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Do we have free will?

Taure

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I consider the term "free will" to be undefinable in any adequate sense, because I consider it a contradiction in terms. See a short article I wrote for why:

For all the debate surrounding the freedom of will, surprisingly little attention has been given to analysis of the concept of "free will", independent of its truth or falsity. It is a vital issue, for without such a definition all arguments which use the phrase run the risk of incorporating a meaningless term, and thus lacking sense. Further, by simple analysis of the phrase "free will" we come across a contradiction which is potentially fatal to the libertarian position, and acts as a road sign for the kind of compatibilist theories which should be pursued.


Traditionally, "free will" has been used by libertarians in the following fashion: to will freely is to will without constraint from forces or causes outside one's control. This usage needs some small further clarification. Firstly we are discussing mental will, not action. No serious philosopher proposes that humans are omnipotent. Secondly, "will" is taken to be something like the process of making a decision or choice. Thus in the simple case of making a choice between an apple and an orange, a libertarian will say that for the choice to be free (and they claim it is), it must be made without being influenced to the point of constraint. This is to say that they may be influenced, but only in a trivial way: if the influence is so strong that the decision can be said to follow causally from it, then it is a constraint, and the choice is not free.


Determinists appear quite happy to take this definition and run with it. It is easy to see why: the position practically walks itself to the gallows. In the case of the apple and the orange, it is simple enough to see that the decision will be based on taste (excluding scenarios where the individual has reason to pick against his or her taste). If I like oranges better than apples, I will pick the orange. Yet I never decided to like oranges better than apples independently of how I found their taste. I just prefer them. It is a fact about me that is outside of my control.


This counter-position often held by determinists is entirely unnecessary. Convincing though it is, it is not logically impossible that a counter argument may be constructed. A stronger argument against the libertarian position can be achieved, one which not so much argues against libertarian free will, but under libertarian free will. By going straight to the foundations of the concept of free will we can display the concept to not just be false, but a logical contradiction in terms.


At the risk of redundancy, the phrase "free will" contains two parts: "free" and "will". "Free will" clearly refers to a certain kind of willing: willing that is free. Let us first then investigate the broader class: what it is to will, and from there move on to the subset: what kind of willing "free will" would be.


Pinning down such a hazy notion as "will" is a tricky business. It is related to desire, but not identical. One main difference between the two is that a desire may be subconscious, but to will something has an element of deliberation to it. I cannot will something without my own knowledge as I can desire something without knowing it. Another difference is that willing something is an event; a desire can last an indeterminate length of time and thus is more akin to a state.


Will also possesses an aspect of intention to act. While I may possess a desire to write this essay for some months without ever writing it, I could not will myself to write it and then not do so. If I will myself to write then I am enacting something - or at least attempting to. It is of course the case that any number of physical limitations may prevent me from making my will actual. For example, someone may physically restrain my hand, yet in this situation I am still willing that I write the essay, for I am trying to do so - I am making a serious attempt to write, unlike when I held only an unfulfilled desire. From this we must take care to stress that, though willing has an element of deciding to enact something, the actual successful enactment is not necessary (in fact it is irrelevant). Will is a mental phenomena, not physical.


With these considerations in mind we may formulate a definition of will. To will X is to consciously and deliberately attempt to enact X. At this point one key observation must be made. Will, as outlined here, is conscious and deliberate. If this is the case, then it is part of a "train of thought" of which we can tell a kind of causal story or narrative. I chose the orange because I liked it better. Or, I chose the apple because I wanted to show that I can make choices contrary to taste. One corollary of this is that it excludes instinctual action from being counted as will. If I jerk my hand away from a hot pan I did not will that I do so. Rather it is a reflex action. Biology confirms this fact: actions such as withdrawing a hand from something hot is coordinated by the spinal column, not the brain.


Armed with this conception of will, we can move forwards and look at what kind of willing libertarians (and consequently determinists) speak of when they discuss freedom of will. Recall the libertarian usage of free will mentioned above. Under this lose definition, a freely willed choice was one which was not constrained by anything which was itself not a free choice made by that individual. This is a way of saying that a freely willed action is one that is uncaused, except by the individual's will. If my decision to pick the orange is caused by my taste then it is no longer my free choice: it is, as it were, my taste's choice. Thus, for the choice to be mine, there cannot be any other cause to "steal" it from me. Freedom comes to mean a lack of causality. Yet what is something uncaused? Something without a causal chain behind it is something random, and not even the randomness of a hypothetical fair die, which is governed by probability. The random nature of a free choice would be more akin to the randomness of a spontaneously existing universe. To use the religious terminology, free choice is choice ex nihilo.


It is here that the contradiction emerges. Will is the end of a chain of thought: a causal process. "Free will" would have to be will without cause - will ex nihilo. Such a thing is a logical contradiction, for will is by nature caused and non-random. A free choice would have to be a choice both with and without a cause, which is clearly contradictory. It is clear, then, from this analysis that "free will" means nothing: it is nonsense.


It is important here to close off one line of escape. It could be claimed that if will could be the cause of itself then the causality of will and the unconstrained nature of freedom could both be satisfied. However, such a proposal would require an infinite regress of willing, which I take most will be unwilling to accept - especially given that an individual's life does not continue back for eternity.


This contradiction draws startling light upon the debates surrounding “free will”. Firstly, it is clear that the libertarian idea of free will is untenable and thus no credible theory may be built using it. To base an argument on a contradiction is to have an argument of nonsense (or to be a Hegelian!), for you are asserting the existence of something which makes no sense. However, it is also a consequence that the determinist arguments, designed to refute libertarianism and therefore utilising that conception of free will, suffer the same fate. Determinism attempts to deny the existence of free will. However, this makes as much sense as one attempting to deny the existence of “gaga”. It is not a thing which we can discuss as existing or not, for it is not a thing at all. The sentence “gaga does not exist” means nothing, just as “gaga exists” means nothing, because “gaga” denotes nothing.


Readers familiar with Russellmay feel the need here to object, claiming that it is not the case that these phrases mean nothing, but rather that the affirmation of the existence of “gaga” is simply false (1905). However, this is not a “present King of France” situation, for it is not that “gaga” or “free will” are definite descriptions which sensibly describe something which is simply non-existent. Rather, they are nonsense themselves, thus rendering the sentence referring to them as nonsense. We understand what "the present King of France is bald" is trying to say - it makes sense - it is merely the case that there is no present King of France. "Free will", meanwhile, is more like the phrase "white blackness". We understand the words but cannot conceive of what they mean when conjoined.


It could perhaps be proposed that the nonsense of “free will” and the nonsense of “gaga” are not the same kind of nonsense. One might be tempted to bring in some kind of concept of “illuminating nonsense” (such as in Hacker, 2001). However, it seems clear to me that “illuminating nonsense” is as much of a contradiction as “free will” is. Nonsense, by definition, means nothing, and if it means nothing then there is no way it can communicate anything meaningful. We can only mistakenly believe that it communicates something: it is this mistaken belief (probably brought about by the fact that the individual elements of “free will” do make sense, before they are brought together) which makes us believe that “free will” and “gaga” could be different kinds of nonsense.


The only discussions on free will which still make sense, therefore, are those which do not utilise the idea of a completely unconstrained freedom of will. The only theories which survive this culling are those of compatibilism. There exists here something of a linguistic misfortune. Compatibilism is named such as it is supposed to be a half way point, combining determinism and libertarianism. It is important to note, however, that despite this naming convention, the theories of compatibilism do not revolve around the affirmation or denial of libertarian “free will” and concordantly do not fall into the trap of discussing a contradiction.


A new debate on the nature of will is needed. This debate would overlap with much of what compatibilism is today, but a certain measure of distancing is needed. The compatibilist theories, while they attempt to construct new definitions of “free will”, are misguided in their motivation. We should not be trying to “rescue” free will. The concept should be left to die, and the debates around will must move on. Using the phrase “free will” to denote something that is quite different to libertarian free will betrays the extent to which compatibilists are still trying to salvage a defunct concept. Instead, a study into the nature of constrained willing must take place, drawing from compatibilist theories, but with a completely different aim: not to maintain or deny freedom of will, but to understand how it is we will and act as part of a larger causal narrative.
However, it should be noted that this argument is purely analytical. It's a conceptual argument, arguing that conceptual discussion of "free will" is nonsense. Rather, we should simply defer to an empirical/scientific study of the nature of human action (neurology, cognitive science, etc.) which does not use philosophically heavy terms such as free will, but talks in precise and physical terms.
 
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Washington

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I consider the term "free will" to be undefinable in any adequate sense, because I consider it a contradiction in terms. See a short article I wrote for why:

However, it should be noted that this argument is purely analytical. It's a conceptual argument, arguing that conceptual discussion of "free will" is nonsense. Rather, we should simply defer to an empirical/scientific study of the nature of human action (neurology, cognitive science, etc.) which does not use philosophically heavy terms such as free will, but talks in precise and physical terms.
I only read the first couple of paragraphs of your piece so I may have missed something here, but it appears to be an exercise in parsing "free will." Assuming this is the case, while parsing terms or expressions can be interesting, and at times even useful, in the free will debate most people recognize the meaning of the term irrespective of the meanings of the individual words. It's like the terms "jumbo shrimp," "deafening silence," "sweet sorrow," and my favorite, "creation science." As long as the meaning of the two-word term is understood it makes no difference that the two are antonyms, or synonyms, or some unpronounceable polyglot. It's kind of like 2 ≠ 3, but put together they make 5, 6, 23, 1, -1, 2/3, or 3/2. It all depends on the meaning we elect to give the combination.

Of course, if I missed the boat here . . . . :D
 
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Washington

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My point is that people only think they understand what it means, because they've not analysed the term completely. After analysis, the term has about as much meaning as "white blackness". Or at least, that's the argument.
But analyzed or not, the meaning of the term remains as given. Analyze "sweet" all you want and analyze "sorrow" all you want, but in the end it doesn't change the meaning of "sweet sorrow," the concurrent feeling of joy and sadness. We can assign whatever meaning we want to whatever combination of words we choose, and no parsing of the words changes the meaning we've assigned that combination. As for the issue of free will versus whatever, you could call it "wee frill" and the meaning would remain the same. If we say "free will" means the ability of an agent to act without absolutely any cause or constraints, then that's what it means. Period!
 
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Taure

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But analyzed or not, the meaning of the term remains as given. Analyze "sweet" all you want and analyze "sorrow" all you want, but in the end it doesn't change the meaning of "sweet sorrow," the concurrent feeling of joy and sadness. We can assign whatever meaning we want to whatever combination of words we choose, and no parsing of the words changes the meaning we've assigned that combination. As for the issue of free will versus whatever, you could call it "wee frill" and the meaning would remain the same. If we say "free will" means the ability of an agent to act without absolutely any cause or constraints, then that's what it means. Period!
You miss my point. I'm saying that the meaning of the term isn't a given, because we don't have a meaning for it at all. We think we do, but this is a linguistic illusion brought on by the fact that we know what "free" means and we know what "will" means. However, when we are asked to pinpoint exactly the meaning that "free will" denotes, we cannot. Yes, we can assign whatever meaning we like to the words "free will", but in actuality we haven't done so - it is a meaningless term.

Sure, we successfully use it in normal conversation, but we could also successfully use "white blackness" in normal conversation. It doesn't mean it denotes anything sensible. People only manage to successfully use the term "free will" because it has no meaning, and they use it in vague terms. If you try to use it precisely, its lack of meaning becomes clear.

If we say "free will" means the ability of an agent to act without absolutely any cause or constraints, then that's what it means. Period!

My point is that this - "the ability of an agent to act without absolutely any cause or constraints" - is nonsense, and therefore holds no meaning. Therefore "free will" has no meaning. A person cannot mean "the ability of an agent to act without absolutely any cause or constraints", because you cannot mean nonsense. You can only think you mean it, because you do not understand it. "The ability of an agent to act without absolutely any cause or constraints" turns out to have the same meaning status as "gaga".
 
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rstrats

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Gracchus

re: "I realize that some people have to believe in free will. I choose not to."


Is there any implication in that comment that you think that a person has the ability to consciously CHOOSE to believe that someone or something does or doesn’t exist, or that a certain proposition is or isn’t true?
 
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Wiccan_Child

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I have decided that I indeed have free will, but also I've conceded the possibility of my free will being illusory. If I can think and know and be truly sentient, how can I not make my own choices?
Just because you can think, doesn't mean you have any control over what you think, over what you do. You may think you have control, but do you really? Can you prove that you have free will?
 
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Wiccan_Child

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My point is that people only think they understand what it means, because they've not analysed the term completely. After analysis, the term has about as much meaning as "white blackness". Or at least, that's the argument.
I agree with Washington here. You seem to be over-analysing the semantics of the phrase, despite the fact that the concept is a valid one. It may be a poor choice of words, but that's just the phrase we use. Your position is quite clear, but I don't see much in the way of substantiation. It's all very well and good to say people just don't understand the term like you do, but without backing that claim up, it's not better than a Creationist saying "Oh, you just don't understand the evidence". That's not an argument, that's a whine. :p
 
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Taure

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You've missed the point to. It's not about the phrase "free will". It's about the concept that it supposedly stands for (which I take to be "the ability of an agent to act without absolutely any cause or constraints"). My argument isn't just about the words "free will" alone, it's about the concepts they stand for, which is to say, the idea of a mental act which must be both caused and uncaused, and thus a contradiction in terms, and thus nonsense.

...did anyone actually read the article I posted?
 
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Texan40

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Just because you can think, doesn't mean you have any control over what you think, over what you do. You may think you have control, but do you really? Can you prove that you have free will?

My free will is limited by my perception and my own conscience. I can, however, decide to ignore my conscience. I can also decide to act regardless of my perception. I really think control is for the most part a self-imposed illusion. Anecdotally I realize that most of the constraints in my life have been generated by my own perception or conscience, and thus aren't true "controls" as I can decide to ignore them.
 
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Chesterton

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And some people choose to use self control more than others, this choose to use or not use it is a preference.

And the choice to use or not is an act of will.

You eat them because you prefer to eat healthy food over eating tasty food sometimes.

Regardless of whatever reasons may factor into my choice, I still have to make a choice.

How Are Calvinism and Christianity different things? I encourage you to not write off Calvinism, I used to be a hardcore Armenian, And after trying to see Christianity from the Calvinist perspective, I changed view points.

As succinctly as I can: the whole of the Gospel message, the entirety of the Christian faith, and Judaism which preceeded it, depends on man having free will. Christianity makes no sense otherwise. There's no need for salvation among a race of beings who were already created "saved" and "unsaved" ab initio.

And there's no possibility of love without will. I could write some computer code to make my computer say "I love you, Ches" all day long for eternity. But I can never make a piece of programmed matter really, actually love me, unless I could give it a will to choose whether or not to love me.

I once started a thread asking anyone to give me at very least one verse that proves that we have free-will and not just decision making abilities. No verse was given.

You want more? You didn't address the one I just gave you, the most fundamental one. Why don't you answer my question based on Genesis first, before we start verse-slinging?

A major theme in your arguments is that as humans we possess a spirit, that does not need to be bound by the rules of matter, or the implications of the progression of time, instead it is a sovereign entity with the role of giving us the ability to accept or reject God, therefore giving value of our love.

A Dog does not have this spirit though, it therefore has no free-will, for the reasons we already discussed. So I challengle you, next time you see a puppy or a dog, and it runs up exited to see you, wagging it's tail, and licking you, I want you to say to it, "Stop it! your love is worthless because it is not stemming from free-will, and thus it is not love at all. Go away you big rat!"^_^

Dogs love people because of what we are, providers, caretakes and protectors. People love their pets not because the pet freely chose them, but because the owner chose the pet, and decided to enter in the process of adopting it into the family. I believe God and man have a similar relationship, with the exception of the difference between God and man being much larger then man to Dog.

That's an interesting view at first blush, but the obvious answer is Matthew 5:46: "For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? Do not even the publicans do the same?". What you're saying is that love is conditional; that love occurs if and when there's selfish benefit received, like a business transaction. If you starved and beat your dog everyday, do you think it'd keep "loving" you if it had the chance to belong to someone who treated it well? Consider Job. God withdrew His care and protection from Job, and He waited to see what Job would do. And Christ loves everyone, including the men who beat and humiliated and killed him.
 
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Chesterton

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Basically, if we know something, the information has to exist in some way, shape, or form. It could be magnetic blips in a hard drive, the synaptic patterns between neurons; basically, some configuration of atoms. When I learn something new, that atoms in my brain vibrate about in their funny ways, reacting to local stimuli, bonding and breaking; the overall effect is that electrical charge passes through my brain, and this 'cements' the information. The exact details are unknown, but that's basically what happens.

Anyway, our brains' decision making software will now act on this new information. In practice, this means that electrical pulses now travel a slightly different route, or take slightly longer, or do something slightly differently, which means our brain 'decides' something different.

In other words, the existence of information in our head alters how the brain makes decisions. The most obvious and pertinant example is this: if I know you are going to say 'pancakes' in one minute's time, and I tell you this, then the act of me telling you is a real, physical change, right? Because, if I didn't know, I couldn't tell you. The word 'pancakes' coming out my mouth is a real, physical phenomenon (wiggles in air molecules, more or less) that wouldn't happen if I didn't posses the knowledge. Thus, knowledge alters the world.

Now, the wiggles in the air reach your ear, which wiggle your ear drum, which wiggle your ear fluid (I forget the name), which sends particular synaptic signals to your brain, which then acts on this new information (mechanistically, mind you, like that calculator I posted earlier). That is how you then 'decide' to not say pancakes: it isn't your choice, but it's what your body's very complex AI 'decides' to do, since it's 'decisions' are algorithmic outputs based on whatever is input; change the input, change the output.

Hope that makes sense.

It makes sense, but I think what you've said is just an assertion that human life is purely physical, which is pretty much tantamount to a mere assertion that there's no free will. I already agree that with purely physical things, input changes output, whether we're talking about baking a cake, or doing a math equation. I can agree that information will cause physical change in the brain, but that's not evidence that there is any change in the decision-making process. You haven't made a connection to the "I" which exercises will. And I don't think you can because we currently don't know where "I" resides. (I believe it resides spiritually in the soul, you believe it resides physically in the brain.)

If you tell me I'm going to say "pancakes", the full extent of the physical change in my brain may only be that I'm aware that a person is telling me I'm going to say "pancakes". And that change only amounts to a potential factor in the decision-making process; it doesn't determine the outcome. Here's how you can see why that's true: if I had determined to say a certain thing before you told me what I was going to say, I could say what I had determined to say regardless of the new information I received. There is no information which could change my action unless I will it, because I could have willed it beforehand, before the input was received, agreed? Even if you bribed me with money or threatened me with violence to say "pancakes", I could not say "pancakes" unless I willed it to be so. Hypothetically, if you threatened me, I could even choose to die for the sake of not saying "pancakes". (Although I had to laugh at the thought of that. ^_^)

And, imagine if the wooden adding machine was conscious. I don't think there's any reason to suppose it would perceive or "feel" that it had will the way we humans feel that we have will. It would know when input pressed one of its rockers that the rocker went left or right, and it would know that that was an involuntary action.

Humans do perform some involuntary actions similar to the machine rockers, for example, food digestion. We do it without consciously deciding to do it. A specific physical input = a specific physical output. And I've never heard of anyone who had deluded themselves into thinking that their digestive system operated by the action of their will. :) So I'm mentioning that for the sake of contrast. Consider how different the involuntary actions like digestion are from our voluntary bodily actions.

So my point is, if we can perceive a difference between willed bodily actions, and un-willed bodily actions, then willed bodily actions must exist, otherwise there'd be no difference to perceive. Put another way, if we couldn't make decisions, there'd be no decisions to make. And if there were no decisions to make, I don't see how or why we could fool ourselves into perceiving that we were making them.
 
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Taure

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I don't see how or why we could fool ourselves into perceiving that we were making them.
I do, quite easily. The answer is simple: we are ignorant of our own inner processes, especially neural ones. This veil of ignorance creates the impression of will, because we cannot see the massively complex causal chain which leads to our decisions. As such it appears to us as if the decision came out of nowhere.

I also think you're conflating the issues of free will and the existence of first person consciousness a bit. Proof of a consciousness (which I take to be a self-evident truth) does not prove the freedom or restrained nature of such a thing.
 
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Washington

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My free will is limited by my perception and my own conscience. I can, however, decide to ignore my conscience. I can also decide to act regardless of my perception. I really think control is for the most part a self-imposed illusion. Anecdotally I realize that most of the constraints in my life have been generated by my own perception or conscience, and thus aren't true "controls" as I can decide to ignore them.

This is for Chesterton as well.

But what was the impetus that convinced you to ignore them? You decided to ignore them because ________________ . Whatever you fill in the blank with operates as the cause for your decision to ignore. And then the question becomes one of, what caused that particular operative to pop into your head? The only alternative is that whatever it was was completely random: The ultimate basis for your decision was an absolute chance occurrence. One that could have just as well gone the other way, which effectivly means that your decision was not really one of choice at all, but the consequence of random happenstance. Ignoring them or not comes down to a crap shoot. You had no control over whether you would ignore or not ignore. On the other hand, because effects always have causes (quantum decay events not withstanding), it's obvious that what happens--even what we think--is determined by antecedent events. You could not have done otherwise, because to do so would necessitate a different set of antecedent events, but for that to occur the past would have to have been different.


Chesterton said:
Put another way, if we couldn't make decisions, there'd be no decisions to make.
That's right. There is no such animal, only the illusion of one.

And if there were no decisions to make, I don't see how or why we could fool ourselves into perceiving that we were making them.
Basically, we fool ourselves because we have been caused to do just that. For whatever the reasons, the illusion has led us to notion of control: "I can choose to do X instead of Y because I have the freedom to do so." But we never have any such control. You did X because you could not do otherwise. For Y to occur either the past would have to have been different or absolute randomness is at work. There is no middle ground.
 
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Chesterton

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...did anyone actually read the article I posted?

Yes. :)

You've missed the point to. It's not about the phrase "free will".

You are dealing with semantics as others have said, but semantics are sometimes very important and instructive. You made a point that I've made before, and think is important, that for practical purposes the term is a redundancy. The question is whether we have will; to have an unfree will would mean to not have a will.

It's about the concept that it supposedly stands for (which I take to be "the ability of an agent to act without absolutely any cause or constraints").

Which is like trying to conceptualize God, because God is the agent which acts as you say, and that is a unique, un-natural mode of being. But Christians believe that God has shared that mode of being with humans. We are made in the image (icon) of God.

My argument isn't just about the words "free will" alone, it's about the concepts they stand for, which is to say, the idea of a mental act which must be both caused and uncaused, and thus a contradiction in terms, and thus nonsense.

Just curious, have you ever read C.S. Lewis' book Miracles? He addresses your same premise in Chapter III, "The Cardinal Difficulty of Naturalism". He goes into the same contradiction regarding the cause-and-effect aspect of mental events.
 
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Texan40

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Because of the complexities involved in any action, God could be the only one who "truly understand." Who I am effects my decisions, my accumulated knowledge, my moral compass, many other things that are internal. My actions can also be effected by long and short-term local stimulus. Someone who I just talked to, something I just read, something I read in school. I agree that no action is truly "random" because everything can be explained. Our accumulation of choices color who we are and thus effect future choices. Does this really mean that we are not of freewill? That an action can be foreknown and explained by God doesn't necessarily constitute intentional direction or predetermination.
 
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Chesterton

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I do, quite easily. The answer is simple: we are ignorant of our own inner processes, especially neural ones. This veil of ignorance creates the impression of will, because we cannot see the massively complex causal chain which leads to our decisions. As such it appears to us as if the decision came out of nowhere.

That's no answer. How does ignorance create an impression of will? As I said, I'm ignorant of how my digestive system works, but I've never gotten the impression that I control it by will.

I also think you're conflating the issues of free will and the existence of first person consciousness a bit. Proof of a consciousness (which I take to be a self-evident truth) does not prove the freedom or restrained nature of such a thing.

That's what I said when I imagined the adding machine to be conscious. It would not perceive it had will merely because it was conscious. Why not? Because it didn't have will.
 
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Chesterton

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On the other hand, because effects always have causes (quantum decay events not withstanding), it's obvious that what happens--even what we think--is determined by antecedent events.

In that case why should I entertain your thoughts about anything? You were bound by natural events to think what you think, and to type what you typed. Your intellectual contribution is as meaningful as a belch or a fart. I'm putting you on ignore.

(Just kidding about the ignore part. :))
 
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