Florida rejects math books containing CRT

[Ana the Ist]

My comment was replying to the "history and civil government questions" mention in the post I was replying to. Not a lot of need for regurgitating geography trivia from a century ago in modern high paying jobs.

My mistake.

 

[KCfromNC]

People say that who don't like memorizing facts, but interestingly, those who can't or won't memorize anything are not proven as a group to have any greater level of achievement. But the ability to gain and retain vast amounts of information seems to be extremely common among those who have attained high educational achievement.

Even if true, it doesn't really point to people today having trouble answering the trivia factoids on a test written a hundred+ years ago meaning much of anything about the quality of education now vs. then.

 

[Ponderous Curmudgeon]

Sure...You're a couple of grumpy old men reminiscing about the "good old days".

If you can't add basic fractions what makes you think you'd be "ok with all the maths" as you put it?

On the contrary, I can and if that last post was to be an example of your greater understanding, all I can do is laugh.

 

[Ponderous Curmudgeon]

Sure...You're a couple of grumpy old men reminiscing about the "good old days".

If you can't add basic fractions what makes you think you'd be "ok with all the maths" as you put it?

Uh, you could demonstrate some knowledge of the changes in teaching over the years.

 

[Bradskii]

Never used a slide rule. But we used log tables a lot, especially when I started working. In my first job I often had to calculate the exact length of pipework that had a lot of bends so I used trigonometry a lot. And this was in the UK before it went metric. So you had to divide something like 7' 3 23/64" by 9' 11 3/64". Yikes!

But we had something called Smalley's Tables - which converted the lengths to feet and a decimal component and gave you the log of those figures. You added them together and then reversed the process and looked up the anti-log which gave you the calculated length.

Gee, that brought back a lot of memories I'd rather forget...

 

[cow451]

So…. I still haven’t seen any examples of actual CRT in these math books.

 

[MehGuy]

The FDOE’s announcement comes as Gov. Ron DeSantis has taken a lead role nationally in Republican efforts to aggressively push back against liberal cultural values and “woke indoctrination.”
Florida DOE rejects 54 math books due to critical race theory content

I guess I don't get it. What would CRT in math even look like?

Have all the black representation you want in your math text books, as long as you're still teaching the core course material. We can look at the national test scores later and see if the representation helped even out disparities.

 

[Ana the Ist]

Uh, you could demonstrate some knowledge of the changes in teaching over the years.

Sure...

While millions of dollars are federally allocated to schools in need across the US, this has basically become a dumping ground for pop psychology nonsense and cronyism. In my day, they emphasized "self esteem" for several years in multiple grades and I had no idea why.

As it turns out....self esteem is a sort of nebulous vague concept with no real grounding in psychology. Who knows how many millions were handed to the relatives of politicians and donors who had some garbage degree they couldn't make a dollar with?

For some reason, about 3/4ths of this country is too dumb to understand they're being robbed. Those hundreds of millions if not billions are being pocketed while bogus solutions that blame anything except the shallow superficial consumerist culture and declining family support structure. What are they selling the dumb this year? They want you to believe Junior can't pass basic English because his teacher has a different skin color lol. How dumb does someone have to be to eat that up? It's not even a viable solution unless the class is one race lol.

How about the fact that teachers aren't very good? They simply aren't. I had maybe 6 good teachers....noticeably so....and at least 4 times that many mediocre to poor ones. Teaching is a bad deal...for some reason, the degree and certification is an overly long and expensive process that for some reason, never includes learning how to teach a subject. Then they go off to work the worst schools first...because no one wants to work on those kids. It sounds like a well paying job, but it pays about 5$ a year and that's almost 3$ too much for the value.

If you don't think you're being robbed, find out how much federal funding your public school gets and then ask the teachers if they have to buy their own supplies. Your public school probably gets a hefty chunk of change....but it doesn't go to your child's education. Example?

Your current Attorney General has a son in law who runs a survey website (2-3 person business) that asks students and teachers how they feel about their schools....then prescribes the solution outlined above. How much does he make in federal funding for this valuable service? Over 100 million last I checked.

Shall I continue? You were saying something interesting about calculators. I don't want to interrupt.

 

[RDKirk]

As it turns out....self esteem is a sort of nebulous vague concept with no real grounding in psychology. Who knows how many millions were handed to the relatives of politicians and donors who had some garbage degree they couldn't make a dollar with?

There is a way to instill an esteem of self. It's been known for thousands of years.

The way we did it in Boy Scouts a generation ago:

1. Place the boy in an organization that is esteemed by his society.
2. The organization gives him goals.
2a. The goals must require a level of determination to complete that is close to the limits of the boy's capabilities.
2b. The goals must be certified as completed by a master.
3. The organization applauds the boy's accomplishments. The boy's society joins in with the accolations.
4. Repeat
5. Repeat
6. Repeat

Hmmm. The military does that too.

 

[RDKirk]

My grandmother was a farm wife, married in 1925 at 15, with an eighth-grade education.

She taught her five children how to read before they started school. They all went to college.

She taught me how to read before I started school.

I don't believe there is any valid reason why there are kids being graduated today after 12 years of school without knowing how to read.

 

[Ponderous Curmudgeon]

Sure...

While millions of dollars are federally allocated to schools in need across the US, this has basically become a dumping ground for pop psychology nonsense and cronyism. In my day, they emphasized "self esteem" for several years in multiple grades and I had no idea why.

As it turns out....self esteem is a sort of nebulous vague concept with no real grounding in psychology. Who knows how many millions were handed to the relatives of politicians and donors who had some garbage degree they couldn't make a dollar with?

For some reason, about 3/4ths of this country is too dumb to understand they're being robbed. Those hundreds of millions if not billions are being pocketed while bogus solutions that blame anything except the shallow superficial consumerist culture and declining family support structure. What are they selling the dumb this year? They want you to believe Junior can't pass basic English because his teacher has a different skin color lol. How dumb does someone have to be to eat that up? It's not even a viable solution unless the class is one race lol.

How about the fact that teachers aren't very good? They simply aren't. I had maybe 6 good teachers....noticeably so....and at least 4 times that many mediocre to poor ones. Teaching is a bad deal...for some reason, the degree and certification is an overly long and expensive process that for some reason, never includes learning how to teach a subject. Then they go off to work the worst schools first...because no one wants to work on those kids. It sounds like a well paying job, but it pays about 5$ a year and that's almost 3$ too much for the value.

If you don't think you're being robbed, find out how much federal funding your public school gets and then ask the teachers if they have to buy their own supplies. Your public school probably gets a hefty chunk of change....but it doesn't go to your child's education. Example?

Your current Attorney General has a son in law who runs a survey website (2-3 person business) that asks students and teachers how they feel about their schools....then prescribes the solution outlined above. How much does he make in federal funding for this valuable service? Over 100 million last I checked.

Shall I continue? You were saying something interesting about calculators. I don't want to interrupt.

Nice pile of assertions, don't bother replying.

 

[Ponderous Curmudgeon]

There is a way to instill an esteem of self. It's been known for thousands of years.

The way we did it in Boy Scouts a generation ago:

1. Place the boy in an organization that is esteemed by his society.
2. The organization gives him goals.
2a. The goals must require a level of determination to complete that is close to the limits of the boy's capabilities.
2b. The goals must be certified as completed by a master.
3. The organization applauds the boy's accomplishments. The boy's society joins in with the accolations.
4. Repeat
5. Repeat
6. Repeat

Hmmm. The military does that too.

sounds a lot like education as well, challenge each person to achieve mastery of a given set of tasks, reward them when they do.

 

[Ana the Ist]

My grandmother was a farm wife, married in 1925 at 15, with an eighth-grade education.

She taught her five children how to read before they started school. They all went to college.

She taught me how to read before I started school.

I don't believe there is any valid reason why there are kids being graduated today after 12 years of school without knowing how to read.

Yeah, I wonder how many children today learn basic reading, adding, subtracting, before entering school.

My parents read to me, arguably, Sesame Street taught me to read. The thing they did where the syllables come together in the middle of the screen? It just kinda clicked one day that I knew the sounds before I heard them and could probably pick out words. So I grabbed a big book and looked for words I could read. Parents were practically hysterical, I don't know how young I was but it was pre-kindergarten.

I do remember my parents prepping me. I do remember them sitting me down and going over the alphabet and addition and other simple things. I remember, more than anything, the insistence upon reading that was forced on me. From about age 7 or 8 to 12...I had an escalating number of books I was required to read and explain to my parents, every summer, between school years. I started at 3 small books and by 12 I'm reading about 5 medium sized (300 pages?) novels a summer. By that point I was allowed to choose anything I wanted to read. I think I finished Stephen Kings Misery in a day at 11 or 12. The requirement was dropped by the time I entered high school but by that time I enjoyed reading.

 

[RDKirk]

sounds a lot like education as well, challenge each person to achieve mastery of a given set of tasks, reward them when they do.

I don't think so, at least not so much anymore. I recall my first grade teacher having that technique (oh, how much did I lust for, and remember, her saying "You're sharp today!"), but that was back in the 50s.

These days they put the cart before the horse and give praise before accomplishment.

 

[RDKirk]

Yeah, I wonder how many children today learn basic reading, adding, subtracting, before entering school.

They shouldn't have to. That's not my point.

My point is that if a farm wife with an eighth-grade education can teach five-year-old kids to read in just a few months, why is it that trained and certified teachers often don't produce readers in 12 years?

 

[Bradskii]

In my day, they emphasized "self esteem" for several years in multiple grades and I had no idea why.

Maybe because it's vitally important. If not critical. Especially during one's formative years. Maybe you don't have children - as this is blazingly obvious to parents.

 

[Ana the Ist]

Nice pile of assertions, don't bother replying.

Uh huh....assertions.

https://thehill.com/opinion/educati...-funding-for-schools-doesnt-help-students-or/

15k per kid average....but clearly not evenly distributed....not that that's a problem. Where does it all go? That slice of pizza they get for lunch? The textbooks that are 5 years old?

https://www.clarkcountytoday.com/op...race-theory-type-programs-not-student-learni/

They spend it on ways to teach your child's teacher. Who are these people? I wonder....

Social Emotional Learning? Do you think that's a valid concept? We're already social and emotional creatures...do you think kids today have a problem with being social or emotional?

 

[Ana the Ist]

Maybe because it's vitally important. If not critical. Especially during one's formative years. Maybe you don't have children - as this is blazingly obvious to parents.

Fake.

Schools are still peddling the self-esteem hoax

You got robbed.

 

[Ana the Ist]

They shouldn't have to. That's not my point.

My point is that if a farm wife with an eighth-grade education can teach five-year-old kids to read in just a few months, why is it that trained and certified teachers often don't produce readers in 12 years?

I'd swear I just posted on this very topic.

Did they have any sayings about teachers when you went to school?

Those who can...do.

Those who can't....teach.

 

[Bradskii]

Fake.

Schools are still peddling the self-esteem hoax

You got robbed.

Ignoring for the moment any manufactured method of getting children to achieve self esteem (it should be partly a natural result of a good education), are you really saying that it's not necessary? You did say that you didn't know why it was emphasised as being important.