Differences Between The Catholic Church & The Lutheran Church

[Second Coming]

Hi I am a confirmed Catholic. I have been attending the Lutheran Church for the past seven years. I am considering returning to the Catholic Church. I would like to use this thread to understand the differences between the Lutheran Church and the Catholic Church.

I have a few questions:

1. Lutheranism teaches justification by faith alone. How do Catholics view salvation? How is a person saved and what means you are saved?

2. What are the Apocraphyl books and why should they be in the canon?

3. Why do you pray to Mary and other Saints?

4. Why do Priests abstain from marriage?

5. What other differences exist?

 

[Michie]

Here are some links to help you.

Catholic Answers | To Explain and Defend the Faith

Lutheranism | Catholic Answers

How We Honor Jesus Through Mary | Catholic Answers

Praying to the Saints | Catholic Answers

Celibacy and the Priesthood | Catholic Answers

Why a Celibate Priesthood? | Catholic Answers

Apocrypha | Catholic Answers


This sounds a lot like the baptist thread from yesterday.

 

[TuxAme]

1. We believe that we are justified by faith, but that works must accompany it. Faith has to come first in order for your works to "avail" anything. Works without faith (and faith without works) are dead. Someone else could describe it better (soteriology isn't my specialty).

2. The Deuterocanon, as we call them, are seven books of the Old Testament which protestants generally reject. On the most basic level, we accept them because the earliest Church councils dealing with the canon of Scripture accepted them, and later councils have affirmed them.

3. We pray (ask) the saints to bring our prayers to God (as they are described as doing in the book of Revelation), and to add their own prayers to our own. This is in keeping with our call to intercede for each other. We have assurance that they can hear our prayers based on the text in Revelation, but there is also some Old Testament example (Samuel conversed with Saul after his death and accurately described the king's demise).

4. The Latin Rite of the Church has, with few exceptions, made celibacy mandatory for priests. Among the reasons for this is what Paul himself says: a married man is anxious about earthly affairs (how to please his wife), but a single man is anxious about heavenly affairs (how to please God). We desire that our priests are only caught up in their ministry, rather than worrying about a family as well. This hasn't always been the case- the Church used to allow candidates to the priesthood to marry prior to ordination- but today this is generally only allowed for converts to the faith who are already married and were ministers in their previous faith.

 

[Second Coming]

2. The Deuterocanon, as we call them, are seven books of the Old Testament which protestants generally reject. On the most basic level, we accept them because the earliest Church councils dealing with the canon of Scripture accepted them, and later councils have affirmed them.

Can someone please elaborate on this point and provide links? Which church councils deemed the apocryphal books accepted?

 

[TKA_TN]

These are some of the same things I question and have had some helpful answers on from people in this forum. I, too, am a Lutheran (LCMS) and have felt the urge to join the Catholic Church. I pray for guidance from the Spirit for you.

 

[Michie]

I just read in the Eastern Orthodox forum where you claim you are allowed to take both Catholic and Lutheran communion. I urge you to ask your pastor and a Catholic priest about this because it is not true.

 

[tampasteve]

I just read in the Eastern Orthodox forum where you claim you are allowed to take both Catholic and Lutheran communion. I urge you to ask your pastor and a Catholic priest about this because it is not true.

Indeed this is true. Especially as the LCMS (OP says that is their church) is definitely not in agreement with the RCC for Eucharistic sharing - or even most other Lutherans. I do not believe there are any LCMS pastors that would approve of their members taking communion in a Catholic Church,.

 

[Second Coming]

I just read in the Eastern Orthodox forum where you claim you are allowed to take both Catholic and Lutheran communion. I urge you to ask your pastor and a Catholic priest about this because it is not true.

I made the comment because the Orthodox Church wants me to wait a year before communing. I do have a choice between the two. My comment was not that I am attending both Churches simultaneously but that I have both of these as an option to choose from. I hope you understand what I am saying and you end your misunderstanding. I am not taking communion at both churches simultaneously but since I am confirmed I have both churches as an option whichever one I may choose to attend regularly.

 

[Second Coming]

Indeed this is true. Especially as the LCMS (OP says that is their church) is definitely not in agreement with the RCC for Eucharistic sharing - or even most other Lutherans. I do not believe there are any LCMS pastors that would approve of their members taking communion in a Catholic Church,.

Agreed. I’m not taking communion at both simultaneously. My comment was only that since I am already confirmed I have both churches as an option should I decide to commit as a parishioner. I wasn’t talking about taking communion at both simultaneously.

 

[archer75]

I made the comment because the Orthodox Church wants me to wait a year before communing. I do have a choice between the two. My comment was not that I am attending both Churches simultaneously but that I have both of these as an option to choose from. I hope you understand what I am saying and you end your misunderstanding. I am not taking communion at both churches simultaneously but since I am confirmed I have both churches as an option whichever one I may choose to attend regularly.

Just for the record, no estimates on the thread in TAW about time from first inquiring to reception are binding. They were just estimates. There is not a fixed rule about this.

 

[Michie]

I made the comment because the Orthodox Church wants me to wait a year before communing. I do have a choice between the two. My comment was not that I am attending both Churches simultaneously but that I have both of these as an option to choose from. I hope you understand what I am saying and you end your misunderstanding. I am not taking communion at both churches simultaneously but since I am confirmed I have both churches as an option whichever one I may choose to attend regularly.

Well you do realize that if you decide to return to the RCC you must talk to a priest and go to confession. Depending on your situation, he may require you take RCIA as well. Communion is not just available upon demand in the RCC. Most churches, Catholic or not require some sort time to show the seriousness of the return. I'm not trying to be rude, but honest. Given the questions you asked in your original post, RCIA might be a blessing for you.

 

[Second Coming]

Well you do realize that if you decide to return to the RCC you must talk to a priest and go to confession. Depending on your situation, he may require you take RCIA as well. Communion is not just available upon demand in the RCC. Most churches, Catholic or not require some sort time to show the seriousness of the return. I'm not trying to be rude, but honest. Given the questions you asked in your original post, RCIA might be a blessing for you.

In all honesty if I returned I would probably not talk to a Priest or attend RCIA. I would probably just go to confession and then attend a service. My local Catholic Church is large and my presence there would go relatively unnoticed.

 

[Michie]

If you've been gone 7 years the priest may want you to do more. Then again, he may not. I guess the key is just following through with whatever he advised you to do. I suppose it would depend on how much it meant to you.

In all honesty if I returned I would probably not talk to a Priest or attend RCIA. I would probably just go to confession and then attend a service.

 

[Second Coming]

If you've been gone 7 years the priest may want you to do more. Then again, he may not. I guess the key is just following through with whatever he advised you to do. I suppose it would depend on how much it meant to you.

Like I said I probably will not talk to a Priest about it. The local Church is extremely large and I’m sure I can just slip through the cracks.

 

[Michie]

Well that's not a good attitude to have. I'm a bit more paranoid about being above board when it comes to faith. Which may not be good either, being so cautious. If you feel good about slipping through the cracks with no spiritual advice, that's on you. Good luck to you.

Like I said I probably will not talk to a Priest about it. The local Church is extremely large and I’m sure I can just slip through the cracks.

 

[Second Coming]

Well that's not a good attitude to have. I'm a bit more paranoid about being above board when it comes to faith. Which may not be good either, being so cautious. If you feel good about slipping through the cracks with no spiritual advice, that's on you. Good luck to you.

At this point I’m actually leaning towards staying Lutheran so it’s not going to matter.

 

[Michie]

Well prayers for you either way. Gotta run. I have to get my dogs caught up on their shots.

At this point I’m actually leaning towards staying Lutheran so it’s not going to matter.

 

[TuxAme]

Can someone please elaborate on this point and provide links? Which church councils deemed the apocryphal books accepted?

There were two in the late 4th century. Per Catholic Answers, the following councils, in their discussions on the Biblical canon, affirmed the 46 book (with Deuterocanon) Old Testament:

At the Council of Rome in 382, the Church decided upon a canon of 46 Old Testament books and 27 in the New Testament. This decision was ratified by the councils at Hippo (393), Carthage (397, 419), II Nicea (787), Florence (1442), and Trent (1546).

 

[Rhamiel]

1. Lutheranism teaches justification by faith alone. How do Catholics view salvation? How is a person saved and what means you are saved?

We are saved by the grace of God through faith and works
The normal way a person is saved is through the Sacraments
This is a very biblical view
Christ commands us to love God above all and love our neighbor as we love ourselves, Love is not just a feeling but choosing to do what is good for others, we see from Christ talking about separation of the sheep from the goats that actions matter, that not all those who say “Lord Lord” will be saved, we see from the lists of sins given by St Paul that bad actions will damn is to Hell
The Protestant view of Sola Fide is not biblical and is not found in any ancient church

2. What are the Apocraphyl books and why should they be in the canon?

They are books that were in the Greek translation of the Jewish Scripture called the Septuagint, looking at the Gospels talking about the Pharisees and Scribes and Herodians and Sadducees and Zealots we can see that Judaism at the time of the Apostles was not monolithic and different sects had different canons of Scripture
The New Testament was written in Greek so the Septuagint was used when the Old Testament was quoted in the New Testament, while some of these books were controversial, there were also controversy about having Revelation counter as Scripture, or leaving out the Epistles of Clement, the canon of Scripture did not just fall out of the sky and everyone accepted it without question, there were long and arduous debates, so just because these books were questioned does not negate their place in Scripture

3. Why do you pray to Mary and other Saints?

Because it has born such good fruit
So many have been led closer to Christ through their devotion to the Saints
Because we believe the Church is one, and we are still united in some ways to the members of the Church in heaven
Because the Bible says that the prayer of the righteous man alleviates much, and who is more righteous then those who now share in the beatific vision?

4. Why do Priests abstain from marriage?

They are following the example of our Lord who did not take a wife while He ministered to the lost sheep of the house of Israel
They are following the example of St Paul who recommends that the unmarried stay unmarried

5. What other differences exist?

Oh, lots of things, but they are more subtle and harder to explain, I will try to come back to this latter

 

[Rhamiel]

In all honesty if I returned I would probably not talk to a Priest or attend RCIA. I would probably just go to confession and then attend a service. My local Catholic Church is large and my presence there would go relatively unnoticed.

Since you are confirmed in the Catholic Church all you would need is confession to be able to receive communion again.