Divorce (why You Should, Or Shouldn't)

[snoochface]

I want those of you who have had messed up marriages to know that I am not going to quit until you find a peaceful way out of your dilemma.

This is where I come in!

I am trying to organize a way to find a positive outlet for people undergoing and considering divorce.

If you are already divorced, please take the time to get closer to God and do some pleasant things for yourself!

Explore the facets of your life and world that you didn't have time to before. Seek spiritual fulfillment! Just give it a try, it won't hurt!

Who IN THE WORLD do you think you are, anyway? What is it that makes you think you have a) the right, and b) the insight into the lives of people that you do not even know to make statements like this?

I think you should examine your own heart, your own motives, and your own closeness with God, and keep your nose out of the lives and hearts of others.

I've never been divorced, and even I am offended by your attitude.

 

[Tink04]

I think she's one of those people from the shut down "Family Life" board. Their arguments are so "holier then thou" . One of then actually had the gall to say that they knew better then the scholars who have translated the Bible.

Honestly her arguments aren't workings, all they have done is make me study God's word more and realize that my choosing to divorce my H is what God would want me to do. That spiritually abusive people have twisted things to say something that God never intended.


God never intended for us to live in a place where we are bound by our abusive, blatantly sinful spouses.

He tell us that when someone repeated sins against us we are to have "nothing to do with them, to treat them as a pagan or a tax collector"

 

[HuntingMan]

I think she's one of those people from the shut down "Family Life" board.

Did Family life forums get shut down?

 

[HuntingMan]

I think she's one of those people from the shut down "Family Life" board. Their arguments are so "holier then thou" . One of then actually had the gall to say that they knew better then the scholars who have translated the Bible.

Honestly her arguments aren't workings, all they have done is make me study God's word more and realize that my choosing to divorce my H is what God would want me to do. That spiritually abusive people have twisted things to say something that God never intended.


God never intended for us to live in a place where we are bound by our abusive, blatantly sinful spouses.

He tell us that when someone repeated sins against us we are to have "nothing to do with them, to treat them as a pagan or a tax collector"

Thats the problem with these false ones.
They seem to worship the marriage covenant to the extent that the persons in that covenant are expendable at best and entirely worthless at best.

A blasphemous, cheating, wife beating spouse is worth a truckload of gold...but the believer is barely worth dirt if they end up having to leave.

entirely disgusting and entirely void of the Spirit of the God.

 

[Tink04]

Did Family life forums get shut down?

It's been closed for about 2 1/2 months now. They did say that they were going to be rebuilding it but it seems to be taking them awhile. Personally I think it was because of the abusive , childish ways that some of the members were acting.

Searcher and I showed up there looking for support and found people who were far from supportive. Our good brother Duece (whom I think you know) came to help us fight.

 

[HuntingMan]

It's been closed for about 2 1/2 months now. They did say that they were going to be rebuilding it but it seems to be taking them awhile. Personally I think it was because of the abusive , childish ways that some of the members were acting.

Searcher and I showed up there looking for support and found people who were far from supportive. Our good brother Duece (whom I think you know) came to help us fight.

Honestly, I had tried for almost a year to get some reform on that forum.

I dealt with mikey pretty directly trying to get him to understand that it was completely destroying the work of FL ministries because when some remarried brother or sister came in there, that small group of marriage terrorists there would tell them that the REASON they were having marital problems was because they werent married at all.

when I found out that mikey had been playing me along I blew a gasket because I had wasted MONTHS of my time with the whole issue.....thats pretty much why I cant post there now because I refuse to apologize.

I tried to contact the main guy, cant remember his or his wifes names right off, because I felt he probably didnt understand the destruction being done to some on a forum with HIS ministries name on it.
I dont think he would be ok with someone coming there for help with their marriage, trying to save it, only to be TOLD to walk out of it for no just cause...kwim?

honestly, unless they remove that element and lay down the law there, I hope it never comes back up. Too many marriages being demeaned...too many innocent brothers and sisters being called adulterers

 

[Tink04]

I really wasn't trying to change their minds I was speaking out for the lurkers and people who haven't formed a decision yet.

There was one woman whom they convinced to go back to her husband, after they had been divorced for years and years. Within a very short time he was refusing her and being emotionally abusive. After 6 months they separated because he had hit the 10yo hard enough to leave a lasting welt and bruise.

It's just a very dangerous place all together.

 

[fuzzymel]

I was a lurker there (before I discovered this place).

I never joined because it just didn't fit where I was and who I was. There was some really bad advice given too. I was just reading before and there was one woman complaining about the troubles she had with inlaws and she mentioned how she went straight to her parents and told them of all her troubles. No one mentioned that she might be in the wrong too by going straight to her parents with her problems rather than her husband.

 

[HuntingMan]

I really wasn't trying to change their minds I was speaking out for the lurkers and people who haven't formed a decision yet.

There was one woman whom they convinced to go back to her husband, after they had been divorced for years and years. Within a very short time he was refusing her and being emotionally abusive. After 6 months they separated because he had hit the 10yo hard enough to leave a lasting welt and bruise.

It's just a very dangerous place all together.

Can you imagine if they make a poor sister feel like she has to return or burn in hell and she goes back and her husband kills her ?

I think people who given advice, professional or otherwise, to an emotionally distressed person ought to be legally accountable.
Probably wont ever happen tho.

 

[HuntingMan]

I was a lurker there (before I discovered this place).

I never joined because it just didn't fit where I was and who I was. There was some really bad advice given too. I was just reading before and there was one woman complaining about the troubles she had with inlaws and she mentioned how she went straight to her parents and told them of all her troubles. No one mentioned that she might be in the wrong too by going straight to her parents with her problems rather than her husband.

That is part of the problem.
the ministry itself is a fine one from my understanding, but instead of the forums being something that accents the ministry they had taken a stance of not getting involved unless a fight pretty much broke out.

That leaves folks who havent got a clue about marriage and abuse or anything else giving advice to people who are in serious life situations.
I mean, when we ask someone on the internet for advice, do we really know who they are ?
It could be some deranged lunatic for all we know just trying to set someone up.
Thats why on one of my forums for Emetophobia (fear of vomiting that Laura used to suffer from) we have strict rules about offering advice.

 

[E-beth]

This thread reminds me why I rarely ever venture to the Marriage Forum anymore. I used to mod here, and I had my fill of posts by people with no clue about my situation who would try to stab me with a Bible.

My first marriage was not entered into lightly. I was in it forever. We even prayed together before consummating on our wedding night. But over the years my Holy Temple was defiled by a husband who was unfaithful countless times. He beat me and killed a baby I was carrying. The next Sunday he was up on stage in church performing with the Drama Ministry while I sat there like the dutiful wife. God didn't design his daughters to be punching bags or receptacles for sperm. He didn't make marriage so each spouse could do whatever and whoever and it would only lead to forgiveness and reconciliation. I tried to live that way. All it did was lead me into a dark abyss and away from God.

My first marriage ended when he divorced me. I never even filed nor stood up for myself because I was deluded that God wanted me to not give up. Only after I moved out and let God heal me did I realize that God wants me to be happy, to be full of Him. And while I was not looking to get married again, He lead me to my husband.

I cannot tell you the struggles I went through, falling in love with a divorced man and another victim of spousal infidelity. But God took two broken people and made them one whole, with Him in the center. Then He made us three ehen He blessed me with my lifelong dream of a baby. I have sought the will of God every step of the way in my new marriage. I have been given signs, miracles, and blessings that I know God would not grant if I were living in sin. So I don't care what anyone says about me or my marriage. I know that God is happy with my marriage, and so am I.

My opinion is that the world is collapsing, and while sin is so prevalent in our society even marriages and families will be affected. Standing on a soap box like a Pharisee is not going to reach people who need to know that there is love in the world, and that God cares about them. Jesus said the greatest commandment is to love God, and to love each other. Not to set yourself up as a great authority or voice of God for a situation you know nothing about. God can speak for Himself, thank you.

 

[Autumnleaf]

It is important first to understand the concept of marriage an the spiritual and moral ramifications of this collaboration. Marriage is a spiritual and physical bond shared between a man and woman. This union marks the completion of spiritual connection that should enable the Christian couple to draw closer to and accomplish more in the name of God. Acts 18: 2,3

The Christian couple, under the bond of marriage is able to unlock some of the mysteries of God. As the interpreter accompanies the speaker in tongues, they are able, through harmony, to seek and find many answers for themselves as well as others in the Christian community. Their spiritual, physical and intellectual intimacy creates and atmosphere allowing divine intervention. For example, a husband may be in a country far from his wife, but is still able to communicate with her by visitation in the spirit or in a dream in the event of an emergency. (This has happened to a Christian couple I know in real life!) Marriage allows this kind of communication. Matthew 18: 19-20

The Bible states that except for fornication, couples should not divorce. Fornication/Adultery breaks a bond that was first formed with the body of Christ. It severs the ties of intimacy with the righteousness of God creating a gap that takes a tremendous amount of time to bridge. This puts the spouse of the adulterer/adulteress in a state of spiritual isolation from them, but not God. It takes away from the effectiveness of spiritual answers sought from God by the couple. This is why divorce is recommended in this case. Proverbs 6: 24-35

Divorce and remarriage are mentioned in Deuteronomy under the extreme case of the husband finding some fault or discrepancy in the wife. Deuteronomy 24: 1-4. One must bear in mind that receiving the spiritual power of the Holy Spirit and the grace of Jesus Christ, our forerunner and days man, was not present in those days. Even though the bond of spirit is broken after adultery, the bond of flesh remains until either spouse dies, rendering remarriage to a different person as a perpetual state of spiritual incompletion and sin in the sight of God. Matthew 19: 8 and 9. Divorce (or temporary separation) gives you ‘time out’ to regroup, pray and seek assistance from God, or a pastor as to why your marriage is falling apart, or what led your spouse to be unfaithful. After this, there may be a possibility for God to heal your marriage!

Divorce should only be recommended in the case where one is certain that the offending spouse has not been afflicted with demonic attacks leading to the act of adultery (or in a case of physical abuse!). (SEE MY BLOG FOR MORE DETAILS ABOUT THIS!) Also bear in mind that God does not sanction, or agree to some marriages because of the same demonic force instituting a ‘false’ marriage. No one should marry an intoxicated, drugged or hypnotized or person, or a person under ‘demonic memorization’. It simply means this person married under influences while they were not ‘aware’ of what they were doing. I have seen it happen before! Proverbs 5:18-21

I did my own poll and from a few cases I have seen of married couples, I have found that in cases where spouses committed adultery, most of the unoffending spouses eventually died from A.I.D.S., heart failure, or stress related maladies if they did not separate from the offending spouse. In most of these cases, it was the woman who stayed with her husband.
PLEASE NOTE! No matter how hurt you are it would be a sin against God and yourself if you retaliate against you spouse by cheating back! The wages of sin is still death! Stoning may no longer be in effect, but the law of God still is. John 8:7


Cheating Husband/ couple divorce
24%
C.H./couple stay together/wife dies
21%
C.H./couple stay together
15%
Man marries under influence of drugs/witchcraft
10%
C.H./couple die from A.I.D.S.
6%
C.H./couple divorce/wife gets new partner
6%
C.H./couple stay together/husband dies
6%
C.H./couple sleep separate/husband dying
3%
Cheating wife/couple stay together
3%
Cheating wife/wife dies
3%
All information for this report came from the Bible and my personal interviewing and polling. The age range of the couples are 18 - 76

That is really great. It still doesn't go to the heart of the matter. Men want to do the right thing. So do women. So do children. You do the math.

 

[angelsword]

Since it is obvious that there are those who feel this thread of mine with Biblical references (and references from persons interviewed) I'll link you a site from a woman who does agree with you!

http://www.firstwivesworld.com

There! I never said anyone was forced to adhere to what I write!

Now! For those who are interested in the Biblical truths I put and the facts gleaned from people interviewed, I would like to share a beautiful story I read from Guideposts; January issue 1995.




Two Pilgrims’ Progress
By Laura Lautz
Havre de Grace, Maryland



He was a beautiful Arabian stallion, a golden bay with a flowing black mane and tail. Anyone could see that he was wild and irascible. I had heard from a friend that he was for sale, but as I watched the racing-farm owner try to halter him I had second thought. The horse reared and plunged, snorting explosively
.

“He’s crazy because he’s been abused,” said the owner, wrestling with the halter. “He belonged to a drunk who used to ride him like a maniac. The man would hit him in the head with a hay rake if he didn’t act right.”


The owner finally haltered the horse and held him. When I approached the bay I noticed him trembling. Only a colt, he must have had four tough years. When I tried to stroke him he edged away, but his soft brown eyes regarded me intently and the sound of my voice seemed to relax him.


“You and I have something in common,” I whispered.


“Want to try him?” the owner asked.


No, I did not want to ride him or make any demands on him yet. I just knew he had to come home with me--- however I might manage him. Maybe he could help me fill a void.


I was going through a separation after a long marriage. My family and friends were reassuring, but my pain lingered no matter how much prayed.


As a psychotherapist I had often counseled people who faced similar crises. I would urge them to find something to keep occupied. When I heard about the Arabian stallion for sale I wondered if I shouldn’t follow my own advice. Animals had always been a part of my life, though I had not owned a horse for years. My friend’s suggestion about seeing this stallion intrigued me and for the first time in months I felt the anticipation of something positive.


So I bought the horse and named him Hadji, which means, “pilgrim” in Arabic. I thought I t was a fitting name, for both of us were searching for peace.


I put Hadji in a pasture by himself. For more than a month he would not come within 100 yards of me, not even for food. If I tried to approach him, gently calling “Hadji,” he dashed away. My only recourse was to sit in a corner of the pasture for a few hours each day. Sometimes he edged closer, but if I dared to move or glance up, he galloped off. As I sat reading or working a crossword puzzle under the pasture oaks, I could sense him staring at me.


One day I was jolted from my reading by the thunder of approaching hooves. I looked up to see Hadji heading toward me at top speed, tail flagged, neck arched. For some reason I felt no fear, only awe at his power and grace. I stood up and remained still. Just two feet from me he slid sideways to a halt, then nudged my shoulder with his nose. For the first time, he allowed me to stroke his golden neck. I walked to the gate and he stepped quietly beside me, then ate a treat from my hand.


Even though Hadji now permitted me to touch him, it was still a long time before I was able to groom him. This required trust on both our parts. I had no idea if he might hurt me and he had no idea if I was going to beat him. But I kept thinking of the Bible verse, “Perfect love casts out fear.”


With Hadji I learned to give without any expectation of getting. I discovered what it was to love again. As the months progressed, we became inseparable. I was completely attached to him, and I could feel myself becoming stronger emotionally.


One Sunday a friend who also owned a horse suggested we put our animals in the same pasture. Hadji was glad for a companion and they began to frolic together. As we were watching them play, suddenly there was a loud crack and Hadji was on the ground. The other horse had inadvertently kicked him. Hadji struggled to his feet and limped toward me, dragging his right hind leg.


I froze in horror. Broken legs can mean putting a horse down. Father, I prayed, please let Hadji be all right. I hoped I would only be a sprain, but his hindquarters began to swell and the veterinarian took X rays that revealed a severe fracture. The vet shook her head. “I’m sorry, but you don’t have much choice.”


At the thought of putting Hadji down I became distraught. I couldn’t bear losing someone else I loved. The vet took my arm. “You might think about sending him to the university veterinary center. I’ve heard they do wonderful things in surgery there.” She patted my shoulder. “At least it’s a chance.”


I took that chance. And I waited anxiously for word.


After a see the call came. “I’m sorry,” said the university vet, “but your horse’s injury is inoperable. The hock is shattered and there isn’t any way we’d be able to piece all the bits of bone together.” He went on to say there was a fifty-fifty chance that if I took care of Hadji the break might heal. “But,” he cautioned, “You’ll probably never ride him.”


I put the phone down feeling sick. Friends tried to be kind and talked about doing the right thing. I had to admit that Hadji did not deserve to be crippled for the rest of his life. But I put that possibility out of my mind and made arrangements to bring him home.


He limped stiff-legged in a case that went up to his hip as I led him down the trailer ramp. He had to be kept quiet in his stall for at least eight weeks if there was to be any chance of healing. We could only allow him to walk a few feet to nibble some grass outside the barn.


How could I keep a horse so full of energy sedentary for two months? Would I end up with a crippled animal? All that night I talked to the Lord, crying out in anguish.


Finally, as dawn came, a deep peace filled me. It seemed that God was telling me very strongly: Hadji will be healed.


I walked through the dewy grass to the stable and announced to the horse keepers that Hadjji was going to be all right. They stared at me incredulously.


“Yes,” I said, “God will heal Hadji,” Than I continued, “And I will ride and train him. He will not be lame.”


There were some mutters and shaking heads. I was surprised at myself. In my training as a behavioral psychologist I had never believed in anything before the fact.


I spent all my free time with Hadji. I slept in his stall, curled up near his front legs, his head on my shoulder. Many times I held his head I my arms and prayed. Through those weeks he remained quiet, as if he understood what I was doing.


Finally, after the eighth week, the vet came out to remove the cast, examine Hadji and take X rays. A small crowd of horse owners had gathered, all prepared that Hadji would never be sound.


She removed the cast, carefully examined Hadji’s leg, then trotted him up the middle aisle of the barn. At the end she stopped, halter in hand, turned around and shouted, “He’s laid all new bone!”


And there before everyone Hadji strutted as if the accident had never happened at all. A cheer rose from the crowd. I took Hadji out to a field and let him loose. Standing at the fence rail, I watched in amazement as the golden bay galloped and bucked, black mane and tail flying in the wind. Hadji was free, not only healed but unimpaired, as the X rays proved.


Since then I have ridden and trained this wonderful horse. At his first horse show he won two blue ribbons. As for me, my soul became renewed. I was able to get outside myself and give my pain to the Lord. Hadji and I were pilgrims, and we found just what we were looking for.

 

[Johnnz]

I am not for easy divorce. But the scriptures that are used require sound exegesis, not just acceptance of what it appears that Jesus was teaching. Jesus spoke those words at a time in history to a specific audience with its own set of special circumstances. Understand that and you can still have inspired scriptures but will a fuller comprehension of what was actually (as opposed to our more modern assumed understanding).

I can send an exegesis of the gospel passages to anyone interested in reading it. We don't need to go around beating up with Scripture women who are being physically, emotionally or spiritually beaten up within their marriage.

John
NZ

 

[HuntingMan]

I am not for easy divorce. But the scriptures that are used require sound exegesis, not just acceptance of what it appears that Jesus was teaching. Jesus spoke those words at a time in history to a specific audience with its own set of special circumstances. Understand that and you can still have inspired scriptures but will a fuller comprehension of what was actually (as opposed to our more modern assumed understanding).

John
NZ

Thats such a huge part of the issue in the MDR thing. Some dont want to accept the fact that Jesus wasnt speaking in a vacuum but was speaking against what the Jews He was dealing with were doing.

The same goes for Paul.
Some seem to think that 1 cor 7 was spoken in a vacuum, but if we look to the very first verse we see pretty conclusively that Paul is responding to questions the Corinthians must have written him about.
Seems like minor point until we realize that Pauls words are dealing with very specific situations and by no means should be taken as being exhaustive.
Had the Corinthians actually asked 'Can I leave my husband if he rapes and beats me " Im quite confident he would have said "YES".

 

[HuntingMan]

I am not for easy divorce. But the scriptures that are used require sound exegesis, not just acceptance of what it appears that Jesus was teaching. Jesus spoke those words at a time in history to a specific audience with its own set of special circumstances. Understand that and you can still have inspired scriptures but will a fuller comprehension of what was actually (as opposed to our more modern assumed understanding).

John
NZ

Thats such a huge part of the issue in the MDR thing. Some dont want to accept the fact that Jesus wasnt speaking in a vacuum but was speaking against what the Jews He was dealing with were doing.

The same goes for Paul.
Some seem to think that 1 cor 7 was spoken in a vacuum, but if we look to the very first verse we see pretty conclusively that Paul is responding to questions the Corinthians must have written him about.
Seems like minor point until we realize that Pauls words are dealing with very specific situations and by no means should be taken as being exhaustive.
Had the Corinthians actually asked 'Can I leave my husband if he rapes and beats me " Im quite confident he would have said "YES".

 

[angelsword]

This article isn't just a one time shot piece to prove my smarts (which is only based on what I see any way and the God given guidance of observance) but a continuation of fact finding.

I took another survey, which stems from information gathered over a five to ten year period, and obtained more findings.

About four weeks ago, a woman died whose husband had been cheating on her for over ten years. The stress of her situation, coupled with her cancer was too much for her.

What did I discover from this? Out of the survey I took, it shows that NONE of the men married their adulterous partners after their wives died!

The spiritual law in the Bible lives on! Back in those days, the adulterous partner, if found out, was stoned. These days, stoning is done away with, but God still acknowledges that it is sin to sleep with another while married.

This woman could have saved her life, had she observed that God's law does not die. If she had left her husband, the spiritual death warrant would have gone out to him. Makes sense to me. Your spouse offends by adultery, divorce them, wait until God takes them and you are free to remarry. Why not wait?

 

[angelsword]

I
Jesus spoke those words at a time in history to a specific audience with its own set of special circumstances.

John
NZ

In that circumstances were different!

1. A woman had little, if no say at all as to who she married.

2. She could not get divorced.

3. She had to have a man rule over her (husband, brother, father, son etc.)

Things have changed in that, as God revealed to me, this is a new Millenium! A woman does not have to depend on a man for money, shelter, or protection as a dogmatic Christian and Secular society would make us believe.

Marriage is a free choice! Curses were meant to be broken. I advise you, if you are uncomfortable, to find out if you are living under a curse.

Hbr 13:8Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.

Jesus' views on Morals never change!

 

[HuntingMan]

This article isn't just a one time shot piece to prove my smarts (which is only based on what I see any way and the God given guidance of observance) but a continuation of fact finding.

I took another survey, which stems from information gathered over a five to ten year period, and obtained more findings.

About four weeks ago, a woman died whose husband had been cheating on her for over ten years. The stress of her situation, coupled with her cancer was too much for her.

What did I discover from this? Out of the survey I took, it shows that NONE of the men married their adulterous partners after their wives died!

The spiritual law in the Bible lives on! Back in those days, the adulterous partner, if found out, was stoned. These days, stoning is done away with, but God still acknowledges that it is sin to sleep with another while married.

This woman could have saved her life, had she observed that God's law does not die. If she had left her husband, the spiritual death warrant would have gone out to him. Makes sense to me. Your spouse offends by adultery, divorce them, wait until God takes them and you are free to remarry. Why not wait?

There is no need to wait when one has divorced for fornication.
Why wait ?

Surveys are meaningless. All that matters as far as truth is Gods word and that word shows that the marriage covenant is quite conditional.
We can bump this thread ten thousand times and the responses will always be the same...

 

[dayknee]

This article isn't just a one time shot piece to prove my smarts (which is only based on what I see any way and the God given guidance of observance) but a continuation of fact finding.

I took another survey, which stems from information gathered over a five to ten year period, and obtained more findings.

About four weeks ago, a woman died whose husband had been cheating on her for over ten years. The stress of her situation, coupled with her cancer was too much for her.

What did I discover from this? Out of the survey I took, it shows that NONE of the men married their adulterous partners after their wives died!

The spiritual law in the Bible lives on! Back in those days, the adulterous partner, if found out, was stoned. These days, stoning is done away with, but God still acknowledges that it is sin to sleep with another while married.

This woman could have saved her life, had she observed that God's law does not die. If she had left her husband, the spiritual death warrant would have gone out to him. Makes sense to me. Your spouse offends by adultery, divorce them, wait until God takes them and you are free to remarry. Why not wait?

Once again...[wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth]rows-up)

This is just sick.
I second what Tropical said.
Plus I might add that this is just a twisted twisted way to think and hardly biblical.
Could you just not post in the marriage forums?