From what law did Paul set us free?

[Bob S]

In Psalms 119:142, the Torah is truth, so you post is opposed to following truth, and Jesus did not set us free from truth, but just the opposite, truth is what sets us free from bondage to sin (John 8:31-36). In Deuteronomy 13:1-5, the way that God instructed His people to determine that someone is a false prophet who is not speaking for Him is if they taught against following the Torah, so if Jesus had tried to do what you suggest, then those who reject him as being a false prophet would be correctly acting in accordance with what God has instructed His people to do.

What was truth for the Israelites wasn't truth for the remainder of mankind. The reason you are so confused is because you have no idea why the Mosaic Covenant ended and was replaced with the New and better Covenant.

 

[expos4ever]

Tell me, you who want to live under the law (the rules of Judaism that does not remove sin), do you know what the law actually says? (The law says what is sin) The Scriptures say that Abraham had two sons, one from his slave wife and one from his freeborn wife. The son of the slave wife was born in a human attempt to bring about the fulfillment of God’s promise (the promise to remove sin from our character). But the son of the freeborn wife was born as God’s own fulfillment of his promise. These two women serve as an illustration of God’s two covenants. The first woman, Hagar, represents Mount Sinai where people received the law that enslaved them (Judaism is enslaved in sin because they sabotaged God's law to not remove sin). And now Jerusalem is just like Mount Sinai in Arabia, because she and her children live in slavery (slavery to sin) to the law (added by the translators, not found in the original). But the other woman, Sarah, represents the heavenly Jerusalem. She is the free woman (free from sin), and she is our mother. As Isaiah said, “Rejoice, O childless woman, you who have never given birth! Break into a joyful shout, you who have never been in labor! For the desolate woman now has more children than the woman who lives with her husband!” And you, dear brothers and sisters, are children of the promise (the promise to remove sin from our character), just like Isaac. But you are now being persecuted by those who want you to keep the law (the rules of Judaism that does not remove sin), just as Ishmael, the child born by human effort, persecuted Isaac, the child born by the power of the Spirit. But what do the Scriptures say about that? “Get rid of the slave and her son, for the son of the slave woman will not share the inheritance with the free woman’s son.” So, dear brothers and sisters, we are not children of the slave woman; we are children of the free woman. (Galatians 4:21-31 NLT fixed)

Lest any readers be deceived, the phrase "Judaism is enslaved in sin because they sabotaged God's law to not remove sin" is your addition. And it is really just an unsupported assertion that directly contradicts what Paul is clearly saying. Here is what Paul actually writes:

The first woman, Hagar, represents Mount Sinai where people received the law that enslaved them

This is beyond debate - Paul is talking about the Law of Moses! What was received at Sinai? Clearly the Law of Moses as any Biblically literate person - even a semi-Biblically literate person - will know.

Your argument that Paul is not referring to enslavement to what all readers will know was delivered at Sinai, namely the Law of Moses, is so obviously wrong, it is hard to imagine how you do not know this.

Here is are some questions for you about this part of verse 25 (The first woman, Hagar, represents Mount Sinai where people received the law that enslaved them). They are clear questions; they are simple questions:

What was delivered to the Jews at Mount Sinai?

What does Paul identify as the thing that enslaved the Jews?

 

[expos4ever]

If you you interpret the NT authors as being in opposition to following what Psalms 119:142 says is the truth, such as speaking against following the Levitical laws, then you have three options that I can see:

1.) You can have the self-awareness to recognize that your interpretation of the NT must be wrong because it is in opposition to truth.

2.) You can insist that your interpretation of the NT is correct and that the NT must therefore be rejected as being in opposition to truth.

3.) You can deny the validity of Psalms 119:142 saying that the Torah is truth and undermine the validity of the NT quoting the Psalms.

It is contradictory to uphold that the Torah is truth, that the NT is truth, and that the NT speaks against following truth, so that option is not available to you.

Here is the Young's Literal Translation of verse 142 of Psalm 119:

Thy righteousness [is] righteousness to the age, And Thy law [is] truth.

Here is the key point - to say that the Law is truth does not in any way logically require us to believe that the Law is still in force. What is true can and does change sometimes. For example, when I was 8 years old it was "truth" that I believed girls were gross. Now, this thing that was indeed true is no longer true.

And lest you try to argue from a translation like this.....

Your righteousness is an everlasting righteousness, And Your Law is truth.

....that the author is indeed writing about an eternal truth, I will point out that the Hebrew word rendered as "everlasting" does not, repeat does not require us to understand it as really eternal.

 

[guevaraj]

The first woman, Hagar, represents Mount Sinai where people received the law that enslaved them

What was delivered to the Jews at Mount Sinai?

Brother, at Mount Sinai they received the promise of freedom from sin by practicing obeying the Ten Commandments: like a child who learns to walk by getting up again and again until he no longer falls. The Ten Commandments alone does not permit this mastery through practice, but Jesus gave us what the Ten Commandments could not: mastery through practice by way of many forgivenesses for past sins, made clear through the daily death of so many animal sacrifices. As our High Priest, Jesus' cycle of many forgivenesses for past sins allows mastery of obeying the Ten Commandments through practice: like someone who learns to play the piano through practice, not something you master on the first try. However, like in the story of Hagar, Judaism's "human effort" to fulfill the promise to obey by substituting the law of God with their own rules did not remove the sin that the Ten Commandments were meant to remove. For example, to obey not to misuse God's name, they substituted what God asked to properly use His name with their own rule not to pronounce God's name at all. This substitution stopped them from having to learn to properly use God's name, stopping the removal of that sin from their character. It is their slavery to sin by their own "human effort" to sabotage the law of God to not remove sin, which leads to death, as Paul tells us in the following passage.

Well then, since God’s grace has set us free from the law (of Judaism), does that mean we can go on sinning (lawlessness)? Of course not (don't misunderstand God's grace)! Don’t you realize that you become the slave of whatever you choose to obey (sin or God)? You can be a slave to sin (lawlessness), which leads to death (like Judaism's example of sabotaging God's Ten Commandments to not remove sin), or you can choose to obey God (Eleven Commandments), which leads to righteous living (freedom from sin). Thank God (Jesus's many forgivenesses as our High Priest allowing us to grow in obedience through practice of the Eleven Commandments)! Once you were slaves of sin (lawlessness), but now you wholeheartedly obey this teaching we have given you (Eleven Commandments). Now you are free from your slavery to sin (when you obey God's Eleven Commandments), and you have become slaves to righteous living (obeying the Eleven Commandments). (Romans 6:15-18 NLT overlaid with commentary)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[expos4ever]

Brother, at Mount Sinai they received the promise of freedom from sin by practicing obeying the Ten Commandments: like a child who learns to walk by getting up again and again until he no longer falls. The Ten Commandments alone does not permit this mastery through practice, but Jesus gave us what the Ten Commandments could not: mastery through practice by way of many forgivenesses for past sins, made clear through the daily death of so many animal sacrifices. As our High Priest, Jesus' cycle of many forgivenesses for past sins allows mastery of obeying the Ten Commandments through practice: like someone who learns to play the piano through practice, not something you master on the first try. However, like in the story of Hagar, Judaism's "human effort" to fulfill the promise to obey by substituting the law of God with their own rules did not remove the sin that the Ten Commandments were meant to remove. For example, to obey not to misuse God's name, they substituted what God asked to properly use His name with their own rule not to pronounce God's name at all. This substitution stopped them from having to learn to properly use God's name, stopping the removal of that sin from their character. It is their slavery to sin by their own "human effort" to sabotage the law of God to not remove sin, which leads to death, as Paul tells us in the following passage.

No.

The answer is simple: The Law of Moses was delivered at Mount Sinai:

Leviticus 26:46 "These are the decrees, the laws and the regulations that the LORD established on Mount Sinai between himself and the Israelites through Moses."

You evade this manifest and self-evident truth though a frankly rambling argument contrived, I suggest, to mislead readers. In that argument, you use the same obviously flawed reasoning you always use: you argue that since some Jews did indeed add their own rules and otherwise distorted the Law, this means that the Law of Moses is not what Paul is talking about when he refers to a law delivered at Sinai. But there is no logical path whatsoever from this:

The Jews added / subsituted new rules (your argument)

....to this:

The thing delivered to the Jews at Sinai was not the Law of Moses (this is what you are claiming even though you dance around and don't actually say it).

A Sunday School student can tell you: It is the Law of Moses, not human traidition, that was delivered at Sinai.

 

[expos4ever]

I want to address the patently fallacious reasoning that takes us from these words of Paul:

The first woman, Hagar, represents Mount Sinai where people received the law that enslaved them.

....to this distortion of Paul's words:

The first woman, Hagar, represents Mount Sinai where people received the law that enslaved them (Judaism is enslaved in sin because they sabotaged God's law to not remove sin)

What Paul is saying cannot be misunderstood - he is saying that the Law of Moses, which you all should know was delivered at Mount Sinai, enslaved the Jews. Seems like a strange thing for a law that Paul elsewhere describes in these favourable terms:

For I joyfully agree with the law of God [u]in the inner person,

But Paul says it all the same - the Law of Moses enslaves. And he says similar things elsewhere such as here:

I was once alive apart [o]from the Law; but when the commandment came, sin came to life, and I died;

Now then, look at what is going on in this "edited" version of the initial verse from Galatians:

The first woman, Hagar, represents Mount Sinai where people received the law that enslaved them (Judaism is enslaved in sin because they sabotaged God's law to not remove sin)

This is a form of the old bait and switch. To make this kind of edit you have to find a way to distract or confuse the reader with a diversion. And the diversion here is to add to Paul's words something that is both true and indeed related to the Law, namely the claim that Jews in some sense "sabotaged" the law. Well, I would agree with this. But this fact is entirely irrelevant since the Law of Moses can both enslave and be sabotaged.

Words have meaning, sentences have internal logic, and context matters. When Paul writes:

The first woman, Hagar, represents Mount Sinai where people received the law that enslaved them

....there is absolutely no doubt to anyone who knows the broader Biblical context that the "law" delivered at Sinai was not, despite the ruse perpetrated by the edit, a "law of Judaism" which is something other than the Law of Moses. What was delivered at Sinai was, of course, the Law of Moses.

And "enslave" means enslave. And the subject of the verb "enslaved" is, of course, the Law of Moses. And the object of the verb "enslaved" is, of course, the Jews.

Paul is saying, strange though it may seem, that the Law of Moses enslaved the Jews.

Trust Paul, and do not fall for efforts to "sabotage" the obvious meaning of his words.

 

[guevaraj]

The first woman, Hagar, represents Mount Sinai where people received the law that enslaved them.

Brother, the law at Mount Sinai is God's promise to separate sin from our character by obeying God through the practice that Paul calls slavery to righteous living in the following passage. Hagar represents the "human attempt" in Judaism to bring about the fulfillment of God's promise that sabotaged God's Ten Commandments so as not to remove sin, leading to death. Paul tells us to remove our slavery to sin by obeying God instead of sin, sin kept by the "human attempt" in Judaism. Judaism replaced obedience to God in the practice that Paul calls slavery to righteous living with obeying human rules that keep people in sin because they are "blind guides" to use laws to separate sin from our character.

Well then, since God’s grace has set us free from the law (of Judaism), does that mean we can go on sinning (lawlessness)? Of course not (don't misunderstand God's grace)! Don’t you realize that you become the slave of whatever you choose to obey (sin or God)? You can be a slave to sin (lawlessness), which leads to death (like Judaism's example of sabotaging God's Ten Commandments to not remove sin), or you can choose to obey God (Eleven Commandments), which leads to righteous living (freedom from sin). Thank God (Jesus's many forgivenesses as our High Priest allowing us to grow in obedience through practice of the Eleven Commandments)! Once you were slaves of sin (lawlessness), but now you wholeheartedly obey this teaching we have given you (Eleven Commandments). Now you are free from your slavery to sin (when you obey God's Eleven Commandments), and you have become slaves to righteous living (obeying the Eleven Commandments). (Romans 6:15-18 NLT overlaid with commentary)​

Sara represents God's own fulfilment of God's promise to separate sin from our character by obeying Eleven Commandments, corrected from the "human attempt" found in Judaism's sabotage of the letter. Following Jesus' example is more complete than the letter in the Ten Commandments that Judaism sabotaged to not remove sin.

Tell me, you who want to live under the law (the rules of Judaism that does not remove sin), do you know what the law actually says? (The law says what is sin) The Scriptures say that Abraham had two sons, one from his slave wife and one from his freeborn wife. The son of the slave wife was born in a human attempt to bring about the fulfillment of God’s promise (the promise to remove sin from our character). But the son of the freeborn wife was born as God’s own fulfillment of his promise. These two women serve as an illustration of God’s two covenants. The first woman, Hagar, represents Mount Sinai where people received the law that enslaved them (Judaism is enslaved in sin because they sabotaged God's law to not remove sin). And now Jerusalem is just like Mount Sinai in Arabia, because she and her children live in slavery (slavery to sin) to the law (added by the translators, not found in the original). But the other woman, Sarah, represents the heavenly Jerusalem. She is the free woman (free from sin), and she is our mother. As Isaiah said, “Rejoice, O childless woman, you who have never given birth! Break into a joyful shout, you who have never been in labor! For the desolate woman now has more children than the woman who lives with her husband!” And you, dear brothers and sisters, are children of the promise (the promise to remove sin from our character), just like Isaac. But you are now being persecuted by those who want you to keep the law (the rules of Judaism that does not remove sin), just as Ishmael, the child born by human effort, persecuted Isaac, the child born by the power of the Spirit. But what do the Scriptures say about that? “Get rid of the slave and her son, for the son of the slave woman will not share the inheritance with the free woman’s son.” So, dear brothers and sisters, we are not children of the slave woman; we are children of the free woman. (Galatians 4:21-31 NLT fixed and overlaid with commentary)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[expos4ever]

Brother, the law at Mount Sinai is God's promise to separate sin from our character by obeying God through the practice that Paul calls slavery to righteous living in the following passage. Hagar represents the "human attempt" in Judaism to bring about the fulfillment of God's promise that sabotaged God's Ten Commandments so as not to remove sin, leading to death. Paul tells us to remove our slavery to sin by obeying God instead of sin, sin kept by the "human attempt" in Judaism. Judaism replaced obedience to God in the practice that Paul calls slavery to righteous living with obeying human rules that keep people in sin because they are "blind guides" to use laws to separate sin from our character.

Well then, since God’s grace has set us free from the law (of Judaism), does that mean we can go on sinning (lawlessness)? Of course not (don't misunderstand God's grace)! Don’t you realize that you become the slave of whatever you choose to obey (sin or God)? You can be a slave to sin (lawlessness), which leads to death (like Judaism's example of sabotaging God's Ten Commandments to not remove sin), or you can choose to obey God (Eleven Commandments), which leads to righteous living (freedom from sin). Thank God (Jesus's many forgivenesses as our High Priest allowing us to grow in obedience through practice of the Eleven Commandments)! Once you were slaves of sin (lawlessness), but now you wholeheartedly obey this teaching we have given you (Eleven Commandments). Now you are free from your slavery to sin (when you obey God's Eleven Commandments), and you have become slaves to righteous living (obeying the Eleven Commandments). (Romans 6:15-18 NLT overlaid with commentary)​

You are simply repeating the same untenable argument - you have evaded addressing all my critiques of this argument.

You cannot simply "add commentary" to a Bible passage and introduce that commented passage with a deeply flawed argument.

You simply claim that "Paul tells us to remove our slavery to sin by obeying God instead of sin, sin kept by the "human attempt" in Judaism." But where is the evidence? Not in Paul's actual words. Anyone can "add commentary " to a passage but you need to have a case that justifies such addition. But you offer no case, merely a bald unsubstantiated claim.

Sara represents God's own fulfilment of God's promise to separate sin from our character by obeying Eleven Commandments, corrected from the "human attempt" found in Judaism's sabotage of the letter. Following Jesus' example is more complete than the letter in the Ten Commandments that Judaism sabotaged to not remove sin.......

Tell me, you who want to live under the law (the rules of Judaism that does not remove sin), do you know what the law actually says? (The law says what is sin) The Scriptures say that Abraham had two sons, one from his slave wife and one from his freeborn wife. The son of the slave wife was born in a human attempt to bring about the fulfillment of God’s promise (the promise to remove sin from our character). But the son of the freeborn wife was born as God’s own fulfillment of his promise. These two women serve as an illustration of God’s two covenants. The first woman, Hagar, represents Mount Sinai where people received the law that enslaved them (Judaism is enslaved in sin because they sabotaged God's law to not remove sin). And now Jerusalem is just like Mount Sinai in Arabia, because she and her children live in slavery (slavery to sin) to the law (added by the translators, not found in the original). But the other woman, Sarah, represents the heavenly Jerusalem. She is the free woman (free from sin), and she is our mother. As Isaiah said, “Rejoice, O childless woman, you who have never given birth! Break into a joyful shout, you who have never been in labor! For the desolate woman now has more children than the woman who lives with her husband!” And you, dear brothers and sisters, are children of the promise (the promise to remove sin from our character), just like Isaac. But you are now being persecuted by those who want you to keep the law (the rules of Judaism that does not remove sin), just as Ishmael, the child born by human effort, persecuted Isaac, the child born by the power of the Spirit. But what do the Scriptures say about that? “Get rid of the slave and her son, for the son of the slave woman will not share the inheritance with the free woman’s son.” So, dear brothers and sisters, we are not children of the slave woman; we are children of the free woman. (Galatians 4:21-31 NLT fixed and overlaid with commentary)​

Again, you simply copy-paste (basically) what you posted before. Any reader with their wits about them will see that you have entirely evaded the clear counterargument I have offered.

And that silence speaks loudly.

 

[Halbhh]

Brothers and Sisters, Paul assumes the listener knows what is written elsewhere and uses summary words like "the law" where the word has already been expanded elsewhere. When Paul uses the word law, unqualified, he is referring to the law of Judaism Jesus has freed us from as accepted in the Jerusalem council expressed by James. The Jerusalem council did not abandon Moses and everything that came before Moses when it provided a seed list to add to, allowing the adoption of Moses and everything before Moses by the gentiles who were turning to God free of the added human traditions of Judaism that Jesus was against in the following passage.

“What sorrow awaits you teachers of religious law and you Pharisees. Hypocrites! For you shut the door of the Kingdom of Heaven in people’s faces. You won’t go in yourselves, and you don’t let others enter either. “What sorrow awaits you teachers of religious law and you Pharisees. Hypocrites! For you cross land and sea to make one convert, and then you turn that person into twice the child of hell you yourselves are! “Blind guides! What sorrow awaits you! For you say that it means nothing to swear ‘by God’s Temple,’ but that it is binding to swear ‘by the gold in the Temple.’ Blind fools! Which is more important—the gold or the Temple that makes the gold sacred? And you say that to swear ‘by the altar’ is not binding, but to swear ‘by the gifts on the altar’ is binding. How blind! For which is more important—the gift on the altar or the altar that makes the gift sacred? When you swear ‘by the altar,’ you are swearing by it and by everything on it. And when you swear ‘by the Temple,’ you are swearing by it and by God, who lives in it. And when you swear ‘by heaven,’ you are swearing by the throne of God and by God, who sits on the throne. (Matthew 23:13-22 NLT)​

James was not limiting what we need to obey, he was giving us permission to adopt Moses without forcing the human traditions of Judaism on us Gentiles, as we turn to God by giving us a seed, a beginning to add to. James saw us as the fulfillment of the prophecy where God would "restore the fallen house of David" as we listened to Moses every Sabbath. What that means is the equivalent of continuing Judaism without human traditions. The human traditions in Judaism led to death by sabotaging God's Ten Commandments so as not to take away sin that would otherwise have been taken away if they had done what God asked, instead of replacing what God asked with their own rules, in their "human effort" to help them obey the law by sabotaging the law so as not to take away sin, which made the law easier to bear. For example, in order not to use God's name in vain, Judaism added the human rule not to pronounce God's name to help obey God's law by preventing them from having to learn not to misuse His name. Judaism managed to bypass the active part of taking away their sin by replacing God's law with their own rule not to utter God's name at all.

When they had finished, James stood and said, “Brothers, listen to me. Peter has told you about the time God first visited the Gentiles to take from them a people for himself. And this conversion of Gentiles is exactly what the prophets predicted. As it is written: ‘Afterward I will return and restore the fallen house of David. I will rebuild its ruins and restore it, so that the rest of humanity might seek the LORD, including the Gentiles—all those I have called to be mine. The LORD has spoken—he who made these things known so long ago.’ “And so my judgment is that we should not make it difficult for the Gentiles who are turning to God. Instead, we should write and tell them to abstain from eating food offered to idols, from sexual immorality, from eating the meat of strangled animals, and from consuming blood. For these laws of Moses has been preached in Jewish synagogues in every city on every Sabbath for many generations.” (Acts 15:13-21 NLT fixed)​

Paul is against the "human effort" in Judaism, as in the story of Hagar, to sabotage the law of God to not remove sin, sin that the law of God is meant to remove. For example, Judaism obeyed not to misuse God's name by not pronouncing His name at all, when their human rule stops the purpose of God's Commandment to separate the sin of misusing His name from our character thanks to the practice gained by the cycle of forgiveness made clear in the animal sacrifices. God's Commandment is meant to separate that sin from our character, that Judaism prevented with their rule that leads to death, because they are preventing God's laws from separating sin from our character.

Well then, since God’s grace has set us free from the law (of Judaism), does that mean we can go on sinning (lawlessness)? Of course not (don't misunderstand God's grace)! Don’t you realize that you become the slave of whatever you choose to obey (sin or God)? You can be a slave to sin (lawlessness), which leads to death (like Judaism's example of sabotaging God's Ten Commandments to not remove sin), or you can choose to obey God (Eleven Commandments), which leads to righteous living (freedom from sin). Thank God (Jesus's many forgivenesses as our High Priest allowing us to grow in obedience through practice of the Eleven Commandments)! Once you were slaves of sin (lawlessness), but now you wholeheartedly obey this teaching we have given you (Eleven Commandments). Now you are free from your slavery to sin (when you obey God's Eleven Commandments), and you have become slaves to righteous living (obeying the Eleven Commandments). (Romans 6:15-18 NLT)​

The sabotage of God's law found in Judaism, like the sabotage in the "human effort" in the story of Hagar, is expressed in the following passage.

Tell me, you who want to live under the law (the rules of Judaism that does not remove sin), do you know what the law actually says? (The law says what is sin) The Scriptures say that Abraham had two sons, one from his slave wife and one from his freeborn wife. The son of the slave wife was born in a human attempt to bring about the fulfillment of God’s promise (the promise to remove sin from our character). But the son of the freeborn wife was born as God’s own fulfillment of his promise. These two women serve as an illustration of God’s two covenants. The first woman, Hagar, represents Mount Sinai where people received the law that enslaved them (Judaism is enslaved in sin because they sabotaged God's law to not remove sin). And now Jerusalem is just like Mount Sinai in Arabia, because she and her children live in slavery (slavery to sin) to the law (added by the translators, not found in the original). But the other woman, Sarah, represents the heavenly Jerusalem. She is the free woman (free from sin), and she is our mother. As Isaiah said, “Rejoice, O childless woman, you who have never given birth! Break into a joyful shout, you who have never been in labor! For the desolate woman now has more children than the woman who lives with her husband!” And you, dear brothers and sisters, are children of the promise (the promise to remove sin from our character), just like Isaac. But you are now being persecuted by those who want you to keep the law (the rules of Judaism that does not remove sin), just as Ishmael, the child born by human effort, persecuted Isaac, the child born by the power of the Spirit. But what do the Scriptures say about that? “Get rid of the slave and her son, for the son of the slave woman will not share the inheritance with the free woman’s son.” So, dear brothers and sisters, we are not children of the slave woman; we are children of the free woman. (Galatians 4:21-31 NLT fixed)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

It may seem unrelated, but it's a subtle thing how words work on us, so...therefore it matters that we say (a better wording) than 'Paul set us free' even when you didn't mean Paul accomplished that great work.

It matters how sentences are worded, and at times there can be confusions, so Paul had at one point by need to write to one city: "Was Paul crucified for you? Were you baptized in the name of Paul? 14 I thank God that I did not baptize any of you except Crispus and Gaius, 15 so no one can say that you were baptized in my name. "

Of course it's Christ that set us free -- and specifically free from the power of sin.

So, that, when we do stumble and sin, we need only confess (honestly, humbly) to God, directly, and we are instantly forgiven and cleansed:

8 If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we claim we have not sinned, we make him out to be a liar and his word is not in us. -- 1rst John 1

Very key though in reading Paul's epistles, we must remember that Paul was writing repeatedly to Jews that had learned they must follow the works of the Law (some of them just man made traditions...) in detail, and he had to repeatedly instruct those particular Jews that their righteousness in the sight of God did not come from their own efforts, but by grace, alone, through faith, so that none can boast. For we are created in Christ Jesus to do the good works that God has prepared for us to do. (from Ephesians 2:8-10)

 

[guevaraj]

You simply claim that "Paul tells us to remove our slavery to sin by obeying God instead of sin, sin kept by the "human attempt" in Judaism." But where is the evidence? Not in Paul's actual words. Anyone can "add commentary " to a passage but you need to have a case that justifies such addition. But you offer no case, merely a bald unsubstantiated claim.

Brother, in brief! Hagar's son to Abraham came from the human will and not from God's will to give Abraham a son through Hagar. Hagar is not the will of God expressed on Mount Sanai but the "human attempt" to fulfill the will of God expressed on Mount Sanai. Therefore, it is not God's laws that are tied to Hagar, but human rules found in Judaism that come from sinful "blind guides" to use laws to accomplish God's will expressed on Mount Sanai, that Jesus says in the following passage: "shut the door of the Kingdom of heaven in people's faces". It is not God's laws expressed on Mount Sanai that "shut the door of the kingdom of heaven in people's faces", it is Judaism's human replacement rules for God's laws that "shut the door of the Kingdom of heaven in people's faces".

“What sorrow awaits you teachers of religious law and you Pharisees. Hypocrites! For you shut the door of the Kingdom of Heaven in people’s faces. You won’t go in yourselves, and you don’t let others enter either. “What sorrow awaits you teachers of religious law and you Pharisees. Hypocrites! For you cross land and sea to make one convert, and then you turn that person into twice the child of hell you yourselves are! “Blind guides! What sorrow awaits you! For you say that it means nothing to swear ‘by God’s Temple,’ but that it is binding to swear ‘by the gold in the Temple.’ Blind fools! Which is more important—the gold or the Temple that makes the gold sacred? And you say that to swear ‘by the altar’ is not binding, but to swear ‘by the gifts on the altar’ is binding. How blind! For which is more important—the gift on the altar or the altar that makes the gift sacred? When you swear ‘by the altar,’ you are swearing by it and by everything on it. And when you swear ‘by the Temple,’ you are swearing by it and by God, who lives in it. And when you swear ‘by heaven,’ you are swearing by the throne of God and by God, who sits on the throne. (Matthew 23:13-22 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[HIM]

I want to address the patently fallacious reasoning that takes us from these words of Paul:

The first woman, Hagar, represents Mount Sinai where people received the law that enslaved them.

....to this distortion of Paul's words:

The first woman, Hagar, represents Mount Sinai where people received the law that enslaved them (Judaism is enslaved in sin because they sabotaged God's law to not remove sin)

What Paul is saying cannot be misunderstood - he is saying that the Law of Moses, which you all should know was delivered at Mount Sinai, enslaved the Jews. Seems like a strange thing for a law that Paul elsewhere describes in these favourable terms:

For I joyfully agree with the law of God [u]in the inner person,

But Paul says it all the same - the Law of Moses enslaves. And he says similar things elsewhere such as here:

I was once alive apart [o]from the Law; but when the commandment came, sin came to life, and I died;

Now then, look at what is going on in this "edited" version of the initial verse from Galatians:

The first woman, Hagar, represents Mount Sinai where people received the law that enslaved them (Judaism is enslaved in sin because they sabotaged God's law to not remove sin)

This is a form of the old bait and switch. To make this kind of edit you have to find a way to distract or confuse the reader with a diversion. And the diversion here is to add to Paul's words something that is both true and indeed related to the Law, namely the claim that Jews in some sense "sabotaged" the law. Well, I would agree with this. But this fact is entirely irrelevant since the Law of Moses can both enslave and be sabotaged.

Words have meaning, sentences have internal logic, and context matters. When Paul writes:

The first woman, Hagar, represents Mount Sinai where people received the law that enslaved them

....there is absolutely no doubt to anyone who knows the broader Biblical context that the "law" delivered at Sinai was not, despite the ruse perpetrated by the edit, a "law of Judaism" which is something other than the Law of Moses. What was delivered at Sinai was, of course, the Law of Moses.

And "enslave" means enslave. And the subject of the verb "enslaved" is, of course, the Law of Moses. And the object of the verb "enslaved" is, of course, the Jews.

Paul is saying, strange though it may seem, that the Law of Moses enslaved the Jews.

Trust Paul, and do not fall for efforts to "sabotage" the obvious meaning of his words.

Because without God through Christ we can't live up to it's standard, which is His. Because we can't without God through Christ we become enslaved and burdened by it. We have been set free from it because we now live by the faith of Christ because we have put on Christ.
It shouldn't be needed anymore but alas it is because most chose to still live through their own power rather than God's through Christ.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Because without God through Christ we can't live up to it's standard, which is His. Because we can't without God through Christ we become enslaved and burdened by it. We have been set free from it because we now live by the faith of Christ because we have put on Christ.
It shouldn't be needed anymore but alas it is because most chose to still live through their own power rather than God's through Christ.

To add the scripture... Gal 3:26 For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. 27 For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

Gal 2:20 I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself for me.

If we live for Christ, we need to live as Christ did as He is our example to follow. Jesus lived in complete obedience to the will of God John 6:38 and all of His commandments John 15:10, including Sabbath-keeping. Luke 4:16 which He said was made for us (mankind) Mark 2:27 and given to be a blessing Isaiah 58:13-14

 

[Bob S]

In Psalms 119:142, the Torah is truth, so you post is opposed to following truth, and Jesus did not set us free from truth, but just the opposite, truth is what sets us free from bondage to sin (John 8:31-36). In Deuteronomy 13:1-5, the way that God instructed His people to determine that someone is a false prophet who is not speaking for Him is if they taught against following the Torah, so if Jesus had tried to do what you suggest, then those who reject him as being a false prophet would be correctly acting in accordance with what God has instructed His people to do. However, in Titus 2:14, it does not say that Jesus gave himself to free us from God's law, but in order to free us from all lawlessness, so the way to believe in what Jesus accomplished at Calvary is by becoming zealous for doing good works in obedience to the Torah (Acts 21:20), while the way to reject what Jesus accomplished at Torah is by you promoting the lawlessness that he gave himself to redeem us from. Jesus spent his ministry teaching his followers how to obey the Torah by word and by example, and he did not establish the New Covenant for the purpose of undermining everything that he taught and accomplished through the cross, but rather the New Covenant still involves following the Torah (Jeremiah 31:33), which includes the command to keep the Sabbath holy.



In Psalms 119:160, all of God's righteous laws are eternal, however, Ephesians 2:14-15 is referring to a law that is not eternal, therefore it is not referring to any of God's laws. In Ephesians 2:10, we are new creations in Christ to do good works, so it wouldn't make sense to interpret a few verses later as saying that Jesus ended God's instructions for how to equip us to do every good work, especially because God's instructions for how to do good works are not a dividing wall of hostility. God did not make any mistakes when He gave His law, so He had no need to send Jesus to abolish His own law, especially when He instructed His people not to listen to anyone who speaks against obeying it even if they perform signs and wonders. Instructions for how to act in accordance with God's nature can't be ended without first ending God.

The Greek word "dogma" is used five times in the Bible, twice in regard to the decrees of Caesar (Luke 2:1, Acts 17:7), and once, in regard to the decree of the Jerusalem Council (Acts 16:4), so you need to give justification for why it should be interpreted in Ephesians 2:15 as referring to all of the Law of God, and justification for why Paul should interpreted in a way that makes him out to be a false prophet and then justification for why we should follow a false prophet instead of God. The reality is that Paul was a servant of God who never spoke against anyone obeying Him and your post should be rejected as being in opposition to truth.

Hi Soyeong, you quote Psalms 119:160 telling us: In Psalms 119:160, all of God's righteous laws are eternal, but that is not what the verse is telling us.
160 The entirety of Your word is truth, And every one of Your righteous judgments endures forever. Look up the word "judgement". Nowhere does it interpret judgement with 'Law". All I see is a desperate attempt to deny what Paul actually said in Eph2:15. Psalms 119:142 reads: Your righteousness is everlasting and your law is true. Neither verse says the Law that God gave to Israel is "forever". I totally agree with those two scriptures. God is forever a righteous God and all His laws WERE true for the ones He gave them to, Israel. The fact is God gave Israel many laws that were for Israel and not any other people on Earth. They are classified as being ceremonial or ritual. God wanted the Israelites to remember their release from bondage, so He gave them the ritual Sabbath as a reminder. No other nation was involved in being delivered for Egypt, so why would any other nation be concerned with that law? Oh, you will say the Sabbath started at Creation and everyone observed it. The problem is you cannot prove it, so that nothing but hearsay.

God is God to all creation and the fact is He never ever asked any other of His Creation to keep the ceremonial or ritual laws He gave His people Israel. So, I ask you why you insist that I should think like you? You have never in any of your posts ever revealed that you understand why Jeremiah prophesied a NEW AND BETTER COVENANT FOR ISRAEL. All you have done is to try to defend the old defunct covenant that Israel failed, in every aspect, to keep. In the New Testament new covenant, there is not one demand to observe the ceremonial demands of the defunct one.

Here it is Good Friday and for the Israelites ready to escape Egypt Passover has passed. For the next 25 days they traveled to the Red Sea.
It is interesting to note that the Sabbath was given to Israel on the 28th day of Israel's flight out of Egypt. For 3 7th days they were fleeing. It was not until the 4th 7th day that God had them rest and the Manna. Care to speculate just why God didn't have them stop on the 1st 7th day, 2nd 7th day or the 3rd 7th day if keeping the day was eternal and so very important?

 

[guevaraj]

You have never in any of your posts ever revealed that you understand why Jeremiah prophesied a NEW AND BETTER COVENANT FOR ISRAEL.

Brother, happy Sabbath, which started this Friday April 7, 2023 at 12:02 am EDT! What is more complete in the new covenant is Jesus' example of the glory of God compared to the written short list of the Ten Commandments. I believe the reason you think you can personally do better than God's guaranteed written Ten Commandments in the Bible through prophets is because of a misunderstanding of the following passage. Critical to the proper understanding of this passage is that God is Spirit: Jesus being God is Spirit. What is compared is Jesus' example of obedience to the Eleven Commandments as more complete than the written Eleven Commandments. To understand this comparison I will use the analogy of replacing a broken window. No doubt it is more complete to follow a professional installer's example than the instructions in a brief manual. The reason the Ten Commandments end in death for Judaism is that they sabotaged God's Ten Commandments to not remove sin that Paul protects against by focusing on sin rather than obeying the law of Judaism as Judaism did. Judaism obeyed the commandment of not misusing God's name by not pronouncing His name at all. This obedience skipped the law's purpose to remove sin from our character. They would have learned to use God's name properly had they done what God asked instead of replacing what God asked with their own "human effort" to obey that did not remove the sin that doing what God asked would have removed.

We are confident of all this because of our great trust in God through Christ. It is not that we think we are qualified to do anything on our own. Our qualification comes from God. He has enabled us to be ministers of his new covenant. This is a covenant not of written laws (Eleven Commandments), but of the Spirit (Jesus' example). The old written covenant ends in death (sabotaged to not remove sin); but under the new covenant, the Spirit (Jesus' example) gives life. The old way (written laws), with laws etched in stone (Ten Commandments), led to death (Sabotaged to not remove sin), though it began with such glory (Ten Commandments) that the people of Israel could not bear to look at Moses’ face. For his face shone with the glory of God, even though the brightness was already fading away (sabotaged to not remove sin). Shouldn’t we expect far greater glory (Eleven Commandments) under the new way (Jesus' example), now that the Holy Spirit (reminding us of Jesus' example) is giving life? If the old way (written laws), which brings condemnation, was glorious (Ten Commandments), how much more glorious (Eleven Commandments) is the new way (Jesus' example), which makes us right with God (removes sin)! In fact, that first glory (Ten Commandments) was not glorious at all compared with the overwhelming glory (Eleven Commandments) of the new way (Jesus' example). So if the old way (written laws), which has been replaced, was glorious (Ten Commandments), how much more glorious (Eleven Commandments) is the new (Jesus' example), which remains forever! (2 Corinthians 3:4-11 NLT overlaid with commentary)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[expos4ever]

Brother, in brief! Hagar's son to Abraham came from the human will and not from God's will to give Abraham a son through Hagar.

True, but please, how can you not understand that the fact that Scripture is rife with examples of people following human will does not remotely justify your claiming that when Paul says we are free from the Law, he must mean we are free misguided human efforts to follow that law! This is basic logic - the one does not follow from the other.

Imagine the government one day says "you are free from the law restricting speeds on the highway to less than 55 miles per hour". Now imagine there were some people who misinterpreted that law, for example by insisting that one cannot drive faster than 45, or that one can text while driving as long as you do not go over 55.

Now then, in light of the above, imagine how utterly inane it would be for someone to interpret the government's edict that the 55 mph limit is no longer in effect in this way: The edict is still in effect - what the government is really saying here (when they say the 55 limit is repealed) is that we have to do away with all the extra rules people have come up with on their own.

That interpretation makes no sense, just as your take on what Paul means makes no sense.

 

[guevaraj]

your take on what Paul means makes no sense.

Brother, happy Sabbath, which starts this Friday April 14, 2023 at 12:07 am EDT! With the rapid cycle of our High Priest Jesus' many forgivenesses for past sins through prayer in the following passage compared to the old slow way of animal sacrifices, we can fulfill Judaism's "human effort" to obey the law of God without their human shortcuts to obey, where they skipped the removal of sin from our character the law of God is meant to remove.

Pray like this: Our Father in heaven, may your name be kept holy. May your Kingdom come soon. May your will be done on earth, as it is in heaven. Give us today the food we need, and forgive us our sins, as we have forgiven those who sin against us. And don’t let us yield to temptation, but rescue us from the evil one. “If you forgive those who sin against you, your heavenly Father will forgive you. But if you refuse to forgive others, your Father will not forgive your sins. (Matthew 6:9-15 NLT)​

Thanks to the rapid cycle of many forgivnesses above for past sins continuing the previous slower cycle with animal sacrifices, we can learn to use God's name correctly without the need for Judaism's shortcut to obey by not uttering God's name at all. Complying truly with the law of God through faith in God's ability to remove sin from our character through His Eleven Commandments, we can achieve the desire of Judaism's blind-guided "human effort" to obey when they sabotage God's law with their own human rules to help them obey the law of God.

But now God has shown us a way to be made right with him without keeping the requirements of the law (of Judaism), as was promised in the writings of Moses and the prophets long ago. We are made right with God by placing our faith in Jesus Christ. And this is true for everyone who believes, no matter who we are. For everyone has sinned; we all fall short of God’s glorious standard. Yet God, in his grace, freely makes us right in his sight. He did this through Christ Jesus when he freed us from the penalty for our sins. For God presented Jesus as the sacrifice for sin. People are made right with God when they believe that Jesus sacrificed his life, shedding his blood. This sacrifice shows that God was being fair when he held back and did not punish those who sinned in times past, for he was looking ahead and including them in what he would do in this present time. God did this to demonstrate his righteousness, for he himself is fair and just, and he makes sinners right in his sight when they believe in Jesus. Can we boast, then, that we have done anything to be accepted by God? No, because our acquittal is not based on obeying the law (of Judaism). It is based on faith. So we are made right with God through faith and not by obeying the law (of Judaism). After all, is God the God of the Jews only? Isn’t he also the God of the Gentiles? Of course he is. There is only one God, and he makes people right with himself only by faith, whether they are Jews or Gentiles. Well then, if we emphasize faith, does this mean that we can forget about the law (of Judaism)? Of course not! In fact, only when we have faith do we truly fulfill the law (of Judaism). (Romans 3:21-31 NLT overlaid with commentary)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[expos4ever]

Brother, happy Sabbath, which starts this Friday April 14, 2023 at 12:07 am EDT! With the rapid cycle of our High Priest Jesus' many forgivenesses for past sins through prayer in the following passage compared to the old slow way of animal sacrifices, we can fulfill Judaism's "human effort" to obey the law of God without their human shortcuts to obey, where they skipped the removal of sin from our character the law of God is meant to remove.

An obvious diversion. You simply will not engage clear counterarguments to your position and appear to simply repeat the same flawed arguments over and over again. Again, it is obvious that the fact there were indeed distortions to the Law of Moses is completely irrelevant to the question of the current status of the Law.

Paul tells us that the Law has been retired. You insist on misrepresenting him by introducing this diversion about "the law of Judaism"

But now God has shown us a way to be made right with him without keeping the requirements of the law (of Judaism), as was promised in the writings of Moses and the prophets long ago. We are made right with God by placing our faith in Jesus Christ. And this is true for everyone who believes, no matter who we are. For everyone has sinned; we all fall short of God’s glorious standard. Yet God, in his grace, freely makes us right in his sight. He did this through Christ Jesus when he freed us from the penalty for our sins. For God presented Jesus as the sacrifice for sin. People are made right with God when they believe that Jesus sacrificed his life, shedding his blood. This sacrifice shows that God was being fair when he held back and did not punish those who sinned in times past, for he was looking ahead and including them in what he would do in this present time. God did this to demonstrate his righteousness, for he himself is fair and just, and he makes sinners right in his sight when they believe in Jesus. Can we boast, then, that we have done anything to be accepted by God? No, because our acquittal is not based on obeying the law (of Judaism). It is based on faith. So we are made right with God through faith and not by obeying the law (of Judaism). After all, is God the God of the Jews only? Isn’t he also the God of the Gentiles? Of course he is. There is only one God, and he makes people right with himself only by faith, whether they are Jews or Gentiles. Well then, if we emphasize faith, does this mean that we can forget about the law (of Judaism)? Of course not! In fact, only when we have faith do we truly fulfill the law (of Judaism). (Romans 3:21-31 NLT)

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

Please stop with your thinly-veiled attempts to rewrite scripture - I suspect this is against forum rules.

For example, this is what the Bible says:

But now God has shown us a way to be made right with him without keeping the requirements of the law, as was promised in the writings of Moses[i] and the prophets long ago.

And here is your version:

But now God has shown us a way to be made right with him without keeping the requirements of the law (of Judaism), as was promised in the writings of Moses and the prophets long ago.

You seem to think it is acceptable to deceive potentially naive readers by inserting your own words to change the meaning of the text!

 

[Soyeong]

The written Law of Moses is a carbon copy of spiritual Laws that all humans are born with. The thing is, if a man is NOT aware of these Laws (eg. he's too young, limits installed by God Himself etc) , he is NOT guilty of Sin. It's not until he becomes aware of of the Law and breaks them that he is guilty of Sin. As soon as a man becomes aware of Laws and told to not break said Laws, what does he do? He BREAKS them. He does the opposite of what he is told not to do. This is why "The Law" is called the Law of Sin and death. Our fleshy minds are wired to be this way, we are in bondage to thinking/behaving this way and we are powerless over it.. The only thing that we will obey when we are told not to do something bad, illegal, spiritual or otherwise, is the Knowledge of Grace and Mercy. You have to REALLY believe that God wont punish you for "being a bad person", if you want to stop being a bad person. And you can't REALLY believe unless God gives you his Holy Spirit.

In Romans 7:25, Paul directly contrasted the Law of God with the law of sin, so they are not the same, but rather they work at opposite purposes. In Romans 7:7, the Law of God is not sinful, but is how we know what sin is, and when our sin is made known to us, then that leads us to repent and causes sin to decrease, so God's law is a blessing (Psalms 119:1-3). There is nothing innate to the Law of God that causes us to sin, which is why Paul said in Romans 7:12-13 that it is holy, righteous, and good, and that it was not that which is good that brought death to him. Rather, the issue is that sin was acting upon the Law of God to cause sin to increase. Paul said that there was a law of sin working within his members to cause hi not to do the good that he wanted to do, so the issue is that there is something in us that is causing us to want to do the opposite of what we are told to do, which stirs up sinful passions in order to bear fruit unto death, and which is the law of sin.

It wont allow me to edit so I am typing it here: When I talked about becoming aware of the Law, I was not referring to the written Law, I was referring to becoming aware of wrong & right naturally, as you age. Every human experiences this to various degrees depending on mental capacity and God's Grace or lack there off, religious or not. These are the Laws we break that condemn us. The written Law condemns us even faster because of the concentration of Law knowledge that is unnaturally entering your mind. These Laws, you really should not be learning in the first place. It should happen slowly and fairly through life experience.. You HARM and curse people by preaching Law, so stay away from it!

In Deuteronomy 30:11-20, it says that God's law is not too difficult to obey and that obedience brings life and a blessing while disobedience brings death and a curse, so choose life! The are many other verses that say the same thing and our own good (Deuteronomy 6:24, 10:12-13), so the opposite is true in that you are causing harm and a curse to people by preaching to stay away from it. In Matthew 4:17-23, Jesus began his ministry with the Gospel message to repent for the Kingdom of God is at hand, and God's law is how his audience knew what sin is (Romans 3:20), so repenting from our disobedience to it is central to the Gospel message, which was in accordance with Acts 3:25-26, where Jesus was sent as the fulfillment of the promise to bless us by turning us from our wickedness, so by claiming that you harm and curse people by preaching God's law, you are acting in direct opposition to spreading the Gospel in accordance with faith in the promise.

 

[HIM]

The question was asked what law did Paul set us free from. He didn't God did, and it His Law we are set free from through Christ. We are no longer in bondage to it because we are not breaking it. We are not sinning through Christ. And if we are sinning then we are still under a tutor, the Schoolmaster, the Law and are only living partly in Christ if at all.

 

[Soyeong]

I agree with your first paragraph except I never said that God's Law causes us to Sin. “The law” I was refering to was Paul's “But I see another Law in my members” - the one that causes us to rebel agains God's laws. Maybe my wording should have been clearer. Other than that, I agree with your first paragraph.

Your second paragraph, I don't agree with.

It's obvious that Deuteronomy 30:11-20 is not God's nature, or patterns of dealing with His Sheep. The mentalities are completely different. Why can't you see that?

Father god: Do this for me and I'll give you stuff! If you cross me, or disobey me, I'll take my blessing away, or even destroy you, do as I say, now!

Do not insult my God by attributing such a nature to Him. It's down right blasphemy to attribute Father god's nature to God the Father. You insult the Spirit of Grace.

Who do you think are the Father god God the Father and what is the difference between them? Which one created the world, which one is the God of Israel, and which one is Jesus one with? The Bible doesn't treat the Father as being two different entities. You mischaracterized what is happening in Deuteronomy 30:11-20. In Deuteronomy 6:24 and 10:12-13, it says that God's law was given for our own good. Like a good father, God wants to bless us and does so by teaching us how to living blesses lives. The blessing and the curses are intrinsic to the action, so it is like a father teaching his child that they will be blessed if they exercise regularly and cursed if they use addictive drugs. It is good for fathers to teach their children how to rightly live in a way that will be for their own good. In Psalms 119:29, David wanted God to be gracious to him by teaching him to obey His law, so that is accordance with grace, not insulting to it.

Deuteronomy 30:11 KJV For this commandment which I command thee this day, it is not hidden from thee, neither is it far off.
King James version does not say “it's not too difficult”. - just throwing that out there.

And what would be the result of ordering someone to choose life, or commanding someone to do anything at all? They would rebel. The Israelites were a perfect example of what happens to people when you try to lead them with Law. Failure and an angry God (god) who takes your blessings away and curses you. God the Father does not order anyone to Choose Life. (because he simply cant choose life, the “Law in his members” cause him to be rebel, remember what Paul was agonizing over?) Spiritual Life is a gift of God given to the subjects of Mercy. It is not a result of following Father god's ordered Carbon copy Laws, it's a result of having the Holy Spirit in you and following God's Laws in spirit.

Everything in Deuteronomy 30:11-14 is building to the point that God's law is not beyond our capabilities, but that the word is very
very near us, in our mouth and in our heart, that we may do it, so saying that it is not too difficult is expressing the same thought as saying that it not far off.

Before Adam and Eve ate from either tree, they were at a crossroads between immortality and mortality where they would have become immortal if they ate from the Tree of Life, but eating from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil caused them to become mortal, so they were given a choice between life and death and commanding them not to eat from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil, which is the same situation as Deuteronomy 30:15-20, where they were at a crossroads between life and death and commanded to choose life. So nature of God expressed in Deuteronomy 30:11-20 is the same as the nature of the God who created the world.

Some Israelites choose life while others did not. The good kings tended to live for much longer than the evil kings did, so adding up the years, they were under a good king for roughly 80% of them time, which is again is mischaracterized as being a failure and an angry god who takes your blessing away and curses you. We have an inclination for good, an inclination for evil, and we have the same choice to make between life and death. God's gives His gift of life by teaching us how to choose life. In Exodus 33:13, Moses wanted God to be gracious to him by teaching him His way that he might know Him and Israel too, in 1 Kings 2:1-3, God taught how to walk in His way through the Mosaic Law, and in John 17:3, eternal life is knowing God and Jesus, so again that is the way to choose eternal life, which is in accordance with what Jesus said in Matthew 19:17 and Luke 10:25-28.

What exactly do you mean by Father god's ordered Carbon copy Laws and what exactly do you mean by God's Laws?