Empathy

[Godcrazy]

Yeah. Best to use cognitive empathy for that.

Really.. I mostly have a problem with emotional empathy. Cognitive empathy is much safer, but less engaging and thrilling for most people. But responsible things often are.

the support, the want to engage longer, to be a support is a big lacking when it comes to cognitive empathy. and that emotional support is what is truly needed the most. anyone can help ,but that..

 

[bèlla]

What makes me sad is that people are going change their mind specifically because HE said it....and moreso in pretty strong and adament language.

Its' not ME putting him on a pedestal. You and I maybe on teh same page when thinking about popular figures, but not everyone is as detached.

This is part of the pruning and why it’s necessary to be discriminating and draw your own conclusions. Many will fall and I don’t want to say you have to get used to it. But that’s true nonetheless.

~bella

 

[Godcrazy]

For someone suffering it feels VERY cold if someone did not listen and showed care over a longer period of time, someone that did not check up on you, someone that did not take time to listen, to support, to let you cry, that heard you saw you. Someone that could relate. That is all empathy is about

 

[NBB]

So, if he didn't believe in empathy, but if he was christian, he believed in biblical values like compassion, doing God commandments, justice, love for your neighbour. Do to others like you like they do to you.
So the people who are accusing him, are not understanding him probably.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

So, if he didn't believe in empathy, but is he was christian, he believed in biblical values like compassion, doing God commandments, justice, love for your neighbour. Do to others like you like they do to you.
So the people who are accusing him, are not understanding him probably.

That's a good point. Let's ask: What is the difference between Empathy and Compassion? I'll let everyone else here work on finding out what they think the answer is.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

For someone suffering it feels VERY cold if someone did not listen and showed care over a longer period of time, someone that did not check up on you, someone that did not take time to listen, to support, to let you cry, that heard you saw you. Someone that could relate. That is all empathy is about

That's a good point, too. It's important for any of us to realize that most other human beings need to be heard.

 

[MehGuy]

well psychopaths and narcissists that are dangeous people do use cognitive empathy, ability to calculate and understand what is needed and emulate it ,without feeling it so that is what they do, so I would say a person not able to feel it is dangerous because they do not really care and could slip any moment. relating to them,from my own experience, is a cold afair.

Same with many people who engage in emotional empathy. Cognitive empathy enhances emotional empathy.

I don't think cognitive empathy is always good either, but for your average person it's safer than being swayed by strong emotions.

Ideally I think one should practice a stronger sense of cognitive empathy with a reasonable amount of emotional empathy.

 

[rambot]

So, from all you've said in response to the hypothetically placed questions I've put forward, it sounds like you believer that empathy 1) should be allocated to victims, and 2) may be mediated in degree according to our interpersonal engagement and knowledge of another person's possible psychological difficulties. Am I close?

My students are NOT bright. I love em but there's no intellectual challenge for me. This post you've given me may be too much Sorry! I'll do what I can.

1) I'd say should be allocated for those needing connection (so usualyl those who are suffering...ie...victims...but not necessarily).
2) MAybe. I just kinda threw that idea out there; not sure if i'm married to it.

Would you agree, then, that the our capacity to offer empathy to other human beings, by whatever mental categories and terms we might use, is conditioned upon how we categorize the nature and significance of another person's actual psychological state?

Sorry...that our ability to offer empathy is affected by someone else's psychological state? I wouldn't say ability but maybe willingness. MAybe some kind extent, capacity too. I dunno.

From this additionally: Could it be that in Charlie Kirk's conception of empathy, he allocates it by principles rather than by personal feelings to those whom he thinks are the most victimized human beings, and that due to this difference of allocation, we may have a difficult time understanding his working definition because it reorganizes and reprioritizes the categories and principles any of us tend to use to classify "who" is a victim and under what circumstance our felt empathy (and sympathy) is to be given to that victim?

I'm soryr, that sentence is too long for me to wrap my head around.
I'm a simple man.
IF someone is using the wrong working definition, it get's tough coming to any kind of understanding. All of what you just said (whatever it is...) could very well be true. Or it could just be that Kirk doesn't like empathy.

[See one of a number of textbooks on Ethics, such as Ethics: An Introduction to Theories and Problems by William S. Sahakian. ] And this is before we even bring in personal differences of neuroscience and psychology. Not everyone who sounds like a sociopath actually is.

Oh trust me. I'm quite aware.

Sometimes, they just work from a different Ethic and a difference set of emotional attachments to certain moral categories.

ok.

You and I don't have to agree with Charlie Kirk, but we might want to realize fully that there are at least a dozen competing Ethical systems in existence that represent the different ways people allocate their Ethical categories and by which any of us funnel our understanding of empathy, such as it is or the degree to which we can give it.

I'm fine with different system. I'm not advocating that Kirk has a different definition. I am inclined to think that we have a shared definition of empathy and he just doesn't like it.

If we have different definitions, that's fine too. It's just not helpful in creating a shared vision of understanding; one certgainly can't build a functioning society without it..

If Kirk has a different idea of what "empathy" is, maybe he's thinking of something slightly different and there should be a NEW word for that. New words and concepts get invented all the time.


AGain, I'm not at my wittiest or brainiest at hte end of the day.

 

[MehGuy]

I appreciate how you've qualified a discernible difference between concepts of empathy. If they're not the same thing, then perhaps we need better, more accurate words by which to identify these psycho-social categories of Ethics, especially in cases dealing with the complicated makeup of human brains (or minds). Otherwise, maybe we all just end up talking past one another on certain levels.

I wouldn't go as far as saying they are not the same thing. Pure cognitive and pure emotional empathy probably do not exist. We probably need one for the other. Just .. I think a larger proportion of one's empathy being cognitive is healthier than being blinded and swayed by emotions emotional empathy conjures.

Although I agree clearer language is needed.

 

[Godcrazy]

Same with many people who engage in emotional empathy. Cognitive empathy enhances emotional empathy.

I don't think cognitive empathy is always good either, but for your average person it's safer than being swayed by strong emotions.

Ideally I think one should practice a stronger sense of cognitive empathy with a reasonable amount of emotional empathy.

verywellmind.com/cognitive and emotional empathy explains everything you want to know in detail and how to achieve,and the differences. If you only have one of them, your resonse to others either become in terms of only cognitive empathy the other person feels unheard and not cared for, and left misunderstood and trouble build connections with others, too much only emotional empathy leads you to take on the others emotions and trouble separate or be engulfed by your own feelings. The best response would be a combination. compassionate empathy, where we both act and are there for the other.
swayed? many times we have not been taught to show emotions or taught wrong about it, not shown towards us/mirrored so we cannot do it ourselves later, this is very important, or taught that emotions are not important or looked down on. the article comes in on it. how we have to drop our own thoughts and just BE THERE for someone. That means, not judge, listen for a LONGER time, support for a LONGER time, check up on them, even practically, etc. Let them talk. etc. this is how you truly help and be there for someone, and build connection.

 

[Godcrazy]

It is a genetic factor and developmental the issue of not being able to show emotional empathy only cognitive. It is an imbalance in the brain they found chromosomes that are responsible in research. As well we have not been taught.

 

[Godcrazy]

Speaking from experience with those not able to show empathy (they were able to cognitiv, but that was very selective and used for dominance) you never build long lasting relationships if you have one as the other can feel the cold quite literally. It is extremely important to have patience and really show listening skills support skills not just practically, but be there, hugs, listening, talking. over a longer time period. this is something I have seen is problematic for that group. And I have seen it creates a lot of problems. And if you have someone that grew up around them you absolutely need the second. Or you feel very alone indeed.

 

[Godcrazy]

A LOT of damage can come from not being able to be there emotionally for someone, regards to support listen skills and talking. A LOT. you hurt a person in need of help more by not doing it than by doing nothing. that is if it is not just about needing help practically.

 

[Godcrazy]

Emotional empathy can be learned partly, by mimic others

 

[MehGuy]

a person that is able to feel empathy, not just cognitve does not usually go around all oh oh feeling but just act on it but able to put themselves in the other persons shoes. something cognitive do not go into

Like I said earlier... When it comes to emotional empathy, I have a hard time believing those higher on the sadomasochistic spectrum do not have an significant edge.

If someone is literally empathizing with the pain of another and the person they are not empathizing is not sadomasochistic themselves(lol), it's probably a rough emotional experience and their overall ability and willingness to engage in emotional empathy is probably severely diminished. Especially compared to those who's emotional empathy has a high sadomasochistic bent.

I am highly skeptical of highly empathetic environments like some Christian circles and leftist/social justice ones. You ever wonder why many on the left take great pains in maintaining a victim hierarchy?