Does "The Truth Always Come Out"?

[DZoolander]

Ya know - I've been thinking about 5kd and his situation this morning...and kind of how it pertains to what my own experience was when I went through my divorce years back. The long and the short of it is that he wants the truth about what's been going on to come out.

...and I remember thinking the same thing years back.

Without going into all of the sordid details - when I got divorced - it was because after an un-arguably crappy marriage - my ex-wife got into all sorts of deviant behaviors (bondage/discipline/sadism/masochism) - and decided that was going to become her primary focus. After she notified me that she had no intention of stopping - I called foul and filed for divorce.

The only thing was - it put me in a bad position. I did not feel that it was my place to notify the world *why* we were getting a divorce. My sealed mouth put me in a situation where everyone else (who apparently did not respect boundaries like I did) were free to talk about what a horrible person I was for "abandoning the marriage".

So - I remember kinda being in his place...and wondering when people would stop advising me that *I* needed to fix the situation - or that it was *my* fault that the marriage had ended.

The one thing that the whole experience taught me though - is that the truth *does* eventually come out. While it sucked at the time - eventually things did start getting out. After all - she *was* engaging in that behavior. When her new boyfriends started showing up - people started figuring out what might be going on. So - the nonsense being directed toward me lessened.

People started asking "was that going on when you were married?" - instead of accusing. Those types of questions I felt justified in answering.. "Yes. That's why we got divorced." Originally I was the "bad guy" - but eventually things turned 180.

So - my point of view is - the truth does usually come out on it's own accord. It's simply a matter of waiting until that happens - and sticking by your own convictions until it does. That was my experience.

Has anyone ever experienced different? Has the advantage of time (like - I'm talking about years since it's been over...since you can't really look at it when you're freshly going through it) not been to anyone's advantage?

 

[5kidsdad]

Ya know - I've been thinking about 5kd and his situation this morning...and kind of how it pertains to what my own experience was when I went through my divorce years back. The long and the short of it is that he wants the truth about what's been going on to come out.

...and I remember thinking the same thing years back.

Without going into all of the sordid details - when I got divorced - it was because after an un-arguably crappy marriage - my ex-wife got into all sorts of deviant behaviors (bondage/discipline/sadism/masochism) - and decided that was going to become her primary focus. After she notified me that she had no intention of stopping - I called foul and filed for divorce.

The only thing was - it put me in a bad position. I did not feel that it was my place to notify the world *why* we were getting a divorce. My sealed mouth put me in a situation where everyone else (who apparently did not respect boundaries like I did) were free to talk about what a horrible person I was for "abandoning the marriage".

So - I remember kinda being in his place...and wondering when people would stop advising me that *I* needed to fix the situation - or that it was *my* fault that the marriage had ended.

The one thing that the whole experience taught me though - is that the truth *does* eventually come out. While it sucked at the time - eventually things did start getting out. After all - she *was* engaging in that behavior. When her new boyfriends started showing up - people started figuring out what might be going on. So - the nonsense being directed toward me lessened.

People started asking "was that going on when you were married?" - instead of accusing. Those types of questions I felt justified in answering.. "Yes. That's why we got divorced." Originally I was the "bad guy" - but eventually things turned 180.

So - my point of view is - the truth does usually come out on it's own accord. It's simply a matter of waiting until that happens - and sticking by your own convictions until it does. That was my experience.

Has anyone ever experienced different? Has the advantage of time (like - I'm talking about years since it's been over...since you can't really look at it when you're freshly going through it) not been to anyone's advantage?

EZ,

Thank you for sharing, and for being sensitive to what I believe was the Spirit directing you to share what you have. I know that it will eventually come out...she is not as careful as she thinks she is, example that me and my coworkers saw them together. Her family is making comments to others in the church that they fear their sister is goofy...my word, aptly describes what she really is. There have been people in our church that have come up to me, and asked if there was another guy, not the other way around. On a Christian website like myspace, she is listing herself as single, and joining the singles group on that website. (It is a website that is dedicated to my faith's believers.) The guy she had or has hooked up with is into BDSM, poker and drinking. Not a Christian by any stretch. I have to hold true to the scriptures that state that what is done in secret will be shouted from the mountains, and that you cannot blatantly lie to your pastor, and lie to others so often, and in the face of the almighty God, and get away with it. She has yet to fall, and face reality. It doesn't help that her family is enablers, instead of standing up to her, telling her she is wrong, and forcing her to face reality. I know why they are like that, for my kids, and the fact that she would cry that they are mentally and verbally abusing her...that is how she is. If it weren't for my 5 kids, and how young they are, I wouldn't fight. My peace in the storm is that the kids spend so much time with her parents, about 3 nights per week. While I dispise what they are doing with her, i am more at peace when the kids are with them. No, I wasn't perfect, and the marriage was miserable for more than a few years. Both of us did things we shouldn't have, to the kids and each other. However, I did remain faithful and true, to her and the kids. I stood by her when even her own family wouldn't, so I couldn't have sucked that bad...I didn't think. Anyway, that's my thoughts.

Sorry EZ, I hope I didn't hijack your post. I hoped it would shed some light, and let you know that there are some errily similar connections there. BTW, I have felt bad about what happened, and stumbled across a video by Trace Adkins called "Muddy Water.' It's on youTube, and it is great for those who have felt beat down, and unworthy of God's love. And I really don't like country music.

Thanks EZ, and God bless.

5kd

 

[DZoolander]

Oh, trust me, you didn't hijack. The post was just as much about your experience as you've laid it out as it was mine, and it's definitely pertinent.

...and yeah...that connection is weird. Maybe that kinda nonsense is just a lot more popular and pervasive than you and I might think.

The truth is - whenever it comes to any situations like this - nobody is blameless. I give you credit for seeing your own failings in the marriage. As weird as my ex-wife got - I wasn't blameless in it either. Sure - I didn't go WAYYYY off the deep end like she did...lol...but was I perfect? By no stretch of the imagination. I learned from my mistakes - however - and have tried to incorporate their lessons into my life ever since.

God bless as you're going through it... Time does make it easier and fix all things - though... Ten years after my own nonsense - I can say that with conviction

 

[5kidsdad]

Oh, trust me, you didn't hijack. The post was just as much about your experience as you've laid it out as it was mine, and it's definitely pertinent.

...and yeah...that connection is weird. Maybe that kinda nonsense is just a lot more popular and pervasive than you and I might think.

The truth is - whenever it comes to any situations like this - nobody is blameless. I give you credit for seeing your own failings in the marriage. As weird as my ex-wife got - I wasn't blameless in it either. Sure - I didn't go WAYYYY off the deep end like she did...lol...but was I perfect? By no stretch of the imagination. I learned from my mistakes - however - and have tried to incorporate their lessons into my life ever since.

God bless as you're going through it... Time does make it easier and fix all things - though... Ten years after my own nonsense - I can say that with conviction

EZ,

I guess I shouldn't be suprised that even those who are Christians would be drawn into the darkness of what I would deem sin. The Bible states in James 1:14, "But people are tempted when their own evil desire leads them away and traps them." (New Century Version.) She has been denying the affair, and even bragged about the online poker she has been playing. Now, I don't necessarily believe it is wrong in all cases, when you have an addictive personality, and you need 'highs' like real money, then it is a sin to you. (Of course, then Reese Cups might just be my addiction...LOL.) I purposly stay away from some things just to be safe, because I do not want to fall into the trap. As society 'evolves' (what a bunch of garbage,) the lines become blurred, and what once seemed to be wrong is now right, and vice versa. It is troubling, what will it be in 5 years? I still believe in universal rights and wrongs. I don't see that BDSM as being OK, but that is just me.

Unless it is a very unique circumstance, each person leads to the demise of the marriage. I have had to recognize that, even if she won't. Like I said before, when it all comes crashing down on her, it will hurt. I just hope the kids aren't affected too bad by it. I have already lost everything, my home, my belongings, my daily life with my kids, my pride, and my financial abilities. The one thing I am thankful for is my family and true friends who have stepped up, and given me the love and support I needed. I am also learning a new appreciation for thankfulness for what I do have, so there is always a new lesson to be learned. My church (actually OUR church since she still comes) have been supportive, as has my pastor.

I hear it gets easier with time...we'll see. I'm sure it does. Thanks for the encouragement EZ.

God bless,

5kd

 

[eatenbylocusts]

My church (actually OUR church since she still comes) have been supportive, as has my pastor.

5kd

Just curious.....your pastor knows what's going on, right?

 

[5kidsdad]

Just curious.....your pastor knows what's going on, right?

EBL,

Yes he does. As soon as I discovered what was going on, I talked to him about it. At that time, I didn't have any proof in concrete. It wasn't until later that I found the evidence. Of course when I broke it to her family, and her, she went running to him, claiming that I had falsly altered the things that I had for evidence. Honestly, what I found, I couldn't in any way, have come up with the ideas, or write like that. He is in a difficult posistion about the whole deal. It kinda goes back to the kids. They still go there. If there were a bad confrontation, she would act out in rage or without thinking (like what got us in this mess in the first place.) She might take them from this church, and who knows then. I am not willing to let that happen. My kids need some stability in their lives, and the church with their friends is an important part of that.

5kd

 

[eatenbylocusts]

EBL,

Yes he does. As soon as I discovered what was going on, I talked to him about it. At that time, I didn't have any proof in concrete. It wasn't until later that I found the evidence. Of course when I broke it to her family, and her, she went running to him, claiming that I had falsly altered the things that I had for evidence. Honestly, what I found, I couldn't in any way, have come up with the ideas, or write like that. He is in a difficult posistion about the whole deal. It kinda goes back to the kids. They still go there. If there were a bad confrontation, she would act out in rage or without thinking (like what got us in this mess in the first place.) She might take them from this church, and who knows then. I am not willing to let that happen. My kids need some stability in their lives, and the church with their friends is an important part of that.

5kd

I think that's great that the kids get to remain at their familiar church. I think it's enough that the pastor has enough info to know what the issues are.

I married a nut with enough red flags and history that my divorce was no surprise, but it just sucks that church-going "Christians" are mucking up their lives and their kids like this. Of course I don't know if your wife was just an attender, but I sure hate to see this stuff that probably makes Satan so happy. Rant over......for now. God give us wisdom that we don't hook up with the wrong ones again.

 

[5kidsdad]

I think that's great that the kids get to remain at their familiar church. I think it's enough that the pastor has enough info to know what the issues are.


I married a nut with enough red flags and history that my divorce was no surprise, but it just sucks that church-going "Christians" are mucking up their lives and their kids like this. Of course I don't know if your wife was just an attender, but I sure hate to see this stuff that probably makes Satan so happy. Rant over......for now. God give us wisdom that we don't hook up with the wrong ones again.

EBL,

I always thought she was a believer, not an attender, but I just don't know now. She sure puts on a good show at church now...as we are one of those 'demonstrative' churches...LOL. Not everyone is fooled, however, so I guess I just don't have to worry. It is a shame that the "Christians" are messing things up. The devil will attack the weakest to get his way, won't he? In retrospect, I should have been a better Christian myself at times. Only now, I am finally getting to where I once was in God, and man, is it great. Not the circumstances, but great to be getting closer to Him. When the world falls apart, we are forced back to Him...it haqs been great in that respect. And yes, God PLEASE give us the wisdom to connect to the right ones, if we go down that road again.

5kd

PS: I am meeting with my pastor once every 2 weeks for lunch, or to talk, ride around, whatever. I am making myself accountable to him in a mentor type way. He has the clearance to call me whenever he wants to ask me what I'm doing, etc. He has not distanced himself from me, or even her. His door is always open, you just have to be willing to make the first step. He is truly a great man of God.

 

[5kidsdad]

I hope the truth comes out. I was just going over the court ordered documents that she had to submit, and again, there is a blatant lie about the amount of money that I provided for her and the kids prior to any court orders. The difference is between about $1200 and about $6700. The $6700 is what I gave. I am simply sick and tired of her constantly giving false info to her attorney and the court about what I rpovided. I just wonder how her attorney will react when he sees that she has been lying to him about the money I gave her? I know that patience is a wonderful thing to learn, and the battles only make us stronger, but I am getting weary in this battle. Thankfully, He is there to sustain us.

5kd

 

[DZoolander]

I hope you have canceled checks to verify what you've given her.

 

[5kidsdad]

I hope you have canceled checks to verify what you've given her.

Cancelled checks, ATM receipts where I deposited it in her account, a calendar where I detailed the dates I deposited the money, and now her bank statements that show the deposits. Plus, there was that rebate that we all got...I took none of it, so it is really about $8000.

 

[DZoolander]

Good.

I'd just go into court with that and state "I want to do her right, but I don't even know how to approach her anymore with the rampant dishonesty."

 

[5kidsdad]

Had our first hearing this week...and got blown away...there is some evidence that she would agree to a shared parenting plan...never thought I would see that coming. It is simply an answer to prayer. I guess we will wait on their proposal, and see where that leads, and then hopefully, I will be able to move close, and get to see my 5 precious children more often.

Thank you all for your prayers, they do work.

5kd

 

[DZoolander]

Yeah, my guess is that you'll probably get more than you anticipated. Once she's worked past the initial spite - and it starts dawning on her how five kids is going to cut into her partytime with the new guy (who is under no obligation to take on that responsibility) - she'll probably start being willing to "give".

At least that's my prediction.

 

[5kidsdad]

Quick question...she has thrown me a curve ball. She is not willing to do the shared parenting as I thought. So, now I'm back to square one. She still is bold faced denying the affair...big suprise. She is threatening to go after my medical records and therapist notes...I wasa pretty sure that those are covered under patient/client priviledge. She also has claimed to have recorded a phone conversation between the two of us...I of course had no knowledge of that...isn't that a illegal act? I am sure I do not have anything to worry about, but it is bothersome to me to even have to think about these things. So instead of thinking that this could end better than I expected, it could be going down in a fireball...I will still fight for the kids, no matter what, but so much for it maybe being easier...pride and selfishness have been many a person's downfall. Just curious if there are any legal scholars out there with any ideas.

Thanks, and God bless,

5kd

 

[Autumnleaf]

Quick question...she has thrown me a curve ball. She is not willing to do the shared parenting as I thought. So, now I'm back to square one. She still is bold faced denying the affair...big suprise. She is threatening to go after my medical records and therapist notes...I wasa pretty sure that those are covered under patient/client priviledge. She also has claimed to have recorded a phone conversation between the two of us...I of course had no knowledge of that...isn't that a illegal act? I am sure I do not have anything to worry about, but it is bothersome to me to even have to think about these things. So instead of thinking that this could end better than I expected, it could be going down in a fireball...I will still fight for the kids, no matter what, but so much for it maybe being easier...pride and selfishness have been many a person's downfall. Just curious if there are any legal scholars out there with any ideas.

Thanks, and God bless,

5kd

Get the best lawyer you can find and follow their advice to keep your money and your kids.

 

[DZoolander]

I agree wholeheartedly with Autumnleaf.

What state are you in, btw? Divorce laws vary state by state.

 

[DZoolander]

And another thing is - don't reveal your cards to anyone before you get a chance to play the deck. Most likely she'll let you know exactly what her approach and tactic will be ahead of time. People are stupid that way. Prepare accordingly - but don't give her the same type of information. As emotionally gratifying as it is to say "Yeah - well - I'm gonna do this!!!" - you only hurt your position.

Let her amass her stuff - tell you how she's gonna lie - etc... Stoically accept it - and then lay the whammy on her in court when she brings those things up. Make her out to be the liar she is. Don't give her a chance to amend her story ahead of time knowing what you can prove and disprove.

Screw it. Take her to the rails in court - and get as much as you possibly can. Take the kids away from her. Be as unmerciful as she seems to be willing to be. What's good for the goose is good for the gander, ya know?

 

[eatenbylocusts]

And another thing is - don't reveal your cards to anyone before you get a chance to play the deck. Most likely she'll let you know exactly what her approach and tactic will be ahead of time. People are stupid that way. Prepare accordingly - but don't give her the same type of information. As emotionally gratifying as it is to say "Yeah - well - I'm gonna do this!!!" - you only hurt your position.

Let her amass her stuff - tell you how she's gonna lie - etc... Stoically accept it - and then lay the whammy on her in court when she brings those things up. Make her out to be the liar she is. Don't give her a chance to amend her story ahead of time knowing what you can prove and disprove.

Screw it. Take her to the rails in court - and get as much as you possibly can. Take the kids away from her. Be as unmerciful as she seems to be willing to be. What's good for the goose is good for the gander, ya know?

I agree with not letting her know about whatever evidence you have beforehand. If she shows herself to be a liar, she discredits all her testimony. In California it is illegal to tape a conversation without advising the other person.

I don't agree with the "Be as unmerciful as she seems to be willing to be. What's good for the goose is good for the gander, ya know". Leave that to God. She may be a real disappointment, but she's the mother of your kids. If you are as bad as her; then you're as bad as her. "She did it first" is for kids. Be the man that I think your posts indicate you are. Let God go before you and hopefully have a wise attorney at your side.

If she has any conscience at all, she should have some major guilt. I think a lot of people who end marriages for the wrong reasons reach a point where they direct all that guilt into custody/property fights. It's like denial. Let me focus on this so I don't have to confront my sin. My manfriend has asked a few times why his ex-wife would be so uncomfortable around him and not friendly like some divorced couples. I told him it was probably pretty hard to face the fact that she divorced the father of her kids, the man she was married to for over 20 years for no good reason. She was remarried 6 months after the divorce was final. There's got to be guilt.

 

[DZoolander]

Well, when I say unmerciful, I mean don't spend a lot of time worrying about the "fairness" of suing for sole custody or how she's going to appear/etc. My stance would be "You've ended the relationship under these circumstances - my emotional obligations as being a loving spouse have ended."

You are two people now contending for what's best for your kids - with an impartial third party making a binding decision on you. The dynamics of marriage are gone. What matters now is what that third party is going to believe - and it's in your best interests to present the facts about yourself as correctly as you can. Don't get involved in a lot of discussion about her. Let the judge come to his own conclusions based upon how she apparently is going to choose going about it.

Let her lie - and be prepared to counter the lies with facts. The fact you have canceled checks is awesome. The more calm and collected you are - while she becomes more outlandish in her allegations and provable lies - the better off you will be. Just be prepared.

Don't get involved in any emotional discussions with her. That time is done. What she decides is unimportant - and it sounds like she's already made clear what her stance is going to be. If she wants to rail at you - let her. The more incensed she gets - and the more she tells you about how she's going to proceed - the better off you are. Let her crucify herself. It's not your job to worry about her mis-steps anymore - nor to reveal to her what they are.

The more you keep to yourself - and the more emotionally distant you present yourself to her - the better off you'll be when things go down.

...and that's what matters. You are not her advocate anymore.