Getting Giddy Over Pope Francis

[ArmyMatt]

Recent Popes also have seemed to love their celebrity too much for me as well. Another reason we Orthodox should be wary in my opinion

 

[gzt]

Well, isn't he special.

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

Yes. For me, if I were a Pope, the first thing that would be said would be, "too much is being made of me. You folks have made me a rock star. I'm here to speak the teachings of Mother Church, not create a cult of personality or seek personal glory. Please diminish me and maximize HE who sent me! Praise be Jesus Christ!"

And I'll at least say that Pope JP2 used his rock star gravitas to talk about ABORTION! He really talked up the culture of death and its dangers! He used his power and fame to topple communism in Europe, to keep the peace, and to try to foster love.

Benedict wasn't a very charismatic pope, not a real barn-burner, but at least the guy TRIED to clean up the horrendously B-A-D liturgy those poor folks suffer thought.

This current guy, Francis...ay yay yay. I'm just not impressed.

Recent Popes also have seemed to love their celebrity too much for me as well. Another reason we Orthodox should be wary in my opinion

 

[St Herman's Ghost]

Fr. John Whiteford on FB:

Christianity: The rich should give to the poor.
Socialism: The government should tax the rich and have dysfunctional programs that keep the poor... poor, but make liberals feel better about themselves.
Communism: The government should kill the rich, and redistribute their wealth... ostensibly to the poor, but really to party members, and those whom they favor.
Christianity is not socialism or communism.... and the Pope's a heretic.

That's like the crappiest definitions of Socialism and Communism I've ever heard of. I mean like really?

Capitalism: where you had better hope you come out of the right vagina or hit the lottery or you're screwed. Oh yeah, and be white, no coloreds.

 

[Cappadocious]

Fr. John Whiteford on FB:
Socialism: The government should tax the rich and have dysfunctional programs that keep the poor... poor, but make liberals feel better about themselves.

There's nothing more Christian than polemical misrepresentation.

 

[St Herman's Ghost]

Enjoy lol

 

[gzt]

That's like the crappiest definitions of Socialism and Communism I've ever heard of. I mean like really?

Capitalism: where you had better hope you come out of the right vagina or hit the lottery or you're screwed. Oh yeah, and be white, no coloreds.

It's also a bad definition of the Christian position. But this is all just par for the course for him.

 

[GregConstantine]

Still, the question remains unanswered, Why do we care about what the Pope says? Once again, we are not Roman Catholic. Why this strange fascination with this man who really hasn't said anything new?

Most of what the Pope says can be said by any ethical, upright person from any religion, heck, it can even be said by a secular atheist.

 

[Albion]

Fr. John Whiteford on FB:

Christianity: The rich should give to the poor.
Socialism: The government should tax the rich and have dysfunctional programs that keep the poor... poor, but make liberals feel better about themselves.
Communism: The government should kill the rich, and redistribute their wealth... ostensibly to the poor, but really to party members, and those whom they favor.
Christianity is not socialism or communism.... and the Pope's a heretic.

At the least, it would be:
Christianity: The rich should give to the poor.
Socialism: The government should steal from the rich, give some to the poor, and use some for itself.
Communism: The government should kill the rich, redistribute their wealth to those who promote the prestige of the government (which might be another way of saying "those whom they favor.") The poor remain poor.

 

[fat wee robin]

What I don't get is that Pope Francis has actually not said anything so ground breaking or novel. Everything I've heard him say that everyone gets all giddy about is basic Christian morality, do not judge, show compassion, feed the hungry, love your neighbor.

I mean, do people need to sit around and wait for someone to say those things before they start thinking about doing them? What does that say about them?

If he said anything groundbreaking in regards to the internal workings of the RCC, then good for them. But I hardly see what relevance that has for us Orthodox, unless he's putting a plan into motion to bring the RCC back to Orthodoxy. I'm really not seeing any reason for Orthodox to get all up in arms about the Pope. I don't mean any disrespect to the pope.

Well most Cathos like their spiritual diet, predigested .No struggling to find the truth ,no long hours reading, contemplating Just tell us what to do , they say .

If I found only a handful of original thinkers I'd go back ,but they are outside .

 

[fat wee robin]

More FB Pope stuff from Orthodox peeps:

Two post a link to an article entiled "Pope Francis: Preaching Jesus Means Fearlessly Moving Forward"

One writes on his profile "Papal Surprise" (dunno what that means)

Two links an article entitled "Pope Francis meets little sisters of the poor in quiet protest of obamacare"

Another links an article about St Silouan and says "I did not know that St Silouan was Russian in background. Interesting. Pope Francis reads his writings."

A link is provided to an article about how the OCA will be represented at Friday's Papal visit to ground zero

Could it be you don't have any POP stars in E.O. ?

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

Nonsense. With capitalism anyone has access to success. Doesn't matter your color or social circumstances. Study hard, focus on your studies, don't get anyone pregnant in high school and don't get a drug or alcohol problem, stay out of gangs and with the wrong crowds.....go to college and get loans and grants, get good job. OR....work small jobs while saving your money and come up with a great idea, loan, start business. Voila.

Plenty of people in the capitalist system succeed. Most who don't choose not to or use excuses of their neighborhood, skin color, or circumstances to stay and wallow in the food stamp welfare waters where they swim and swim.

My parents had very little money growing up. They were so broke half the time that we only ate out at restaurants once a month and any clothes I needed for school went on charge cards. My dad worked two jobs---Southern California Edison power company and with the Army Reserves. My mom worked part time. AND YET they scrimped and saved and paid for my entire college bill with zero loans. My family was broke. We never went anywhere until summer and even then we stayed in a tiny camper on the back of my dad's Ford truck! He drove the same 66 Ford truck (still does drive it!) and we'd keep cars for ten years at a time. My mom and I would have to dig under the couch cushions in the summer to find coins to go to Thrifty and get an ice cream. That was our "big moment" for the day.

My parents put me through college through sacrifice, scrimping, saving, and pinching pennies. They had a dream for me to graduate college...AND I DID! Now I'm a teacher, I make a respectable salary. I have benefits, a pension, and some comfort.

My wife came DIRT POOR from the Philippines! She came to the U.S. with zero!!!! My wedding ring that she bought for me cost $100!!!! She grew up half the time without electricity and sometimes no gas or lights! She had to put herself through college in the Philippines working while going to school.

My wife comes to America, is an amazing mom, goes to school at nights, becomes a nurse.

So my parents, when I was growing up, made around $30,000 a year!!! Then at the HEIGHT of my parents' working when I was in college they made $42,000!!! That's it. That's the ceiling they reached. My wife and I make a combined $130,000. Progress!!

I hope my kids do even better! My kids go to a private school because I'm sacrificing $1,400 per month so they can get the best education they can have. The goal is for them to outdo us!

We don't need the government running our lives to be successful. We need sacrifice, hard work, belief in ourselves, faith in God, hope, and determination. Throwing $$$$ at people and the welfare state doesn't work worth beans.

And with regard to the color of your skin----I have plenty of Mexican friends who make more money than I do! My best friend is a highway patrolman. His parents came here broke from Mexico in the 1950's...BROWN SKIN AND ALL! He makes $100,000 a year to my $75,000. His wife, also Mexican, makes around $80,000. My wife's Filipino friends, mostly nurses and doctors, are loaded. Brown skin. How did Dr. Ben Carson become a rich, successful neurologist? His skin seems a touch dark?

Capitalism is heavily flawed. Any Earthly system is! I'd prefer Chesterton's distributism model, but it's quite unrealistic and a pipe dream in many ways, but if I have to choose between freedom and capitalism and the tyranny of the government running my life, it's a no-brainer.

This pope spooks me. Growing up in liberation theology-rich South America is NOT a strength imho!

That's like the crappiest definitions of Socialism and Communism I've ever heard of. I mean like really?

Capitalism: where you had better hope you come out of the right vagina or hit the lottery or you're screwed. Oh yeah, and be white, no coloreds.

 

[fat wee robin]

Right then, well all I will say about that is I pray for you and I don't understand how anyone calling themselves Orthodox could go around talking about HAH like that.

Moving forward, what's so wrong with liberation theology anyway? Maybe it's just because I'm an Anarchist but I don't get what's wrong with that. Or why when we have a bishop who rejects the gold cross in favor of simple metal, who rejects congressman and sups with the homeless, and just get all hipstery and hostile about it? Why? If there is a influential leader, religious or secular, who speaks for the people whom Christ spoke of more than anything else, the poor, the sick, and so on, why hate? Do we not pray for the captives each and every Sunday? What's wrong with granting asylum? Remember when the world said the same about Jews that they are about Syrians in the 1930s?

Schismatic? Sure, in error? Yes, Christian? Yes, he absolutely seems genuine in his dedication to the teachings of Christ and following The Way. A righteous dude, dude.

Fat wee Robin

Sure it's fine for an anarchist ,socialist politician ,but then he is not that ,he is head of a religious organisation who should put Christ first .It is as individuals we will be judged on our charity ,and yes our choice of politicians can be part of that .The problem is that anarchists and socialists do not understand why religion and politics must be seperate for leaders ,while not being in every way , for individuals .[/QUOTE]
THIS POST IS NOT MINE I AM NOT AN ANARCHIST

 

[fat wee robin]

I couldn't care less that the Pope is here. Good for him and RCC I guess. He seems like a pretty theologically liberal guy though. CNN was interviewing New Yorkers last night about the Pope's visit and not one of the supposed Catholics mentioned Christ or his teachings, they all mentioned how the Pope represented "tolerance" and "acceptance." RC are becoming more and more liberal with their theology, I wouldn't be surprised to see female RCC priests and homosexual marriage within the next few decades.

Not likely ,the Church will end before that would happen .

 

[fat wee robin]

Nonsense. With capitalism anyone has access to success. Doesn't matter your color or social circumstances. Study hard, focus on your studies, don't get anyone pregnant in high school and don't get a drug or alcohol problem, stay out of gangs and with the wrong crowds.....go to college and get loans and grants, get good job. OR....work small jobs while saving your money and come up with a great idea, loan, start business. Voila.

Plenty of people in the capitalist system succeed. Most who don't choose not to or use excuses of their neighborhood, skin color, or circumstances to stay and wallow in the food stamp welfare waters where they swim and swim.

My parents had very little money growing up. They were so broke half the time that we only ate out at restaurants once a month and any clothes I needed for school went on charge cards. My dad worked two jobs---Southern California Edison power company and with the Army Reserves. My mom worked part time. AND YET they scrimped and saved and paid for my entire college bill with zero loans. My family was broke. We never went anywhere until summer and even then we stayed in a tiny camper on the back of my dad's Ford truck! He drove the same 66 Ford truck (still does drive it!) and we'd keep cars for ten years at a time. My mom and I would have to dig under the couch cushions in the summer to find coins to go to Thrifty and get an ice cream. That was our "big moment" for the day.

My parents put me through college through sacrifice, scrimping, saving, and pinching pennies. They had a dream for me to graduate college...AND I DID! Now I'm a teacher, I make a respectable salary. I have benefits, a pension, and some comfort.

My wife came DIRT POOR from the Philippines! She came to the U.S. with zero!!!! My wedding ring that she bought for me cost $100!!!! She grew up half the time without electricity and sometimes no gas or lights! She had to put herself through college in the Philippines working while going to school.

My wife comes to America, is an amazing mom, goes to school at nights, becomes a nurse.

So my parents, when I was growing up, made around $30,000 a year!!! Then at the HEIGHT of my parents' working when I was in college they made $42,000!!! That's it. That's the ceiling they reached. My wife and I make a combined $130,000. Progress!!

I hope my kids do even better! My kids go to a private school because I'm sacrificing $1,400 per month so they can get the best education they can have. The goal is for them to outdo us!

We don't need the government running our lives to be successful. We need sacrifice, hard work, belief in ourselves, faith in God, hope, and determination. Throwing $$$$ at people and the welfare state doesn't work worth beans.

Your vaginal narrative was both gross and tacky, not appropriate for this forum, Herman.

And with regard to the color of your skin----I have plenty of Mexican friends who make more money than I do! My best friend is a highway patrolman. His parents came here broke from Mexico in the 1950's...BROWN SKIN AND ALL! He makes $100,000 a year to my $75,000. His wife, also Mexican, makes around $80,000. My wife's Filipino friends, mostly nurses and doctors, are loaded. Brown skin. How did Dr. Ben Carson become a rich, successful neurologist? His skin seems a touch dark?

Yes, I did, and I read them, but I didn't commit them to memory. Don't really remember the ones in the feeds of the people requesting friendships either - except that both you and they mentioned the Little Sisters of mercy.

I only glanced at the headlines in the friend requests. Enough to see that they were saying good things and not slamming Pope Francis.

One Orthodox friend did post something about Pope Francis the other day. But I'm not sure if it was "for" or "against". It actually seemed to be more about the Protestant opinion of Pope Francis. The title was something like "I wonder when Pope Francis will turn into the AntiChrist" ... With some reference to the idea that some denominations might be saying that. I didn't bother reading it. My impression was that it was a negative opinion of anyone who might be thinking the Pope was the antichrist.

Well some very Catholic people are thinking that .I feel sorry for him ,I think he carries a huge burden at this time in history .

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

I think the role of the Pope right now is to be a staunch, tough, powerful ship in a stormy mess. He needs to shout from the rooftops that he is pro-life and that abortion is murder. He needs to scream at the top of his lungs in a charitable way that only a man and woman constitute a marriage, and that a marriage must follow the traditional, holy understanding. He needs to stand up against the culture of death, preach against violence, condemn racism and hatred, and yes he absolutely can address climate change and income inequality and women's issues, etc. But the most important issues should come first. This pope seems to be trying to be an Elvis pope....cool, hip, everyone loves him kinda guy. It annoys me. He seems to be the "cool dad" in a divorce that feeds his kids peanut butter cups for dinner and lets them go to bed at midnight. He's skipping the nutrition of the Church and is giving a false image that he is a hippie liberal guy who's trying to placate the most hipster liberal "no hangups" folks around us. He seems to be lowering the bar and trying to reach out TOO HARD to liberals.

Well some very Catholic people are thinking that .I feel sorry for him ,I think he carries a huge burden at this time in history .

 

[Cappadocious]

With capitalism anyone has access to success.

Hypothetical access and access are not the same thing.

 

[jckstraw72]

can always count on this forum for a whole lotta awesome

 

[dzheremi]

Why is anyone even hoping for anything else? The RCC is a modern church. It is not the ancient church of the fathers, proclaiming the faith once delivered to the saints.

That's the whole problem with their ecclesiology in a temporal sense, isn't it? You have different factions within the RCC, and some of them say "I wish we had a pope like ____" (whoever the last Pope they liked is) or "Hold fast until God delivers us a man more like _____", and others who say "Finally! This Pope is saying what we have all been waiting for for so long!" It's like a lottery. Whether or not the church will be of this or that character depends on the character of the man in the chair, rather than the unchanging faith which anyway they abandoned a long time ago in favor of later innovations and theological speculations.

Sorry if that's harsh, but really...to say that Pope Francis ought to be doing this or that is fine, but kind of ignores the reality that, thanks to Rome's unique ecclesiology, the fact that he is already Pope nullifies this idea that he might not be the right man for the job, or that he might be doing more harm than good, or however you want to put it (unless you're a sedecavantist, I guess, but that's neither here nor there as far as Orthodox comments about the Pope are concerned). So to say that he ought to do something other than what he's doing throws the whole RCC house of cards into disarray, because then maybe, just maybe, they will have to realize that it is wrong to concentrate this amount of power in one man to the point where his disposition determines the trajectory of their entire church.

 

[GregConstantine]

Yes dzheremi! Everything you said is spot on! Which is why it is so strange that Orthodox people would just gush over every word that comes out of the mouth of this pope as if he is a Church Father or Saint coming to visit us! He is not Orthodox! He is a member of a schismatic Church that holds to heretical beliefs! My word! What is it going to take to get Orthodox people to realize this!?!

Cease the foolishness of trying to jam Christianity into any kind of worldly system or philosophy! Whether its socialism, libertarianism, conservatism, liberalism, etc. We are first and foremost subjects of the Kingdom of God and our "social program" is not any "ism", but the Love of God in the Holy Trinity!