Does God want us to "sin less" in this life or to "stop sinning?"

[Noxot]

i'm starting to think that not sinning is very possible and that people focus way too much on calling things sin that might not be sin at all.

 

[Neogaia777]

i'm starting to think that not sinning is very possible and that people focus way too much on calling things sin that might not be sin at all.

Please... elaborate...?

What might be some of those things...?

And it can only truly happen a certain way, right, not by like, focusing on not doing the do not do's, can be self-defeating and I do not think it is part of the way either, one main part of that way is Love, and letting true Godly love conquer all for you and make the way, or make the way clear... Of being sinless, or of being truly righteous...

 

[Bible Highlighter]

2 Timothy 2:5, holding a form of godliness, but having denied the power therefore. From these also turn away.

I was wondering what kind of "power" or what "power" could it be talking about, and I thought maybe power of or in overcoming sin in their lives in their person...? The ones that just can't seem to do away with sin or stop sinning... With Pharasitical ones, Those who do not practice what they preach, Pharisees, Ones insisting on O.C. Law alone nowadays... Do as they say, not as they do... Also, People who are unable to repent fully and know it also, denying the power of, by a lack of faith or believing maybe, or other reasons, unable to do away with sinning completely...

What should they do now, how should they proceed....?

Yes. They deny the power of God (Christ) to make them holy. God works in a believer to help them to live righteously. Jesus said, with man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.

As for who these people are: Well, it is any believer trying to justify sin with the thinking they are saved.

What should they do? Well, repent of course.
But not many of them will do that.
Sin is pretty enticing to people.
It's hard to give up.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

So you think it's possible...?

Yes, because I believe Scripture. The 144,000 were found without fault before the throne of God.(Revelation 14:3-5). Enoch was translated because he pleased God.

Interesting...?

This is not really a proper question. What do you mean?

Can I ask are, or do you...?

This sentence is not gramatically correct. I am not sure what you are trying to say.
Please rephrase it.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

And it can only truly happen a certain way, right, not by like, focusing on not doing the do not do's, can be self-defeating and I do not think it is part of the way either, one main part of that way is Love, and letting true Godly love conquer all for you and make the way, or make the way clear... Of being sinless, or of being truly righteous...

Well, yes. We need love to obey God's commands in the New Testament. But meditating on God's Commands is not going to work against you, though. It is God's Holy Word. He wants you to focus on His Word. The problem with why the Pharisees failed is because they did not seek things by faith. They did not have God's grace and salvation through Jesus Christ. They did not keep the weightier matters of the Law like love, justice, faith, and mercy (Matthew 23:23) (Luke 11:42).

 

[Neogaia777]

Yes. They deny the power of God (Christ) to make them holy. God works in a believer to help them to live righteously. Jesus said, with man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.

As for who these people are: Well, it is any believer trying to justify sin with the thinking they are saved.

What should they do? Well, repent of course.
But not many of them will do that.
Sin is pretty enticing to people.
It's hard to give up.

There are believer's who do sin, who are not trying to justify the sin before God, or angels, and some even men or man, and are not yet denying that they are a sinner who does sin, but also not denying the truth of and about that, and sin, yet not trying to justify it in any way, it often keeps them humble before God IMOP...

I think I'm going to heaven or am a saved soul/person, either way now, just the question is what I want my life to be like here, while I am here, is the issue right now... You can sow seeds here for fruit in both worlds you know, while your here...

Glad you admitted that it is hard to do...

But, do you, or can you, or do you, or can you, not sin at all anymore...?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

There are believer's who do sin, who are not trying to justify the sin before God, or angels, and some even men or man, and are not yet denying that they are a sinner who does sin, but also not denying the truth of and about that, and sin, yet not trying to justify it in any way, it often keeps them humble before God IMOP...

Being a slave to sin is not a humble position to have. Jesus said to the Pharisees that he that sins is a slave to sin. He did not say this in a favorable way to them.

I think I'm going to heaven or am a saved soul/person, either way now, just the question is what I want my life to be like here, while I am here, is the issue right now... You can sow seeds here for fruit in both worlds you know, while your here...

Jesus says you cannot serve two masters. Jesus says a good tree cannot bring forth bad fruit and a bad tree cannot bring forth good fruit.

Glad you admitted that it is hard to do...

Love for Jesus is what should compel a believer to want to stop sinning.
Jesus says if you love me, keep my commandments.

But, do you, or can you, or do you, or can you, not sin at all anymore...?

It is possible to stop sinning. Galatians 5:24 says they that are Christ's have crucified the affections and lusts. 1 Peter 4:1-2 says that we can suffer in the flesh as Christ has suffered in the flesh and by doing this we can cease from sin. Verse 2 then says we should live the rest of our time here on this Earth to the will of God and not to the lusts of the flesh. 2 Corinthians 7:1 says, Let us cleanse ourselves from ALL filthiness of the flesh and spirit perfecting holiness in the fear of God.

As for my life: I do not have a crystal ball to know what I will do tomorrow. My destiny is not determined by my past. There are days I do not commit sins that lead unto spiritual death. Any days I do faulter, I confess these sins to God. But we have to understand that my life is not the Word of God. Even if I failed horribly in my walk with God, the Scriptures teaching on overcoming sin would still be true regardless. So I am not sure why you think it is important for you to know about my walk. What's important is: "What does God's Word say on the matter?" For we walk by faith and not by sight.

 

[Neogaia777]

Yes, because I believe Scripture. The 144,000 were found without fault before the throne of God.(Revelation 14:3-5). Enoch was translated because he pleased God.

The elect are a very small in number relatively speaking, are very small in number small group that rules and reigns with Christ, and were or are "perfect" most will probably be our heads and teachers or leaders in heaven...

But, they do actually obey the law, and are virgins, and are pure (in thinking) (yet not innocent or ignorant), and are perfect in Love, and perfect in many things, essentially, mark of true saints of God... They will make good leaders and teachers and wise men...

But, the innumerable great crowd is most of not the elect of God... Most of us... The Born Again, the saved, the spared, the redeemed... Us...

Who Christ leads... His "other sheep" of and from "other folds"...

 

[Neogaia777]

Being a slave to sin is not a humble position to have. Jesus said to the Pharisees that he that sins is a slave to sin. He did not say this in a favorable way to them.



Jesus says you cannot serve two masters. Jesus says a good tree cannot bring forth bad fruit and a bad tree cannot bring forth good fruit.



Love for Jesus is what should compel a believer to want to stop sinning.
Jesus says if you love me, keep my commandments.



It is possible to stop sinning. Galatians 5:24 says they that are Christ's have crucified the affections and lusts. 1 Peter 4:1-2 says that we can suffer in the flesh as Christ has suffered in the flesh and by doing this we can cease from sin. Verse 2 then says we should live the rest of our time here on this Earth to the will of God and not to the lusts of the flesh. 2 Corinthians 7:1 says, Let us cleanse ourselves from ALL filthiness of the flesh and spirit perfecting holiness in the fear of God.

Do you not sin anymore...? (You seem to be avoiding that question?)

Is part of our problem the "definition of" sin, or not...?

Do you serve two masters...?

I think obedience is a fruit of a root of planted seed, and comes only when it becomes fruitful...

Sin shouldn't keep me humble, but because I do feel very bad about it, it shames and disgusts me even, makes me feel like an animal... It does, cause I have to be humble, or I feel the need to humble myself, when I have committed a sin (afterward)... Cause it might have been pride and rebellion, I don't know...?

Anyhow, another voice suggested that it might also be a part of being a human being and not God...

I think many people who they do not sin at all anymore, must have a very narrow view of sin, for one, but are just adopting new unknown to them, sins that they do and do not even think twice about most of the time...

God Bless!

 

[So Cliche]

He kinda does.

I've always had that Matt 25:41-46 lingering in my mind. It's heavy.

 

[Noxot]

Please... elaborate...?

What might be some of those things...?

And it can only truly happen a certain way, right, not by like, focusing on not doing the do not do's, can be self-defeating and I do not think it is part of the way either, one main part of that way is Love, and letting true Godly love conquer all for you and make the way, or make the way clear... Of being sinless, or of being truly righteous...

~shrugs~ I dunno really. I feel a powerful liberty with God which in and of itself could make me sin if I do not hold God near to me as my first love. other people seem very restrictive in their religion and worry that the devil will drink them up. i'm not saying it is bad, only the Lord says if something is bad or good and we should all be going so near to him that we hear him clearly. it should be our main priority to be as near to God as possible in whatever way he leads us. so I can't really lay down any laws for anything and it becomes hard to describe a path when only the Lord is the way, the truth, and the life.

it just seems that sometimes we focus so much on sin and make it tenfold the bogeyman that it really is. at what point do we start sinning against God for calling ourselves sinners? why try so hard to look for this or that way that you might be sinning? whatever the Lords will is for you is what you should be doing. otherwise before you know it you would have added to the simplicity in Christ and heaped up a burden that neither your forefathers nor you can bear.

Num 13:30 (YLT)
And Caleb stilleth the people concerning Moses, and saith, `Let us certainly go up--and we have possessed it; for we are thoroughly able for it.'

Num 13:31-33 (YLT)
And the men who have gone up with him said, `We are not able to go up against the people, for it is stronger than we;' and they bring out an evil account of the land which they have spied unto the sons of Israel, saying, `The land into which we passed over to spy it, is a land eating up its inhabitants; and all the people whom we saw in its midst are men of stature; and there we saw the Nephilim, sons of Anak, of the Nephilim; and we are in our own eyes as grasshoppers; and so we were in their eyes.'

what can even be said? it seems that in those times when we become somewhat unconscious of God that challenges come about but when you are awake with God everything seems so light and burnt up. today I was close to God in honest and natural prayer, worship, and rejoicing. focusing on the do's and don'ts was just part of the act of communion with God. everything seemed so perfect today. get an evil thought? so what, it's not me and I don't let it have me because I belong to the Lord. the Lord himself treasures even those things up in me so I might be me and love him through the denial of such things.

 

[Neogaia777]

~shrugs~ I dunno really. I feel a powerful liberty with God which in and of itself could make me sin if I do not hold God near to me as my first love. other people seem very restrictive in their religion and worry that the devil will drink them up. i'm not saying it is bad, only the Lord says if something is bad or good and we should all be going so near to him that we hear him clearly. it should be our main priority to be as near to God as possible in whatever way he leads us. so I can't really lay down any laws for anything and it becomes hard to describe a path when only the Lord is the way, the truth, and the life.

it just seems that sometimes we focus so much on sin and make it tenfold the bogeyman that it really is. at what point do we start sinning against God for calling ourselves sinners? why try so hard to look for this or that way that you might be sinning? whatever the Lords will is for you is what you should be doing. otherwise before you know it you would have added to the simplicity in Christ and heaped up a burden that neither your forefathers nor you can bear.

Num 13:30 (YLT)
And Caleb stilleth the people concerning Moses, and saith, `Let us certainly go up--and we have possessed it; for we are thoroughly able for it.'

Num 13:31-33 (YLT)
And the men who have gone up with him said, `We are not able to go up against the people, for it is stronger than we;' and they bring out an evil account of the land which they have spied unto the sons of Israel, saying, `The land into which we passed over to spy it, is a land eating up its inhabitants; and all the people whom we saw in its midst are men of stature; and there we saw the Nephilim, sons of Anak, of the Nephilim; and we are in our own eyes as grasshoppers; and so we were in their eyes.'

what can even be said? it seems that in those times when we become somewhat unconscious of God that challenges come about but when you are awake with God everything seems so light and burnt up. today I was close to God in honest and natural prayer, worship, and rejoicing. focusing on the dos and don't was just part of the act of communion with God. everything seemed so perfect today. get an evil thought? so what, it's not me and I don't let it have me because I belong to the Lord. the Lord himself treasures even those things up in me so I might be me and love him through the denial of such things.

Awesome post!

God Bless!

 

[Gregory Thompson]

Passages such as Philippians 4:4-9 give insight similar to being on the road, you tend to go where you're looking. If sin is the main focus, then there isn't much time provided to focus on the better parts of this new and better covenant.
.
it's not so much about trying to stop sinning, it's applying what the bible says about being like God in this life. It's kind of like the word for repentance, it means to change your thinking, and in many cases it means to change the thought direction so you can trust in the reality of who God is, instead of the reality of we are sinners and got to get it right ... a sentiment which kind of negates what Jesus did, he did it .. we can't - that's the point.

 

[brinny]

Nobody is claiming that God is not our strength. Overcoming sin is only possible by God’s power if we follow His instructions within His Word. But if we don’t believe those instructions, then we will see things differently.

Isn't that what i posted, Jason?

 

[Adstar]

You are going to do works regardless. One is either saved by

Option 1. God's grace + good works or
Option 2. God's grace + evil works.

I will take option 1 because that is not only the Biblical position but it is also the moral one.

There is only one option .. God's Grace + Nothing else..

 

[Bible Highlighter]

The elect are a very small in number relatively speaking, are very small in number small group that rules and reigns with Christ, and were or are "perfect" most will probably be our heads and teachers or leaders in heaven...

But, they do actually obey the law, and are virgins, and are pure (in thinking) (yet not innocent or ignorant), and are perfect in Love, and perfect in many things, essentially, mark of true saints of God... They will make good leaders and teachers and wise men...

But, the innumerable great crowd is most of not the elect of God... Most of us... The Born Again, the saved, the spared, the redeemed... Us...

Who Christ leads... His "other sheep" of and from "other folds"...

No. The "Elect" are those called to salvation. Judas was elected or called as a disciple but he fell away from God's grace by his sinful choices. God chooses the "Elect" based on His future foreknowledge (1 Peter 1:1-2). This means God chooses us based on what we know we are going to do in regards to Him involving our free will choice.

The Scriptures say,
Many are called, few are chosen (Matthew 22:14).

"Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall." (2 Peter 1:10).

 

[Aseyesee]

No. The "Elect" are those called to salvation. Judas was elected or called as a disciple but he fell away from God's grace by his sinful choices. God chooses the "Elect" based on His future foreknowledge (1 Peter 1:1-2). This means God chooses us based on what we know we are going to do in regards to Him involving our free will choice.

The Scriptures say,
Many are called, few are chosen (Matthew 22:14).

"Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall." (2 Peter 1:10).

Do you believe God knit everyone in their mothers womb?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Do you not sin anymore...? (You seem to be avoiding that question?)

No. I was not avoiding your question. I was tired while posting last night. Before I even seen this post (which was today), I was proof reading my post last night and noticed all of what you said prior in the other post and I re-edited it so as to answer you. Refresh the page and look at Post #227 (at the last paragraph). I also have answered this question numerous times here at CF, as well. So I was not avoiding your question. I merely did not catch all of what you were saying clearly when I was posting last night so I re-edited it (While I was proof reading my post so as to check for grammar) last night.

Besides, even if my walk was 100% perfect, I doubt it would convince you. You believe the way you do because you find it comforting that you can sin in this life and also serve God. The idea of putting away sin is not something that is attractive to you; Hence, why you attack such a position.

However, if you truly do love God and Christ, and want to truly do what is true and pleasing in His sight, please read in prayer 2 Corinthians 7:1, 1 Peter 4:1-2, Galatians 5:24 over and over for several days. Do not try and change these verses but let them change you.

Is part of our problem the "definition of" sin, or not...?

There is no problem with the definition of sin in the Bible.
1 John 3:4 says sin is transgression of the Law.
So if you are breaking God's commandments you are sinning.
A belief on Jesus is not going to automatically wipe them away.
One needs to "repent" (i.e. ask Jesus for forgiveness or admit their sinful condition) and then forsake their sinful and evil ways.

Do you serve two masters...?

No. But anyone who teaches a doctrine that they can sin and still be saved does.
The Scriptures say, "Choose this day in whom ye will serve."
A person cannot serve both God and sin.
It doesn't work like that.

I think obedience is a fruit of a root of planted seed, and comes only when it becomes fruitful...

Jesus is the "Good Tree" who lives inside a believer. Receiving of the seed of the Word of God (i.e. the Holy Scriptures) is how Jesus can live in our hearts by faith when we accept what He says. Any good fruit a believer does is the result of Christ working in them.

Sin shouldn't keep me humble, but because I do feel very bad about it, it shames and disgusts me even, makes me feel like an animal... It does, cause I have to be humble, or I feel the need to humble myself, when I have committed a sin (afterward)... Cause it might have been pride and rebellion, I don't know...?

On one hand, God's grace is there for us if we do honestly stumble or struggle with sin (like the Tax Collector in the Parable of the Tax Collector and the Pharisee), but on the other hand, God's grace is not there for someone who thinks they will be a slave to their sin their entire lives and they cannot help but to sin as a way of life. There is no holiness or overcoming sin with this kind of thinking. One will be a slave to sin and not a slave to righteousness. Paul talks about how we can be a slave to righteousness in Romans 6. However, it is only by the power of Jesus Christ that can set a believer free from their sinful state. They can overcome their sin by Jesus. This is the other side of the gospel message that is never heard these days (See Ephesians 5:25-27, Titus 2:14). It is why we are living in the last days whereby there are men who have a form of Godliness but deny the power thereof (2 Timothy 3:1-9).

Anyhow, another voice suggested that it might also be a part of being a human being and not God...

Sin is always a part of what man does and it is never a part of what God does. God is holy, good, and loving. Sin is foreign to Him. It is why He cannot agree with a believer's plan of salvation that says they can do evil so that good may come.

I think many people who they do not sin at all anymore, must have a very narrow view of sin, for one, but are just adopting new unknown to them, sins that they do and do not even think twice about most of the time...

God Bless!

Not sure what you are saying here. It is not clear, my friend.

Anyways, may God's love shine upon you today.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Do you believe God knit everyone in their mothers womb?

While I read and use Modern Translations, the KJV is my final Word of authority. It is saying something similar but in a metaphorical way.

"For thou hast possessed my reins: thou hast covered me in my mother's womb."
(Psalms 139:13) (KJV).​

This means God oversees the process of creation that was set forth back in the creation week.

Jeremiah 1:5 would be a verse that would be closer to what you want it to say in Psalms 139:13.

"Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations." (Jeremiah 1:5).​

This does not mean God is adding to the six day creation week. God is merely taking the DNA (information) from Adam and bringing it forth and overseeing the creation being properly maintained.

Not sure why you think this has anything to do with "Election" or "God's elect." (i.e. Those who are Called).

 

[Bible Highlighter]

There is only one option .. God's Grace + Nothing else..

This may be true for the thief on the cross and or death bed confessionals, but this is not true for believers who live out their faith. If a believer lives out their faith, they will bring forth works of some kind. Their works (fruit) will determine what kind of tree there are of.

Even if you don't think works does not play a part in your salvation, you have to conclude that evil works (sin) is going to be a part of your life. To not acknowledge this is to be in denial.

So if you believe that saints will always be in sin according to 1 John 1:8, and Romans 3:23, etc. and you are saved by God's grace then Option 2 is reality.

You are saved by:

Option 2. God's grace + evil works.

Note: Good works do not count if one is also doing evil works (See Ezekiel 18:24 and Matthew 7:23).