case will be dismissed due to lack of evidence.

You have been warned.

 

[Pete Harcoff]

Since I have some people here, Im going to share the gospell with you guys (one more time wont hurt, you must have heard it all before i know)

<snip>

This is a science forum, not a preaching forum.

If you want to convert people, you'd be better off in the General Apologetics forum.

 

[Modus]

not trying to convert you, just warning you. It only took one post and its over now. no big deal.
WEll, actually now it took three posts.

 

[Physics_guy]

Excuse, but It thought this was a discussion about the theory of evolution and some corrollary discussion into the apparent age of the Universe and the Earth. What exactly has this discussion have to do with the 10 Commandments? You do know that you can be Christian and accept the validity of the Theory of Evolution, don't you?

 

[Meatros]

5. "Honor your father and your mother."

Have you always honored your parents in a way that's pleasing in the sight of God? Ask Him to remind you of the sins of your youth. You may have forgotten them, but God hasn't.

How odd...My bible says that Jesus taught the opposit of this: Luke 14:26

 

[Modus]

Excuse, but It thought this was a discussion about the theory of evolution and some corrollary discussion into the apparent age of the Universe and the Earth. What exactly has this discussion have to do with the 10 Commandments? You do know that you can be Christian and accept the validity of the Theory of Evolution, don't you?

actually this discussion was about me getting material for the topics presented. I should be able to post that in a thread that I started. I know you don't like it, but it was just one post. No big deal

 

[bmount1217]

LOL.....this is CHRISTIANFORUMS.COM........Science forums...HAAHAHAHAHAHAH.....Good luck with that

 

[ForeRunner]

woops

 

[Modus]

How odd...My bible says that Jesus taught the opposit of this: Luke 14:26

I don't see a condradiction. What are you talking about

 

[ForeRunner]

Since I have some people here, Im going to share the gospell with you guys (one more time wont hurt, you must have heard it all before i know)

First of all, most of you might think you are a good person. Well, I have a simple test to see if that is true. Here it goes:
If you have said guilty to anyone of these, then you are guilty of breaking God's law.


If you have not repented (decided to hate sin and turn from it) and put your trust in Jesus Christ then when you die you will be judged by this standard, and if you said guilty to any one of those you will recieve the consequences, eternity in hell. If you want to escape the consequences to your sin, then you must turn from your sins, ask for forgiveness, and follow Jesus.

If you do this, God will make you righteous and on the day of judgment, your case will be dismissed due to lack of evidence.

You have been warned.

I think Jesus was an invention of Paul to lend credence to his new cult. That makes the gospel and anything else he "said" irrelevant. What do you have to say to that.

 

[Meatros]

I don't see a condradiction. What are you talking about

Actually, I'm not going to get into it here, as tempting as it is.

 

[Modus]

I think Jesus was an invention of Paul to lend credence to his new cult. That makes the gospel and anything else he "said" irrelevant. What do you have to say to that.

I say you have mountains of corraborating evidence to explain away.