Discussion on Islam

[Osiris]

I would like to point out something about Islam which I have noticed recently. Well, muslims like any other members of other religions also commit logical fallacies regularly whenever they argue. One of such arguments which is used alot here is (sadly): "Islam is the fastest growing religion - implying islam is the best religion or somehow because is the fastest growing religion it must possess some truth to it."

Also, in recent news some (a lot) of muslims have been involved in violent protests because of drawings or because of what someone said about islam.

So, the points I would like to make are these:

1. Muslims claim that Islam is a religion of peace, and any acts of terrorism(or violence) cannot be attributed to islam but to religious extremists that don't know what islam means.

But the fact that alot of muslims have been rioting in Europe, in England, there's Al Qaeda, any many other violent groups -- which would count as alot of members of islam even though islam thinks down upon them.

So, if muslims say they have a large religion, they shouldn't forget that a part of that large population we have are these extremists which cause violence around the world. So... would Islam be a fast growing religion without these violent extremists? (Just a question to discuss on, I am not trying to bash Islam)


2. If the riots are justifiend; and if the muslims causing the riots in Europe condem terrorism, I think they are wasting their energies by rioting against drawings and what people say about Islam. If the riots are for a good cause and are justified, why doesn't Islam cause riots and violence against terrorists?

 

[LightOfEyes]

Peace to you brother,

Actually non-Muslims attack Muslims and they don’t want them to defend their self, Muslims do nothing but self-defense, they have the right to defend their prophet and their believes, just I am asking who start the aggression draw their prophet.

And who created terrorism, don’t terrorism has been created by the injustice policies of the main powers in the world?.! They occupied Palestine, Iraq, Afghanistan, and so on.
And when they defend their self, they claim that is terrorism. I am sure they will stop if they leave them alone.

Islam the religion of peace but it command Muslims to defend their self in case of aggression

Peace

 

[Osiris]

Peace to you brother,

Actually non-Muslims attack Muslims and they don’t want them to defend their self, Muslims do nothing but self-defense, they have the right to defend their prophet and their believes, just I am asking who start the aggression draw their prophet.

And who created terrorism, don’t terrorism has been created by the injustice policiesof the main powers in the world?.! They occupied Palestine, Iraq, Afghanistan, and so on.
And when they defend their self, they claim that is terrorism. I am sure they will stop if they leave them alone.

Islam the religion of peace but it command Muslims to defend their self in case of aggression

Peace

I think you did not respond to my questions.

Terrorism is not an act of self defense. Muslims who have strapped bombs on their bodies and killed civilians inside buses, trains or crashing planes into buildings to kill civilians is not an act of self defense.

1. Does islam condem these acts? Yes or No?

If yes? And if violent riots for drawings or words of people against islam are justified... why don't muslims riot against terrorists such as bin laden?

2. If islam condems terrorism, and look down upon terrorists because islam is a religion of peace. Then, is islam's claim for a growing population really true since a major part of its growth maybe a growth of these extremists?

 

[Galilean]

Here's a hint -
go to the 'islam world' page.
Long list of articles. At the top, you will see your introduction articles, mostly saying stuff like 'islam is a religion of peace, terrorism is anti-islamic'. Then, scroll a bit further down and you'll see articles like 'islamic jihad' that promote jihad - as in physical warefare. Kind of reminds me of how they say sermons preached in english to newcomers promote islam as a religion of peace, but then arabic sermons preached to the regular muslims are all about over throwing the government fighting jihad and establishing shariah.

 

[RichardT]

If yes? And if violent riots for drawings or words of people against islam are justified... why don't muslims riot against terrorists such as bin laden?

My question also ...

 

[the-fact-is]

I would like to point out something about Islam which I have noticed recently. Well, muslims like any other members of other religions also commit logical fallacies regularly whenever they argue.

One of such arguments which is used alot here is (sadly): "Islam is the fastest growing religion - implying islam is the best religion or somehow because is the fastest growing religion it must possess some truth to it."

Not true! take a look at these non-muslim facts to see the truth:
http://www.menj.org/fastest/

also muslims are not allowed to make up baseless claims. the Holy Quran says in chaptre #2 " ................"Produce your proof if you are truthful."

Also, in recent news some (a lot) of muslims have been involved in violent protests because of drawings or because of what someone said about islam.

you seem to ignore the fact that for months muslims have tried to solve the problem peacefully but Denmark government refused which made some muslims drustrated enough to attack Danish interests.

1. Muslims claim that Islam is a religion of peace, and any acts of terrorism(or violence) cannot be attributed to islam but to religious extremists that don't know what islam means.

But the fact that alot of muslims have been rioting in Europe, in England, there's Al Qaeda, any many other violent groups -- which would count as alot of members of islam even though islam thinks down upon them.

Yes Islam is the religion of peace . that is what it means in Arabic.
as for your accusations the fact is muslims are being wronged and mistreated all over the world :-

1- The Jews occupied,killed, Kicked, or turned the lives of every Palestinias into living hell , and you accuse Muslims of terror!
2- The Christians unconditionally support the Jews and supply them with the weapons which they use to kill Muslims with, they are also occupying Muslim countries, and daily killing Muslims in Iraq, Afghanistan, Chechnya…., they are unjustly holding Muslims in Guantanamo and still you accuse Muslims of terror!!!
3- The Hindus are occupying & Killing Muslims in Kashmir , and still you accuse us of terror.
4- The Buddists killed one million Muslims In Cambodia, tortured them in Laos, and you are accusing us of terror!!!
​

So, if muslims say they have a large religion, they shouldn't forget that a part of that large population we have are these extremists which cause violence around the world. So... would Islam be a fast growing religion without these violent extremists? (Just a question to discuss on, I am not trying to bash Islam)

there are no extremists but rather some muslims who are fed up with the way muslims are being treated.

2. If the riots are justifiend; and if the muslims causing the riots in Europe condem terrorism, I think they are wasting their energies by rioting against drawings and what people say about Islam. If the riots are for a good cause and are justified, why doesn't Islam cause riots and violence against terrorists?

There is no better cause than defending our Prophet (peace be upon him)
the real terrorists are those who deliberatly and intentionally insult others and who occupy their countries. Guess whom I am talking about

 

[arunma]

Here's a hint -
go to the 'islam world' page.
Long list of articles. At the top, you will see your introduction articles, mostly saying stuff like 'islam is a religion of peace, terrorism is anti-islamic'. Then, scroll a bit further down and you'll see articles like 'islamic jihad' that promote jihad - as in physical warefare. Kind of reminds me of how they say sermons preached in english to newcomers promote islam as a religion of peace, but then arabic sermons preached to the regular muslims are all about over throwing the government fighting jihad and establishing shariah.

Hello again Galilean. I'm eager for you to tell us the white supremacist's view on Islamic terrorism.

 

[LightOfEyes]

I think you did not respond to my questions.

Terrorism is not an act of self defense. Muslims who have strapped bombs on their bodies and killed civilians inside buses, trains or crashing planes into buildings to kill civilians is not an act of self defense.

1. Does islam condem these acts? Yes or No?

If yes? And if violent riots for drawings or words of people against islam are justified... why don't muslims riot against terrorists such as bin laden?

2. If islam condems terrorism, and look down upon terrorists because islam is a religion of peace. Then, is islam's claim for a growing population really true since a major part of its growth maybe a growth of these extremists?

Actually Yes we do condemn these acts but realy I find justification for them to defenf their self I just now posted new thread talking about one sister .
please read:http://www.christianforums.com/t2600788-who-are-the-terrorists.html

I just ask you, if your sister where that sister what do you thing you can do, i guess may you blow them to pieces by strapped bomb if you can.

Peace.

 

[Osiris]

Not true! take a look at these non-muslim facts to see the truth:
http://www.menj.org/fastest/

I don't think you understand the point I am trying to make here. I am not arguing that islam is not a fast growing religion...

also muslims are not allowed to make up baseless claims. the Holy Quran says in chaptre #2 " ................"Produce your proof if you are truthful."
[/color]

I am not saying that [Islam being a fast growing religion] is a baseless claim. What I was pointing out was that it was just a logical fallacy to think that because it is a fast growing religion, that islam must be the true religion. But this was really not the major point of the thread...

you seem to ignore the fact that for months muslims have tried to solve the problem peacefully but Denmark government refused which made some muslims drustrated enough to attack Danish interests.

I did not ignore anything.
My point is that these riots did happen whether some muslims tried to solve the problem peacefully with the danish government or not. The danish government has no control over what the people do as long as the people do no break the law -- else it'd be a dictatorship. But that's another issues.

If islam is a peaceful religion, the fruits that it creates should know to turn the other cheek.

But then, just as christians look down upon the KKK, would you look down upon Al Qaeda and other terrorists or groups that promote violence? (which was one of my questions)

Yes Islam is the religion of peace . that is what it means in Arabic.
as for your accusations the fact is muslims are being wronged and mistreated all over the world :-

I am not doing any accusations. I am just pointing out some things that have been caused by muslims around the world, and that some muslims deny that these muslims represent islam and look down upon their actions.

But, if you believe that all muslims (extremists, terrorists, etc) are real muslims and represent islam and they follow God. Then I am sorry to say that these questions were not addressed towards you.

I should have specified that these questions were addressed to muslims that literally believe that Islam is a religion of peace, and not just on "name."

1- The Jews occupied,killed, Kicked, or turned the lives of every Palestinias into living hell , and you accuse Muslims of terror!​

2- The Christians unconditionally support the Jews and supply them with the weapons which they use to kill Muslims with, they are also occupying Muslim countries, and daily killing Muslims in Iraq, Afghanistan, Chechnya…., they are unjustly holding Muslims in Guantanamo and still you accuse Muslims of terror!!!
3- The Hindus are occupying & Killing Muslims in Kashmir , and still you accuse us of terror.
4- The Buddists killed one million Muslims In Cambodia, tortured them in Laos, and you are accusing us of terror!!!

The thread is not trying to argue about that.

The native americans have been oppressed far more than muslims, you don't see them causing violent acts.
But I don't want to insult other muslims though, I just want to clarify that violent acts and terrorism are caused by extremists that are not in the correct path.

there are no extremists but rather some muslims who are fed up with the way muslims are being treated.

There is no better cause than defending our Prophet (peace be upon him)
the real terrorists are those who deliberatly and intentionally insult others and who occupy their countries. Guess whom I am talking about

Like I said... the OP was intended for muslims that believe islam to be a religion of peace. From what I see, you justify the attacks on 9-11 and all the innocent people that were killed there, attacks in the UK, and perhaps bin laden.

The reason it was not intended towards you, was because there is no need for answers to my questions -- the answers would be:

1. since you believe extremists and terrorists are real muslims, then of course you will agree that the fast groth of religion would still be accurate.

2. no, muslims should not riot against terrorists because terrorists are real muslims.

 

[Fares]

Evil spreads faster then Good !

Humans are easly temptated by lies and are very easly manipulated .

At some point people will realise that Islam is a fraud .

 

[mallowpuff]

Here's a hint -
go to the 'islam world' page.
Long list of articles. At the top, you will see your introduction articles, mostly saying stuff like 'islam is a religion of peace, terrorism is anti-islamic'. Then, scroll a bit further down and you'll see articles like 'islamic jihad' that promote jihad - as in physical warefare. Kind of reminds me of how they say sermons preached in english to newcomers promote islam as a religion of peace, but then arabic sermons preached to the regular muslims are all about over throwing the government fighting jihad and establishing shariah.

It's all done to deceive.

 

[Fares]

More people in Islam less people in heaven .
Some will find this funny, but its sad .
Those are not evil men, just missguided !

May God have mercy on their souls .

 

[Galilean]

Hello again Galilean. I'm eager for you to tell us the white supremacist's view on Islamic terrorism.

oh? shouldn't you be telling me my 'white supremacist veiw on Islamic terrorism'?

 

[Hello There]

High birth rates lead to a large amount of followers.

 

[saladin1970]

I would like to point out something about Islam which I have noticed recently. Well, muslims like any other members of other religions also commit logical fallacies regularly whenever they argue. One of such arguments which is used alot here is (sadly): "Islam is the fastest growing religion - implying islam is the best religion or somehow because is the fastest growing religion it must possess some truth to it."

Also, in recent news some (a lot) of muslims have been involved in violent protests because of drawings or because of what someone said about islam.

So, the points I would like to make are these:

1. Muslims claim that Islam is a religion of peace, and any acts of terrorism(or violence) cannot be attributed to islam but to religious extremists that don't know what islam means.

But the fact that alot of muslims have been rioting in Europe, in England, there's Al Qaeda, any many other violent groups -- which would count as alot of members of islam even though islam thinks down upon them.

So, if muslims say they have a large religion, they shouldn't forget that a part of that large population we have are these extremists which cause violence around the world. So... would Islam be a fast growing religion without these violent extremists? (Just a question to discuss on, I am not trying to bash Islam)


2. If the riots are justifiend; and if the muslims causing the riots in Europe condem terrorism, I think they are wasting their energies by rioting against drawings and what people say about Islam. If the riots are for a good cause and are justified, why doesn't Islam cause riots and violence against terrorists?

They do, as according to ALL official definitions of terrorism, America is THE no 1 terrorist nation in the world. Look at the definition and apply it to US policy.

 

[I_are_sceptical]

At some point people will realise that Islam is a fraud .

Islam has already existed for 1400 years, and the Muslims are not convinced their Faith is a fraud. That includes the scholars at the Al-Azhar University in Cairo.

It seems to me that "some point" will take a very long time. Perhaps never.

 

[I_are_sceptical]

why don't muslims riot against terrorists such as bin laden?

Perhaps for the same reason that Christians in the United States did not riot against the Militias when two Christian American terrorists blew up the Murrah Federal Building in Oklahoma City eleven years ago, killing 168 people including dozens of children in a day care center.

 

[Theowne]

the real terrorists are those who deliberatly and intentionally insult others and who occupy their countries. Guess whom I am talking about

I agree the real terrorists are those who remove dictators who have murdered countless people and would have continued to do so. The heros of this world are those who intentionally target the helpless or innocent simply for the sake of murder.

 

[elijah115]

Peace to you brother,

Actually non-Muslims attack Muslims and they don’t want them to defend their self, Muslims do nothing but self-defense, they have the right to defend their prophet and their believes, just I am asking who start the aggression draw their prophet.

And who created terrorism, don’t terrorism has been created by the injustice policies of the main powers in the world?.! They occupied Palestine, Iraq, Afghanistan, and so on.
And when they defend their self, they claim that is terrorism. I am sure they will stop if they leave them alone.

Islam the religion of peace but it command Muslims to defend their self in case of aggression

Peace

Terrorists are dumb, like extremely dumb. IF all the insurgents in Iraq, left tomorrow the US would leave by 1 months time. Pro-jihadists don't get the fact, no body wants to stay in a stone age country and get killed because these stupid insurgents. The quran says fight for the weak and oppressed. Why didn't any Muslim country fight for the Kurds in Iraq? They were Oppressed, weren't they? I rest my case.

 

[elijah115]

Perhaps for the same reason that Christians in the United States did not riot against the Militias when two Christian American terrorists blew up the Murrah Federal Building in Oklahoma City eleven years ago, killing 168 people including dozens of children in a day care center.

"two Christians American terrorists"