GUILTY

[Zaha Torte]

The verdict is in, and Trump will appeal it, (as he should); but he’s likely, (given his history), of opening his mouth to his own detriment and then blame other people for the consequences.
I wish I didn’t have to hear about how poor Donald Trump got indicted, that’s rough on anybody. But he been found guilty in a jury trial.
He’s not a victim. He doesn’t need our help, he’s the “only I” President, he’ll be fine no matter what happens.

I do agree that these convictions will amount to nothing in regard to Trump - but it seems to be bad precedent for the country.

 

[Pommer]

I understand there can be an emergency appeal but the SCOTUS is not likely to take it.

I think the only way it can go (at this stage) to SCOTUS, is if the appellants raise enough of a Constitutional issue, that might warrant perusal by the High Court…I haven’t seem anything like such an appeal be forthcoming.

I think they could get involved because of the ramifications of the election. If the judge sentences Trump to something that prevents him from campaigning maybe.

If Mister Trump is incarcerated, (say), yes, that’d put a damper on his campaign for President, somewhat.
i don’t see how this would violate the 8th amendment though.

But if Harvey Weinstein can prevail in an appeal in NY there is still hope for Trump.

Oh, was he convicted of doctoring his books so that an illegal campaign contribution was hidden by making sure that the ledgers said “legal fees” too?
Small world!

I just hope he doesn’t get all this support, win the election then spend all his time trying to get revenge and waging his own lawfare against Democrats.

It would be entertaining though.

I don’t like seeing it done to him and I don’t want it done to Democrats either.

Nothing was done to him that he hasn’t deserved.

 

[FaithT]

Then Trump will be a convicted felon

As of now, he already is.and will you accept that or become some sort of protester?

 

[BPPLEE]

I think the only way it can go (at this stage) to SCOTUS, is if the appellants raise enough of a Constitutional issue, that might warrant perusal by the High Court…I haven’t seem anything like such an appeal be forthcoming.



If Mister Trump is incarcerated, (say), yes, that’d put a damper on his campaign for President, somewhat.
i don’t see how this would violate the 8th amendment though.


Oh, was he convicted of doctoring his books so that an illegal campaign contribution was hidden by making sure that the ledgers said “legal fees” too?
Small world!


It would be entertaining though.


Nothing was done to him that he hasn’t deserved.

You can’t see it because it’s Trump. If it was happening to anyone else you would be crying foul

 

[BPPLEE]

As of now, he already is.and will you accept that or become some sort of protester?

I don’t do protests. I have a job to go to.

 

[Pommer]

You can’t see it because it’s Trump. If it was happening to anyone else you would be crying foul

I don’t hate Trump, though, either as a person or as a politician, (which your lovely accusation would seem to suggest), he did things that turned out to be illegal and left enough of a paper trail so he got nabbed, indicted, booked and convicted.
Stuff happens.

 

[Yttrium]

I think they could get involved because of the ramifications of the election. If the judge sentences Trump to something that prevents him from campaigning maybe.

You're implying that any presidential candidate should be above the law when running for office. If a candidate murdered somebody, well, we don't want that to interfere with the election, better throw out any conviction.

 

[BPPLEE]

You're implying that any presidential candidate should be above the law when running for office. If a candidate murdered somebody, well, we don't want that to interfere with the election, better throw out any conviction.

That’s absurd

 

[Bradskii]

From what I have seen and heard I don't understand how Trump could be convicted of anything...

Your bemusement is noted.

 

[Green Sun]

That’s absurd

And it's what Trump's lawyers are arguing.

When asked if a former president could be indicted for assassinating a political opponent while in office, his laywers said that that would not be possible unless Congress had impeached and removed him from office.

Trump attorney says presidents can’t be prosecuted for selling pardons or ordering murders

She interjected to repeat the query after Mr Sauer’s filibustering answer: “I asked you a yes or no question. Could a president who ordered SEAL Team 6 to assassinate a political rival ... would he be subject to criminal prosecution?”

He replied: “Qualified yes – if he is impeached and convicted first.”

They even argued in SCOTUS that it could fall under "offical acts", and thus be immune.

Trump Lawyer Says Having Political Rival Killed Could Constitute ‘Official’ Presidential Act

When asked by Justice Sonya Sotomayor during arguments on Thursday if the president deciding “that his rival is a corrupt person and he orders the military — or he orders someone to assassinate him” would constitute an official act subject to immunity, attorney D. John Sauer said it could.

“It would depend on the hypothetical but we can see that could well be an official act,” Sauer told the court.

In another hypothetical, Justice Elena Kagan asked if the president would be immune from prosecution if he sold nuclear secrets to a foreign adversary. Sauer affirmed that the sale was an “official act” the president would need to first be impeached and convicted before he could be prosecuted.

Sauer also claimed under questioning that a president could theoretically be immune from prosecution if he carried out — or attempted to carry out — a coup against the government.

“Let’s say this president ordered the military to stage a coup. He’s no longer president. He wasn’t impeached, he couldn’t be impeached, but he ordered the military to stage a coup, and you’re saying that’s an official act?” Justice Elena Kagan asked.

“I think it would depend on the circumstances whether it was an official act,” Sauer responded. “If it’s an official act, there needs to be impeachment and conviction before [criminal charges could be pursued].

They keep saying it as clear as day, so I don't understand why people think it's absurd to state that Trump's legal team and Trump himself view any sort of investigation as "political" when they keep saying that explicitly.

Trump's team has made it clear again and again what their position is. I would expect his supporters and those that are listening to his legal teams claims to believe when they state what their views are.

 

[Green Sun]

The amount of sealioning here is wild, really.

 

[BPPLEE]

And it's what Trump's lawyers are arguing.

When asked if a former president could be indicted for assassinating a political opponent while in office, his laywers said that that would not be possible unless Congress had impeached and removed him from office.

Trump attorney says presidents can’t be prosecuted for selling pardons or ordering murders



They even argued in SCOTUS that it could fall under "offical acts", and thus be immune.

Trump Lawyer Says Having Political Rival Killed Could Constitute ‘Official’ Presidential Act


They keep saying it as clear as day, so I don't understand why people think it's absurd to state that Trump's legal team and Trump himself view any sort of investigation as "political" when they keep saying that explicitly.

Trump's team has made it clear again and again what their position is. I would expect his supporters and those that are listening to his legal teams claims to believe when they state what their views are.

Don’t be giving Biden ideas. He may not understand what hypothetical means

 

[Green Sun]

Don’t be giving Biden ideas. He may not understand what hypothetical means

You can thank Trump and his legal team for putting it out there.

Glad we agree that that's what his team's arguing though - I assume since you didn't seem to feel the need about responding with any further detail, only giving some snarky remark, you agree with the fact that that is indeed Trump's legal argument. It being a hypothetical question does not reduce their belief in what they are saying.

If they don't believe that the president has that level of immunity, then they wouldn't be arguing that view in court, under oath.

 

[BPPLEE]

You can thank Trump and his legal team for putting it out there.

Glad we agree that that's what his team's arguing though - I assume since you didn't seem to feel the need about responding with any further detail, only giving some snarky remark, you agree with the fact that that is indeed Trump's legal argument. It being a hypothetical question does not reduce their belief in what they are saying.

If they don't believe that the president has that level of immunity, then they wouldn't be arguing that in court, under oath.

It sounds like a procedural problem being pointed out .

 

[Green Sun]

It sounds like a procedural problem being pointed out .

The judge and the Supreme Court Justices are asking questions to understand what Trump's legal team position is on how far the immunity he and his team claim the president has goes.

His team claim that it is absolute, and can only be voided through impeachment and removal - So no impeachment and removal means no charges or investigation can be brought.

So, yes, the legal argument that Trump's lawyers are giving results in "Biden could assassinate Trump, and since that was an act he would take as President, thus Biden could not be held accountable unless impeached and removed from office first."

That's what absolute immunity entails - It would cover any action taken, no matter what. So they ask an extreme example, and Trump's team must be consistent in their claims, so assassination is covered under their view.

 

[stevevw]

The verdict is in. We now witnessing history. The first man to be elected President a felon

Please........

Make your excuses. Spout your conspiracy theories. Tell us how this makes him an even better candidate. Also comment on what sentencing will look like. Between his outbursts, his contempt of court flirtations, his addressing the jury when that's a no-no. What I want to hear about most is how corrupt the judge was when he was found guilty by a jury of his peers......

After you justify all of his felonies and inform us of the corruption of his judge and the court system in general. Let us know about the same courts' fairness as it relates to race because every known statistic shows the disparity. When you do that, please explain why this is a corrupt court and the courts that have created a disparity between blacks and whites when it comes to pulling citizens over, convicting at a higher rate, charging higher bail, and not approving bail as often as whites, and longer sentences for black who are in the same legal situation as whites and are convicted of the same or similar crimes.

Can't wait to hear from you.

I'm not from the US and I think this whole thing is a circus. I have watched over the years the corruption within governments. We have seen how the system is rigged. The problem I see and from what I have been hearing it seems a lot of minorities are relating to Trumps targeting for political purposes and see this an an example of a rigged system. I think this will actually work in Trumps favor.

I think the main message coming out of all this is big brother interference and they see that as a greater wrong than what Trump has done. They know that Trump is not the only polititian who is corrupt. They know that there are Trump like deals done behind closed doors. Its just they are more clever in covering it up. Everyone knows the system is corrupt.

 

[BCP1928]

Oh boy, that doesn't sound like the first thing I expect to hear from a good Christian.

As the Christian Right defines it these days they are good Christians and you are not. When Trump gets in they will be able to put some muscle behind that determination. And I say "when" because I truly believe that these Christians are prepared to put him in by force if he is not elected.

 

[BCP1928]

I'm not from the US and I think this whole thing is a circus. I have watched over the years the corruption within governments. We have seen how the system is rigged. The problem I see and from what I have been hearing it seems a lot of minorities are relating to Trumps targeting for political purposes and see this an an example of a rigged system. I think this will actually work in Trumps favor.

Of course it will--he's counting on it.

I think the main message coming out of all this is big brother interference and they see that as a greater wrong than what Trump has done. They know that Trump is not the only polititian who is corrupt. They know that there are Trump like deals done behind closed doors. Its just they are more clever in covering it up. Everyone knows the system is corrupt.

Catch them if you can.

 

[probinson]

I'm not from the US and I think this whole thing is a circus. I have watched over the years the corruption within governments. We have seen how the system is rigged. The problem I see and from what I have been hearing it seems a lot of minorities are relating to Trumps targeting for political purposes and see this an an example of a rigged system. I think this will actually work in Trumps favor.

I think the main message coming out of all this is big brother interference and they see that as a greater wrong than what Trump has done. They know that Trump is not the only polititian who is corrupt. They know that there are Trump like deals done behind closed doors. Its just they are more clever in covering it up. Everyone knows the system is corrupt.

You hit the nail square on the head:

Prosecutors Got Trump — But They Also Contorted the Law

The Manhattan jury was thrown into a Frankenstein’s monster of a case.

nymag.com

 

[stevevw]

Of course it will--he's counting on it.

Thats the thing, he's not stupid in that sense. Its almost like a Hollywood drama from where I'm sitting lol. The US presidency between a senile old man and a crooked man lol.

But I thing its left a bad taste in peoples mouths that the system can go after a person, a political opponent and take them out. That is what I think has struck a chord and people are almost willing to overlook Trumps indescretion and be more mad about those who manipulate the system using their power.

We all know polititians get up to stuff and we have tended to accept that as part and parcel that people, men especially in power get up to mischief. From John Kennedy and his affairs, Obama's dirty little secrets, Clintons escapades, Bush dirty deals. Even Biden seems to have sskeltons in the closet.

But I think what p***** people ooff the most is hypocracy. Is using the system to take a rival out. I can see that this was not just about Trumps behaviour. The way it was rushed, the way people were working night and day to find something, to make it stick.

I'm not saying Trump is an angle, certainly not. But it seems that what you see is what you get with Trump warts and all. He knows people know he has messed around. Many polititians have had secret affairs or had sex with some intern or prostitue or done some shady deal. They have just been better at hiding it and the people know this.

That is what I think sticks in many peoples craw that they know the very people who went out of their way to get Trump have done the same and that they have used this to shut down an opponent who threatened to take their power. They relate because that same system has been taking their power for years.

Catch them if you can.

But thats the thing. People eventually get caught as we have seen with stuff coming out about X presidents and others in power. That goes in the memory bank and that is why people have generally stopped trusting polititians and they see that they are in it for money and to hold onto power. Its not about the people but themselves.

That is why I think Trump is popular because unlike polititians he is a business and street person first who happen to dabble in politics. We have seen this trend where people have been rejecting main parties and voting in Independents and smaller fringe parties. It seems whether by design or luck Trump has tapped into something people relate to.

I can see the Left exploiting this. I think the memes making Trump into a felon will last around a couple of weeks and then people will begin to get sick of it. The more the Left uses it the more it will begin to represent hypocracy because the voters are not stupid and know when something is being exploited for political reasons.

The more the Left try to make themselves out to be on higher moral ground the more people will turn off. It may even pushpeople towards Trump because at the end of the day they will have a choice between two bad options. It just a case of which they think is worse. I don't think many see Trumps descresions as major but they do see the abuse of power as worse as many have experienced it themselves.

What this will do is decend US politics into the gutter and may even create some sort of conflict in the streets. Identity politics has polarised people and hieghtened their feelings. Now polititians will be digging up dirt on each other and its going to be a s*** fight. It may even decend into violence.

What the Left have to worry about now I think is whether its Trump or another candidate they will tap into this sentiment and its like a free ride to an election win. If they put up a clean skin riding off the back of Trumps common man approach then the Left will lose for sure. If Trump goes ahead and still maintains his support and even increases it I would not be surprised if someone tries to take him out. I think things are getting that desperate.