Feast Days

[BobRyan]

ATONEMENT (Leviticus 23.26-32)
(The day when the High Priest atoned for the sins of Israel)
Tishri 10

I have been working on this Day of Atonement and the significance, which I have shown what I have found so far. I believe there is more to understand, and I believe that it plays a role in our understanding the how and why things in Revelation and the last days of earth's history will play out. .

So then I recommend this post -
17 minutes ago #13

 

[BobRyan]

On the Day of Atonement, there will be the coming of the Lord to His temple, .. The second coming, and the coming of the Lord to His temple, are distinct and separate events. The Day of Atonement is the coming to His temple and the Feast of Tabernacles is the second coming.

Agreed but only as quoted above ... see post 13

In Dan 7 we see the Son of Man coming to the Ancient of Days - to the courtroom - in the Temple of God... the Holy of Holies. It is His coming to that part of the temple indicating the start of the Day of Atonement , judgment.

BTW for this to work as a conversation you need to post a few points not 100 -- so we can discuss and focus on what is most important in a sequence.

(trust me - I could flood this thread with reams of material if that were the objective)

 

[BobRyan]

My concern was over the ritual taking priority over the significance of the reality. Just like the passover lamb when it went from ritual to reality, many did not see what had occurred. To not be a part of those that miss the boat because of lack of understanding when it comes to the second coming, is my ultimate objective.
.

I am fine with that - God uses the symbols as a teaching aid - a visual aid for the reader but we need to differentiate after the cross between the need to study the symbols vs the need to engage in a liturgy of animal sacrifice once the cross is in the past.

 

[BobRyan]

The Feast of Trumpets is about a remembrance, but the Bible does not tell us what we are supposed to remember!
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I have always viewed the ten days of Awe as the announcement, the forerunner - of the start of the Day of Atonement

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Since the ceremonial feasts are there for a reason, since God always has deeper meaning to everything He does. Since the new covenant had the spring time feasts fulfilled in a reality lets take a closer look at the fall feasts that God has given us.

Feast of TRUMPETS (Leviticus 23.23-25)
(First day of the seventh month and start of the civil year) Tishri 1

Interesting that you find the Trumpets in Revelation. It would take understanding the Feast of Trumpets through scripture in the OT and through prophecy of OT prophets and NT prophets to understand the significance of these fall feasts.

ATONEMENT (Leviticus 23.26-32)
(The day when the High Priest atoned for the sins of Israel)
Tishri 10

I have been working on this Day of Atonement and the significance, which I have shown what I have found so far. I believe there is more to understand, and I believe that it plays a role in our understanding the how and why things in Revelation and the last days of earth's history will play out. It will also show us where we are to be spiritually in order to receive the blessings of the ceremonial fall feasts like the disciples were in the upper room and received the baptism of the Holy Spirit on Pentacost.

FEAST OF TABERNACLES (Leviticus 23.33-43)
(Final fall harvest of the Land)
Tishri 15-21

Final Harvest..... from the first fruits of those ressurected to the final harvest which are those that will meet the Lord in the air, those that are alive and those that are woke up by the Trump of God.

Hi Guys nice to see you here. Hope you do not mind if I make a few comments as I think this is a good topic that I have already been having discussion elsewhere in the forums with Soyeong, HARK! and Studyman on other topics elsewhere (PS it was not me that reported Studyman and got him banned contrary to popular opinion).

For me personally, I do not have any problems with people wanting to keep the Feast days if they understand what they point to and they understand no one keeps the Feast days today according to the Torah of the old covenant. The question is are they compulsory? Absolutely not! Although let me explain from the scriptures why they are not compulsory.

According to the book of Hebrews, Exodus, Leviticus and Deuteronomy and elsewhere it is impossible to separate the old covenant Torah laws for the Feast days from the "shadow laws" for remission of sins in which they were directly linked as a requirement for their observance (animal sacrifices and sin offerings, Levitical Priesthood and an earthly Sanctuary).

Therefore, it is very clear in the new covenant scriptures found in Hebrews 7 to Hebrews 10 that Christ who these "shadow laws" of animal sacrifices and sin offerings all pointed to are fulfilled and continued under the new covenant in Christ once and for all *Hebrews 10:10 (see Hebrews 10:1-17).

There has also been a change in the Levitical Priesthood to the order of Melchisedec (meaning King Priest) of which Jesus is now our great High Priest ministering on our behalf in the Heavenly Sanctuary that the Lord pitched and not man (Hebrews 9:1-28) of which the earthly was only a copy (shadow) *Hebrews 8:2.

This now means in the new covenant that these laws for remission of sins of the old covenant are "shadow laws" pointing to the body of Christ as the coming Messiah as God's sacrifice for the sins of the world once and for all *John 1:29; 36; Hebrews 10:10 and we are in the new covenant now according to the scriptures and now God's laws for remission of sins are based on better promises *Hebrews 8:1-6 on Christs true sacrifice and ministration on our behalf in the Heavenly Sanctuary not made with hands Hebrews 10:10.

So does this now mean that all these "shadow laws" like circumcision, animal sacrifices, the Levitical Priesthood and the earthly Sanctuary and the Feast days are abolished? Absolutely not! It means they are now fulfilled in that to which they pointed to; the shadow pointed to the body of Christ and are now continued in Christ to who they pointed to so therefore are forever although the process has changed in the new covenant which are now in Christ based on better promises in a new covenant *Hebrews 10:1-17.

It is impossible to separate the old covenant Feast days from the old covenant sacrificial system to which they are inexplicably linked to according to the Torah. Therefore no one keeps the old covenant Feast days according to the Torah today because there are no more animal sacrifices and sin offerings, no more Levitical Priesthood and no more earthly Sanctuary and a new covenant showing that these "shadow laws" (animal sacrifices and sin offerings, Levitical Priesthood, and earthly Sanctuary) are now fulfilled and continued in Christ to who they pointed to.

Hope this is helpful.

 

[Laureate]

True. Those feasts predicted both the first coming and the 2nd coming. The first coming happened 2000 years ago.

the second coming is future.

I think we agree on this as well.

A Future date is a day that is no longer Future when that day becomes Present, i.e., if the Physical Body of Yᵊsʰûʷəʰ rose (Early) on the Third Day, (while it was yet Dark), and because a Day is as a thousand years, and we are currently in the Third Millennium, therefore, we are (according to scripture) in the Third Day.

As Faithful Witnesses, who keep Watch, we are capable of Knowing what Watch (a three hour period) in the Night that he shall come;

The passage quoted, a Day is as a Thousand Years...., is a partial quotation taken from Psalms, and it concludes, ....and as a Watch in the Night: which is a three Hour period, subsequently, a Faithful person is not only able to know what Three Hour period the (Unknown) Hour is in, they are also able to narrow the (Unknown Day) down to being One of Three Days, the Millennium however, should not be a Mystery, though we are informed that No Man Knows the Day or Hour, it does not include, No Man Knows the Millennium.

 

[pasifika]

I think everyone here would agree on that point.



Agreed as well.



agreed.




As noted above I agree that studying the feasts to find out what they reveal about the Gospel is very beneficial to Christianity. I am not clear on what "else" would be learned by celebrating them that cannot also be learned by studying them however.

Hello Bob, how can you agree with visionary regarding feast days as an everlasting ordinance...But as you pointed out in the OP that you agree with Ellen White SDA that believes the feast days ended at the cross???

So are you agree with visionary or Ellen White?

 

[BobRyan]

Hello Bob, how can you agree with visionary regarding feast days as an everlasting ordinance

Hi Pasifika -

He was quoting the Bible - I always agree with the Bible. The term for everlasting has more than one interpretation in Hebrew.

...But as you pointed out in the OP that you agree with Ellen White SDA that believes the feast days ended at the cross???

Because Hebrews 10:4-12 is also true - not just the OT text. Both are true and there is no OT statement about "observance" without the animal sacrifice and offering specified in the observance in the OT.

I think some folks are replying to my thread without reading my first 3 posts in it... true? For example I see very little in @visionary responses that address the first 3 posts.

 

[BobRyan]

A Future date is a day that is no longer Future when that day becomes Present

agreed.

if the Physical Body of Yᵊsʰûʷəʰ rose (Early) on the Third Day, (while it was yet Dark),

agreed.

and because a Day is as a thousand years, and we are currently in the Third Millennium

2 Pet 3 says "with God" -- a day is as a thousand years AND "A Thousand years is as a day" - it says it BOTH ways so it cannot be used as a time ruler.

The passage quoted, a Day is as a Thousand Years...., is a partial quotation taken from Psalms, and it concludes, ....and as a Watch in the Night: which is a three Hour period, subsequently, a Faithful person is not only able to know what Three Hour period the (Unknown) Hour is in, they are also able to narrow the (Unknown Day) down to being One of Three Days, the Millennium however, should not be a Mystery, though we are informed that No Man Knows the Day or Hour, it does not include, No Man Knows the Millennium.

Not sure what your point is or how that relates to the feast days ended when animal sacrifice and offering "liturgy" specified in scripture ended according to Heb 10:4-12

 

[BobRyan]

For me personally, I do not have any problems with people wanting to keep the Feast days if they understand what they point to and they understand no one keeps the Feast days today according to the Torah of the old covenant. The question is are they compulsory?

As a side note -- even in the OT only 3 of the feast days were mandatory -- all the others were optional.

 

[visionary]

Hello Bob, how can you agree with visionary regarding feast days as an everlasting ordinance...But as you pointed out in the OP that you agree with Ellen White SDA that believes the feast days ended at the cross???

So are you agree with visionary or Ellen White?

Feast of Trumpets is of a memorial not yet happened. Was EG White's opinion on ending the feasts at the cross or ending the sacrifices of lambs found within the feasts at the cross? LoveGodsWord figures that because the sacrificing of lambs has ended that the feasts have ended. It is like saying the temple services are over, yet we know they continue on in heaven with our Heavenly High Priest Yeshua, pleading our cases until the great Yom Kippur in Heaven is concluded. So I think there is in more agreement here and more need to detail it where the differences are.

 

[visionary]

I am fine with that - God uses the symbols as a teaching aid - a visual aid for the reader but we need to differentiate after the cross between the need to study the symbols vs the need to engage in a liturgy of animal sacrifice once the cross is in the past.

I am with you on the "no need to sacrifice animals" as Yeshua represents all the symbolic sacrificing done. But to me, that isn't the heart of the feasts, they are prophetic and have a spiritual time with God that we should appreciate, each in their appropriate time, and their appropriate purpose. I am not into the rituals, I am for the blessings found within.

 

[visionary]

Agreed but only as quoted above ... see post 13

In Dan 7 we see the Son of Man coming to the Ancient of Days - to the courtroom - in the Temple of God... the Holy of Holies. It is His coming to that part of the temple indicating the start of the Day of Atonement , judgment.

BTW for this to work as a conversation you need to post a few points not 100 -- so we can discuss and focus on what is most important in a sequence.

(trust me - I could flood this thread with reams of material if that were the objective)

I know, that is why I tried to overview it, and only post the Feast of Trumpets to start. Didn't mean to overwhelm you. Do you think it is important to make note of the feasts days when they occur just in case they become a reality that year?

 

[pasifika]

Feast of Trumpets is of a memorial not yet happened. Was EG White's opinion on ending the feasts at the cross or ending the sacrifices of lambs found within the feasts at the cross? LoveGodsWord figures that because the sacrificing of lambs has ended that the feasts have ended. It is like saying the temple services are over, yet we know they continue on in heaven with our Heavenly High Priest Yeshua, pleading our cases until the great Yom Kippur in Heaven is concluded. So I think there is in more agreement here and more need to detail it where the differences are.

Hello, the OP pointed out that the feast days ended at the cross and reference Hebrews 10:4-12..

So I'm not sure which which feast days out of the 7 festivals given to Israel ( Lev 23) is Hebrews 10 is about...So can you explain what feast days is Hebrews 10:4-12 is referring to?

 

[BobRyan]

I know, that is why I tried to overview it, and only post the Feast of Trumpets to start. Didn't mean to overwhelm you. Do you think it is important to make note of the feasts days when they occur just in case they become a reality that year?

Well as noted in my earlier posts - they indicate the even and the time ... so knowing when the actual fall feast occurs in a given year. That is one reason SDAs are so focused on the Oct 22 date in the year 1844 for the "Day of Atonement" event starting.

 

[BobRyan]

Hello, the OP pointed out that the feast days ended at the cross and reference Hebrews 10:4-12..

So I'm not sure which which feast days out of the 7 festivals given to Israel ( Lev 23) is Hebrews 10 is about...So can you explain what feast days is Hebrews 10:4-12 is referring to?

Hebrews 10 points to an end of animal sacrifices and offerings.

If you go to Lev 23 and remove all liturgy that requires animal sacrifices and offering you end up with almost no liturgy at all for the "observance" of a given annual feast day.

If you consider how Heb 7 removes the earthly priesthood and puts all the focus on Christ's priesthood in heaven (as we see in Heb 8:1-6) then even "less" is left for celebrating an earthly liturgy for any given feast.

So while it is still true that the feasts are teaching us about important gospel details and in the case of the fall feasts even pointing to "event" and the timing for that event. -- still the "liturgy" for it would be far less after the cross according to Heb 10.

And as you stated - the whole point of the feasts was to teach a lesson about the gospel event it points to and we can still do that as we study regardless of the fact that there are no earthly priests or animal sacrifice liturgies left.

 

[pasifika]

Hebrews 10 points to an end of animal sacrifices and offerings.

If you go to Lev 23 and remove all liturgy that requires animal sacrifices and offering you end up with almost no liturgy at all for the "observance" of a given annual feast day.

If you consider how Heb 7 removes the earthly priesthood and puts all the focus on Christ's priesthood in heaven (as we see in Heb 8:1-6) then even "less" is left for celebrating an earthly liturgy for any given feast.

So while it is still true that the feasts are teaching us about important gospel details and in the case of the fall feasts even pointing to "event" and the timing for that event. -- still the "liturgy" for it would be far less after the cross according to Heb 10.

And as you stated - the whole point of the feasts was to teach a lesson about the gospel event it points to and we can still do that as we study regardless of the fact that there are no earthly priests or animal sacrifice liturgies left.

Thanks Bob, so feast days are optional to celebrate by Christian since animal sacrifice through those feast days ceased at the cross?

 

[BobRyan]

Thanks Bob, so feast days are optional to celebrate by Christian since animal sacrifice through those feast days ceased at the cross?

Romans 14 says they are optional, so one person observes one above the others - and another person observes them all.

Heb 10:4-11 says the animal sacrifices and offerings are "taken away" - vs 9 "He takes away the first to establish the second".

Heb 7 says that with the change in priesthood comes a change in law regarding the sacrifices and priesthood.

So even though Paul continued to observe them - there were other Christians who did not.

Acts 20
4 And he was accompanied by Sopater of Berea, the son of Pyrrhus, and by Aristarchus and Secundus of the Thessalonians, and Gaius of Derbe, and Timothy, and Tychicus and Trophimus of Asia. 5 Now these had gone on ahead and were waiting for us at Troas. 6 We sailed from Philippi after the days of Unleavened Bread, and reached them at Troas within five days; and we stayed there for seven days.
...
Troas to Miletus
... 16 For Paul had decided to sail past Ephesus so that he would not have to lose time in Asia; for he was hurrying, if it might be possible for him to be in Jerusalem the day of Pentecost.

===

It appears that Paul was being very observant but some of the others in his group were not.

 

[pasifika]

Romans 14 says they are optional, so one person observes one above the others - and another person observes them all.

Heb 10:4-11 says the animal sacrifices and offerings are "taken away" - vs 9 "He takes away the first to establish the second".

Heb 7 says that with the change in priesthood comes a change in law regarding the sacrifices and priesthood.

So even though Paul continued to observe them - there were other Christians who did not.

Acts 20
4 And he was accompanied by Sopater of Berea, the son of Pyrrhus, and by Aristarchus and Secundus of the Thessalonians, and Gaius of Derbe, and Timothy, and Tychicus and Trophimus of Asia. 5 Now these had gone on ahead and were waiting for us at Troas. 6 We sailed from Philippi after the days of Unleavened Bread, and reached them at Troas within five days; and we stayed there for seven days.
...
Troas to Miletus
... 16 For Paul had decided to sail past Ephesus so that he would not have to lose time in Asia; for he was hurrying, if it might be possible for him to be in Jerusalem the day of Pentecost.

===

It appears that Paul was being very observant but some of the others in his group were not.

Thank you Bob, so as you prove according to Paul in Romans 14 that feast days are optional for Christians to observe...

Then just one more question; so what are 7 feast days given to Israel according to Leviticus 23..I have my list but just to double check..Thanks

 

[BobRyan]

Thank you Bob, so as you prove according to Paul in Romans 14 that feast days are optional for Christians to observe...

Then just one more question; so what are 7 feast days given to Israel according to Leviticus 23..I have my list but just to double check..Thanks

Ok - I think it is this.

1. Passover — Leviticus 23:4-8
2. Unleavened Bread — Leviticus 23:6
3. First Fruits — Leviticus 23:10
4. Feast of Weeks or Pentecost — Leviticus 23:16

========================
5. Feast of Trumpets — Leviticus 23:24-25
25 You shall not do any laborious work, but you shall present an offering by fire to the Lord.’”

6. Day of Atonement — Leviticus 16, Lev 23:26-32
7. Feast of Tabernacles or Booths — Leviticus 23:34-36

• Lev 23:36 For seven days you shall present an offering by fire to the Lord. On the eighth day you shall have a holy convocation and present an offering by fire