Hello fellow Reformers

[MizDoulos]

Congratulations on your 1,000th post, Gabriel!!!

 

[Quixote]

4th March 2003 at 02:36 PM Gabriel said this in Post #28

We don't follow Calvin. We follow biblical truth. We are commanded to conform our lives to God's word.

Well, sir, is that not the issue:  "Biblical Truth"?  For ultimately, it always comes down to the individual's subjective interpretation.  In our piety, we like to believe that the Holy Spirit speaks directly to us and we unerringly interpret His divine will.  But are we not mere mortals after all? 

So, while you'd like to claim your ideas are your own, inspired by the Holy Spirit, you seem to fall in line with the ideas of John Calvin and so, no insult intended, you are therefore a Calvinist.  Through no fault of yours, since he got there first, his is the name we attribute to your theology of predestination and the like.

later, in that same post (#28), Gabriel said...
There is no such thing as an out dated concept when it comes to truth.

You are probably too young to remember when we used to believe the world was flat.  This was our truth.  We knew this as assuredly as we knew our own name.  In time, this became outdated.  So to the idea that the earth was at the center of the solar system.  This truth served our idea of ourselves as well as our world quite well so when science made this idea outdated, it caused us much consternation but still our truth was altered.

Now you may say that these beliefs were in error from their inception for we did not have all of "the facts".  But we are not talking about facts nor anything that can be truly objectively measured.  We are traversing the realm of theology: a mysterious world where we use objective language to explain the most subjective of experiences.  Our truths evolve as our connection with the Divine matures.

then Gabriel spouted off with...
Either you follow God's word or you don't.

I don't listen to anyone or any document that cannot take me to the bible to confirm their statements, doctrine, feelings, whatever.

You must find it difficult to program your VCR for very few instruction manuals refer to Scripture.

then, to close, he said...

The problem, as I see it, with so many minstream churches these days is that they conform to the world and to worldly views and concerns. They claim to be bible based, but gladly skirt around issues that are very plain in the bible. Such as, homosexual and female pastors and elders, a women's right to choose, the bible was written by men and does contain God's word but is not infallible, or my favorite....truth is subjective to your circumstance and/or personal convictions.

I would be very interested to examine any evidence or proof you might be able to offer that could show how one particular interpretation of Scripture is the only possible "truth".  You could do the entire world a favor by pointing out just which religions were ultimately and objectively wrong.

Vaya con Dios,

Q

 

[Gabriel]

So, while you'd like to claim your ideas are your own, inspired by the Holy Spirit, you seem to fall in line with the ideas of John Calvin and so, no insult intended, you are therefore a Calvinist. Through no fault of yours, since he got there first, his is the name we attribute to your theology of predestination and the like.

I follow the truth of the bible because it is written, in the bible. Not because John Calvin said it was so. I thought that was pretty obvious.

You are probably too young to remember when we used to believe the world was flat. This was our truth. We knew this as assuredly as we knew our own name. In time, this became outdated. So to the idea that the earth was at the center of the solar system. This truth served our idea of ourselves as well as our world quite well so when science made this idea outdated, it caused us much consternation but still our truth was altered.

Uh, yea. The truth was not altered. What you thought, in error, to be true was altered. Your misconception of the shape of the world, what you thought was truth, changed when you learned the truth. The truth, which in this case was the shape of the world, remained the same through-out.

You must find it difficult to program your VCR for very few instruction manuals refer to Scripture.

Again, I thought my intent was quite obvious here. But I'll explain a little more thoroughly. "I don't listen to anyone or any document concerning biblical matters or theology that cannot take me to the bible to confirm their statements, doctrine, feelings, whatever. Instruction manual? Why would I use one of those? I am a man.

I would be very interested to examine any evidence or proof you might be able to offer that could show how one particular interpretation of Scripture is the only possible "truth".

Scripture best interprets scripture. Every scripture contained in the bible, when taken in proper context, upholds and confirms each and every other part contained therein. Study it for yourself. If you come to different conclusions than I do, that is your perogative. I would say the Holy Spirit works on us differently and that He has a purpose for each of us. Who are we to reply against God's will in our lives?

Anyway, welcome to CF.

 

[chelcb]

Why would I use one of those? I am a man.

As a female person, I have to say that I take issue with this. I do not use a manual to program my VCR either, does this make me a man?

I am making light of this, it's a joke. Please no one go flying off the handle on me.