• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

Gasp, I'm sort of an Amillennialist!

Grip Docility

Well-Known Member
Nov 27, 2017
7,019
2,784
North America
✟19,296.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
What strange magic placed me here? Jude for starters. "Chained in darkness". Revelation 12, Satan is cast out with the angels and bound to earth, which isn't under Christ's ACTIVE Authority, except through the indwelling Holy Spirit of Christ within the Body. In this way, Satan is limited in power, along with his following angels and humans. Also, I believe that we go to heaven, immediately upon death... which indeed places me within the Revelation 20 (early portion of the chapter).

That verse in 2 Peter 3 makes it pretty hard to arrive at any other conclusion! :idea:

Am I a theological Mutt? Usually. I've learned to live with it. Discuss, Debate, Inquire, Ignore... Be Loving.
 
Last edited:

Hazelelponi

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Jun 25, 2018
11,799
11,205
USA
✟1,041,277.00
Country
United States
Gender
Female
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
Most of the Christian denominations have traditionally been Amillenial or something very similar for most of church history.

While other eschatological positions are more popular today some were long ago dismissed as heretical or something similar.

I uphold an Amillenial eschatology myself.
 
Upvote 0

Grip Docility

Well-Known Member
Nov 27, 2017
7,019
2,784
North America
✟19,296.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
Most of the Christian denominations have traditionally been Amillenial or something very similar for the last 1950 years or so.

While other eschatological positions are more popular today some were long ago dismissed as heretical or something similar.

I uphold an Amillenial eschatology myself.
That's awesome to hear! I was insisting that we die and go to be with Jesus, IMMEDIATLY... and there was MEGA push back! I finally realized that the 4 views were the culprit! I forget how deeply it solidifies certain scriptural understanding!

Thank you for sharing your position! Cheers!
 
  • Like
Reactions: Hazelelponi
Upvote 0

RandyPNW

Well-Known Member
Jun 8, 2021
3,524
796
Pacific NW, USA
✟164,856.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
What strange magic placed me here? Jude for starters. "Chained in darkness". Revelation 12, Satan is cast out with the angels and bound to earth, which isn't under Christ's ACTIVE Authority, except through the indwelling Holy Spirit of Christ within the Body. In this way, Satan is limited in power, along with his following angels and humans. Also, I believe that we go to heaven, immediately upon death... which indeed places me within the Revelation 20 (early portion of the chapter).

That verse in 2 Peter 3 makes it pretty hard to arrive at any other conclusion! :idea:

Am I a theological Mutt? Usually. I've learned to live with it. Discuss, Debate, Inquire, Ignore... Be Loving.
Adopt the theology that most closely agrees with Scripture to you! If that's Amill, so be it. You have to live with it--not anybody else. As for me, I choose to be PreMill, and I'm quite happy to live with it. We remain "one in Christ." :)
 
Upvote 0

Grip Docility

Well-Known Member
Nov 27, 2017
7,019
2,784
North America
✟19,296.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
Adopt the theology that most closely agrees with Scripture to you! If that's Amill, so be it. You have to live with it--not anybody else. As for me, I choose to be PreMill, and I'm quite happy to live with it. We remain "one in Christ." :)
I had been out of the discussion loop for a while and had forgotten how deeply that impacts certain views! Thanks for the Grace of Jesus towards me! I don't deserve it in this matter! It just hit me why certain discussion points are impossible to agree on when the views differ!

All Love to you in the Name of our Highest HOPE, Jesus Christ!
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Maria Billingsley

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Oct 7, 2018
11,189
9,233
65
Martinez
✟1,147,752.00
Country
United States
Gender
Female
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
What strange magic placed me here? Jude for starters. "Chained in darkness". Revelation 12, Satan is cast out with the angels and bound to earth, which isn't under Christ's ACTIVE Authority, except through the indwelling Holy Spirit of Christ within the Body. In this way, Satan is limited in power, along with his following angels and humans. Also, I believe that we go to heaven, immediately upon death... which indeed places me within the Revelation 20 (early portion of the chapter).

That verse in 2 Peter 3 makes it pretty hard to arrive at any other conclusion! :idea:

Am I a theological Mutt? Usually. I've learned to live with it. Discuss, Debate, Inquire, Ignore... Be Loving.
So you have come to the conclusion that there is no 1000 year reigh of Jesus Christ of Nazareth on earth? And that it is a metaphor for eternity? Just clarifying.
 
Upvote 0

Grip Docility

Well-Known Member
Nov 27, 2017
7,019
2,784
North America
✟19,296.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
So you have come to the conclusion that there us no 1000 year reign of Jesus Christ of Nazareth on earth? And that it is a metaphor for eternity? Just clarifying.
Thank you for clarifying! :purpleheart:

Not at all. I believe that as the Saints Die, they go to be with Jesus in Heaven.

I believe that The Great White throne isn't a single day, but the beginning of Eternity with Him under the NEW HEAVEN and NEW Earth.... and that entire event hasn't happened yet.

It goes like this, for me, per opinion.

Unbelieving Israel was broken off.
Believing Israel integrated with the BOC and the rest of LITERAL Israel Divorced itself from God. (Stoning of Steven that followed Christ being rejected as Israel's King... "Caesar is our King".)

This is the Age of the Gentiles... 2 Peter 3 1000 years statement binds to Rev 20 early portion of passage.

We are awaiting Him to return to Establish His physical Reign.

THE BOC will be united in full in the clouds when He returns with all of those that died and dwelled in Heaven with Him, as He returns.
By caught up, I mean when the final days are upon the earth and the ACTUAL anti Christ is permitted to set up Reign, then the Church is snatched. It's not ALL at once, but from the scriptures view, it all moves fast.​

The focus will then shift back to UNBELIEVING ISRAEL.

Hope that clears it up... as to my personal perspective.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Maria Billingsley

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Oct 7, 2018
11,189
9,233
65
Martinez
✟1,147,752.00
Country
United States
Gender
Female
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Thank you for clarifying! :purpleheart:

Not at all. I believe that as the Saints Die, they go to be with Jesus in Heaven.

I believe that The Great White throne isn't a single day, but the beginning of Eternity with Him under the NEW HEAVEN and NEW Earth.... and that entire event hasn't happened yet.

It goes like this, for me, per opinion.

Unbelieving Israel was broken off.
Believing Israel integrated with the BOC and the rest of LITERAL Israel Divorced itself from God. (Stoning of Steven that followed Christ being rejected as Israel's King... "Caesar is our King".)

This is the Age of the Gentiles... 2 Peter 3 1000 years statement binds to Rev 20 early portion of passage.

We are awaiting Him to return to Establish His physical Reign.

THE BOC will be united in full in the clouds when He returns with all of those that died and dwelled in Heaven with Him, as He returns.
By caught up, I mean when the final days are upon the earth and the ACTUAL anti Christ is permitted to set up Reign, then the Church is snatched. It's not ALL at once, but from the scriptures view, it all moves fast.​

The focus will then shift back to UNBELIEVING ISRAEL.

Hope that clears it up... as to my personal perspective.
Ok but Amillinialism is defined as such:
 
Upvote 0

keras

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy
Feb 7, 2013
15,076
2,590
84
Thames, New Zealand
Visit site
✟350,991.00
Country
New Zealand
Gender
Male
Faith
Pentecostal
Marital Status
Married
I reject AMillennium-ism, as it does not give Jesus His reward. Psalms 2:7-8
Jesus came to earth first as a suffering servant. He will Return as the King of Kings and Lord of Lords. Revelation 19:16
He will reign over His people and Satan will not be able to deceive them.

But at the end of the thousand years; literally a thousand orbits of the earth around the sun, Satan will be released in order to give the final test of faith to those humans alive then and many will fail. Revelation 20:7-10
THEN the Judgment of everybody who has ever lived will take place. Revelation 20:11-15

I believe that everyone's name is Written in the Book of Life at birth, but it can be erased by sins and disbelief of God.
 
Upvote 0

Grip Docility

Well-Known Member
Nov 27, 2017
7,019
2,784
North America
✟19,296.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
Upvote 0

Grip Docility

Well-Known Member
Nov 27, 2017
7,019
2,784
North America
✟19,296.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
I reject AMillennium-ism, as it does not give Jesus His reward. Psalms 2:7-8
Jesus came to earth first as a suffering servant. He will Return as the King of Kings and Lord of Lords. Revelation 19:16
He will reign over His people and Satan will not be able to deceive them.

But at the end of the thousand years; literally a thousand orbits of the earth around the sun, Satan will be released in order to give the final test of faith to those humans alive then and many will fail. Revelation 20:7-10
THEN the Judgment of everybody who has ever lived will take place. Revelation 20:11-15

I believe that everyone's name is Written in the Book of Life at birth, but it can be erased by sins and disbelief of God.
You know how I'm usually a pain in the tail to you keras? Not here! Thank you for sharing this! I know that you diligently study these matters and they are important to you! So... Do we disagree? We know the answer.

However......

Are you my Brother in our Blessed Jesus Christ? YES, Yes and Amen! I Love you friend in Him and appreciate you sharing your view here! As long as it all stays loving and good humored, I don't really care what direction this OP goes in discussion. Most of all, I just want it to be a... we all may agree or disagree thread, love to share and listen to one another and such forth... kind of thread.
 
Upvote 0

Spiritual Jew

Amillennialist
Site Supporter
Oct 12, 2020
8,514
2,834
MI
✟433,929.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
What strange magic placed me here? Jude for starters. "Chained in darkness". Revelation 12, Satan is cast out with the angels and bound to earth, which isn't under Christ's ACTIVE Authority, except through the indwelling Holy Spirit of Christ within the Body. In this way, Satan is limited in power, along with his following angels and humans. Also, I believe that we go to heaven, immediately upon death... which indeed places me within the Revelation 20 (early portion of the chapter).

That verse in 2 Peter 3 makes it pretty hard to arrive at any other conclusion! :idea:

Am I a theological Mutt? Usually. I've learned to live with it. Discuss, Debate, Inquire, Ignore... Be Loving.
There are many of us who are amillennialists. Nothing strange about it at all. Some will try to lie and tell you that the doctrine was created by Augustine, but it is taught in scripture and originated in scripture.
 
Upvote 0

Grip Docility

Well-Known Member
Nov 27, 2017
7,019
2,784
North America
✟19,296.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
There are many of us who are amillennialists. Nothing strange about it at all. Some will try to lie and tell you that the doctrine was created by Augustine, but it is taught in scripture and originated in scripture.
When I released all doctrines of men, I ended up getting closer and closer to the original 50 AD - 100 AD doctrines, without realizing it! :tearsofjoy:

I'm small "c" catholic (Universal Invisible Body of Christ) and I didn't set out with that intention! :purpleheart:
 
  • Like
Reactions: Spiritual Jew
Upvote 0

Spiritual Jew

Amillennialist
Site Supporter
Oct 12, 2020
8,514
2,834
MI
✟433,929.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
That's awesome to hear! I was insisting that we die and go to be with Jesus, IMMEDIATLY... and there was MEGA push back!
Who was giving you push back about that? I would think a vast majority of Christians believe that when we physically die our spirits and/or souls immediately go to be with Jesus in heaven.
 
Upvote 0

Grip Docility

Well-Known Member
Nov 27, 2017
7,019
2,784
North America
✟19,296.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
Who was giving you push back about that? I would think a vast majority of Christians believe that when we physically die our spirits and/or souls immediately go to be with Jesus in heaven.
It's not one person in particular. It's more of a collective thing that occurs and I forget that folks get set by "Eschatology" without even realizing it sometimes. It's a thing I had forgotten.
 
Upvote 0

Spiritual Jew

Amillennialist
Site Supporter
Oct 12, 2020
8,514
2,834
MI
✟433,929.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Thank you for clarifying! :purpleheart:

Not at all. I believe that as the Saints Die, they go to be with Jesus in Heaven.

I believe that The Great White throne isn't a single day, but the beginning of Eternity with Him under the NEW HEAVEN and NEW Earth.... and that entire event hasn't happened yet.

It goes like this, for me, per opinion.

Unbelieving Israel was broken off.
Believing Israel integrated with the BOC and the rest of LITERAL Israel Divorced itself from God. (Stoning of Steven that followed Christ being rejected as Israel's King... "Caesar is our King".)

This is the Age of the Gentiles... 2 Peter 3 1000 years statement binds to Rev 20 early portion of passage.

We are awaiting Him to return to Establish His physical Reign.

THE BOC will be united in full in the clouds when He returns with all of those that died and dwelled in Heaven with Him, as He returns.
By caught up, I mean when the final days are upon the earth and the ACTUAL anti Christ is permitted to set up Reign, then the Church is snatched. It's not ALL at once, but from the scriptures view, it all moves fast.​

The focus will then shift back to UNBELIEVING ISRAEL.

Hope that clears it up... as to my personal perspective.
Hmmm. Amillennialists typically believe that on the day Christ returns the dead in Christ and living Christians will all be caught up to Jesus in the air after which He proceeds to burn up the earth and destroy all of the wicked (2 Peter 3:10-12)? Is that not what you believe?
 
Upvote 0

Grip Docility

Well-Known Member
Nov 27, 2017
7,019
2,784
North America
✟19,296.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
Hmmm. Amillennialists typically believe that on the day Christ returns the dead in Christ and living Christians will all be caught up to Jesus in the air after which He proceeds to burn up the earth and destroy all of the wicked (2 Peter 3:10-12)? Is that not what you believe?
Rotfl... this is indeed a can of worms. It's not that simple for me. I can explain. Or, you can spare yourself the pain of having to suffer through someone else's "Well this is how I see it". :p
 
Upvote 0

Spiritual Jew

Amillennialist
Site Supporter
Oct 12, 2020
8,514
2,834
MI
✟433,929.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Rotfl... this is indeed a can of worms. It's not that simple for me. I can explain. Or, you can spare yourself the pain of having to suffer through someone else's "Well this is how I see it". :p
No, that's fine. You can explain your view to me.
 
  • Wow
Reactions: Grip Docility
Upvote 0

Spiritual Jew

Amillennialist
Site Supporter
Oct 12, 2020
8,514
2,834
MI
✟433,929.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
I reject AMillennium-ism, as it does not give Jesus His reward. Psalms 2:7-8
Nonsense.

Jesus came to earth first as a suffering servant. He will Return as the King of Kings and Lord of Lords. Revelation 19:16
He is King of kings and Lord of lords now, as scripture teaches.

Ephesians 1:19 and his incomparably great power for us who believe. That power is the same as the mighty strength 20 he exerted when he raised Christ from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly realms, 21 far above all rule and authority, power and dominion, and every name that is invoked, not only in the present age but also in the one to come. 22 And God placed all things under his feet and appointed him to be head over everything for the church, 23 which is his body, the fullness of him who fills everything in every way.

As Paul taught, Jesus, at the time of His resurrection from the dead, was placed "far above all rule and authority, power and dominion, and every name that is invoked" and "God placed all things under his feet and appointed him to be head over everything for the church" at that time.

He will reign over His people and Satan will not be able to deceive them.
Jesus reigns over us and Satan has no power over us now.

James 4:7 Submit yourselves, then, to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.
 
Upvote 0

Grip Docility

Well-Known Member
Nov 27, 2017
7,019
2,784
North America
✟19,296.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
No, that's fine. You can explain your view to me.
Okay... I usually take aeon's to exegete this stuff... but I will try to drop scripture and move fast.

My personal pet view is that several matters must be understood to follow through...

1- Jonah says this: "But to Jonah this seemed very wrong, and he became angry. 2 He prayed to the Lord, “Isn’t this what I said, Lord, when I was still at home? That is what I tried to forestall by fleeing to Tarshish. I knew that you are a gracious and compassionate God, slow to anger and abounding in love, a God who relents from sending calamity. 3 Now, Lord, take away my life, for it is better for me to die than to live.”

2- Jesus descended into Sheol to jail break those that were in Ga' Eden, then those that were in the bad place. He broke out the repentant.

3- Sheol is loaded with NEW SOULS, and old Souls that saw the very Holy Spirit of Messiah and Rejected Him

4- God is ensuring that those that Go to the Lake of Fire are 100 percent Judged by their very own ways, words and deeds of the Soul.

So... Zechariah 14 and Joel 3 combine to kick off the matter.

The literal Presence of Satan and Satan's Angels will be about to overthrow Literal Israel and are holding down Jerusalem of the Earth.
- Final Body of Christ that are alive in this carnal realm will get snatched.

As soon as it begins to get EXTRA EVIL, The Body of Christ is Going to Descend from Heaven with Jesus... and that's where Jesus "Super Man Lands" on the Mount of Olives. It's the moment that the Anti Christ is thwarted and kicked out of Israel.

Satan and his pawns will all be aligned against Literal Israel and now... PHYSICAL GOD PRESENT.

The next series of events will be specifically what is known as THE DAY OF THE LORD. SHEOL will be EMPTIED into an event where Satan and JESUS are present in PHYSICAL Form.

Those that are within Sheol will also contain "Unbelieving Israel". My suspicion is that Unbelieving Israel will begin to weep, realizing that IT WAS JESUS ALL ALONG! From within those that the Devil thought were his own ranks... His Army like the seas of the sand will arise a commotion never heard before!

Israel poured forth from Sheol will turn on Satan and ALL of his minions... and fight and flank those rising against LITERAL Israel.....

When the Wicked have fully aligned with Satan, from Sheol and those alive before the emptying of Sheol.... and those of Sheol that have aligned with God are all sorted out... I suspect that God will finally call the WORDS... and.... The very fires of Hell will literally light as the earth outside Israel in the prophetically identified places break open! The wicked will be swallowed by the Long Prophesied Gehenna or Hinnom.

Those left that weren't sealed PRIOR to the Emptying of Sheol will be sorted by Jesus Himself... and however He deems that should occur... ie cowards from the sincere. There are passages in Joel 3 that are rather interesting on that mechanism.

The earth will then be void of wickedness... and God will merge Heaven with Earth... and Bang!

They all lived happily ever after. (something like that... in my humble opinion)

NOW... if the Body of Christ is away from planet earth.. and the Man of Lawlessness has to come... while Israel is literally present on the earth and a 100% target of all that are left on earth.... It becomes obvious that the "Time of the Gentiles" is OVER. God has had the Ark of the Covenant with Israel in Heaven... All of this TIME! He's coming back to finish keeping HIS PROMISE to ISRAEL, not because of HER "righteousness", but BECAUSE of HIS good Character! They get saved just like we got saved! It's based on HIM, not US. They WILL turn to HIM!

Romans 11
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0