I asked for a verse that teaches that the Holy Spirit is given at water baptism. This doesn't say this. Further, Acts 2 was during the EARLIEST beginning of the Christian church. The Holy Spirit hadn't been given to any Gentiles yet. So using a verse from this period is a sign of desperation. Where did Paul teach what you claim?Acts 2:38-39 Then Peter said to them, “Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the a remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39 For the promise is to you and to your children, and to all who are afar off, as many as the Lord our God will call.”
Your statement couldn't be further from the truth. Believers ARE to cease from sinning. Of course. But the Bible is clear about the FACT that we STILL have our original sin natures, and that we will struggle, just like Paul, with sin. But all this just keeps going right over your head.But from what I can tell, you don't believe in turning away from any sin, let alone, all sin.
And this doesn't answer my question about whether you think repentance from all sin is a one time event or does it occur again and again.It can be if you die soon after. But for most of us we will have various trials and temptations to face to test us. As we face each test, we can either pass or fail. If you pass one test, you are that much stronger when encountering the next test. But if you fail, it is because you have quenched the Spirit, and with each failure thereafter, you can become dull of hearing, and finally as Hebrews 10 says, "But if anyone draws back,
My soul has no pleasure in him.”
Boy, do you misunderstand a bunch. I don't believe a thing you've posted, because none of what you post can be found in the Bible.I know you don't believe a thing God says in His word except for the ones you pick and choose.
Well, finally, maybe you're getting it a bit. You are right: I have no power over sin. And neither do you.You even have the nerve to apply them to yourself. Good luck with that if you have no power over sin.
This is a non answer. It doesn't show any condition in v.27 or v.28.I kept it in context. Thats how.
I certainly know that false teachers twist and distort God's Word to say what they want their itching ears to hear.Don't you know you can make the Word of God say anything you want it to?
Pathetic and ridiculous. Only those who believe can be saved. Wise up.You are living proof of teaching that ungodliness can be saved.
Right. But you've not been paying attention.But, the Word of God must be read with rhemas from the Holy Spirit teaching us its truth.
Further, Acts 2 was during the EARLIEST beginning of the Christian church. The Holy Spirit hadn't been given to any Gentiles yet. So using a verse from this period is a sign of desperation. Where did Paul teach what you claim?
duplicateI certainly know that false teachers twist and distort God's Word to say what they want their itching ears to hear.
The fact that you don't believe in eternal security when Jesus taught it so clearly is evidence.
I certainly know that false teachers twist and distort God's Word to say what they want their itching ears to hear.
2 Tim 4:3 - For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear.
These verses disagree with you.I disagree.* They DID NOT have the indwelling of the Holy Spirit.
You really should find out what the demons believe.You must do more than BELIEVE. Even the demons believe and tremble.
have the Spirit.Now? When we truly repent of all sin. That means turn away from all sin.
I notice in your reply you didn't respond to 1 John 2:1.You forgot verse 6. 1 John 1:6, 8, and 10 are all BEFORE Christ who takes away our sin, not just covers it while we keep committing them. 6, 8, and 10 are those who walk in darkness and still have no truth in them.
1 John 1:5 This is the message which we have heard from Him and declare to you, that God is light and in Him is no darkness at all.
Verse 7 is a Christian, not 6, 8 or 10. But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin.
How is it that one who has been given eternal life can perish when Jesus said they would never perish?I've already told you, but hear it again.
CONTEXT:
27 My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. 28 And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand.
Two things to know if you've secured eternal life.
1. They can hear My voice. I can. You say you can't, and furthermore, that no one can.
2. and they follow Me. Jesus said, "If you love me, you will keep my commandments." They are lead by Christ's Spirit, and cannot sin. 1 John 3:9
If you are currently working or doing iniquity, you cannot rightly say that you are one of Jesus' sheep and therefore one who has been given eternal life. Again, Jesus knows His sheep (John 10:27). And He never knew those who work or do iniquity, and they will be cast into the furnace of fire (Matthew 7:23, Matthew 13:41-42). He does not know them, they are not His sheep (John 10:27). They cannot therefore rightly claim John 10:28 as their 'get out of jail free' card; it does not guarantee eternal security except to the one who is currently walking in holiness (abiding in Christ).FreeGrace2 said: ↑
your claims are refuted soundly by 1 John 1:8,10 and 2:1.
8 If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us.
10 If we claim we have not sinned, we make him out to be a liar and his word is not in us.
I notice in your reply you didn't respond to 1 John 2:1.
And I have asked before, if we believers are unable to sin, why did he write that verse?
FreeGrace2 said: ↑
Explain to me what Jesus was teaching in John 10:28 by the sentence "I give them eternal life and they shall never perish."
How is it that one who has been given eternal life can perish when Jesus said they would never perish?
I agree that we must repent, but not from sin (at least not the sin of breaking God's commands), we are to repent from unbelief.@1stcenturylady is right in saying that we must repent of all sin to have the baptism of the Holy Ghost. And Acts 2:38-39 does indeed speak of a conditional promise; the promise being the Holy Ghost, the condition being repentance and baptism in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins. It is the conditional promise of the Holy Ghost given to as many as the Lord our God shall call.
Believers are declared to be saints, not sinners.If you are currently working or doing iniquity, you cannot rightly say that you are one of Jesus' sheep and therefore one who has been given eternal life. Again, Jesus knows His sheep (John 10:27). And He never knew those who work or do iniquity, and they will be cast into the furnace of fire (Matthew 7:23, Matthew 13:41-42). He does not know them, they are not His sheep (John 10:27). They cannot therefore rightly claim John 10:28 as their 'get out of jail free' card; it does not guarantee eternal security except to the one who is currently walking in holiness (abiding in Christ).
I agree that we must repent, but not from sin (at least not the sin of breaking God's commands), we are to repent from unbelief.
Mark 1:15 says "Repent and believe the Gospel".
Repent means to change yo ur mind.
So that verse could be rephrsed as "Change your mind and believe the Gospel.
We change our mind from not believing to believing.
Acts 3:26 says Jesus Christ turns us away from sins, we don't turn ourselves.
If we trust Him to lead us, we won't sin.
Believers are declared to be saints, not sinners.
Our identity is not in what we do, but in whose we are.
Believers are not children of disobedience or wrath. We were children of wrath and disobedience, but that is not who we are now. Ephesians 2:1-10, 1 Corinthians 6:9-11
God's promise to not impute sin is interpreted by Romans 3:25 and 2 Peter 1:9, which tells us that God does not impute past sins to us. Of course even those who do well in living the Christian life in the present moment once were not Christians, and sinned as unbelievers. So those old sins that they committed as unbelievers, God will not impute to them.And with your doctrine God's promise not to impute sin to the believer is an empty promise.
Pretty much saying God won't impute sin to you as long as you don't sin.
@justbyfaith I am curious why you rated post 2542 funny?
I was extremely serious.
For if you say Jesus was speaking hyperbole when He said "I never knew you" how can you tell when hyperbole is being used?
What do you tell the skeptic when he says the Genesis 1 account is hyperbole?
Or the whole earth wasn't destroyed in a flood, that was just hyperbole.
Or Psalms 105:37 that says not one feeble among the Jews who left Egypt after the plagues.
Did Moses really part the Red Sea and they walked on dry land?
Did Jesus really feed 5000 men plus women and children with just 5 loaves and 2 fish?
Did Jesus really rise from the dead?
Are you really depending solely on Jesus Christ and Him crucified? Or are you depending on Him plus your works?
Doug Melven said: ↑
In Acts 8:12 the Samarians believed and were water baptized so we know they were born-again and had the indwelling Holy Spirit according to the verses listed above.
Then Peter and John came, prayed for them and laid hands on them and the Holy Spirit fell upon them.
These verses disagree with you.
Ephesians 1:13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
Romans 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
You really should find out what the demons believe.
They are not trusting Jesus Christ for salvation.
FreeGrace2 said: ↑
So, when does a person have the indwelling holy Spirit?
have the Spirit.
This verse says all believers. 1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.
I notice in your reply you didn't respond to 1 John 2:1.
And I have asked before, if we believers are unable to sin, why did he write that verse?
Believers are declared to be saints, not sinners.
Our identity is not in what we do, but in whose we are.
I agree that we must repent, but not from sin (at least not the sin of breaking God's commands), we are to repent from unbelief.
How is it that one who has been given eternal life can perish when Jesus said they would never perish?
re #2629:
all BELIEVERS.
In scripture, believing can be understood in two different ways. 1) It can refer to a nominal, lukewarm, or shallow faith (Revelation 3:16) that is either mental assent to doctrine (John 5:39-40) or an emotional experience (Luke 8:13) but is not a living and saving, heart faith; or, 2) it can refer to a living and saving, heart faith that is unto righteousness (Romans 10:10) and also tenacious unto the enduring to the end (Hebrews 3:6, Hebrews 3:14, Matthew 10:22).
In order to determine what kind of faith it is talking about any time we see the words "believe" or "faith" we must consider what word, if inserted there, will be more conducive to the doctrine/truth that is according to godliness (1 Timothy 6:3, Titus 1:1). For the Bible's teaching is in accordance with the doctrine that is according to godliness; it does not teach anything that would lead its readers to think that they can live ungodly lives without any kind of repercussions.
Those who have been baptized into one Spirit and have been made to drink into one Spirit, therefore, are those who believe according to definition #2.
@1stcenturylady is right in saying that we must repent of all sin to have the baptism of the Holy Ghost. And Acts 2:38-39 does indeed speak of a conditional promise; the promise being the Holy Ghost, the condition being repentance and baptism in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins. It is the conditional promise of the Holy Ghost given to as many as the Lord our God shall call.
So then, repentance is very important. See Matthew 3:8-12, Acts of the Apostles 2:38-39, Acts of the Apostles 3:19, Acts of the Apostles 17:30, Acts of the Apostles 20:21, Acts of the Apostles 26:20, 2 Corinthians 7:10.
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