Difficult Conversations At Pride Event

[Lost4words]

Ah-hahaha, good catch, Alex! Didn't even notice or think of that!

Thanks for sharing your thoughts, PloverWing! As for Catholics, I don't believe they are Christians. I'm sure some may be Christians who are Catholic, but as a whole I don't believe they are.

1) We are saved by believing in Jesus, but we need to turn from our sins. If I just say I believe in Jesus and continue to live my life my way and refuse to repent of my sins then do I really believe in Jesus? Jesus even says if you love Me you'll obey my teachings.

2) Great point and suggestion. But, it's something, for me, that will come with time as I was really nervous going to the pride event. Actually, I get nervous every time I go out to evangelize but I trust the Spirit will guide me. Usually when I go out around town with my one friend he loves to share his testimony.

Thanks, the book of John is absolutely incredible and I go to it often! As for being legalistic or works based... I guess we'd have to define what you mean by that. Technically, it's "work" to believe. If someone goes to give you a free gift, do you say you worked for it? You could... as you would have to reach out your hand to accept it, which could be considered work.

Do you have any examples you could share with me with you using this opening? There's not just one way to open the conversation, but nice question.

Thanks for the continued encouragement, Nathan!

Obviously you dont really know Catholicism...

 

[RileyG]

Obviously you dont really know Catholicism...

I love it when non-Catholics claim to know what the Catholic Church teaches! NOT

 

[BibleBeliever1611]

Have you witnesses a pride march?

No, I would never witness in a pride march because I believe there are some people who do not deserve to hear about the gospel based on Matthew 7:6.

 

[Lost4words]

No, I would never witness in a pride march because I believe there are some people who do not deserve to hear about the gospel based on Matthew 7:6.

I meant 'seen' a pride march....

If you have, you will notice straight Way that they are the work of evil...

 

[d taylor]

Thanks, the book of John is absolutely incredible and I go to it often! As for being legalistic or works based... I guess we'd have to define what you mean by that. Technically, it's "work" to believe. If someone goes to give you a free gift, do you say you worked for it? You could... as you would have to reach out your hand to accept it, which could be considered work.

Do you have any examples you could share with me with you using this opening? There's not just one way to open the conversation, but nice question.

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Legalistic is you confronted the girl with the Law (10 commandments). That she must do an action to be able to believe in Jesus, which is repent of her sins. Or in other words clean up her life first, then you may believe in Jesus.

Just ask a person: Excuse me please, what do you understand it takes for a person to become a permanent born again child of God.

 

[1Tonne]

Legalistic is you confronted the girl with the Law (10 commandments). That she must do an action to be able to believe in Jesus, which is repent of her sins. Or in other words clean up her life first, then you may believe in Jesus.

2 Timothy 2:24-25 (ESV): "And the Lord's servant must not be quarrelsome but kind to everyone, able to teach, patiently enduring evil, correcting his opponents with gentleness. God may perhaps grant them repentance leading to a knowledge of the truth."

This is a great verse because many believers think that you cannot point out an unbeliever's wrongdoing. But the verse says, "correcting his opponents with gentleness. God may perhaps grant them repentance leading to a knowledge of the truth.". To show someone how they are sinning against God is truly loving them and we should do it with gentleness. Not yelling or condemning them. They may not like it when it is pointed out, but it is better than leaving them in a state where they are unaware. A lot of believers do not understand this and so they choose not to show people their sins. But this is showing love and Jesus said to love your neighbour as you love yourself.
It is like your young teenager who wants to go off to a party and you know that there are going to be drugs and alcohol there. You tell your child that they are not allowed to go, and they then get angry at you. But you have done the right thing because you showed love to your child, and you did it with gentleness and respect.

 

[David Hunter]

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Legalistic is you confronted the girl with the Law (10 commandments). That she must do an action to be able to believe in Jesus, which is repent of her sins. Or in other words clean up her life first, then you may believe in Jesus.

Just ask a person: Excuse me please, what do you understand it takes for a person to become a permanent born again child of God.

Confronting someone with the 10 commandments is not being legalistic. We can't keep the law, but it shows us that we've sinned against a Holy God, that's why we need Jesus.

 

[d taylor]

Confronting someone with the 10 commandments is not being legalistic. We can't keep the law, but it shows us that we've sinned against a Holy God, that's why we need Jesus.

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​

People need to believe in Jesus, not because we have sinned against a Holy God. We are born separated from God before we commit even the first sin. But they need to believe in Jesus because that is the only way to receive God's free gift of Eternal Life and become a permanent born again child of God
People need to understand this truth, that it is only by belief in Jesus, that a person becomes a born again child of God and receives The Life of God.

Bringing up sins, is usually used (99% of the time) because the person presenting their message will state to be saved the person needs to repent of sins and sometimes they may even say they also need to believe in Jesus. But what believing in Jesus means, is usually never explained.

From your talk with this girl after confronting her about breaking laws (sin). You state she needs to repent of her sins, Then you say she has to surrender her life to Jesus. Next the person with you talks about a transformed life, then he goes on to say that a person goes to heaven because, again they have repented and finally he states believe in Jesus. But nothing about what believing in Jesus actually means. Then back to speaking about rape and the law, etc....

...So how the law is being used now of many churches with the confronting of people breaking the 10 commandments by lying, stealing, etc.. Is so people preaching their message can add to faith in Jesus, the requirement of repenting of sins. And in the case of your video, it basically replaces faith in Jesus, because more time is spent on repenting and surrendering ones life.
...Than telling people about belief in Jesus for Eternal Life and what belief in Jesus means. Explaining that belief in Jesus is more than believing Jesus existed or was human or a good teacher, etc.. But that Jesus is who He says He is: The Promised Messiah/Son of God, the resurrection and the life and than believing this (name) about Jesus is the only way to receive God's free gift of Eternal Life and become a permanent born again child of God.

Repenting of sin is connected to the law, because the law confronted Israel with their sins against the law God gave and governed Israel by. But the law was designed to bring people to believe in Jesus. Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith. So how are you using the breaking of the 10 commandments to bring unbelievers to believe in Jesus. I see you using it to tell people they need to repent of their sins, but that does not give a person God's free gift of Eternal Life and become a permanent born again child of God.

But now the law is not what the church is under, the church is now under grace. So why confront unbelievers with the law (10 commandments) when they are not under the law, they are under the law of the United States of America. Do you think a person has to admit they are a sinner first before they can believe in Jesus for Eternal Life. I do not see that (admitting they are a sinner) listed in The Bible as a requirement God has given to receive Eternal Life.

A person may repent of their sin, but no one is justified or becomes a born again child of God by repenting of sins. Repenting of sins gets the born again child of God (believer) back into fellowship with God. When the born again believer turns from their sin back to God their Father. But in The Gospel of John repenting is not mentioned as something a person must do to believe in Jesus. They simply just need to believe.

but these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that believing you may have life in His name.

 

[d taylor]

2 Timothy 2:24-25 (ESV): "And the Lord's servant must not be quarrelsome but kind to everyone, able to teach, patiently enduring evil, correcting his opponents with gentleness. God may perhaps grant them repentance leading to a knowledge of the truth."

This is a great verse because many believers think that you cannot point out an unbeliever's wrongdoing. But the verse says, "correcting his opponents with gentleness. God may perhaps grant them repentance leading to a knowledge of the truth.". To show someone how they are sinning against God is truly loving them and we should do it with gentleness. Not yelling or condemning them. They may not like it when it is pointed out, but it is better than leaving them in a state where they are unaware. A lot of believers do not understand this and so they choose not to show people their sins. But this is showing love and Jesus said to love your neighbour as you love yourself.
It is like your young teenager who wants to go off to a party and you know that there are going to be drugs and alcohol there. You tell your child that they are not allowed to go, and they then get angry at you. But you have done the right thing because you showed love to your child, and you did it with gentleness and respect.

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2nd Timothy 2:24-25 is not addressing unbelievers, but believers in The Church. The repentance is for the believer to repent from false teaching.

 

[FireDragon76]

2 Timothy 2:24-25 (ESV): "And the Lord's servant must not be quarrelsome but kind to everyone, able to teach, patiently enduring evil, correcting his opponents with gentleness. God may perhaps grant them repentance leading to a knowledge of the truth."

This is a great verse because many believers think that you cannot point out an unbeliever's wrongdoing. But the verse says, "correcting his opponents with gentleness. God may perhaps grant them repentance leading to a knowledge of the truth.". To show someone how they are sinning against God is truly loving them and we should do it with gentleness. Not yelling or condemning them. They may not like it when it is pointed out, but it is better than leaving them in a state where they are unaware. A lot of believers do not understand this and so they choose not to show people their sins. But this is showing love and Jesus said to love your neighbour as you love yourself.
It is like your young teenager who wants to go off to a party and you know that there are going to be drugs and alcohol there. You tell your child that they are not allowed to go, and they then get angry at you. But you have done the right thing because you showed love to your child, and you did it with gentleness and respect.

Presuming spiritual authority over a perfect stranger is unkind and often unwelcome.

 

[1Tonne]

Presuming spiritual authority over a perfect stranger is unkind and often unwelcome.

When did I say that I was presuming spiritual authority over a stranger?

I have shown many people how they have fallen short of God's standard and then I have told them about the cross. A large amount of these people have thanked me. They were glad I had the courage to share and they welcomed it.
You seem to be very experienced in evangelism and so we could learn from you. Can you please tell me how you do it and how often?

 

[FireDragon76]

When did I say that I was presuming spiritual authority over a stranger?

I have shown many people how they have fallen short of God's standard and then I have told them about the cross.

Telling people how they fall short is presuming spiritual authority over someone else.

A large amount of these people have thanked me. They were glad I had the courage to share and they welcomed it.
You seem to be very experienced in evangelism and so we could learn from you. Can you please tell me how you do it and how often?

You're not engaged in evangelism. You're engaged in proselytism.

 

[1Tonne]

Telling people how they fall short is presuming spiritual authority over someone else.

I tell them that I have broken all the laws. How is that presuming spiritual authority over someone else?
You are reaching for something that is not there.
If you are going to fire a gun you have to put real bullets in it. Stop firing blanks.

You're not engaged in evangelism. You're engaged in proselytism.

You are not even engaged.

Please answer the question I asked as you seem very knowledgeable in evangelism.
Can you please tell me how you do it and how often?

 

[FireDragon76]

I tell them that I have broken all the laws. How is that presuming spiritual authority over someone else?
You are reaching for something that is not there.
If you are going to fire a gun you have to put real bullets in it. Stop firing blanks.

Please answer the question I asked as you seem very knowledgeable in evangelism.
Can you please tell me how you do it and how often?

The responsibility is not on me to demonstrate anything to you. This is a matter of ethics. Ethics trumps questions of practicality.

 

[1Tonne]

The responsibility is not on me to demonstrate anything to you. This is a matter of ethics. Ethics trumps questions of practicality.

I thought so. Another armchair critic.

 

[FireDragon76]

I thought so. Another armchair critic.

I've had plenty of conversations about religion in the past decade. But they don't involve selling the Gospel as a hot take and trying to undermine other peoples faith in the process.

 

[1Tonne]

I've had plenty of conversations about religion in the past decade.

Do you have to add them all up over a decade to get plenty? What about in the last month?

 

[FireDragon76]

Do you have to add them all up over a decade to get plenty? What about in the last month?

You know, this isn't about me. This is about the ethics of badgering people who say they believe in Jesus, but have a different religious tradition from you.

 

[MForbes]

You know, this isn't about me. This is about the ethics of badgering people who say they believe in Jesus, but have a different religious tradition from you.

Actually this is all about him and racking up the number count of people he's "witnessed" to. You either match his number count (or greater), or you're not doing the job you're supposed to be doing as a Christian.

Confrontational Evangelists love a good argument on the street.

 

[rebornfree]

No, I would never witness in a pride march because I believe there are some people who do not deserve to hear about the gospel based on Matthew 7:6.

I'm not sure that any of us deserve to hear it but thankfully the Lord has decreed that we all should: Matt 28 v 18-20; John 3 v 16,17; 2 Peter 3 v 9.