Do Aliens Exist?

[jamesbond007]

Atheists may have moral codes too, but it isn't derived from atheism. Personally I strongly believe in not bearing false witness.

Sheesh. You're bearing false witness to your creator, the Lord thy God now. How severe will that be?

The evidence is that on the Earth very simple life appeared then developed into more complicated life.

The evidence is that life is made up of exactly the same chemical reactions as non living organic chemistry.

The evidence is that organic chemistry exists all over the universe.

So, without any evidence for a necessary external force for the transition from non living chemistry to very simple life forms it is a reasonable inference that it can happen naturally.

More of the same false witness. We have not found it with aliens and that would've happened already.

You reasoning is false.

Multiverses are a merely a mathematical inference from some strange interpretations of advanced physics. Nothing to do with atheism.

And the lie about scientists removing it from the internet is a shameful case of bearing false witness.

It's not I. Science backs me up and the greatest scientists in history were creation scientists.

Multiverses have to do with infinite sets now because it was pointed out to the atheist scientists that only God can divide by zero. Now, they've gone to infinite sets like the counting nos. Yet, there is absolutely no evidence for multiverses. Why actual scientists believe is beyond me. I don't have an explanation, but it's their atheism talking. Satan has hidden himself well.

Then present them. Your misinterpretations and false assertions aren't evidence.

They fine tuning parameters explain no aliens and debunk abiogenesis. The creation scientists discovered the elixir of life, water, is the big enemy of amino acids. It's ironic life needs water, but water dissolves the origins of life. No protein can form.

Lie.

Once again, it has nothing to do with atheism. It's just inferences from the physical world.

You were trying to put pseudoscience on me and creation science. It's a huge lie as the pseudoscience lies with scientific atheism.

Otherwise, we would've found aliens already haha.

Not all Christians interpret the Ten Commandments the same way... so, no, that isn't objective.

For example lying about scientists deliberately covering up their research to conceal the evidence for creation would often been seen as a breach of the ninth commandment... but not all Christians think that is wrong.

Wow. Jesus talked about the seven covenants in describing the Ten Commandments. Those show proof of the objective morals and some already have happened in history.

You are too much a false witness and liar from your atheism. No morals at all.

Atheists don't think they are like God... they don't believe God exists. For the most part they think the Bible is a book written by humans. It really isn't some kind of big deal they rebel against.

The atheists will reap what they sow.

 

[jamesbond007]

Good thing we aren't like 70% water or something.

Oh, wait...

We already have the proteins and can eat right to get the building blocks.

 

[Strathos]

Why would I be wrong about it? I have creation science backing me. It's not about faith, but science.

I don't see anything in science or scripture that would preclude microbial life on other planets. Nothing that would confirm it either. But that just makes it an open question at this point.

 

[jamesbond007]

It's not a religion, by definition - check any dictionary.

Once you read the definition, one can conclude it is a religion with no moralism. To God, it means disobedience.

Science isn't a question of belief, but of probabilities and levels of confidence based on empirical evidence.

That's why there are no aliens and no evidence of abiogenesis. As for the rest, it's more of you immoral religion of atheism and scientific atheism. Both aliens and abiogenesis have been debunked now. Same with atheistic beliefs.

 

[jamesbond007]

I don't see anything in science or scripture that would preclude microbial life on other planets. Nothing that would confirm it either. But that just makes it an open question at this point.

I just presented two huge scientific barriers. The fine tuning facts which life needs to survive and the building blocks of life cannot form because water dissolves it.

 

[Ophiolite]

That's why there are no aliens and no evidence of abiogenesis. As for the rest, it's more of you immoral religion of atheism and scientific atheism. Both aliens and abiogenesis have been debunked now. Same with atheistic beliefs.

I do hope I have the self discipline to make this my last post to you. Sadly, hope often goes wanting.

An outline of the evidence for abiogenesis has been presented to you on numerous threads by several members. You may not think the evidence convincing, you may not agree with the conclusions inferred from the evidence, but the only way you can deny the existence of the evidence is by lying, or by being unusually foolish. I hope it is is the latter, for that would provide you with an excuse. It would be a shame to think you a liar.

 

[Speedwell]

It's not I. Science backs me up and the greatest scientists in history were creation scientists.

That is sheer humbug, easily disproven.

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

That's why there are no aliens and no evidence of abiogenesis. As for the rest, it's more of you immoral religion of atheism and scientific atheism. Both aliens and abiogenesis have been debunked now. Same with atheistic beliefs.

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

you think you know it's fantasy


you don't know

Of course, it's my opinion.

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

... the building blocks of life cannot form because water dissolves it.

Bad news for fish...

But do tell, how do cells make protein if they're full of water?

[this is GCSE-level chemistry in the UK, equivalent to US 10th grade]

 

[Strathos]

I just presented two huge scientific barriers. The fine tuning facts which life needs to survive and the building blocks of life cannot form because water dissolves it.

Who knows what God might do?

 

[jamesbond007]

Bad news for fish...

But do tell, how do cells make protein if they're full of water?

[this is GCSE-level chemistry in the UK, equivalent to US 10th grade]

Not bad news for fish who need water to live. All life need water to survive.

Cells are find because they're living organism. What aren't fine are the amino acids or chemistry that gets dissolved by water before they can become protein. Get it now? No abiogenesis ever. No aliens ever since God the Creator didn't create them.

 

[jamesbond007]

Who knows what God might do?

In those cases, it's science. God already did his thing so only God was the cause.

 

[Strathos]

In those cases, it's science. God already did his thing so only God was the cause.

God is the ultimate cause of everything in the universe. Science just discovers the details... so I don't think certain scientific discoveries do anything to discredit God, just certain people's narrow views of exactly how and what God did.

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

Once you read the definition, one can conclude it is a religion with no moralism.

Which definition is that (citation needed)?

You don't need religion or belief in a god or gods to have morals - as so many civilised secular societies demonstrate. For a lucid explanation of why this is the case, I recommend Patricia Churchland's book 'Conscience - The Origins of Moral Intuition'.

That's why there are no aliens and no evidence of abiogenesis.

That's wishful thinking - quite understandable, given your worldview; but the fact is that we simply don't know if there are aliens out there or not, and there is strong circumstantial evidence for abiogenesis in Earth's past, and a continually increasing amount of empirical evidence for the chemistry that may have produced it.

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

Not bad news for fish who need water to live. All life need water to survive.

Cells are find because they're living organism. What aren't fine are the amino acids or chemistry that gets dissolved by water before they can become protein. Get it now? No abiogenesis ever. No aliens ever since God the Creator didn't create them.

Living things make proteins from amino acids inside their cells - which are full of water; i.e. the amino acids are in solution. You claimed that proteins can't be made from amino acids in solution.

If you're claiming that only the metabolism of living things can do this, you might be interested to hear that heating and drying amino acid solutions can produce peptides ('proto-proteins') analogous to today’s proteins - and the amino acids that polymerize this way happen to be the same as those present in the proteins of living things. Coincidence?

 

[jamesbond007]

"big bang theory"

Cosmic background radiation.
Recession of galaxies and clusters.
Acceleration of space.
Mathematical consequences of demonstrated physics.

"theory of evolution"

Fossil Evidence.
Nested hierarchy of modern life in form and genetics.
Geological evidence.
Observed evolution of modern animals.

Regarding BB theory:
What caused the radiation, i.e. where did the energy come from?
That fits the creationist universe.
What's causing the universe to accelerate in its expansion, i.e. where is the energy coming from? If you say dark energy, then you may as well say God.
Math and physics fits the creationist model better.

Regarding ToE:
There's no transitional fossil evidence. Just evidence for natural selection
Not really.
Uniformitarianism theory which is wrong. The geologic evidence points towards catastrophism.
It's natural selection at work. Has nothing to do with macroevolution.

Thus, all of your reasoning fits creationism.

 

[Speedwell]

Regarding BB theory:
What caused the radiation, i.e. where did the energy come from?
That fits the creationist universe.
What's causing the universe to accelerate in its expansion, i.e. where is the energy coming from? If you say dark energy, then you may as well say God.
Math and physics fits the creationist model better.

Regarding ToE:
There's no transitional fossil evidence. Just evidence for natural selection
Not really.
Uniformitarianism theory which is wrong. The geologic evidence points towards catastrophism.
It's natural selection at work. Has nothing to do with macroevolution.

Thus, all of your reasoning fits creationism.

None of it fits creationism. There is no evidence that the universe, the Earth and its inhabitants were created 6000 years ago in their present form.

 

[jamesbond007]

God is the ultimate cause of everything in the universe. Science just discovers the details... so I don't think certain scientific discoveries do anything to discredit God, just certain people's narrow views of exactly how and what God did.

I agree, but I'm not being narrow minded.

All I'm saying is aliens can't happen or else we would've found them by now. Abiogenesis can't happen either or we would've found evidence for it with all the looking. Instead, science found why it can't happen.

 

[jamesbond007]

Which definition is that (citation needed)?

You don't need religion or belief in a god or gods to have morals - as so many civilised secular societies demonstrate. For a lucid explanation of why this is the case, I recommend Patricia Churchland's book 'Conscience - The Origins of Moral Intuition'.


That's wishful thinking - quite understandable, given your worldview; but the fact is that we simply don't know if there are aliens out there or not, and there is strong circumstantial evidence for abiogenesis in Earth's past, and a continually increasing amount of empirical evidence for the chemistry that may have produced it.

Moral intuition is not objective. One can easily rationalize doing something immoral such as disobeying God.

It's not I who uses wishful thinking for aliens and abiogenesis. Those would require science to fail and be wrong.

BTW, your cells and water citation doesn't hold water. It's before the amino acids can form into proteins in space, on Earth, or wherever. We can't have cells without free amino acids forming proteins. Thus, it means no abiogenesis anywhere. Why is it like that?

ETA: Even if they did form in space, they wouldn't be able to survive because of the fining tuning facts. Why is it like that?