• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

  • CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.

Guardians of Science...

Is there a link between birds an dinosaur?

  • No, there is no evidence

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Not sure/can't decide

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    23

joshua 1 9

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
May 11, 2015
17,420
3,593
Northern Ohio
✟314,607.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Frighteningly disappointing and boring if true.
Exactly, even if there was no God with intelligence and abilities greater then mankind, we would still have to invent one. Hope can be a powerful force and hopelessness can lead to despair.
 
Upvote 0

Hieronymus

Well-Known Member
Jan 12, 2016
8,428
3,005
54
the Hague NL
✟84,932.00
Country
Netherlands
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Exactly, even if there was no God with intelligence and abilities greater then mankind, we would still have to invent one. Hope can be a powerful force and hopelessness can lead to despair.
But isn't it a strange kind of hope, hoping your existence will not end forever, while we see all our fellow mammals dying terminally.
Even when life is horrible, people don't want to stop it, but cling to some hope for a solution.
 
Upvote 0

Hieronymus

Well-Known Member
Jan 12, 2016
8,428
3,005
54
the Hague NL
✟84,932.00
Country
Netherlands
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Why would it have to be in one event??
It was a curse of some sorts. But no indication of how fast this change was.
But maybe they will find the genes that have to be either switched on or off to have a plant grow thorns or not.
 
Upvote 0

joshua 1 9

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
May 11, 2015
17,420
3,593
Northern Ohio
✟314,607.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
But isn't it a strange kind of hope, hoping your existence will not end forever, while we see all our fellow mammals dying terminally.
Even when life is horrible, people don't want to stop it, but cling to some hope for a solution.
I never thought about that, but perhaps that is something that makes us different then the animals.
 
Upvote 0

Hieronymus

Well-Known Member
Jan 12, 2016
8,428
3,005
54
the Hague NL
✟84,932.00
Country
Netherlands
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
I never thought about that, but perhaps that is something that makes us different then the animals.
Actually that would be the question a child may ask:
"What happens when you die?"
And wondering about the purpose of it all, when grandma dies..

It seems this is where people divide in 2 views:
1 - Physical death is the terminal end of your existence.
2 - There will be something to consciously experience after physical death.
 
Upvote 0

joshua 1 9

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
May 11, 2015
17,420
3,593
Northern Ohio
✟314,607.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
It seems this is where people divide in 2 views:
1 - Physical death is the terminal end of your existence.
2 - There will be something to consciously experience after physical death.
If people have a choice then perhaps they base their choice on what they find the most comfort with. For some it is a comfort that they will see their loved ones again. For others perhaps it is a comfort when they die that is the end of it and they no longer exist.
 
Upvote 0

Jay Follett

Well-Known Member
Mar 6, 2016
498
204
53
UK
✟1,705.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Agnostic
Marital Status
Married
Why would science need to explain mythical creatures?
Because it would explain how Mohammed rode a winged horse up to heaven, if you can't explain it then it must have happened, and while we're at it how do you explain Jesus walking on water? you can't can you? :doh:
 
Upvote 0

Ophiolite

Recalcitrant Procrastinating Ape
Nov 12, 2008
9,331
10,206
✟289,195.00
Country
United Kingdom
Faith
Agnostic
Marital Status
Private
Exactly, even if there was no God with intelligence and abilities greater then mankind, we would still have to invent one. Hope can be a powerful force and hopelessness can lead to despair.
I was hoping more for super intelligent antelopes from the Andromeda galaxy. :)
 
Upvote 0

Jay Follett

Well-Known Member
Mar 6, 2016
498
204
53
UK
✟1,705.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Agnostic
Marital Status
Married
Exactly, even if there was no God with intelligence and abilities greater then mankind, we would still have to invent one..
Where do you think all the Gods throughout the world came from in the first place? man invented them to protect themselves from the forces of nature.
 
Upvote 0

PsychoSarah

Chaotic Neutral
Jan 13, 2014
20,522
2,609
✟102,963.00
Gender
Female
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
In Relationship
But isn't it a strange kind of hope, hoping your existence will not end forever, while we see all our fellow mammals dying terminally.
Even when life is horrible, people don't want to stop it, but cling to some hope for a solution.
I don't view it as strange; we understand death is inevitable, and have the capacity to imagine a way out. So, why wouldn't we? Pretty much why we come up with myths and legends that "explain" the world is to alleviate fear and despair
 
Upvote 0

PsychoSarah

Chaotic Neutral
Jan 13, 2014
20,522
2,609
✟102,963.00
Gender
Female
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
In Relationship
Actually that would be the question a child may ask:
"What happens when you die?"
And wondering about the purpose of it all, when grandma dies..

It seems this is where people divide in 2 views:
1 - Physical death is the terminal end of your existence.
2 - There will be something to consciously experience after physical death.
I would argue that reincarnation doesn't fully belong to either category, because some component of your being continues to exist, but a key part of what makes you who you are, your memories, do not.
 
Upvote 0

Jay Follett

Well-Known Member
Mar 6, 2016
498
204
53
UK
✟1,705.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Agnostic
Marital Status
Married
we understand death is inevitable, and have the capacity to imagine a way out.
Yes but how does a sane person make themselves believe something they know is not true? what damage must we do to our brains to get ourselves to believe something like that? people would end up talking to themselves, wait.....
 
Upvote 0

PsychoSarah

Chaotic Neutral
Jan 13, 2014
20,522
2,609
✟102,963.00
Gender
Female
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
In Relationship
Yes but how does a sane person make themselves believe something they know is not true?
They don't. Much like the theist that states "all atheists secretly believe", you are wrong in assuming that somewhere, deep down, no one believes. They don't feel as if the afterlife is impossible or even unlikely.


what damage must we do to our brains to get ourselves to believe something like that? people would end up talking to themselves, wait.....
You act as if atheism can't have negative effects on some people psychologically. How many atheists do you know that go through a nihilist phase compared to theist, because to me, it seems slightly unbalanced. Not that every atheist has that problem, but I see it in a lot more atheists than theists.
 
Upvote 0

Jay Follett

Well-Known Member
Mar 6, 2016
498
204
53
UK
✟1,705.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Agnostic
Marital Status
Married
They don't. Much like the theist that states "all atheists secretly believe", you are wrong in assuming that somewhere, deep down, no one believes. They don't feel as if the afterlife is impossible or even unlikely.
I know they have convinced themselves that they believe that's obvious, however it's difficult for someone who knows anything to get their head around a fairy tale like life after death, they obviously do not know what death is and what it does to our bodies, we are animals just like all the other animals and I guess believers wouldn't say every animal was going to have an after life would they? wishful think is all it is.
You act as if atheism can't have negative effects on some people psychologically. How many atheists do you know that go through a nihilist phase compared to theist, because to me, it seems slightly unbalanced. Not that every atheist has that problem, but I see it in a lot more atheists than theists.
I want to live forever, can I say it more clearly than that? it's why there are and have been so many gods created over the years, but just because I want something means absolutely nothing to reality and real life, I can want until the cows come home and it will get me no where, death is the end for all things that live.
 
Upvote 0

PsychoSarah

Chaotic Neutral
Jan 13, 2014
20,522
2,609
✟102,963.00
Gender
Female
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
In Relationship
I know they have convinced themselves that they believe that's obvious,
I don't think one has to force oneself to be convinced that there is an afterlife. In fact, I would go as far as to say we have a natural inclination towards thinking that. I mean, gosh darn it, I used to believe in an afterlife because of watching the show Ghosthunters. Freaking Ghosthunters! I wish I was joking, but I'm not. What a sorry reason for a 14 year old to believe in life after death, yeesh. But, at the time, I didn't consider the possibility that it was all an act, these adults running scared from noises in the night, heck, in a few episodes, their clothes are grabbed on camera and you see them dragged a bit. It might have made it more convincing that a lot of episodes had "no paranormal activity", and they would explain away the noises as being produced by objects in the building, and very few had tons of it. Regardless, a pretty silly reason to believe in ghosts.

however it's difficult for someone who knows anything to get their head around a fairy tale like life after death,
It's technically not impossible that there is life after death, though I highly doubt that any religion reflects the reality if there is one. Personally, I think that even if there is one, the "physical us" has no part in it, and it is more of some ephemeral imprint left behind that eventually fades away, like some spiritual residue we leave behind wherever we go even while alive that tends to accumulate in places we spend a lot of time in or get highly emotional about.

they obviously do not know what death is and what it does to our bodies,
I have only encountered 1 person, theist or atheist, ever in my life that thought the afterlife was tied to our physical bodies and the atoms that once were us. Which I found to be ridiculous and countered completely. Other than that person, everyone on here gets that our bodies rot. For those that believe in an afterlife, who we are is not entirely tied to our physical bodies, so it doesn't matter.

we are animals just like all the other animals and I guess believers wouldn't say every animal was going to have an after life would they?
Actually, that's a point of contention. For example, the person with the username of "dad" believes that all living things have an afterlife when they die. However, AV1611 believes only humans do, if I recall correctly. Both of these men are YECs. I think even the more moderate theists aren't in agreement on the matter.

wishful think is all it is.I want to live forever, can I say it more clearly than that?
I really don't want to live forever, I just view it as preferable to the relatively short human lifespan. I mean, it would really suck to outlive the universe itself and just be kinda floating in nothingness for all of eternity. In fact, the lack of stimulation would drive a person insane pretty quickly. I can think of no worse hell than that. I want everything to keep going. Unlike some people, that contend that eventually, a person would do all there is to do (given enough time), I don't think it is actually possible to run out of things to do in a literal sense. If you read every book, write a new one. If you become a master of every game, invent one. That, and with others to interact with for all of eternity, I don't think I would get bored. The despair I feel isn't just for my own end, but that everything will end with enough time. The earth, all the planets and stars in the universe, and perhaps even the universe itself, will eventually be gone. You see, I am not only burdened by a mind that cannot handle death or find belief to help manage it, but I am also prone to looking ahead. Very, very, very far ahead, to the final countdown of recognizable existence. Knowing that I can do nothing about it gives me no sense of acceptance or peace, but a feeling of powerlessness and hopelessness that grows the longer I think about it.

it's why there are and have been so many gods created over the years, but just because I want something means absolutely nothing to reality and real life
I think those were created more to explain a world that, at the time, had processes without explanation that the people at the time lacked the tools to properly investigate. Our species doesn't like unknowns, in case you haven't noticed.

I can want until the cows come home and it will get me no where, death is the end for all things that live.
Unless you are one of those jellyfish that just revert back to a younger state when they get old. Gosh, jealous of a squishy, brainless creature; I think I may be nearing the "rock bottom" of my life. Obviously, I know that even those jellyfish will eventually die one way or another, but I often find myself wondering if I am happy that I was born human, or if I would have been better off being something like a tortoise. That is, not smart enough to have an existential crisis.
 
Upvote 0