Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.
Asked and answered multiple times. See Matt12:5 and explain Jesus' question. Did the Priests profane/desecrate Sabbath or is this question hyperbole or something else? IOW, ask Jesus.IN what way does God tell someone "please don't observe my Holy Sabbath" in your pov?
Thanks for posting reference to actual Scripture.The day before the Sabbath, twice as much manna fell, and the Lord told the children of Israel to gather enough for two days. On the Sabbath day they did not receive any manna. Yeshua and His followers were only eating and not gathering.
Actually, this is comical in a way. A proper appeal to fellowship by posting a verse that is at the center of the disagreement.Saints, a lot of the acrymony, bad feelings, and tension is completely unnecessary if we
all would adhere to the apostle's fellowship. It really is not all that difficult.
One judges one day above another; another judges every day alike. Let each be fully persuaded in his own mind. (Romans 14:5)
Waving a red flag in front of a bull?Actually, this is comical in a way. A proper appeal to fellowship by posting a verse that is at the center of the disagreement.
Can you work in the "not anyone" verses also?
In all seriousness, please pardon my smile.
Yes. Smiling again. Isn't there a Scripture that says a little levity leavens the whole batch?Waving a red flag in front of a bull?
Well, we should see that the problems around strong personal convictions is not new.
Paul spends chapters on more indivdual spiritual experience and growth.
He is wise enough as a "master builder" to know divisions in the church will be self defeating of everything else.
Some things we can be general about. We can receive each other. They are less than absolutely critical
issues. They do not effect the basics of the faith as he has elaborated in previous chapters. We can accomodate each other.
I think that is Hezekiah 3:16.Yes. Smiling again. Isn't there a Scripture that says a little levity leavens the whole batch?
Much agreed and appreciated.
It's really quite amazing to consider the current level of division to be ultimately self-defeating. The Eph4 corporate unity in understanding and maturity is something that seems so impossible in the here and now realm. Once again, He amazes, and I look forward.
IN what way does God tell someone "please don't observe my Holy Sabbath" in your pov?I'll reword this to be a bit broader and not have Jesus' question about profaning/desecration in the background:
If the 4th Word/Statement is God's Eternal Righteous Moral Character, then why does God provide for some to not observe it?
Keep asking the question we all know the answer to? again? To see the same answer posted again?Asked and answered multiple times. See Matt12:5 and explain Jesus' question. Did the Priests profane/desecrate Sabbath or is this question hyperbole or something else?
I'm going to cherry-pick (or grain-pick or darnel pick) through your posts. To elaborate, I'm not going to read them in entirety There's simply too much
They did not have to be all-knowing or omniscient to get the glaringly obvious point that priests leading out in worship on Sabbath as God directed at Sinai were not engaged in a form of rebellion against God (as if leading out in worship on Sabbath were a sin) - nor did God ever claim that leading out in worship is an act against His Sabbath -- as BOTH sides already know (which is why you never see and serious Bible scholarship going down that road)It's quite an assertion that men who live and rule by oral law tradition fully understood God's Law, its structure, its ultimate intent
He did NOT want them to go out and TRY to gather more manna, because in CONTEXT some had already done that. How long do you refuse to keep My commandments and My laws? AND this was BEFORE Sinai. Where do you go that says it does? Kindling a fire and gathering wood to do so is prohibited. Cooking and work is prohibited. In Nehemiah, we learn of a number of Shabbat infractions that the people in Judah were accused of committing: pressing wine, carrying grains and other fruits into Jerusalem, and selling food. So no buying or selling. Isaiah says no striking of bargains. FYI, borders of fields were left uncut for the poor to glean for food.Thanks for posting reference to actual Scripture.
NKJ Ex16:26-30 "Six days you shall gather it, but on the seventh day, which is the Sabbath, there will be none." 27 Now it happened that some of the people went out on the seventh day to gather, but they found none. 28 And the LORD said to Moses, "How long do you refuse to keep My commandments and My laws? 29 "See! For the LORD has given you the Sabbath; therefore He gives you on the sixth day bread for two days. Let every man remain in his place; let no man go out of his place on the seventh day." 30 So the people rested on the seventh day.
Where do you go in Scripture to say that going out and picking and crushing and eating grain on Sabbath is not profaning Sabbath, or do you think it does profane Sabbath but was OK because the disciples in Matt12 were with Jesus doing God's work, or???
- Do you see the underlined as normative, normative for a time. not to be taken literally - IOW - contextually they could go out but not to get provision, a tightening of the reins (so to speak) since some had disobeyed, an enforced rest, or???
Brought forward again.I read this a couple of times and enjoyed it.
I think the Sabbath signifies two things really:
1.) God has a purpose that when attained gives Him satisfaction, rest, fulfillment.
2.) Man also should be (and indeed only CAN be) satisfied with that which satisfies God.
God rests on the seventh day because everything is in order according to His plan. All is "very good."
When God is not satisfied there is NO WAY that man can be satisfied.
Man's rest (in every sense) is in entering into God's eternal purpose.
I think of the meaning of the Sabbath throughout the whole bible in this light.
Thanks.He did NOT want them to go out and TRY to gather more manna, because in CONTEXT some had already done that. How long do you refuse to keep My commandments and My laws? AND this was BEFORE Sinai. Where do you go that says it does? Kindling a fire and gathering wood to do so is prohibited. Cooking and work is prohibited. In Nehemiah, we learn of a number of Shabbat infractions that the people in Judah were accused of committing: pressing wine, carrying grains and other fruits into Jerusalem, and selling food. So no buying or selling. Isaiah says no striking of bargains. FYI, borders of fields were left uncut for the poor to glean for food.
This is a good place to at least let you know that I see no reason to respond to your posts. Skimming past the details of Scripture is not my normal practice. Skimming through your posts for something meaningful IMO is simply some wisdom. The wiser thing would probably be to cease even the skimming of them. We'll see...I keep calling that "skim past the details" the sign of a "weak argument" then you keep admitting you are in fact doing that very thing.
nice.
Might be the same thing. "Though He was rich, yet for your sake, He became poor so that you through His poverty might become rich." Some of His followers were called "Ebyonim" or the poor.Do you think gleaning for the poor is applicable to Matt12 or is Deut23:25 better?
That text doesn't say as you think or wish in respect to the Sabbath..
One judges one day above another; another judges every day alike. Let each be fully persuaded in his own mind. (Romans 14:5)
God called it a commandment and identifies them as a unit as “My commandments” i.e. the commandments of God Exo 20 Exo 20:6 and was personally written with His own finger like He did all His other commandments in this unit of Ten. This is God’s work His testimony that no one is above Exo 32:16 Exo 31:18. God placed the Ten inside the ark of the covenant, not outside so your argument is not with man.Beyond being a sign of the temporary and now replaced Mosaic Covenant, was the weekly Sabbath what is called by some who categorize laws a ceremonial law?
Might be is about how I concluded not having put much thought into it. The info re: the poor also crossed my mind. I did note the Hebrew for the gleaning can mean remnants and the Greek basically means to fall. I did also note that in Ruth she was gleaning behind the reapers and Boaz set things up, so she came away with an ephah - so about 30lbs as seems to be the measure. May or may not be any help for Matt12. Seems a side-track to the greater issue and context of Matt12 anyway.Might be the same thing. "Though He was rich, yet for your sake, He became poor so that you through His poverty might become rich." Some of His followers were called "Ebyonim" or the poor.
I'm surprised anyone would consider Mat 12 an issue- I know the Pharisees did, but Jesus said clearly they were guiltless Mat 12:7- this really should be the end of the discussion if we are to believe His Word. Jesus did not go on to say we do not need to keep the Sabbath commandment- Jesus said If you love Me- keep My commandments which of course includes the Sabbath commandment He wrote and He spoke and said was made for mankind and will be kept by the saints until He comes back Rev 14:12 and for all eternity Isa 66:22-23 says our Lord and Savior. Amen!Might be is about how I concluded not having put much thought into it. The info re: the poor also crossed my mind. I did note the Hebrew for the gleaning can mean remnants and the Greek basically means to fall. I did also note that in Ruth she was gleaning behind the reapers and Boaz set things up, so she came away with an ephah - so about 30lbs as seems to be the measure. May or may not be any help for Matt12. Seems a side-track to the greater issue and context of Matt12 anyway.
Yes it refers to any Sabbath, any special day, even your favorite one.That text doesn't say as you think or wish in respect to the Sabbath.
Its rather simple. And it is very much like the "Sermon on the Mount" in Matthew.The context of the passage isn't the Lords will in our lives but arguing over our own opinions and surmising.
It doesn't matter where the Torah instructed or the Torah did not instruct.See verse 1 and 2 which verse 5 is in context to. Nowhere does it state in the Torah we are to only eat Vegetables or herbs. They were arguing over opinions. As it states in verse 1. Which sets the context.
That is right. In the assembly life, like a family, there will be some stronger in faith and some weaker.Rom 14:1 (NET) Now receive the one who is weak in the faith, and do not have disputes over differing opinions.
As I said before. To establish the principle Paul uses two representative examples.Rom 14:2 One person believes in eating everything, but the weak person eats only vegetables.
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?