gentiles to keep from profaning the Sabbath -- even in the OT Sabbath made for mankind

[Cribstyl]

Romans 8:4-11 Paul insists that the wicked "do not submit to the LAW of God - neither indeed CAN they"

No wonder Paul says -
"what matters is keeping the Commandments of God" 1 Cor 7:19

And John says:
"the saints KEEP the Commandments of God AND their faith in Jesus" Rev 14:12

Now then .. how about that New Covenant known to Jeremiah and the LAW of God known to Jeremiah and his readers in Jer 31, also known to Moses and Elijah in Matthew 17

Jer 31:31-33
31 “Behold, days are coming,” declares the Lord, “when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah, 32 not like the covenant which I made with their fathers in the day I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, although I was a husband to them,” declares the Lord. 33 “But this is the covenant which I will make with the house of Israel after those days,” declares the Lord, “I will put My law within them and on their heart I will write it; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people.

You're blatantly mishandling the word of God.

 

[HARK!]

You're blatantly mishandling the word of God.

Bare assertion fallacy.

 

[Cribstyl]

Bare assertion fallacy.

You too.

 

[Cribstyl]

What would posses you to think that works don't come through the law of faith?

(CLV) Ro 3:27
Where, then, is boasting? It is debarred! Through what law? Of works? Not! But through faith's law.

Here's an example of you and Bob mishandling the word of God. The same context where Paul is teaching Righteousness by faith without the law, you're teaching righteousness by the law.

Rom 3:21 ¶But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets.

Rom 3:28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.

By isolating this verse below you create the illusion that Paul is saying the opposite of his clear teachings about what God requires of us.
Rom 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

 

[Cribstyl]

When did I say that the law came by Abraham?

Here is what I said:

(CLV) Gn 26:5
inasmuch as your father Abraham hearkened to My voice and kept My charge, My instructions, My statutes and My laws.

Are you asserting that Moses made this up?

Obviously you're asserting that Abraham kept the ten commandments with this text.
You don't want to acknowledge that God did give Abraham a covenant and instructions other than the ten commandments.

Unfortunately for you, Moses did make it clear that the ten commandments was a covenant not made with the fathers.
Deu 5:2 The LORD our God made a covenant with us in Horeb.
Deu 5:3 The LORD made not this covenant with our fathers, but with us, even us, who are all of us here alive this day.
I don't expect you and Bob to see the truth because you guys are busy making up your own teachings.

 

[Cribstyl]

Here is what the Bible proves:

(CLV) Gn 26:5
inasmuch as your father Abraham hearkened to My voice and kept My charge, My instructions, My statutes and My laws.

What are you trying to prove?

Are you trying to prove that the law wasn't given to Abraham? Are you trying to prove that Abraham kept YHWH's charge, kept YHWH's instructions, kept YHWH's statutes and kept YHWH's laws, without knowing what they were? Are trying to prove that because the law was given to Moses, that it can't be given to anyone else; that it can't be written on your heart?

Your theory has been exposed and debunked by Moses own words in the post above and here.
Deu 5:2 The LORD our God made a covenant with us in Horeb.
Deu 5:3 The LORD made not this covenant with our fathers, but with us, even us, who are all of us here alive this day.

 

[HARK!]

Obviously you're asserting that Abraham kept the ten commandments with this text.

I didn't write that. It's scripture. Your gripe isn't with me. It's with the Bible.

Shalom

 

[pasifika]

Think about what you’re saying. You’re saying that obeying God’s instructions is a work from ourselves. That makes 0 sense because God desires that we obey his commandments.

The law is from God, not Moses. Moses was the mediator who gave the law from God to God’s people.

God gave instructions to us - why would he not want us to obey them?

Why do you think God made a new covenant then if the one in Sinai can be still perfectly uphold by the people? ??

Who was the problem the people or the law?

If the law is the problem why God still give it to the people in the first place...and if the problem is the people then what makes you different from those who broke the law in Sinai?

 

[HARK!]

Who was the problem the people or the law?

I think that you already knew the answer. The law isn't a who.

(CLV) Ps 19:7
The law of Yahweh is flawless, restoring the soul; The testimony of Yahweh is faithful|, making wise the simple;

 

[pasifika]

Abraham believed and was obedient. He didn’t just walk around and say “I love God” and not obey what God told him to do.

Abraham proved he believed in God by his actions/obedience.

Believe comes from faith...
Faith comes from knowing God...

Law comes from God, and the law requires your own works to follow it...put it this way, God gave the law, and you follow...

This is why the reason of fulfilling the law in Sinai based solely on our own works....
When God told Moses to go and tell the Israelites if they obey (through faith) God and keep His covenant then they will be a kingdom, holy nation etc Exodus 19:3-6..

But, the people responded...Exodus 19:8...We will DO what the Lord has said...
So, the requirements of following the law God gave is the works of the people or whoever is following the law Not God....God knew that, but the people were stubborn and don't really know their God..

But, Faith...is God who give it, and God will fulfill it....

 

[pasifika]

James expresses it more clearly.

(CLV) Ja 2:21
Abraham, our father, was he not justified by works when offering up his son Isaac on the altar?

(CLV) Ja 2:22
You are observing that faith worked together with his works, and by works was faith perfected.

(CLV) Ja 2:23
And fulfilled was the scripture which is saying, Now "Abraham believes God, and it is reckoned to him for righteousness," and he was called "the friend of God."

You mixed the two..."Law" and Law of Christ
Law=works
Law of Christ =faith
It was Abraham's faith that justified him, when he offered Isaac .....meaning his actions as the result of his faith

 

[pasifika]

I think that you already knew the answer. The law isn't a who.

(CLV) Ps 19:7
The law of Yahweh is flawless, restoring the soul; The testimony of Yahweh is faithful|, making wise the simple;

The law is perfect, good, etc because it's from God...But the people are not perfect, evil etc...so can we follow a perfect law with evil controlling our lives...not possible!
That why, a new covenant of God himself do all its necessary to make us follow His law...

 

[HARK!]

It was Abraham's faith that justified him, when he offered Isaac .....meaning his actions as the result of his faith

I understand that obedience to the law is the fruit of faith; but James said that Abraham was justified by works.

 

[HARK!]

The law is perfect, good, etc because it's from God...But the people are not perfect, evil etc...so can we follow a perfect law with evil controlling our lives...not possible!
That why, a new covenant of God himself do all its necessary to make us follow His law...

Indeed.

(CLV) Mt 19:26
Now, looking at them, Yahshua said to them, "With men this is impossible, yet with God all is possible."

But wasn't this always the case? Wasn't the strength to follow his law always from him?

 

[pasifika]

I understand that obedience to the law is the fruit of faith; but James said that Abraham was justified by works.

What law?
If you talking about the "Law" written law (10 commandments )...then Abraham can never be justified, he is a sinner just like any man apart from Christ..

If you talking about the Law of Christ (which by Faith)...then yes, Abraham was justified because of his Faith and his actions proved his faith by offer Isaac...

Two laws, 1..Law (10 commandments )..by works
2..Law of Christ (Spirit )..by Faith

 

[Cribstyl]

I didn't write that. It's scripture. Your gripe isn't with me. It's with the Bible.

Shalom

CLUE: It does not say what you and a few others want it to say. I've been through this with SDA many time...….. You have no choice but to argue vague text.

 

[pasifika]

Indeed.

(CLV) Mt 19:26
Now, looking at them, Yahshua said to them, "With men this is impossible, yet with God all is possible."

But wasn't this always the case? Wasn't the strength to follow his law always from him?

Yes, always the case, but in Sinai. ..the people responded..."We Will Do what the Lord has said"..Exodus 19:8...and that is where people want to do the work of God...

 

[HARK!]

Law of Christ

How do you define the law of Christ? Can you show me in scripture?

Are you rejecting the words of James?

(CLV) Ja 2:21
Abraham, our father, was he not justified by works when offering up his son Isaac on the altar?

(CLV) Ja 2:22
You are observing that faith worked together with his works, and by works was faith perfected.

(CLV) Ja 2:23
And fulfilled was the scripture which is saying, Now "Abraham believes God, and it is reckoned to him for righteousness," and he was called "the friend of God."

If you read carefully; you will see that faith and works are two different things.

 

[HARK!]

CLUE: It does not say what you and a few others want it to say. I've been through this with SDA many time...….. You have no choice but to argue vague text.

CLUE: I'm not SDA. It doesn't seem vague to me. Actually it seems very clear.

 

[HARK!]

Yes, always the case, but in Sinai. ..the people responded..."We Will Do what the Lord has said"..Exodus 19:8...and that is where people want to do the work of God...

So you don't feel that you need to be an active participant, by at least following what YHWH is telling you to do?

Isn't that what Abraham did?

Isn't that what even Yahshua himself did?