"Everyone has their own heaven"

[juvenissun]

I've been toying with a philosophical concept I seem to have made up myself that everyone has their own, individualized heaven. When they die and go to heaven, their reality becomes that which is wholesome and pleases them. A more generalized heaven might not work as well. For example, I have a very love-hate relationship with my family. I go back and forth on what I think of some of them. If given the option, I might not prefer to spend the rest of eternity with them after all. I know I've said otherwise in the past... I'm just not sure.

Why do you (and others) need a heaven?

If you are serious, then you need to iron out the meaning of these religious terms, but not flirting them around without knowing what do they really mean. For example, once you start to carefully define the idea of heaven, then you would have a very different understanding of this term.

 

[Left]

Why do you (and others) need a heaven?

Because we are unsatified with our current, crumpled up old existence.

 

[juvenissun]

Because we are unsatified with our current, crumpled up old existence.

How many people could be put in a single heaven?

 

[-57]

Are you guys refuting me in love? If not, first cast the beam out of your own eye.

And I just get the feeling that I may have a different interpretation of the verses -57 posted. I wasn't able to actually see anything wrong with them.

I'm not "refuting" you....Just trying to present you with stuf to think about. It was obvious to me the rich man wasn't enjoying his "heaven" . This tends to make me think we don't create our own heaven.

 

[marawuti]

I've been toying with a philosophical concept I seem to have made up myself that everyone has their own, individualized heaven. When they die and go to heaven, their reality becomes that which is wholesome and pleases them. A more generalized heaven might not work as well. For example, I have a very love-hate relationship with my family. I go back and forth on what I think of some of them. If given the option, I might not prefer to spend the rest of eternity with them after all. I know I've said otherwise in the past... I'm just not sure.

I've scanned through the answers to this point and haven't found anyone pointing out Is 65:17. The things and relationships of this world are going to be removed from memory.

It's my belief (I can't find the NT reference quickly) that heaven being a new creation is beyond our understanding. It does not reflect or echo this current world's material nature or relationships. Philosophy has its uses in our attempts to work out an understanding of our current context, but it is pretty much irrelevant or more accurately impotent in understanding / visualizing heaven,

However, the musings you are having may be useful in self analysis to draw you closer to God. The images and desires you reveal may give you concepts to take before God for healing.

 

[Albion]

I've been toying with a philosophical concept I seem to have made up myself that everyone has their own, individualized heaven. When they die and go to heaven, their reality becomes that which is wholesome and pleases them. A more generalized heaven might not work as well. For example, I have a very love-hate relationship with my family. I go back and forth on what I think of some of them. If given the option, I might not prefer to spend the rest of eternity with them after all. I know I've said otherwise in the past... I'm just not sure.

This idea doesn't seem especially revolutionary to me. However, I'd expect your family members and your view of them to be changed in the afterlife, so that could resolve what you see as a problem with that matter.

 

[marawuti]

This idea doesn't seem especially revolutionary to me. However, I'd expect your family members and your view of them to be changed in the afterlife, so that could resolve what you see as a problem with that matter.

Check out Is 65:17

 

[JESUS=G.O.A.T]

To clarify GOAT, you used philosophy in a good way without knowing it. You stated that God knows what we want better than we do, so there's no point in catering to a specific person's needs, and He is capable of creating a general heaven that everyone enjoys.

No I got that from Matthew 7:11 like it straight up says that. The bible itself though like the ideals in the bible kind of appear philosophical in nature though, only thing that doesn't make it fit in with philosophy is the fact that like the authors in the bible profess to know truth. JESUS himself even says in the bible I am truth. WHile with philosophy you're looking for it.

 

[Left]

No I got that from Matthew 7:11 like it straight up says that. The bible itself though like the ideals in the bible kind of appear philosophical in nature though, only thing that doesn't make it fit in with philosophy is the fact that like the authors in the bible profess to know truth. JESUS himself even says in the bible I am truth. WHile with philosophy you're looking for it.

Uh, I'll just nod my head and go with my version in which you told a philosophical concept which made sense. Your version, in which you took a verse and appeared to try to make it say things it did not, doesn't make sense.

 

[JESUS=G.O.A.T]

Uh, I'll just nod my head and go with my version in which you told a philosophical concept which made sense. Your version, in which you took a verse and appeared to try to make it say things it did not, doesn't make sense.

You can do as you usually do I find which is define things as you see fit... kinda explains your ideology behind heaven. And no I suggest you read the verse in different translations as well as check out a kjv commentary or two, all point towards the verse saying what I stated. God basicully saying he knows best what's good for us. The Bible even says every good and perfect gift is from above and comes down from the father of lights. Trust me knowing other scriptures to support one really helps. Knowing heaven is already defined in revelations helps too and of course from time to time commentaries From your study bible if you have one.

 

[JCFantasy23]

I've been toying with a philosophical concept I seem to have made up myself that everyone has their own, individualized heaven. When they die and go to heaven, their reality becomes that which is wholesome and pleases them. A more generalized heaven might not work as well. For example, I have a very love-hate relationship with my family. I go back and forth on what I think of some of them. If given the option, I might not prefer to spend the rest of eternity with them after all. I know I've said otherwise in the past... I'm just not sure.

I don't believe we have our own heavens. That is a movie concept I've seen, so I know where the idea may have appeal. I do think God may do unique things for us (like hopefully pets we've lost and wanted to be reunited with or something special to us), but I'm not sure. That's just a guess. There's really a lot of mystery involved with it and we know little about it.

 

[NeoScholasticism]

Heaven is principally the vision of God. Of course there are other things accessory to it, but they do not constitute Heaven as such.

This is integral to the first thousand and a half years of Christian theology. The Greek Fathers often repeated after Irenaeus of Lyons (†202 AD) that God became man in the Incarnation as an image of man's union with God in Heaven (c.f. Against Heresies, Bk. V, preface). If we might recall how fiercely the Greek Father defended the intimate union of the divine and human natures in Christ, we can understand the sobriety they had when they echoed Irenaeus. Indeed, they thought it necessary to go to apparently extreme lengths to combat every kind of Christological heresy which might suggest in the slightest that Christ was not fully human or fully divine.

Just as the Incarnation is supernatural -- above human nature -- so seeing God is supernatural. It is above any perfection proper to creatures. In other words, heaven is the not the default even for sinless human beings, i.e. before the fall. We need grace to get there, even if we had no sin. (For this reason, many medieval Christian theologians came to the conclusion that Adam and Eve had grace before the fall.) It is not just a very perfect paradise, or some kind of Eden on steroids. It is quite literally as no eye has seen nor ear heard. And this, because it is not in itself a delightful vision to the eye, or melody to the ear, etc. It is not natural. It is not, properly speaking, a created thing either.

On the contrary, to be in Heaven is to be inserted into the life of the Holy Trinity (c.f. John 17:13, and John 17:24-26). It is eternal life. That is a cause for joy -- that God would care to share His life with us. No creature deserves that. Not even if they are sinless. So, that is really the way half of the "Good News" was understood in the era of Christian theology I mentioned. Yes, we can be healed of our sins and protected from eternal damnation because of Christ's redeeming sacrifice. That is good indeed, and is also the work of God's grace. But over and above that, we are still called to perfect happiness in God, to see Him as He is. This is incredible!

The developments in (western) Christian theology around the time of the Reformation and counter-Reformation deal more with justification. In other words, there is a stronger focus on that first half of the Gospel message: being healed from our sins and protected from eternal damnation. We need a solid understanding of justification, obviously. But the other half cannot be forgotten. Heaven is not something proportionate to human nature. Not even if we were sinless, and wrought good works. They would be human works, meriting human happiness. But we are promised something very different: eternal life. Consider that eternal life is proper to God alone. That is divine happiness -- the kind of happiness befitting God!

(For an historical proof of all this, consider Eastern Christian theology. Eastern/Oriental Orthodox theology, while in my opinion lacking a proper understanding of justification, nevertheless still has this very strong double-aspect of the Gospel message. That's because they didn't have the equivalent of a Reformation and large-scale debate over the whatness of justification. They just have not lost that emphasis on the double-aspect. Catholicism, too has this double-aspect, but it is easily covered up in a sea of talk about justification.)

So, Heaven is not just an amalgamation of creaturely comforts and consolations. That is an almost Muslim understanding of Heaven. So what is it? It is a participation, by grace, in the perfect happiness of God. Or, as St. Peter calls it, a participation in the divine nature (II Peter 1:4). If we understand this offer correctly, we ought to be utterly astounded. It is perfect happiness. Who has perfect happiness by nature except God? It is God's happiness.

The bottom line is this: Whatever it means for God to be happy -- whatever it is that God does and is -- that is what the departed faithful are promised to participate in. They will be co-heirs with the eternal Son to the inheritance of the Father. For a creature to be put into the divine life, suspended in that eternal moment of God's light, is nearly unthinkable. Indeed, the Good News is good -- as good as it can possibly get. If God is offering us His eternal life, what else could we possibly be given as a gift? There is nothing else God could give a creature beyond this. It is the highest offer, full stop.

Consider 1 John 3:2; 1 Corinthians 13:12; Revelation 22:4. There are many others, but those are the ones from memory.

 

[Ron Gurley]

1. Jesus the Christ preached on "Abraham's Bosom = Paradise + Hades" (all SPIRITUAL Realms!)
The Rich Man and Lazarus...Luke 16:19-31

2. John 5:24 Jesus:..“Truly, truly, I say to you,
he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, has eternal (SPIRITUAL) life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life.

3. 64 times as the Hebrew word "Sheol" appears in the OT, ...the lowest grave in the earth

4. Acts 23:8
For the Sadducees say that there is no resurrection, nor an angel, nor a spirit,
but the Pharisees acknowledge them all.

5. Ecclesiastes 12:1,7... At "death" of the Body/Soul combo, SPIRIT returns to God who gave it!

"heaven" occurs 456 times in 436 verses in the NASB, almost equally in the OT and the NT.
IT IS A SPRITUAL REALM!

Genesis 2:4
This is the account of the heavens and the earth when they were created, in the day that the LORD God made earth and heaven.

and heaven...Hebrew 8064...shamayim...visible heavens, sky; B.Heaven (as the abode of God)

Matthew 5:12
“Rejoice and be glad, for your reward in heaven is great; for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you.

heaven...Greek 3772...ouranos...
I.the vaulted expanse of the sky with all things visible in it
A.the universe, the world (kozmos)
B.the aerial heavens or sky, the region where the clouds and the tempests gather, and where thunder and lightning are produced (atmosphere)
C.the sidereal or starry heavens
II.the region ABOVE the sidereal heavens,
the seat of order of things eternal and consummately perfect
where God dwells and other heavenly beings (ANGELS + SAVED BELIEVERS)

THERE is but ONE "heaven" and ONE "earth"
provided for God (pure spirit) to relate to Man. (body/soul/spirit)
ONE heavenly REALM from which the pre-existent God "created".
ONE earthly REALM prepared by God on which Man and life can dwell.

No man has ever seen God the Father...only manifestations.
But my guess is that TRI-UNE GOD will not "appear"
as a king on his throne with angels flittimg around Him in the "clouds".
No man has ever "seen" God's SPIRITUAL REALM...only promises of spiritual "eternal life".
There are no Biblical eyewitness reports by believers who went to "heaven" and returned to describe it.

John 4:24
God is spirit,
and those who worship Him
must worship in spirit and truth.”

God the Spirit's spiritual realm is SPIRIT!

Psalm 99...Metaphors!
The Lord reigns, let the peoples tremble;
He is enthroned above the cherubim, let the earth shake!...
Exalt the Lord our God
And worship at His footstool;
Holy is He...
Exalt the Lord our God
And worship at His holy hill,
For holy is the Lord our God.

Revelation 21...Metaphors!
Then I saw a NEW heaven and a NEW earth;
for the first heaven and the first earth passed away,
and there is no longer any sea.
And I saw the holy city, NEW Jerusalem,
coming DOWN out of heaven from God,
made ready as a bride adorned for her husband.
And I heard a loud voice from the throne, saying,
“Behold, the tabernacle of God is among men,
and He will dwell among them, and
they shall be His people, and
God Himself will be among them, (Eden-like)
and He will wipe away every tear from their eyes;
and there will no longer be any death;
there will no longer be any mourning, or crying, or pain;
the first things have passed away.”

2 Peter 3: 1-13...Peter's Prophecy of "The Coming Day of the Lord"...and New Heavens and a New Earth

New Heavens and a New Earth

But "the day of the Lord" will come like a thief,
in which the heavens (atmosphere) will pass away with a roar and the elements (living / matter) will be destroyed with intense heat, and the earth and its works (people / life) will be burned up.
Since all these things are to be destroyed in this way,
what sort of people ought you to be in holy conduct and godliness,looking for and hastening "the coming of the day of God", because of which the heavens (atmosphere) will be destroyed by burning,
and the elements (living /matter) will melt with intense heat!
But according to His promise we are looking for "New Heavens and a New Earth", in which righteousness dwells.