Doubting Believer

[selfinflikted]

That's just not correct. And I certainly wouldn't tell that to any woman in which you might be interested.

1) I can list verse upon verse in which this is clearly implied if not stated outright. So, it's not incorrect.

(ex. 1 Peter 3:7, among many others.)

2) *I* don't think women are inferior. But your god and Bible do. Further still, I am not interested in any woman.

 

[TillICollapse]

Perhaps they are tares.

Which only keeps the circle going. "Perhaps" is a key. "Perhaps they aren't real _____", etc. One claims they are wrong, another right, another appeals to being the true version of a thing while another points the finger and says they are a false version of a thing.

Again, I've never understood how a believer can be *content* with those types of contradictions. I understand how a person can be content with what they specifically believe to be true about a thing ... regardless of the focus ... as it relates to their own life and their perspective. But if they are part of something where people in a group are claiming contradictory information yet often appealing to the same authority or source ... I don't understand how many believers can be content with that.

 

[selfinflikted]

Which only keeps the circle going. "Perhaps" is a key. "Perhaps they aren't real _____", etc. One claims they are wrong, another right, another appeals to being the true version of a thing while another points the finger and says they are a false version of a thing.

Again, I've never understood how a believer can be *content* with those types of contradictions. I understand how a person can be content with what they specifically believe to be true about a thing ... regardless of the focus ... as it relates to their own life and their perspective. But if they are part of something where people in a group are claiming contradictory information yet often appealing to the same authority or source ... I don't understand how many believers can be content with that.

The alleged rewards outweigh everything, imo. The promise of immortality is a powerful, powerful thing.

 

[TillICollapse]

The alleged rewards outweigh everything, imo. The promise of immortality is a powerful, powerful thing.

Yes but if a person is wrong, and the belief they are clinging to is false, the alternative is often some form of eternal or temporary torment, torture, etc. So the rewards if they're right are great, but if they're wrong ... horrors.

So one would think they would REALLY REALLY REALLY want to get it right. I would think the desire to make sure you get it right is the powerful thing, not the reward only, because of the alternative if one chooses poorly. Yet, they are often content with the contradictions and confusion, which would seem to indicate they aren't taking the gamble all that seriously. It's either a form of Russian Roulette, or it's the Price is Right. You would think before someone pulls that trigger or chooses that door, they really hope they're making the right choice. And if they see 100,000 options to choose from, with everyone claiming this and that ... that doesn't seem to give enough pause for one to go, "Hmm ... maybe they're ALL wrong ? So how do we settle this so that I can choose the right option instead of facing eternal horrors ?"

 

[revrobor]

1) I can list verse upon verse in which this is clearly implied if not stated outright. So, it's not incorrect.

(ex. 1 Peter 3:7, among many others.)

2) *I* don't think women are inferior. But your god and Bible do. Further still, I am not interested in any woman.

I think before I discuss this any further with you you must at least make an effort to have a personal relationship with the One who inspired the Bible. Then you will understand what He is saying about women.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Yes but if a person is wrong, and the belief they are clinging to is false, the alternative is often some form of eternal or temporary torment, torture, etc. So the rewards if they're right are great, but if they're wrong ... horrors.

So one would think they would REALLY REALLY REALLY want to get it right. I would think the desire to make sure you get it right is the powerful thing, not the reward only, because of the alternative if one chooses poorly. Yet, they are often content with the contradictions and confusion, which would seem to indicate they aren't taking the gamble all that seriously. It's either a form of Russian Roulette, or it's the Price is Right. You would think before someone pulls that trigger or chooses that door, they really hope they're making the right choice. And if they see 100,000 options to choose from, with everyone claiming this and that ... that doesn't seem to give enough pause for one to go, "Hmm ... maybe they're ALL wrong ? So how do we settle this so that I can choose the right option instead of facing eternal horrors ?"

We live and learn, and in the end God judges. In the meantime it's fun to argue about it.

 

[selfinflikted]

I think before I discuss this any further with you you must at least make an effort to have a personal relationship with the One who inspired the Bible. Then you will understand what He is saying about women.

I was a Christian for many years. Beyond that, even when one is a Christian, you don't get any special powers of discernment to read what is written. It says what it says. You can explain it away, or ignore it, or twist it, or tap dance around it all day long, it just won't change what it actually says.

 

[dazed]

It's more a question of understanding than belief. For example I believe that stoning was indeed a punishment in ancient Israel, but I understand that that ordinance was done away by the new covenant.

Really? Somebody better tells the good Christians in Indiana and Arkansas that Leviticus laws were done away with the new covenant.

 

[TillICollapse]

We live and learn, and in the end God judges. In the meantime it's fun to argue about it.

Would you say that you don't take it that seriously then ?

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Would you say that you don't take it that seriously then ?

These forums are rarely serious discussions about anything. When someone does get really serious they come off as a weirdo.

 

[ThinkForYourself]

The alleged rewards outweigh everything, imo. The promise of immortality is a powerful, powerful thing.

Personally, I believe the threat of eternal torture is more powerful. Especially when it comes to indoctrinating children.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Really? Somebody better tells the good Christians in Indiana and Arkansas that Leviticus laws were done away with the new covenant.

Are they stoning people in Indiana and Arkansas?

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Personally, I believe the threat of eternal torture is more powerful. Especially when it comes to indoctrinating children.

Not all Christians believe in eternal torture.

 

[TillICollapse]

These forums are rarely serious discussions about anything. When someone does get really serious they come off as a weirdo.

But I wasn't talking about these forums in particular, but the subject matter of believer's in general and their response to the confusion and contradictions and contentedness with it.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

But I wasn't talking about these forums in particular, but the subject matter of believer's in general and their response to the confusion and contradictions and contentedness with it.

At my age I'm content with what I believe. I can't speak for those who are confused. I must say that people sometimes get a confused look when I tell them what I believe, as it contradicts much of what they believe.

 

[selfinflikted]

Personally, I believe the threat of eternal torture is more powerful. Especially when it comes to indoctrinating children.

Of course. That's part and parcel of the "reward" - which is to say not going to hell.

 

[TillICollapse]

Of course. That's part and parcel of the "reward" - which is to say not going to hell.

What is that called, where withholding punishment is considered "reward" ? I'm assuming it's categorized as a type of abuse ?

 

[selfinflikted]

What is that called, where withholding punishment is considered "reward" ? I'm assuming it's categorized as a type of abuse ?

Hm. Not sure. Perhaps?

 

[TillICollapse]

Hm. Not sure. Perhaps?

I'm assuming it's a form of abuse, or psychological phenomenon that takes place between abuser and the abused. I was hoping someone would know if there is a term that fits it ...

 

[selfinflikted]

I'm assuming it's a form of abuse, or psychological phenomenon that takes place between abuser and the abused. I was hoping someone would know if there is a term that fits it ...

Perhaps bhstme (sp?) would know. He's kinda the resident psych, even though I don't think he's been around for a few days.