Evolution Goes (Retro)Viral

[Blaise N]

First off: press the space bar after a comma and full stop, please! Your posts are really hard to read as it is.

And secondly, all you are doing is doubling down on your argument from incredulity. You're mixing the big bang theory, abiogenesis and the theory of evolution all into one in a clearly deliberate act to try and throw them all away because you can't understand nor want to understand the science behind them. And if you think that challenges your religious views, then I don't think your religious views are as strong as you'd like them to be.

And lastly: space after a full stop and a comma. Cannot stress that enough. It's really bugging me.

My faith is as strong as indestructible steel.

and two, I understand them quite well, I used to support them until I found major flaws in them. Quite frankly, evolution is man’s way of expressing his control over his life and his wicked desire to do whatever he pleases without any consequences or laws.

Ironically, Charles Darwin(Yes I know quite wel of history, contrary to what you may think of my intellect) never even intended Evolution to even contradict religion.

It was only after atheists used it to create arguments against religion that it became a weapon.
A weapon sadly taught in schools and colleges, accepted as fact though it contains loopholes, gaps, inadequacies, and flaws.

Do I deny dinosaurs existence? NOPE
Do I deny the existence of ancient organisms? NOPE
Do I reject the idea of a self-creating universe which works itself? Absolutely
Do I know everything or am I superior to you or any other science supporting individual? Nope,
not even the slightest.
Mr warden, you’re an intelligent individual with lots of knowledge, I respect that as someone who also knows lots as well, it’s an admirable trait in a society with many individuals that cannot even demonstrate basic geography.

But there’s some things I disagree with, respectfully that being evolution .

 

[Occams Barber]

But prior to the planets existence,
Hypothetically speaking if the Big Bang were true,the universe randomly formed under the right circumstances in a empty void absent of any sort of matter(gravity,light,temperature, mass,gravity,etc.) and over trillions of years eventually formed a planet,in which (I used to support evolution,but now shun and object it) went through a volcanic phase,cooled,created vast oceans,which miraculously had microscopic single-cell organisms that eventually evolved into multi cell organisms,eventually evolved into fish,vertebrates,plants,plankton,phytoplankton,and invertebrates.Then learned to adapt to breathe out of water,and over the course of billions of years created plants,mammals,reptiles,birds,insects,arachnids,fish,bacteria,viruses,parasites, and amphibians.

And miraculously eventually came to ape ancestors, who somehow; with small brains eventually learned to speak,walk upright,hunt,fish,create tools,then learned all the ancient ways and eventually over thousands of years created the most advanced and sophisticated race on the planet?

Hello Blaise

I understand your problem. It all just doesn't seem possible - right?

Not only is the universe as we know it probable - it's actually inevitable. The problem lies in how we think about it. It's difficult to explain but I'll try to keep this a short as possible.

Imagine you have a pile of cards (like playing cards) numbered 1 to 100. You put the cards into a machine which automatically shuffles them and then deals them out one at a time.

The first time you do this the cards come out in number order from 1 to 100,
What are the odds of the cards coming out in number order?

• The odds of the first card being number 1 are 1 in 100
• The odds of the second card being 2 are 1 in 99
• The odds of the third card being 3 are 1 in 98...and so on down to card 100

The total odds for this 1 to 100 sequence are 100 x 99 x 98 x 97 x 96 etc. etc. or 9.3 x 10 followed by 157 zeros - huge!!

Put the cards back the machine and repeat the automatic shuffle and deal.

This time the cards come out in a random order - 7, 29,11, 83, 46, 52 etc. etc.
What are the odds of the cards coming out in this particular random numeric order?

• The odds of the first card being 7 are 1 in 100
• The odds of the second card being 29 are 1 in 99
• The odds of the third card being 11 are 1 in 98...and so on down to the last card

The total odds for this particular random sequence are 100 x 99 x 98 x 97 x 96 etc. etc. or 9.3 x 10 followed by 157 zeros - exactly the same as the first number order sequence! This sameness is counter intuitive. You would expect the number order sequence to be much less likely than the random sequence. The difference lies in your expectations. The numbered sequence is familiar: the random sequence isn't.

The cards represent all the bits and pieces of matter and energy etc. in the universe. The automatic shuffle & deal machine is the laws and rules of physics acting on the stuff of the universe and the sequence of cards in the deal represents the universe as it is. Just as with the cards, we assume the current state of the universe has to be something special because it's familiar. Since it's familiar we assume it must have been intentional.

We'll take one last step. We'll fine tune the deal/shuffle machine so that it shuffles the cards in exactly the same way each time it's used. The result - the sequence of cards dealt will always be the same.

This is the same as saying that the laws and rules of physics (the shuffle machine) are not variable. In fact, we have no evidence to suggest that the laws of physics could be any different to what they are. Assuming the laws of physics are a constant, the universe could only turn out one way.

Life, the universe and everything may not be 42 - but they are surprisingly inevitable.

OB

 

[Estrid]

Hello Blaise

I understand your problem. It all just doesn't seem possible - right?

Not only is the universe as we know it probable - it's actually inevitable. The problem lies in how we think about it. It's difficult to explain but I'll try to keep this a short as possible.

Imagine you have a pile of cards (like playing cards) numbered 1 to 100. You put the cards into a machine which automatically shuffles them and then deals them out one at a time.

The first time you do this the cards come out in number order from 1 to 100,
What are the odds of the cards coming out in number order?

• The odds of the first card being number 1 are 1 in 100
• The odds of the second card being 2 are 1 in 99
• The odds of the third card being 3 are 1 in 98...and so on down to card 100

The total odds for this 1 to 100 sequence are 100 x 99 x 98 x 97 x 96 etc. etc. or 9.3 x 10 followed by 157 zeros - huge!!

Put the cards back the machine and repeat the automatic shuffle and deal.

This time the cards come out in a random order - 7, 29,11, 83, 46, 52 etc. etc.
What are the odds of the cards coming out in this particular random numeric order?

• The odds of the first card being 7 are 1 in 100
• The odds of the second card being 29 are 1 in 99
• The odds of the third card being 11 are 1 in 98...and so on down to the last card

The total odds for this particular random sequence are 100 x 99 x 98 x 97 x 96 etc. etc. or 9.3 x 10 followed by 157 zeros - exactly the same as the first number order sequence! This sameness is counter intuitive. You would expect the number order sequence to be much less likely than the random sequence. The difference lies in your expectations. The numbered sequence is familiar: the random sequence isn't.

The cards represent all the bits and pieces of matter and energy etc. in the universe. The automatic shuffle & deal machine is the laws and rules of physics acting on the stuff of the universe and the sequence of cards in the deal represents the universe as it is. Just as with the cards, we assume the current state of the universe has to be something special because it's familiar. Since it's familiar we assume it must have been intentional.

We'll take one last step. We'll fine tune the deal/shuffle machine so that it shuffles the cards in exactly the same way each time it's used. The result - the sequence of cards dealt will always be the same.

This is the same as saying that the laws and rules of physics (the shuffle machine) are not variable. In fact, we have no evidence to suggest that the laws of physics could be any different to what they are. Assuming the laws of physics are a constant, the universe could only turn out one way.

Life, the universe and everything may not be 42 - but they are surprisingly inevitable.

OB

I took what I called elemprobnstat what 15 yrs
ago? So I had to go thru that twice.
Forget that thing about " Asians good at math".

 

[Estrid]

My faith is as strong as indestructible steel.

and two, I understand them quite well, I used to support them until I found major flaws in them. Quite frankly, evolution is man’s way of expressing his control over his life and his wicked desire to do whatever he pleases without any consequences or laws.

Ironically, Charles Darwin(Yes I know quite wel of history, contrary to what you may think of my intellect) never even intended Evolution to even contradict religion.

It was only after atheists used it to create arguments against religion that it became a weapon.
A weapon sadly taught in schools and colleges, accepted as fact though it contains loopholes, gaps, inadequacies, and flaws.

Do I deny dinosaurs existence? NOPE
Do I deny the existence of ancient organisms? NOPE
Do I reject the idea of a self-creating universe which works itself? Absolutely
Do I know everything or am I superior to you or any other science supporting individual? Nope,
not even the slightest.
Mr warden, you’re an intelligent individual with lots of knowledge, I respect that as someone who also knows lots as well, it’s an admirable trait in a society with many individuals that cannot even demonstrate basic geography.

But there’s some things I disagree with, respectfully that being evolution .

A little salt water does wonders on
stainless steel.

 

[Blaise N]

A little salt water does wonders on
stainless steel.

Yep you’re right;

Unless it’s treated!

 

[Occams Barber]

I took what I called elemprobnstat what 15 yrs
ago? So I had to go thru that twice.
Forget that thing about " Asians good at math".

Never, ever take up gambling.

OB

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

My faith is as strong as indestructible steel.

and two, I understand them quite well, I used to support them until I found major flaws in them. Quite frankly, evolution is man’s way of expressing his control over his life and his wicked desire to do whatever he pleases without any consequences or laws.

Ironically, Charles Darwin(Yes I know quite wel of history, contrary to what you may think of my intellect) never even intended Evolution to even contradict religion.

It was only after atheists used it to create arguments against religion that it became a weapon.
A weapon sadly taught in schools and colleges, accepted as fact though it contains loopholes, gaps, inadequacies, and flaws.

Do I deny dinosaurs existence? NOPE
Do I deny the existence of ancient organisms? NOPE
Do I reject the idea of a self-creating universe which works itself? Absolutely
Do I know everything or am I superior to you or any other science supporting individual? Nope,
not even the slightest.
Mr warden, you’re an intelligent individual with lots of knowledge, I respect that as someone who also knows lots as well, it’s an admirable trait in a society with many individuals that cannot even demonstrate basic geography.

But there’s some things I disagree with, respectfully that being evolution .

Except that you feel that the theory of evolution can lead to people being atheists. In fact, your claim about evolution, being 'evolution is man’s way of expressing his control over his life and his wicked desire to do whatever he pleases without any consequences or laws.' shows some strange fear of it, when you really should not.

And yes, Darwin did not intend evolution to contradict religion. Because it doesn't. It does not say that God is not the creator of things. It just says "Oh, this is what we see from the evidence from God's creation." All it contradicts is a literal reading of the Bible. That's it.

And you've done nothing to show any flaws in the science behind evolution, abiogenesis or the big bang theory. All you have done is used your own incredulity, your own inability to accept the scientific evidence we have from God's own creation, and gone "Nope, it's wrong." That's it.

 

[Estrid]

Never, ever take up gambling.

OB

Now THAT is a stereotypical Chinese vice
that's true. Of me.

 

[Occams Barber]

Now THAT is a stereotypical Chinese vice
that's true. Of me.

Have you heard of the Gambler's Fallacy?

Imagine you flip a fair* coin 5 times and every flip comes up heads:

• What are the odds your next flip will come up heads?
• What are the odds your next flip will come up tails?

For bonus points;

• What are the odds of flipping heads five times in a row?

(one wrong answer and you must promise to stay away from casinos for the rest of your life)

*Perfectly balanced

OB

 

[Estrid]

Have you heard of the Gambler's Fallacy?

Imagine you flip a fair* coin 5 times and every flip comes up heads:

• What are the odds your next flip will come up heads?
• What are the odds your next flip will come up tails?

For bonus points;

• What are the odds of flipping heads five times in a row?

(one wrong answer and you must promise to stay away from casinos for the rest of your life)

*Perfectly balanced

OB

I understood the first thing you
wrote. Even tho it was around
4 a.m. I was kind of slow though.

I did pass probnstat. But it was work.

It's way late now so I'm not doing math.

As for gambling I'm disciplined about it.
After I've lost 10,000 HK I quit for the day.

Eze math

Sleep time here on the Strait

 

[AV1611VET]

Have you heard of the Gambler's Fallacy?

Imagine you flip a fair* coin 5 times and every flip comes up heads:

• What are the odds your next flip will come up heads?
• What are the odds your next flip will come up tails?

For bonus points;

• What are the odds of flipping heads five times in a row?

(one wrong answer and you must promise to stay away from casinos for the rest of your life)

*Perfectly balanced

OB

I'll take a stab at this:

• 1 in 2
• 1 in 2
• 1 in 32

 

[Astrophile]

Do I deny dinosaurs existence? NOPE
Do I deny the existence of ancient organisms? NOPE
Do I reject the idea of a self-creating universe which works itself? Absolutely
Do I know everything or am I superior to you or any other science supporting individual? Nope,
not even the slightest.

Do you accept that birds are dinosaurs?
Do you accept that the Earth is about 4540 million years old, and that life has existed on Earth for at least 3800 million years?
Do you accept that there are galaxies and quasars that are so far away that their light has taken more than 5000 million years to reach the Earth?
Do you accept that there are star clusters that are more than 12 billion years old?
Do you accept that the cosmic microwave background is the redshifted light from the fireball of the Big Bang?

 

[dlamberth]

Ya -- as long as McDonald's keeps serving up french fries.

What's that saying that comes to mind?

First they came for the Communists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Communist

Then they came for the Socialists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Socialist

Then they came for the trade unionists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a trade unionist

Then they came for the Jews
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Jew

Then they came for me
And there was no one left
To speak out for me

There's no way I'm able to see any connection between any of this that you wrote and the status of a rock in space. Pretty over the top stuff here AV.

 

[dlamberth]

Quite frankly, evolution is man’s way of expressing his control over his life and his wicked desire to do whatever he pleases without any consequences or laws.

I see no connection between change, which is basically all evolution is, and "man’s way of expressing his control over his life and his wicked desire to do whatever he pleases without any consequences or laws." That's all made up stuff.

 

[Astrophile]

So they just named it a planet without "working out the details if its structure and composition sufficient to determine it it matches the criteria for 'planet'"?

Hmmm ...

Nebraska Man comes to mind here too.

Michael E. Bakich devotes a chapter to Pluto (pp. 297-309) in his book The Cambridge Planetary Handbook (Cambridge University Press, 2000). In this chapter he says, 'Some astronomers have stated that the only reason that Pluto is considered a major planet was because of Percival Lowell and the search for Planet X. When Pluto was finally discovered, the media barrage that ensued, and the response to it by the Lowell Observatory, virtually guaranteed the classification of Pluto as a major planet.'

If this is true, it appears that media propaganda, rather than the scientific data, was the cause of Pluto's being named a planet.

 

[Astrophile]

and two, I understand them quite well, I used to support them until I found major flaws in them. Quite frankly, evolution is man’s way of expressing his control over his life and his wicked desire to do whatever he pleases without any consequences or laws.

On your own account, you have only just passed your 21st birthday. You have not had enough time to do the necessary research to find flaws in the theories of evolution, abiogenesis and cosmology. Do you think that you are a better scientist than people who have spent their whole lives researching these subjects?

By the way, as a life-long teetotaller, I sympathise with your anxieties about alcohol. I was brought up in a church that was strongly opposed to drinking, and even when I became an atheist I maintained my convictions on this point. If your church holds the same view, you may be able to get some practical help there.

 

[AV1611VET]

If this is true, it appears that media propaganda, rather than the scientific data, was the cause of Pluto's being named a planet.

I didn't read the book, but I admit, I don't believe that at all.

76 years under media propaganda?

C'mon.

And if it was just media propaganda, why the rigged vote?

Why did the IAU have to violate its own bylaws to get Pluto classified where it belongs?

Is media propaganda that powerful?

 

[Estrid]

Have you heard of the Gambler's Fallacy?

Imagine you flip a fair* coin 5 times and every flip comes up heads:

• What are the odds your next flip will come up heads?
• What are the odds your next flip will come up tails?

For bonus points;

• What are the odds of flipping heads five times in a row?

(one wrong answer and you must promise to stay away from casinos for the rest of your life)

*Perfectly balanced

OB

50 50 on first two

Bonus, if I had the answer I might be able
to reverse engineer it.

Or I could flip a lot.

Math would never have advanced much
if it's up to me.

 

[Occams Barber]

50 50 on first two

Correct

Bonus, if I had the answer I might be able
to reverse engineer it.

1 in 32

OB

 

[Occams Barber]

1 in 2

1 in 2

1 in 32