Guilt!!!

[New Creation]

I went to that site Gentle Christian Mothers and it seems like a really amazing place - they all practise grace based discipline- but...

You're not even allowed to TALK about your baby crying it out to sleep and well, that's what I do so I am a rotten selfish mother apparently.

I nurse Meaghan (10 months) before bed every night and she gets drowsy and I put her to sleep in her crib in her room which is directly off of ours. I usually put her down by 7:30. For the longest time she would just roll over and go right to sleep but my folks came here for two weeks and it totally messed up her schedule.
We are just getting back on it and she has been crying when I put her to bed. My husband won't let me get her after she cries because he says that she will just keep doing it. If I stay in the room and try to do the "put your hand on her back soothe her" thing, she sits up and riles herself all up. I have found that she calms down better if I just leave. She usually does not cry longer than 5-10 minutes and it is not her "real" cry. If she goes longer than an hour (has happened 3-4 times total in her life) then I tell him that she needs to be nursed to calm down and go to sleep. and I do and she does.

Anyway, the thing is, I feel awful after going to that site - like I'm really messing up here- I never sleep-shared- I was always too afraid of rolling on her. To get her to go to sleep on her own initially, I basically did the cry it out method for three nights. That's all it took until she would sleep after putting her down.
These women at GCM stay up like HOURS with their babies. One of them is still nursing at 3.5 yrs and hey, if it works for you, great but that's never going to happen in my household. I am torn between admiration and disbelief. My husband would never go for that. And I have to be honest. He and I only get that time at night together and we need it. She needs to go to bed for this to happen.
Am I selfish? What kind of mother am I? Can I get some honest input here?

 

[GolfingMom]

I think you're doing fine.
I visited that sight and left. It was just not for me.
YOU know your child and what works in your house. YOU do what YOU need to!
I don't think you are being selfish from what I've read either.
HUGS

 

[JustBeachy]

NOT selfish. Sounds like you are doing your best to have routine in your household, and that is very important. It takes a little work to reestablish that routine when it is disrupted, but these things happen throughout childhood. You're being a great mom! YOU know your child better than anyone else and you know what works in your family. It's important to have balance in a home...my daughter and I have a very close bond, without co-sleeping and without me being devoted to carrying her everywhere I go. Not saying those that do are wrong, just that there are different ways to being a succesful parent, and you don't need to feel like you are ruining your child for not doing those things! Unfortunately, many Christian parents adhere to 'thou shalt not judge' until it comes to different parenting tactics. Sorry you had a negative experience on that website. Sounds like they have a lot of wonderful advice, but ultimately it is your decision what to keep and what to discard.
btw, I read your testimony- wow!

 

[Kazamataz]

Your not selfish at all!

(In fact I'm going out on a limb here and may upset some people but thats life.)

I really belive your doing exactly what your meant to do.

Babies need to learn that your not just going to pick them up everytime they cry. They need to learn how to self settle, you can not make your life all about them.

If all your doing is giving in to them and doing what they want, when they want. Your just teaching them how to be selfish self centered people.

And if you continued to give into them (which alot of people do) they'll grow up to be............ (can't say the words but you know what i'm getting at people)
......................thats nobody wants to have anything to do with.

Now don't get me wrong here i'm not saying that means you should leave your child to cry for hours and hours in fact the method that your using (controlled crying)
is clear that you should let them cry for 10mins then go back in give them a pat soothe them and then walk out again.
If they cry again then leave them for an other 10mins and repeat the process.

It's a highly successful method, we usually only have to go back in 2 or 3 times to settle our little one. We do sometimes get the nights when he'll just cry and cry for an hour or so and we have to keep going back in but this has only happened a couple of times.

Lastly I just want to say don't ever let anyone make you feel guilty for being who you are. God has given you this child because He knows your the best person for the job.
Nobody can parent your children like you can. If you weren't up for the task God would never have given you a bubs in the first place. I'm sure your an awesome mum and i know that God see this and He will bless you for it.

 

[RoseofLima]

Life lesson- Take what you can use and leave the rest... God gave us intellect as one of the great gifts of His chief creatures, using that intellect is a good thing.

That said- I don't stay up hours with my baby AND I don't let him CIO...it all has to do with the baby and his or her temperment. Andrew wakes once a night to nurse after sleeping about 8-10 hours. My husband and I still get to spend lots and lots of time together without taking care of children. We still are physically intimate every couple of days and watch lots of movies (which I can do while nursing bab to sleep) and play lots of card and board games( again which I can do while nursing baby to sleep). I have to tell you that most women on there would likely write that if you feel your baby settles better on her own- then you are following her lead.

I think it is damaging to children to be left alone to cry for long, repeated stretches of time. I beleve that the scientific evidence supports that view strongly. However- in there are the realities of our lives--and a place where we need to balance the needs of everyone in the family.

I wouldn't knock extended breastfeeding- the world wide average age of weaning is between 3 and 4 years of age (and the includes the pitiful average age of weaning in AMerica). It doesn't work for a lot of families in America, because of social and monetary constraints--but is certainly not abnormal by any means. The World Health Organization recommends breastfeeding for a minimum of two years. However, again - real life floats around in the midst of all of these facts- and you ultimately just have to rationally make the decisions that are right for you as a family.

One of the things that I have learned that differentiates me from many of the women I meet at LLL is that I am in charge- I am the leader of my children and manager of my home. I am not child led- but rather sensitive to the real and true needs of my children and make decisions accordingly. To me there is a subtle difference there-- but I am also a much more experienced and confident mom than I was when my oldest was little. What I find, even on sites like GCM-- is that moms that have older children and more children tend to understand that parenting isn't dogmatic. You do what works with the authority you have been given by God- and try to mirror HIm in your mercy and compassion and service to least among us.

 

[RoseofLima]

Also just for the record- I do always pick my children up when they are crying as babies.(There is a difference for me between a whimper and a cry). And I do have them in arms (or on me) nearly the entire time they are awake before they are mobile. I always ask them if the want me to sit with them when they are crying as older children or if they want to be by themselves.

I feel like my job isn't to stop my kids frm crying, but to be with them as they cry and work through big emotions. I kind of see my job as an emotions midwife.

My older children are not selfish--at all (other than the occassional age appropriate issue). They are in fact very selfless and empathetic towards each other, their peers, other adults and even strangers in need.

I just wanted to add that in here- since the opposite idea was put forward, as a counter balance

 

[tessas212]

Do please excuse the intrusion. I am no mother of a child, but have only my dogs that I have raised in comparison. But with babysitting children and having raised and trained my own dogs, there truly is so many similarities. Through raising my own dogs, we have to do this as well. You put the young pup in its crate for hte night and you do NOT let it out. If you do, they will learn to cry harder and longer until you give in again. Once you do, now the DOG is in control and you are no longer the "parent". Now you are the object that gives them whatever they want.

You are doing exactly the right thing. A child needs consistency and rules, even from the start. In fact, if anything I would be the one to say THOSE mothers are the ones that are doing the wrong thing. A child needs love, but love alone without consistency and discipline is going to turn them into a little brat that doesn't understand the importance of patience and the lesson that life truly isn't fair; you don't always get what you want.

 

[MyaShane]

The fact that you’re even worried about this shows that you’re a good, caring mother. I am a firm believer in letting them cry it out a little as long as it’s obvious that they are not in pain, don’t get themselves too upset, or it doesn’t carry on for an extended amount of time. Babies do learn to soothe themselves and that’s a very important thing for them to learn.
Focus on what works for your family not what others are telling you to do. What works for someone else is not always the best solution for you.
The best advice I was given was from my mother who told me to accept all of the advice from everyone graciously, but that at 2am it was me there with the baby not all of the advice givers; so I should do what I felt was best for my baby – and it has worked wonderfully! As long as your baby is healthly, happy, loved, etc. you’re doing absolutely nothing wrong!

 

[Kazamataz]

Also just for the record- I do always pick my children up when they are crying as babies.(There is a difference for me between a whimper and a cry). And I do have them in arms (or on me) nearly the entire time they are awake before they are mobile. I always ask them if the want me to sit with them when they are crying as older children or if they want to be by themselves.

I feel like my job isn't to stop my kids frm crying, but to be with them as they cry and work through big emotions. I kind of see my job as an emotions midwife.

My older children are not selfish--at all (other than the occassional age appropriate issue). They are in fact very selfless and empathetic towards each other, their peers, other adults and even strangers in need.

I just wanted to add that in here- since the opposite idea was put forward, as a counter balance

I think your mis-interperating what I said.

I said that people who get into the habit of giving into there children ALL the time create selfish self centered people.

Going and comforting your baby is not going to create a selfish child.

However if you let your children have what they want when they want it whenever they want it that creates selfish people.

I'm talking about contiuning the habit when they are 4, 10, 15, 21 years of age.

Also There is a difference between leaving your child cry for hours and hours and controlled crying.

when your using controlled crying you shouldn't leave your bubs to cry for longer than 10 mins. after the 10 you go in and comfort them meaning give them a pat, a cuddle, whatever soothes them. once they've calmed down then put them back down and if they cry again then only leave them 10mins.

So i really don't see how your points and mine are THAT different?

 

[jgonz]

I have also visited the Gentle Christian Mother's website and felt guilty. But for different reasons. I think that it's a normal thing to feel "mommy guilt" because we are ALWAYS questioning Everything we do... because our babies/children are ALWAYS changing and we are constantly having to Experiment!

It's completely Frustrating to read someone else's post and come away with the feeling that they've "arrived" and know what they're doing. What I have to do is remind myself that No one knows Exactly what they're doing... every baby is Completely different... so many different personalities... what works best for one baby/child doesn't work for another... and who knows how many Other things that poster is dealing with that she hasn't shared? (or Can't share because of posting regulations on that site.)

The advice of "take what works for you" that was given already was good. I'd like to add, "take what Might ever work for you in the future". Tuck that info away in your head, and experiment later if you need to (because you will need to eventually. )

 

[Robinsegg]

There's a woman who wrote a whole book on it! Motherhood: The Guilt That Keeps on Giving
Okay, seriously, give yourself a break! Remember, none of those women has your child, lives in your home, or even knows you or your family. Things that work in one situation often don't work in another, even trying to transfer methods between siblings is often a huge disaster!

If it's working for you, keep it up! "If it ain't broke, don't fix it".

Rachel

 

[Beth1231]

When I first visited GCM over a year ago, it made me angry for lots of reasons. I hated that I had to agree not to discuss certain things in order to register. But after a year of visiting the site, reading the threads and getting to know the very imperfect moms, I see if differently. The site is unique in that it's a refuge from the places that allow debate. Some of those moms really feel beat up (and yes, sometimes guiltly) about the flak they are getting from friends and family that dont' agree with their methods. GCM is a place they can feel refreshed and supported, hence the "you can't debate certain things" rule.
And not all of the moms agree with every single GCM ideal. Some don't co-sleep, do extended bfing, use cloth diapers or nurse to sleep. There is a wide variety and I just try to keep an open mind and learn what I can. I hope you'll come back and give it a few more chances That site has been instrumental in softening my heart on some very personal issues from my childhood.

 

[JulySheMustFly]

I can certainly relate but that is how I felt after going to a variety of other parenting sites. I do not do many of the things that other moms on GCM do but I have not yet felt condemned for the choices I have made like not bfding my last child. It has been very supportive place for me to be a little more vulnerable. I also like knowing that when I ask a question like how to get my son to stop hitting his sisters I'm not going to get an answer like give him a swat on the bottom.

In the end you know your child and your lifestyle. What may work perfectly, or at least seemingly so, may not even work for the next child that comes in that same family. You take what you think might work for you and leave the rest for someone else.

 

[New Creation]

I have also visited the Gentle Christian Mother's website and felt guilty. But for different reasons. I think that it's a normal thing to feel "mommy guilt" because we are ALWAYS questioning Everything we do... because our babies/children are ALWAYS changing and we are constantly having to Experiment!

It's completely Frustrating to read someone else's post and come away with the feeling that they've "arrived" and know what they're doing. What I have to do is remind myself that No one knows Exactly what they're doing... every baby is Completely different... so many different personalities... what works best for one baby/child doesn't work for another... and who knows how many Other things that poster is dealing with that she hasn't shared? (or Can't share because of posting regulations on that site.)

The advice of "take what works for you" that was given already was good. I'd like to add, "take what Might ever work for you in the future". Tuck that info away in your head, and experiment later if you need to (because you will need to eventually. )

You are one very clever woman.

Thank you to all of you ladies for responding. I truly do feel better about things now and I will go back to GCM and take what I need. But not right away.

Thanks also to Leanna who PMed me at length because I forgot to leave the thread {open}.

 

[lin1235]

I've been active on the GCM website for a few months and I love it. I have let my baby cry it out once before and I feel horrible about it - and did before I joined GCM so maybe my mindset is a little more like theirs. But I'm not a typical GCM mom; we don't cosleep, my baby feeds more or less on a schedule, I work outside the home and so on, and I never get any guilt trips from other moms. One of the other very active moms there stopped breastfeeding at (I think) 8 weeks and I've never seen her criticised for it.

Anyway, all that just to say, the rules may be strict but I think it's to help the moms who struggle to break away from certain habits. So for example you're not allowed to discuss the benefits of spanking, because a number of moms there used to spank their kids and want to stop but still find themselves defaulting to spanking when they're angry or frustrated. And a discussion about how spanking is good can make them relapse into a spanking mindset.

Most moms there are really kind and non-judgemental; I'm sorry you didn't find it like that!

 

[RoseofLima]

I think your mis-interperating what I said.

I said that people who get into the habit of giving into there children ALL the time create selfish self centered people.

Going and comforting your baby is not going to create a selfish child.

However if you let your children have what they want when they want it whenever they want it that creates selfish people.

I'm talking about contiuning the habit when they are 4, 10, 15, 21 years of age.

Also There is a difference between leaving your child cry for hours and hours and controlled crying.

when your using controlled crying you shouldn't leave your bubs to cry for longer than 10 mins. after the 10 you go in and comfort them meaning give them a pat, a cuddle, whatever soothes them. once they've calmed down then put them back down and if they cry again then only leave them 10mins.

So i really don't see how your points and mine are THAT different?

I think it's that I do not view picking up a crying baby as 'giving in' to a child. Being permissive in regards to behaviour is very different to me than accepting my child's unhappiness and being with them through it.

I think we both steadfastly agree that permissive parenting = BAD

 

[DonnaB]

We pretty much parent like Rose described, so I won't share that--just ditto! I will say, though, that there are times when the best thing for you is the best thing for your child. When DD was 6 mo old and DH and I went to a party, I gave DD a bottle of (gasp) formula because I wanted to indulge in a glass of wine. Another mom at the party, whose son actually had the same birthday, made several rude comments about the formula. I felt sooo guilty and DH gave me the above pep talk.

I'm sorry you felt judged at GCM. I lurk there but geenrally feel like I'm not up to snuff there either, so I get what you're saying. We are AP, non-CIO, organic, etc, etc family, yet I feel guilty at GCM because we use pampers instead of cloth and DD weaned herself at 11 months. Us moms need to stick together because mommyhood is just plain hard and there is always someone who does it "better".

One thing that worked for us at that age was to go in and hold DD for 1-2 minutes, swayng her gently and then we'd lay her down. I never let her cry more than 1-2 minutes and she'd doze off after one or two visits. We co-slept until DD was about 8 months and we realized we were keeping her awake, lol! (DH snores very loudly.) Anyway, the method we used worked very well for us, she was reassured and soothed, yet she'd fall asleep on her own.

 

[New Creation]

I've been active on the GCM website for a few months and I love it. I have let my baby cry it out once before and I feel horrible about it - and did before I joined GCM so maybe my mindset is a little more like theirs. But I'm not a typical GCM mom; we don't cosleep, my baby feeds more or less on a schedule, I work outside the home and so on, and I never get any guilt trips from other moms. One of the other very active moms there stopped breastfeeding at (I think) 8 weeks and I've never seen her criticised for it.

Anyway, all that just to say, the rules may be strict but I think it's to help the moms who struggle to break away from certain habits. So for example you're not allowed to discuss the benefits of spanking, because a number of moms there used to spank their kids and want to stop but still find themselves defaulting to spanking when they're angry or frustrated. And a discussion about how spanking is good can make them relapse into a spanking mindset.

Most moms there are really kind and non-judgemental; I'm sorry you didn't find it like that!

Just want to clarify that I didn't find the moms judgemental at all. I've only posted once so far! I just felt like I couldn't "measure up" since I'm not doing so many of the things that most of them seem to be doing.

 

[New Creation]

We pretty much parent like Rose described, so I won't share that--just ditto! I will say, though, that there are times when the best thing for you is the best thing for your child. When DD was 6 mo old and DH and I went to a party, I gave DD a bottle of (gasp) formula because I wanted to indulge in a glass of wine. Another mom at the party, whose son actually had the same birthday, made several rude comments about the formula. I felt sooo guilty and DH gave me the above pep talk.

Good for your hubby! That's great!

I'm sorry you felt judged at GCM. I lurk there but geenrally feel like I'm not up to snuff there either, so I get what you're saying. We are AP, non-CIO, organic, etc, etc family, yet I feel guilty at GCM because we use pampers instead of cloth and DD weaned herself at 11 months. Us moms need to stick together because mommyhood is just plain hard and there is always someone who does it "better". .

You are a sweetheart. thank you for expressing yourself so honestly. That's what it is there- I don't feel up to snuff and not sure that we're ever going to snuff up! I mean, I tried cloth diapering for HALF A DAY, I kid you not. In the end, I gave all those cloth diapers away and I'm happy with my decision to keep Meg in disposables.

One thing that worked for us at that age was to go in and hold DD for 1-2 minutes, swayng her gently and then we'd lay her down. I never let her cry more than 1-2 minutes and she'd doze off after one or two visits. We co-slept until DD was about 8 months and we realized we were keeping her awake, lol! (DH snores very loudly.) Anyway, the method we used worked very well for us, she was reassured and soothed, yet she'd fall asleep on her own.

I was kind of freaked out since Meg was so out of her routine but she is falling back into it nicely. I nurse her drowsy and put her down; then she cries for 1-2 minutes and nods off. I can live with that even though leaving her that way is not my favourite thing to do.

Meg has been quarantined from other babies for three weeks because my mother had shingles when she was here. Tomorrow is her first day back into the social baby world! Hooray!

 

[AutumnDreamer]

Do you really want honest input? Do I think you are a bad mom? No, but you have obviously had some reservations about doing things this way, otherwise you wouldn't feel guilt. People can not make other people feel emotion, emotions are a choice you make. I never let my kids cry it out, I couldn't do it. My youngest child slept with us until she was 4. This was a choice we made. GCM is a site based on those choices, asking new people not to talk about certain things is not always b/c they are looking down on you, part of it is to avoid heated debates and arguments. You made a choice to raise your child a certain way, it is not about bad or good, it is about you and your child. People may not agree with you, many people I come in contact with look at me like I grew a new head when I mention something about co sleeping, it happens on both sides. So if you are feeling guilt you need to figure out why, is it b/c you are not happy with the way you are raising your daughter, or is it b/c you are too worried about other people affirming your choices?