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Enough!

Discussion in 'Creation & Evolution' started by Caffeine Socialism, Aug 20, 2002.

  1. armageddonman

    armageddonman Beware the Cat

    346
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    Do you actually know what a scientific theory is?
     
  2. Racer X

    Racer X <b><font color="red">Searcher of Truth</font></b>

    69
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    Yes, it's a theory
     
  3. armageddonman

    armageddonman Beware the Cat

    346
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    And that is...? Could you explain the meaning?
     
  4. armageddonman

    armageddonman Beware the Cat

    346
    +1
    http://phyun5.ucr.edu/~wudka/Physics7/Notes_www/node6.html

    "What is the "scientific method''?
    The scientific method is the best way yet discovered for winnowing the truth from lies and delusion. The simple version looks something like this:


    1. Observe some aspect of the universe.
    2. Invent a tentative description, called a hypothesis, that is consistent with what you have observed.
    3. Use the hypothesis to make predictions.
    4. Test those predictions by experiments or further observations and modify the hypothesis in the light of your results.
    5. Repeat steps 3 and 4 until there are no discrepancies between theory and experiment and/or observation.

    When consistency is obtained the hypothesis becomes a theory and provides a coherent set of propositions which explain a class of phenomena. A theory is then a framework within which observations are explained and predictions are made. "

    Is it that what you meant?
     
  5. Brimshack

    Brimshack Well-Known Member

    +447
    Atheist
    So, racer X, if you are simply a skeptic, then why are you parrotting all the usual Creationist disinformation?

    Man from monkey (time honored straw simian).
    no absolute proof (misrepresentation of scientific standards).
    Thuh Missing Link.
    The argument from ignorance. (If you can't prove your theory, mine is the correct one.)

    All of these are deliberate disinformation tactics, used by some Fundamentalist Christians, not to debate evolution, but to prevent honest debate from occuring. And then you fall back on Intelligent Design. I could respect someone who comes straight out and argues their own position, but not someone who pretends to be someone they're not. You pretend that you are a borderline atheist while advocating intelligent design? You aren't just expressing doubts, btw, words like; "of course it was intelligent design" indicate a definite stance. I'm sorry if I'm wrong, but it gets my goat to think that someone would claim to be an unbeliever just to play games with us.
     
  6. Racer X

    Racer X <b><font color="red">Searcher of Truth</font></b>

    69
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    But a theory isn't proof. Its compelling, but I don't believe in evolution.
     
  7. Patty

    Patty Nice ta see yas!

    +1
    &nbsp;

    Hey Brimshack,

    I can PROVE there's no missing link.&nbsp; Check out my new avatar.&nbsp; I ain't monkeying with a missing link.&nbsp; I just went ape.&nbsp; That's proof enough for me (I say as I pound my chest).

    Patty
     
  8. Brimshack

    Brimshack Well-Known Member

    +447
    Atheist
    LOL, and all this time I thought I was the missing link.
     
  9. armageddonman

    armageddonman Beware the Cat

    346
    +1


    Noone ever claimed so.

    Why? Do you have a scientific theory that contradicts evolution?
     
  10. Patty

    Patty Nice ta see yas!

    +1
    &nbsp;

    But, but, but Brimshack, buddy, pal, ole pal.

    You're here - on Christian Forums - being seen by at least 3 people!

    That means, you ain't missing, lost or anything else, don't it?


    Patty
     
  11. Brimshack

    Brimshack Well-Known Member

    +447
    Atheist
    Ah then the missing link has been filled. Evolution is proven.

    Alright, Racer X, I'll assume that I am wrong about you. Do you not see the inconsistency of your position?
     
  12. Brimshack

    Brimshack Well-Known Member

    +447
    Atheist
    Alrihgt, I'm sorry I got aggressive. I am aware of a few Christians who have pretended to be agnostics, and I thought you were one of them. I am still a little suspicious, but it's probably not appropriate to act on it. The main issue is this, while claiming to be a boderline atheist, you have expressed more than doubts about evolution. You have in fact argued a Theistic line with words indicating actual confidence in the position. You have also advanced many of the more obvious misrepresentations of evolutionary theory, misrepresentations coming from Creationist camps. Hence, the source of my suspicion:

    1) Evolutionary theory does not postulate that man is descended from monkeys.

    2) Absolute proof is a red herring; that is not the standard in most scientific reasoning, so to say that evolution is not proven absolutely is to praise the theory with faint damn.

    3)The missing link. There are actually gaps between different species all over the place, but these are regularly filled in. It is legitimate to question whether or not the methods of doing this are accurate, etc., but to speak of a single missing link is a deliberate over-simplification of the issue.

    4) Creation Scientists always seem to keep the emphasis on Evolution. They claim they have a scientific theory, but no-one can seem to find this theory. By continuing to press evolution on a thread that is intended to solicit evidence for creation, you are advancing that strategy.

    These lead me to believe that your thoughts on the topic are fairly in line with the less responsible of creation scientist's attacks. If you come by it honestly, then I am sorry for questioning you, but this pattern just doesn't square with your stated philosophical orientation.
     
  13. Racer X

    Racer X <b><font color="red">Searcher of Truth</font></b>

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    Ok, I don't know, I have a couple of friends who brought me here, they knows more about it than i do, they are christian, I am learning and will probably become Christian. My whole life I never went to Church, I am learning. As far as i can tell I cannot believe in a theory that is incomplete.
     
  14. armageddonman

    armageddonman Beware the Cat

    346
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    Noone expects you to BELIEVE in a theory.
     
  15. LewisWildermuth

    LewisWildermuth Senior Veteran

    +116
    Christian
    Single
    Now now Brim, let's remember that most Christians accept evolution and it is only a small fundie movement centered in the U.S. that denys it.
     
  16. OldBadfish

    OldBadfish Well-Known Member

    +20
    Can I ask how anyone can believe in a theory? Evolution is still way in it's infancy, who can ever win this argument? Both are theories.
     
  17. armageddonman

    armageddonman Beware the Cat

    346
    +1
    &nbsp;

    What is the scientific theory of creation?
     
  18. Brimshack

    Brimshack Well-Known Member

    +447
    Atheist
    You are absolutely coorect Lewis. I will change it immediately.
     
  19. OldBadfish

    OldBadfish Well-Known Member

    +20
    Man how did you quote me that fast? Well the big Bang would be consistent with Spontaneous creation, in fact it sounds better than the cause without a cause theory.
     
  20. LewisWildermuth

    LewisWildermuth Senior Veteran

    +116
    Christian
    Single
    Then step back from the computer slowly for it operated on an EVIL incomplete theories called physics, and so do all electric devices and fire and medicine...

    If your friends are telling you that you have to deny evolution to be a Christian they are flat out wrong. You no more have to deny evolution then you have to deny the earth is round. Yes if you interpret some of the OT literaly evolution seems to be out, but then again some of the Bible seems to suggest a flat earth, that women are only fields for sperm to plant itself in and grow, and disease should only be cured by prayer, that slavery was okay, and many other things that we now see were wrong ideas.
     
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