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Is the Book of Revelation true?Revelation was written many centuries later, when the views of God and Satan had changed—in the Old Testament, God was in charge of both good and bad, where Satan in his sole appearance (in Job) was like God's prosecutor in a bet. In the New Testament the view changed so that God was seen as completely causing nothing but good and anything bad was attributed to Satan—this is even clear from the story of David being moved to take a census, while in the OT it says God did it and in the NT it was claimed Satan did it. The writers of Genesis itself had no intention of the serpent being Satan (who only existed in Job to them), all the text implies it being just a serpent. Revelation almost wasn't even included in the Bible.
Ball was just a false god of one of the other tribes. It's like saying Satan is the same as (insert any other false deity ever here). Those other gods were just idols that others worshipped. Nothing about Satan.
When is the war in heaven?SING:
Heaven is a wonderful place,
Filled with glory and grace.
I wanna see my Savior’s face,
‘Cause Heaven is a wonderful place.
I wanna go there!
We know that Lucifer fell and became Satan at the latest in the garden of Eden since he brought about the fall of mankind. Since he caused the fall of mankind it doesn't make sense that he'd be jealous of our salvation. Frankly, I don't think they can be saved. If God could save them I think he would. My own speculation is that their being only spirits made their fall total. Whereas humanity being made in the image of God is tripartate so our fall in the had the work-ability of salvation since we are three parts not one part.
You are right about my statement. I don't know why I wrote that he is jealous that we can be saved. He is jealous that we are in the image of God and he wants to be God. I think what I meant by my statement is that not only are we made in the image of God and he is not, we have the power of the Living God dwelling inside us which is our salvation. In that light is what I meant. Satan wants to be God. This is clearly stated in Scriptures.I dont buy that. I dont believe Satan is jealous for us because we have the way to be saved. Satan hates us because that is his nature, he loves to hate, he loves chaos, destrcution, lies and death. Satan is not seeking to get to Heaven, he hates Heaven because Heaven means selflessness, humility, honesty, generosity, all the things which Satan cannot stand. This is why Satan is destined to the lake of fire, because he hates everything right and good.
You are right about my statement. I don't know why I wrote that he is jealous that we can be saved. He is jealous that we are in the image of God and he wants to be God. I think what I meant by my statement is that not only are we made in the image of God and he is not, we have the power of the Living God dwelling inside us which is our salvation. In that light is what I meant. Satan wants to be God. This is clearly stated in Scriptures.
Isa 14:12 "How you have fallen from heaven, Day Star, son of the Dawn! How you have been thrown down to earth, you who laid low the nation!
Isa 14:13 You said in your heart, 'I'll ascend to heaven, above the stars of God. I'll erect my throne; I'll sit on the Mount of Assembly in the far reaches of the north;
Isa 14:14 I'll ascend above the tops of the clouds; I'll make myself like the Most High.'
Isa 14:15 But you are brought down to join the dead, to the far reaches of the Pit.
It is commonly understood as to refer to Lucifer, aka, Satan.
As I understand it, there is no salvation for any of the fallen angels. Jesus said that the Lake of Fire was made for Satan and his followers.
But the problem is that the demonic forces will never want to repent of their sin. In their rebellion, they became evil. Evil is the opposite of God's holiness. It is the desire to do that which is against God, to inflict pain and suffering, and to have extreme malice towards anyone. Out of such a fallen state, no good can come. Therefore, it is not possible for the demonic realm to repent because they will never want to.
The Bible makes no such statement. One might think that, since they can assume human form, but human form is not what makes us in God's image. I believe there is much more to what makes us in God's image, although I am hard pressed to explain it.Aren't angels made in God's image too?
The Bible makes no such statement. One might think that, since they can assume human form, but human form is not what makes us in God's image. I believe there is much more to what makes us in God's image, although I am hard pressed to explain it.
No it doesn't. Jesus is the Son of God, and we are made in His image and are the heirs of salvation. You are referring to Job which is commonly thought to mean that angels are are the sons of God. Just because Satan was amongst them doesn't mean they were angels, they are more likely to be humans, descendants of Shem, that were worshipping God. There is another place in psalms that refers to the sons of God praising him at creation, and is also assumed to be angels, but again, the text does not specifically state that they are angels. It is also possible that it refers to men praising Him for the creation. At any rate, the point of view that angels are the sons of God is a tenuous one, whereas we, people who follow Christ are clearly referred to as sons of God.The Bible says they are the sons of God.
No it doesn't. Jesus is the Son of God, and we are made in His image and are the heirs of salvation. You are referring to Job which is commonly thought to mean that angels are are the sons of God. Just because Satan was amongst them doesn't mean they were angels, they are more likely to be humans, descendants of Shem, that were worshipping God. There is another place in psalms that refers to the sons of God praising him at creation, and is also assumed to be angels, but again, the text does not specifically state that they are angels. It is also possible that it refers to men praising Him for the creation. At any rate, the point of view that angels are the sons of God is a tenuous one, whereas we, people who follow Christ are clearly referred to as sons of God.
Genesis does not say they were fallen angels. This is an ancient doctrine that predates Christ. It comes from Genesis 6If angels aren't in God's image-why are they called men?
Doesn't Genesis refer to the sons of God? Beginning And End That site talks about them being fallen angels.
Genesis does not say they were fallen angels. This is an ancient doctrine that predates Christ. It comes from Genesis 6
Gen 6:1 And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them,
Gen 6:2 That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose.
Gen 6:3 And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.
Gen 6:4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.
The assumption is that the sons of God were fallen angels that had sex with women who gave birth to giants. The verse says nothing of the sort. First everything begats after its own kind. Even with horses and donkeys, which are similar species, the mule that is born is sterile and can not reproduce. Further more Jesus said that people in heaven will be like the angels that do not marry, implying that they do not procreate.
It is more likely that the sons of God are the righteous line of Seth who were in the lineage of the Messiah. These righteous men married pagan women who did not follow Yahweh. It does not say that giants were born from them, only that there were giants in those days. Those giants would be people. Instead it says that the children born became mighty men of renown. Meaning that the blessing of God on the righteous line spills over to those connected to them, even if they are pagan.
To justify this doctrine a further doctrine has been created that says that all angels are the sons of God by right of first creation. Even in this doctrine angels do not procreate because they were individually created by God just as Adam was.
God is the God of Abundant life. Not all life is the same. Take plants, for example. They are living entities that God created for food and resource. Would it be merciful of God to make plants sentient beings with intelligence, fear and pain? They are sentient to a limited extent, of course. But their purpose is for food. Likewise, angels are intelligent sentient beings whose purpose is to serve God and His heirs of salvation, that is, us. They are not the same, nor are they children of God. They are servants to to be worshipped nor communed with because they are butlers and maids.
Who? What When? Why? How? Where?
All easy to ask, almost impossible to answer.
Q: When is the war in heaven?
A: After the peace in heaven ends?
Start here:
Revelation 12:7[ The Angel, Michael ]
And there was war in heaven, Michael and his angels waging war with the dragon (satan/devil/serpent). The dragon and his angels (emons) waged war,8 and they were not strong enough, and there was no longer a place found for them in heaven. 9 And the great dragon was thrown down, the serpent of old who is called the devil and Satan, who deceives the whole world; he was thrown down to the earth, and his angels were thrown down with him.
Sounds like the battle was won, but the war rages on...until:
Revelation 19:11[ The Coming of Christ ]
And I saw heaven opened, and behold, a white horse, and He who sat on it is called Faithful and True, and in righteousness He judges and wages war...(and WINS the WAR!)
"Doom of the Beast and False Prophet"
20 And the beast (anti-christ) was seized, and with him the false prophet (anti-spirit)
who performed the signs in his presence, by which he deceived those who had received the mark of the beast and those who worshiped his image; these two were thrown alive into the "lake of fire" which burns with brimstone. 21 And the rest were killed with the sword
which came from the mouth of Him who sat on the horse,(Jesus the God-Man) and all the birds were filled with their flesh. (YUK!!)
You are right about my statement. I don't know why I wrote that he is jealous that we can be saved. He is jealous that we are in the image of God and he wants to be God. I think what I meant by my statement is that not only are we made in the image of God and he is not, we have the power of the Living God dwelling inside us which is our salvation. In that light is what I meant. Satan wants to be God. This is clearly stated in Scriptures.
Isa 14:12 "How you have fallen from heaven, Day Star, son of the Dawn! How you have been thrown down to earth, you who laid low the nation!
Isa 14:13 You said in your heart, 'I'll ascend to heaven, above the stars of God. I'll erect my throne; I'll sit on the Mount of Assembly in the far reaches of the north;
Isa 14:14 I'll ascend above the tops of the clouds; I'll make myself like the Most High.'
Isa 14:15 But you are brought down to join the dead, to the far reaches of the Pit.
It is commonly understood as to refer to Lucifer, aka, Satan.
As I understand it, there is no salvation for any of the fallen angels. Jesus said that the Lake of Fire was made for Satan and his followers.
Where is the "New Earth"...AND... the "New Jerusalem ??
Where is the "lake of fire" ?? Where is God ??
Where is the devil / demons ??
No, I do not. Only in Heaven will we really know.Do you think we can grasp the real appearance of angels with our limited 3 dimensional worldview?
No devil/satan/serpent in the OT?? How about BAAL??
Zephaniah 1:4
“So I will stretch out My hand against Judah And against all the inhabitants of Jerusalem. And I will cut off the remnant of Baal from this place, And the names of the idolatrous priests along with the priests.
Romans 11:4
But what is the divine response to him? “I have kept for Myself seven thousand men who have not bowed the knee to Baal.”
I said the spirit is the point and points have no measurement. You seem to be thinking of the spirit world as though it is the same as the physical, and it is not. Remember the demoniac of Gadera had thousands of demons dwelling within him. If they have physical measurement how could thousands dwell in him?
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