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Eve came from Adam, evolution does not allow this

Cis.jd

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To be honest I'm still waiting for you to answer my questions.

I post them and all you seem to do is play dodge ball.
All of your questions have been answered, and they have been dumbed down over and over again. The reason why you don't get it is because you don't even know what metaphors are. That is why you keep going "so you're saying it didn't happen". You've ignored all the christian sites telling you the details of how Eve was created is a metaphor with the actual Hebrew word use. You have been academically and scripturally refuted in every reply and you've been replying with nothing but nonsense.
 
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dad

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Unwillingness to learn cultural backgrounds and about the literature of the era is not equal to "secret extra meaning".

Its not secret, its public. Its only "deeper" than a first time surface literal reading and requires more time and energy to invest.
We should not invest in devising ways to wave away the highest basic truths of the word. Jesus wants child like faith. Yes we can get into some juicy meat as we grow but that chewing will not involve casting away what we have..only adding to it.
 
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dad

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When you will learn that "dust" means "mortality", not chemical material of man's composition, you will understand the message of Genesis much more.
? So maybe provide us with the secret code word book to properly read the bible!

Eve was really..what..monkey?
 
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dad

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Well atleast you bring on every issue that childish faith you always talk about. Combined with infantile understanding it makes all of your posting quite hard to debate.
Belief is now infantile understanding..got it.
 
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trophy33

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I can hardly wait to hear this cryptic explanation.
Its not cryptic, its Mesopotamian. Its cryptic only for you, being a 21st century American.

And there is nothing to wait for, its pretty much it - mortality.
 
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trophy33

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? So maybe provide us with the secret code word book to properly read the bible!

Eve was really..what..monkey?
Nothing secret, its public and online, its called "education". You only need to invest your time and energy to study it.
 
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trophy33

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We should not invest in devising ways to wave away the highest basic truths of the word.
Exactly, so stop investing your time into the SDA/YEC way.

Jesus wants child like faith. Yes we can get into some juicy meat as we grow but that chewing will not involve casting away what we have..only adding to it.
The more far away in time we are from the time of Jesus, not to say from the time of Moses, the more energy and time we must invest into learning what they taught and why.

Its a simple logic. If you would like to study some ancient Chinese writings, you would need to learn about ancient China to understand what you read.

Why do some Christians think that regarding the Bible they do not need to put any effort into cultural background study and can simply read it in their (American) way.
 
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-57

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But it wasn't a rib, just as all those christians sites said. Rejecting and inserting random guesses again.


wow.. now you're showing inability to comprehend what you are reading.


Another line of you showing bad reading comprehension. I'm assuming you just skimmed and in 5 seconds replied straight away. These sites are telling you that 1. The word isn't "rib" and 2 the whole thing is a metaphor.


Just admit it already, you really don't care to even try to have something educated to say.

You've lost the argument.

21 So the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon the man, and while he slept took one of his ribs and closed up its place with flesh. 22 And the rib that the LORD God had taken from the man he madeh into a woman and brought her to the man. 23 Then the man said,

“This at last is bone of my bones
and flesh of my flesh;
she shall be called Woman,
because she was taken out of Man.”

In the above you can click on the links for the word rib and bone.

When you study a word you need to read around the verse to obtain the proper nuance. That's why I linked you to rib and bone. You do know a rib is a bone?

The verse uses terminology such as "closed up its place with flesh" and "taken out of" should help you understand it was a rib and not Adams side.

But it really matters not....if it was Adams "side" according to the bible it happened and wasn't allegorical. Sure, we can assign an allegorical meaning to the formation of Eve from Adams rib, that is the equality, the one flesh and all that goes along with it but you fail to realize is that the allegory is based upon and reflects an actual event that once happened in history.
 
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-57

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All of your questions have been answered, and they have been dumbed down over and over again. The reason why you don't get it is because you don't even know what metaphors are. That is why you keep going "so you're saying it didn't happen". You've ignored all the christian sites telling you the details of how Eve was created is a metaphor with the actual Hebrew word use. You have been academically and scripturally refuted in every reply and you've been replying with nothing but nonsense.

What you fail to realize is that Eve was made from Adams rib and the account was literal and historical THEN the allegoric or metaphoric meaning was derived from that event.

You on the other hand keep saying the account didn't happen every time you label the event as allegoric or metaphoric. The event literally and historically occurred THEN the allegoric or metaphoric meaning was derived from that event.

You said you posted links, I visited them. The first was from Got Questions who said God made Eve in this fashion...THEN...told us why. Many people have then assigned allegoric or metaphoric meaning to the why God did it that way.

I do find it ironic that you would use Got Questions considering they have this belief "The Bible clearly presents Adam and Eve as literal people who existed in a literal Garden of Eden." They go on to say "Christians who deny the story of Adam and Eve essentially deny their own faith."
 
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The Barbarian

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I'm still waiting on your explanation of the fall.

You seem to miss things you don't want to see. Adam and Eve were real people, and their disobedience (not necessarily eating a forbidden apple) was the occasion for the fall.

Barbarian observes:
YEC was invented by the Seventh-Day Adventists in the early 20th century, and their new revision of Genesis required some changes in traditional Christian belief.

Such as?????

Such as the Christian understanding that the days of Genesis could not be interpreted as literal 24-hour days.

Barbarian observes:
And just as Genesis has no position on evolution, so does science have no position on miracles. These are neither confirmed nor denied by the other.

Sure it has a position.

Nope. Some people have revised scripture as a literal history. Others do not. But since evolution is directly observed to happen, there isn't much choice, really.

Then it goes on to say Eve was the mother of all which goes against the populations evolve therot presented by all evolutionist.

Nope. There's nothing in evolutionary theory that says a population can't descend from a single two individuals. In fact, we know humans have evolved since the first two. It's inescapable. Adam and Eve could have had at most, four alleles for each gene. (humans only have two copies of each gene). And yet today there are dozens or hundreds of alleles for most human genes. The rest evolved.

No way to dodge it.

So, I kinda fail to see your point.

I know. You're stumbling around in the dark, because you don't know a lot of things that impact on this issue.

It's no sin to be ignorant. All of us are ignorant in various ways. There's no one here who isn't your or my superior in some area of knowledge.

But it's curable. You could learn about it.
 
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The Barbarian

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Once again, and I'll type slowly for you....Forming -Adam- from-the -dust- then-
Eve -from -Adams -rib -is -not -evolutionism.

Yes, it's figurative, as early Christians like Augustine recognized.

"Evolutionism", is apparently the collective batch of misconceptions creationists have about evolution.
 
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trophy33

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21 So the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon the man, and while he slept took one of his ribs

This place can be also translated as "The Lord God caused a visionary state / trance to fall upon the man and while he was in the visionary state, he saw that God took one of his sides..."

So, reading it as a vision instead of literal event is perfectly biblical.
 
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-57

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You seem to miss things you don't want to see. Adam and Eve were real people, and their disobedience (not necessarily eating a forbidden apple) was the occasion for the fall.

Barbarian observes:
YEC was invented by the Seventh-Day Adventists in the early 20th century, and their new revision of Genesis required some changes in traditional Christian belief.



Such as the Christian understanding that the days of Genesis could not be interpreted as literal 24-hour days.

Barbarian observes:
And just as Genesis has no position on evolution, so does science have no position on miracles. These are neither confirmed nor denied by the other.



Nope. Some people have revised scripture as a literal history. Others do not. But since evolution is directly observed to happen, there isn't much choice, really.



Nope. There's nothing in evolutionary theory that says a population can't descend from a single two individuals. In fact, we know humans have evolved since the first two. It's inescapable. Adam and Eve could have had at most, four alleles for each gene. (humans only have two copies of each gene). And yet today there are dozens or hundreds of alleles for most human genes. The rest evolved.

No way to dodge it.



I know. You're stumbling around in the dark, because you don't know a lot of things that impact on this issue.

It's no sin to be ignorant. All of us are ignorant in various ways. There's no one here who isn't your or my superior in some area of knowledge.

But it's curable. You could learn about it.

I couldn't quite follow your line of thought. I believe you are saying the SDA invented the YEC position then in your next quote tell us the SDA said you can't have a 24 hour day interpretation?

Later on you said "But since evolution is directly observed to happen, there isn't much choice, really."

Evolutionism has not been directly observed...unless you want to consider the mixing of dog breeds as evolution or the loss of information as evolutionism such as what happened with the blind cave fish.

YEC's understand micro-evolutionism such as speciation events have occured and do occur. On the other hand there is no direct evidence of macro-evolution. So, that much is pretty much false in your statement and i wish the evo-minded would stop using it.

You also mentioned "In fact, we know humans have evolved since the first two. " No, not really true. I believe a better term would be humans have de-evolved. One would think Adam and Eve were created with 100% functioning DNA....as they were created "very good"...which is something the Theo-Evo sect would have to deny. Not knowing the full function of the DNA and what that has to do with our alleles as well as the original heterozygosity of Adam and Eve has to be looked at.
 
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-57

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This place can be also translated as "The Lord God caused a visionary state / trance to fall upon the man and while he was in the visionary state, he saw that God took one of his sides..."

So, reading it as a vision instead of literal event is perfectly biblical.
This place can be also translated as "The Lord God caused a visionary state / trance to fall upon the man and while he was in the visionary state, he saw that God took one of his sides..."

So, reading it as a vision instead of literal event is perfectly biblical.

So, now we've reached the point where the anti-Genesis people need to go through the process of biblical gymnastics to make the creation of man as a non-event.

But, you still fail. Even if it was a vision Adams vision was of a real event.
 
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Oh...great....

It didn't happen because it's allegory...and..

It's allegory because it didin't happen....

So...

What about Jesus walking on water, feeding the 5000, turning water to wine, stopping wind and rain and coming back from dead?

Where do you start... where do you stop......?
Where did I say that anything in the New Testament was allegory? Please show me those words.
 
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So, now you're telling me Paul wasn't inspired by God when he wrote much of the NT.

Please rethink your reply.
Except I didn't say that. Please stop making such false accusations.
 
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Science says a dead guy can't come back to life on day 3. So, using your logic I would suppose the resurrection was also allegorical.

Can you explain that allegory?
Where did I say that anything that happened in the New Testament was allegory? Either show me those words or stop making false accusations.
 
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The science of vaccines and the Apollo program were not designed to do away with the foundation of Christianity.

Neither was the Big Bang theory.

Should we get back to original sin? You still haven't answered the question. But, heck, why do you need to ? The fall never happened and we don't really need Jesus.

When did I say that man never fell? When did I say that we don't need Jesus? You are very good at making stuff up.
 
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-57

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Except I didn't say that. Please stop making such false accusations.
You said "Because Paul didn't know how the Earth and life on the Earth were actually created, so he incorrectly read an allegory as being literal."

You are saying that the inspired Paul made an error when he wrote the letter to Timothy? How many more errors did Paul make?

Did Luke error when he wrote "And he made from one man every nation of mankind to live on all the face of the earth, having determined allotted periods and the boundaries of their dwelling place," Acts 17:26

The Theo-Evos are sliding down a slippery slope.
 
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